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Old
11-15-2007, 02:50 PM
  #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayMan82 View Post
Striaght up, I think it's at the lowest right now... Get him on the PP, get him some goals, and then think about trading him...

BTW, he'd be on the PP just to get his confidence going... We all know what a confident Petr Prucha can do...



You move Shanny to the 2nd PP line...
I agree throw Pru on the PP, hes got a shot and good eyes to go with it.

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Originally Posted by ThirdEye View Post
Prucha is actually a good player, he just needs to iron out the kinks in his game. Despite what some of you believe, he can still score and he's a decent playmaker at worst. Drury really struggling offensively right not is not helping him in that regard.

I can't believe some of you think he is worthless
I agree as well, we all know Prucha can score.

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11-15-2007, 03:03 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by ThirdEye View Post
Prucha is actually a good player, he just needs to iron out the kinks in his game. Despite what some of you believe, he can still score and he's a decent playmaker at worst. Drury really struggling offensively right not is not helping him in that regard.

I can't believe some of you think he is worthless
I don't think he's worthless. But, I think he is completely overrated on this board. I think he is a decent player at best. While he could be a consistent 30 goal scorer, he needs to have everything go his way to get there. He needs good players surrounding him constantly to make him seem better. He will not create anything on his own. He peaked his rookie year before the league knew about him. Now they have the book on him. With a player like him you will get more 10 goal seasons than 30 goal seasons.

And why is it that w/ Prucha everybody is screaming to give him more time and he is a proven player. It's bs. Prucha is not a proven player. Everybody wants Malik gone but he is a proven steady dman. Look how long he's been in this league. He is proven, prucha is not. If your going to cut Prucha a break cut Malik one then also.

Two years of inconsistancy does not make you proven. Proven players are players that will do the same things consistantly. Prucha has been anything but consistant. Let me reiterate his goals 30, 22, on pace for 4. Does this sound consistant? Some games hes visible most games he isn't. He is far from proven.

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11-15-2007, 03:03 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
Well he's not doing anything offensively...really.

Dawes is playing the same ice time as him but he is still finding a way to score goals.

He's got a lot of heart but is not producing. At this point Betts is more valuable IMO.

I think when Drury snaps outta his slump Prucha will get some more points so i'm not that worried yet. But Prucha hasn't earned any extra ice time at this point..

Prucha has really been invisable this season, makes a nice play every couple games or so, but reallly, he's a sniper/dangler (from his first season at least)...he sure isn't acting like one this year.
That's harsh.....Until recently, this team hasn't been doing much offensively. Prucha has shown one thing, he's a streaky scorer. Let him get on a streak.

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11-15-2007, 08:08 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by vipernsx View Post
That's harsh.....Until recently, this team hasn't been doing much offensively. Prucha has shown one thing, he's a streaky scorer. Let him get on a streak.
there's one goal... let's see if he gets a few more... maybe we woke him up

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11-15-2007, 09:15 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by vipernsx View Post
That's harsh.....Until recently, this team hasn't been doing much offensively. Prucha has shown one thing, he's a streaky scorer. Let him get on a streak.
Yes he is streaky and scores in bundles. thats a trait some players just have. thats why I get frustrated with people who want him scratched or traded. thats how he scores deal with it. 30 golas season 1, 22 the following season with limited ice time. If he gets some more help from Drury on that line having him score 20+ is not a problem.

he needs confidence hopefully this gets him going.

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11-16-2007, 05:05 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
Well he's not doing anything offensively...really.

Dawes is playing the same ice time as him but he is still finding a way to score goals.

He's got a lot of heart but is not producing. At this point Betts is more valuable IMO.

I think when Drury snaps outta his slump Prucha will get some more points so i'm not that worried yet. But Prucha hasn't earned any extra ice time at this point..

Prucha has really been invisable this season, makes a nice play every couple games or so, but reallly, he's a sniper/dangler (from his first season at least)...he sure isn't acting like one this year.
IF callahan makes it straight back into the line up (we know Straka will) and Renney is faithful with Hossa - i see Prucha (even after his goal at PHI) as the victim.

If he doesnt rack up points fairly quickly i can see him becoming trade bait. I hope not but he's not doing what he's paid to do at the end of the day.

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11-16-2007, 05:28 AM
  #82
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prucha is my favorite ranger, and id be crying if he was traded. Though he isnt producing as much as people would like, you can just tell that he has the most heart than anyone else on the team. I've never seen a player that allows himself to get a pounding time and time again just to start or continue a play.

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11-16-2007, 05:32 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Blackburn2727 View Post
prucha is my favorite ranger, and id be crying if he was traded. Though he isnt producing as much as people would like, you can just tell that he has the most heart than anyone else on the team. I've never seen a player that allows himself to get a pounding time and time again just to start or continue a play.
i love the guy too. i was pleading to keep him when everyone wanted rid of him a while back... but 2 goals in 19 games for 1.6m isnt enough. Especially when he's not effective defensively and/or on other untis like the PK.

I'd like to keep him but (in theory) if he was in a package for a rental come Deadline day that took us over the edge i would be more than willing.... and right now he's the most likely guy to be in that kind of a package.

