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Old
11-06-2007, 10:35 AM
  #1
coolbean04
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Stop with the Trap Crap

We are winning and our team hasn't been this good in A REALLY LONG TIME!!!

I rather win 1-0 games and be solid and make it far into the playoffs

compared to

High scoring games and missing the playoffs for almost a decade.


If we can win the Stanley Cup winning 1-0 games, I'll be the happiest person alive.


You hear in basketball and football how defense wins games. Why can't we use that in hockey, we never used the "defense first" mentality. Our players are showing more responsibility by TRYING TO PLAY A TWO-WAY GAME. We should be applauding them!

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11-06-2007, 10:42 AM
  #2
FLYLine24
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We're not playing the trap though. We're playing a defensive system yes, a good one at that, but we are not clogging up the neutral zone so the other team cannot cross our blue line (which is exactly what the trap is).

Fact is, we have a lot of 2 way forwards on the team that are back checking their ass off, blocking passes, blocking shots, and forcing players to the outside. Plus our defense has been great this season, Tyutin & Girardi have been flawless, Staal is really starting to look good, Rosy and Mara have been solid for the most part, and Malik...well thats whats Lundqvist is there for (i kid).

Add in that we have one of the top PKs in the league.

Add in that we have the best goalie in the league as the moment.


Other fans can try to discredit our defensive play and goalie all they want by saying we trap, but its the little things our team is doing, and yes Lundqvist is a huge part of that when he makes the saves he should and makes the saves he shouldn't.

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Old
11-06-2007, 10:44 AM
  #3
HockeyBasedNYC
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Agree with FLY... and the PK has been huge.

I still think this team is going to start scoring more. They just have to with the players they have.

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Old
11-06-2007, 10:46 AM
  #4
Nich
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
We're not playing the trap though. We're playing a defensive system yes, a good one at that, but we are not clogging up the neutral zone so the other team cannot cross our blue line (which is exactly what the trap is).

Fact is, we have a lot of 2 way forwards on the team that are back checking their ass off, blocking passes, blocking shots, and forcing players to the outside. Plus our defense has been great this season, Tyutin & Girardi have been flawless, Staal is really starting to look good, Rosy and Mara have been solid for the most part, and Malik...well thats whats Lundqvist is there for (i kid).

Add in that we have one of the top PKs in the league.

Add in that we have the best goalie in the league as the moment.


Other fans can try to discredit our defensive play and goalie all they want by saying we trap, but its the little things our team is doing, and yes Lundqvist is a huge part of that when he makes the saves he should and makes the saves he shouldn't.
100 % on fly. other teams just don't like giving us credit. first our d was terrible, then Lundqvist was over rated, so since we are one of the best defensively, all they can say is we play the trap as opposed to saying the other bs was wrong.

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11-06-2007, 11:10 AM
  #5
TomLaidlaw
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I enjoyed that you rhymed Trap with Crap in the title. I think all thread titles should rhyme in some capacity.

I do think we played a defensive trap last night to start the 3rd period, some people agree some don't. However, there seems to be this misconception around the boards from opposing fans that we play a strict trap every single game, and that simply isn't true. I would be the first to admit it since I could care less if we were playing a trap for 60 minutes, as long as we won I wouldn't care if we dug a giant hole at center ice and covered it with leaves and waited for teams to fall into it.

Like Nich mentioned above, fans of other teams looked at our defense on paper and made judgements about them all off season. How many times did you read " the rangers are gonna be good this year, but their defense is a huge question mark". It didn't matter how many times we reminded people that their statement was inaccurate. They just kept on saying it. We would show them our defense stats from last year, didn't matter. We didn't have any BIG NAME D-men therefore our defense must be terrible. Now that we have the top defense in the league people can't understand how it is happening. Even though if they took the time to look at last years stats they would have realized we had one of the top defenses in the eastern conference from the all star break on. Who cares about stats though, NAME VALUE is all that matters when judging another team that you never watched.

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Old
11-06-2007, 11:15 AM
  #6
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it's not a true freakin' trap....

whatever it takes to get wins...and I still enjoy watching them play.

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11-06-2007, 11:20 AM
  #7
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we are not playing a trap...far from it.

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Old
11-06-2007, 11:21 AM
  #8
bathgate
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
We're not playing the trap though. We're playing a defensive system yes, a good one at that, but we are not clogging up the neutral zone so the other team cannot cross our blue line (which is exactly what the trap is).

Fact is, we have a lot of 2 way forwards on the team that are back checking their ass off, blocking passes, blocking shots, and forcing players to the outside. Plus our defense has been great this season, Tyutin & Girardi have been flawless, Staal is really starting to look good, Rosy and Mara have been solid for the most part, and Malik...well thats whats Lundqvist is there for (i kid).

Add in that we have one of the top PKs in the league.

Add in that we have the best goalie in the league as the moment.


Other fans can try to discredit our defensive play and goalie all they want by saying we trap, but its the little things our team is doing, and yes Lundqvist is a huge part of that when he makes the saves he should and makes the saves he shouldn't.
Staal is growing by leaps and bounds. He's getting more physical and starting to lead the rush on occasion. Staal, Tyutin, Girardi are the foundation of a great defense in front of arguably the nhl's best goalie!

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Old
11-06-2007, 11:24 AM
  #9
WhipNash27
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Actually there are many times throughout the game where the Rangers do trap, but they do not trap all game long like some people *cough* Devils fans *cough* are saying.

The Rangers have been playing exceptional hockey in their own end, that coupled with Lundqvist had led to very few goals against.

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Old
11-06-2007, 11:42 AM
  #10
KingLundqvistXXX
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The people that say boring games and trap don't know what that means. They don't watch the games, they don't want to give Lundqvist credit, they just see the very low scoring games and automatically assume things. I've even seen them use excuses like the size of Lundqvist's pads. Nothing should surprise you anymore coming from fans of other teams who despise the Rangers.

If the Rangers were doing a serious trap, opposing teams wouldnt get as many chances as they do, and it would be a lot harder for them to enter the Rangers zone. The games are exciting, I don't find myself falling asleep during games ever like I did watching the mid 90s Devils. Huge difference as a matter of fact. If I wanted to watch a trap now I'd watch certain Western Coference teams that I don't have to name.

How can some Devils fans even SAY the word trap to anyone? That is what I don't understand. Their friggin show is called The Trap for god sakes.

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Old
11-06-2007, 11:44 AM
  #11
nexusrage21
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I think some people are confused as to what "the trap" actually is.

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11-06-2007, 11:51 AM
  #12
John Torturella
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusrage21 View Post
I think some people are confused as to what "the trap" actually is.
I know and its annoying. One way you know the Rangers are not playing a trap is number of shots on goal. For those of you who dont understand, If we were playing a trap, teams would not be getting through our neutral zone. That is totally not the case. We keep the shots from low percentage angles, play with a good amount of physicallity, make great plays with sticks and clear the puck on most occasions. If all of that stuff fails, we have a brick wall in the net. Thats why our GA total is the best in the league.

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Old
11-06-2007, 11:53 AM
  #13
Vodka Drunkenski
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I'm not exactly sure how the trap generates over 40 shots and a ton of scoring chances?

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Old
11-06-2007, 11:53 AM
  #14
McRanger
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It certainly looked like a trap from where I was sitting last night.

They would pressure in some situations but more often than not they seemed to sit back with an extremely passive one man forecheck.

Who cares anyway? Using the "trap" does not equal defensive success, as most teams realized in the late 90's after several failed attempts to mimic the Devils. Our strengths are our in-zone defensive coverage and Lundqvist. Our ability to force turnovers in the neutral zone is 3rd by a large margin.

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Old
11-06-2007, 12:00 PM
  #15
Larry Melnyk
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Trap, foreecheck, puck possession, funneling everything to the outside...We have been incorporating all of it into our defensive system..And I love it....and I love the team playing this type of hockey. We have made defense and goaltending the backbone with everybody buying into it..

The best part is that there is too much skill and talent on the offense for it not to pick up and become strong..And waytch out when it does...But, when it slumps (and it will), we will still have the defense and The King to fall back on and lead us..That's the way you win Cups..

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Old
11-06-2007, 12:18 PM
  #16
n_a_c
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I would define the trap system as having a more passive stance in the neutral zone - having all players with all their sticks and bodies in the way so that the other team has a problem getting through. Two opposing strategies would be to always be aggressive on the puck, or always collapse into our zone and don't use our blue line and the offsides rule to our advantage.

It seems to me that trapping is a successful strategy, and most teams use it to some degree. I don't think the Rangers don't take it to the extreme. They do forecheck hard at times and therefore don't always collapse into a trap as soon as the opposing team has the puck. And I think they don't stand up us much on our blue line as say the Devils used to - the defensemen will move back easier and then assume good coverage on our end.

Now - one thing the trap is NOT - which it used to be for some teams especially the Devils - it is not a commitment to hook and interfere with players moving through any zone. The enforcement of the hooking rule in since 2004 has removed that old system from being viable and really increased the flow of the game. It has also mandated that if a team wants to play a good defensive game, they have to be much smarter and more flexible about it.

And one last thing - in comparing the Rangers to the Devils or saying that they play the trap - part of the comment is because the Rangers are so damn well coached and so disciplined. Just like the Devils used to be. It is a strong defensive system across all 200 feet. Not only do players rarely make mistakes, each one acts as part of a team and knows what his job is in any situation. Kudos to Renney, because the Rangers system seems at times to be flawless and unbeatable. It is a big step up from the past couple years, and the past couple years were impressive at times. Lets hope they keep it up and continue to improve.

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11-06-2007, 12:22 PM
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HockeyBasedNYC
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Cue a Devils poster....

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Old
11-06-2007, 12:28 PM
  #18
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No one can really accuse us of playing the trap when we are third in the league in shots taken per game (meaning we aren't just sitting back and playing conservatively) and aren't top six in least amount of shots given up per game. As other posters have already said, we just have an incredibly strong mix of two-way players who have been trained by the coaching staff to take responsibility in the defensive end. It's funny because I was a little concerned about our defensive offensemen when we dropped Orts who was really strong in this area. I think we should really start giving Renney and his staff their due for how uniform he has made this team. They play (at least defensively) like a five fingered organism; now let's get them to do it up front!

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11-06-2007, 12:46 PM
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DutchShamrock
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Once we learn how to transition from defense to offense with this system, the goals will pick up. With our system, we need to generate more chances in a north/south fashion... more shots off the rush as opposed to gaining the zone, pulling up and trying to thread a pass. Our defensive system just doesn't really favor waiting in the offensive zone and getting guys trapped deep.

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Old
11-06-2007, 12:47 PM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolbean04 View Post
We are winning and our team hasn't been this good in A REALLY LONG TIME!!!

I rather win 1-0 games and be solid and make it far into the playoffs

compared to

High scoring games and missing the playoffs for almost a decade.


If we can win the Stanley Cup winning 1-0 games, I'll be the happiest person alive.


You hear in basketball and football how defense wins games. Why can't we use that in hockey, we never used the "defense first" mentality. Our players are showing more responsibility by TRYING TO PLAY A TWO-WAY GAME. We should be applauding them!
Agreed 100%. That's what I said last night at the game, I'd rather lose boring than win an exciting game. Most of the time they do not play a true neutral-zone box, but they do clog the zone at points..they aren't completely immune from trapping schemes.

Nevertheless, if that's the way we won 5 out of 6 games, I'll happily take that style any day of the week. Maybe it's not always the most exciting way to watch a game, but I really only care about wins at this point.

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Old
11-06-2007, 01:24 PM
  #21
Brooklyndevil
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Originally Posted by motime42 View Post
I know and its annoying. One way you know the Rangers are not playing a trap is number of shots on goal. For those of you who dont understand, If we were playing a trap, teams would not be getting through our neutral zone. That is totally not the case. We keep the shots from low percentage angles, play with a good amount of physicallity, make great plays with sticks and clear the puck on most occasions. If all of that stuff fails, we have a brick wall in the net. Thats why our GA total is the best in the league.
Sounds a lot like the old Devils, out-shoot you opponet by a large margin and keep shots against to a low margin. The system looks pretty familiar.

And by the way, I think it's a thing of beauty the way the Rangers are playing defensively and currently have the best goaltender in the game. I personally miss not being able to win 1-0 or 2-1 games.


Last edited by Brooklyndevil: 11-06-2007 at 01:33 PM.
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Old
11-06-2007, 03:06 PM
  #22
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Isn't it great we can all sit by the campfire, where Rangers fans nowadays understand why Devils fans liked winning games 1-0 and Devils fans can look at the new Rangers and feel some nostalgia over the old Devils?

The collective defensive responsibility the Rangers roster is undertaking each game is great to watch.

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Old
11-06-2007, 03:13 PM
  #23
Garv23
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Who the hell cares? Every team plays some version of the trap. I'd prefer a couple more goals though before they sit back. That 3rd period had me nervous as hell for the first half.

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Old
11-06-2007, 07:40 PM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
We're not playing the trap though. We're playing a defensive system yes, a good one at that, but we are not clogging up the neutral zone so the other team cannot cross our blue line (which is exactly what the trap is).

Fact is, we have a lot of 2 way forwards on the team that are back checking their ass off, blocking passes, blocking shots, and forcing players to the outside. Plus our defense has been great this season, Tyutin & Girardi have been flawless, Staal is really starting to look good, Rosy and Mara have been solid for the most part, and Malik...well thats whats Lundqvist is there for (i kid).

Add in that we have one of the top PKs in the league.

Add in that we have the best goalie in the league as the moment.


Other fans can try to discredit our defensive play and goalie all they want by saying we trap, but its the little things our team is doing, and yes Lundqvist is a huge part of that when he makes the saves he should and makes the saves he shouldn't.
Yes we are, the devil fans say so, so it has to be true! We just play it from the offensive circles in. It use to be called the forecheck lock.

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Old
11-07-2007, 01:37 AM
  #25
David Puddy
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It seems to me that a lot of Rangers fans don't even know what the trap is. Perhaps it has just come to be a derogatory term used against the New Jersey Devils in the team's fans. I shall explain what it is then.

The neutral-zone trap, or One-Two-Two (Un-Deux-Deux in French,) uses one forechecker, generally the centerman, though a winger will do it on occasion and even a defenseman in rare instances. The role of the forechecker is to force to puck handler to move the puck quickly. This forechecker is the “one” in the term “One-Two-Two.”

The second part of the One-Two-Two is the other two forwards. They lineup in the neutral-zone roughly 30 feet apart.

The final part of the defensive scheme is the two defensemen creating the last set of "twos." They are spaced about 40 feet apart.

Here is a diagram that I modified in September of 2005 base on the NHL’s explanation of two-line passes now being legal. It shows the forechecker backed by the other two forwards and two defensemen forming a trapezoid in the neutral-zone.





Here are the New York Rangers using the One-Two-Two against the New York Islanders on November 6, 2007:




I personally love the One-Two-Two and wish that the New Jersey Devils still used the system. I am not going to put it down now because the Devils aren’t using it. I am sincerely a fan of it.

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