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11-16-2007, 11:23 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
Dawes is playing the same ice time as him but he is still finding a way to score goals.
.
Yeah, cause all 4 goals that Dawes has blows all of Pruchas 2 goals out of the water by miles. Especially since Dawes has scored so much more at the NHL level . definitly keep Dawes up and send down Prucha, **** even trade him. Cause any time any one struggles the best idea is to bench them or trade them.

So I definitley see your point. it makes a ton of sense.

Hope this comment is not offensive to you.


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11-16-2007, 02:17 PM
  #85
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Petr Sucha scores one measely goal and the supporters are saying "I told you so"?

give me a break....

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11-16-2007, 02:50 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by hightide85 View Post
Petr Sucha scores one measely goal and the supporters are saying "I told you so"?

give me a break....
Where did you read that?

the amount of,whats the word, Insanity, ( a nice word to use so i dont get in trouble ) around here is ridiculous, especially with an ignorant opinion like this. I dont see where any one said that.


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11-16-2007, 03:00 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Jay88 View Post
Yes he is streaky and scores in bundles. thats a trait some players just have. thats why I get frustrated with people who want him scratched or traded. thats how he scores deal with it. 30 golas season 1, 22 the following season with limited ice time. If he gets some more help from Drury on that line having him score 20+ is not a problem.

he needs confidence hopefully this gets him going.
He's the kind of player who 8 years from now, we could be looking back and saying "this guy's scored 20 goals a year, every year since he came into the leage, and most seasons scored 30".

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11-16-2007, 03:01 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by vipernsx View Post
He's the kind of player who 8 years from now, we could be looking back and saying "this guy's scored 20 goals a year, every year since he came into the leage, and most seasons scored 30".
Or he could be Jan Hlavac.

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11-16-2007, 03:08 PM
  #89
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He'll likely replace Shanahan after he retires, which I'd think would be after this year... Keep Pruuuu at least through the middle of next season, then see how our new guys are progressing, no?

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11-16-2007, 03:12 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Or he could be Jan Hlavac.
Jesus man, lets hope he isnt . Last thing I want to hear, but I will always be a Prucha fan, espeically having the same last name. I will always have to support him

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11-16-2007, 03:25 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Jay88 View Post
Jesus man, lets hope he isnt . Last thing I want to hear, but I will always be a Prucha fan, espeically having the same last name. I will always have to support him
I like the guy too. But there has to be concerns:

- He's very streaky.

- He's small for the type of game he plays.

- He takes an awful pounding.

- Looking at his past, he doesn't have a history of being a goal scorer.

- He had fewer goals in more games last season than he did his rookie season.

- The majority of his goal scoring came from the PP. And with this team as it is, he's not going to get much time on the PP.

- If this trend continues, it is going to greatly diminish his trade value.

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11-16-2007, 03:32 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
I don't think he's worthless. But, I think he is completely overrated on this board. I think he is a decent player at best. While he could be a consistent 30 goal scorer, he needs to have everything go his way to get there. He needs good players surrounding him constantly to make him seem better. He will not create anything on his own. He peaked his rookie year before the league knew about him. Now they have the book on him. With a player like him you will get more 10 goal seasons than 30 goal seasons.

And why is it that w/ Prucha everybody is screaming to give him more time and he is a proven player. It's bs. Prucha is not a proven player. Everybody wants Malik gone but he is a proven steady dman. Look how long he's been in this league. He is proven, prucha is not. If your going to cut Prucha a break cut Malik one then also.

Two years of inconsistancy does not make you proven. Proven players are players that will do the same things consistantly. Prucha has been anything but consistant. Let me reiterate his goals 30, 22, on pace for 4. Does this sound consistant? Some games hes visible most games he isn't. He is far from proven.
I think the reason that people care for Prucha so much is three-fold:

1.) He was one of the first home grown talents that this team had brought along in years and he scored 30 goals in his rookie year.

2.) He plays "hard" meaning he skates really fast and tries to hit people on the forecheck. He's also not afraid to blockshots. This usually wins points with people more so than some other, more important things.

3.) Much maligned players like Hossa have been given better opportunities for arguably less "production."

He's got potential, sure, but he's got to be used properly. I'm also not sure that he's been the same since his injury last year. Very tentative and he still refuses to shoot the puck (with the exception of the other night). If we could even get him shooting more, as opposed to dipsy-doodling past every player, his point production would increase.

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11-16-2007, 03:43 PM
  #93
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Prucha to me is not Hlavac. Hlavac (at least in his last couple years) avoided going into combat areas. Prucha has no fear in that respect. Hlavac is also bigger and stronger. Prucha is a streaky player. He needs good linemates. He's a bit of a defensive liability and he's limited in some of the extras like penalty killing and is not our first weapon of choice on the PWP at LW. I wouldn't be surprised to see him moved this year but I think we would need to get something pretty damn good back (at least a 2nd). I would think he is available for the right price. What that price would be Sather I don't know.

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11-16-2007, 04:07 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I like the guy too. But there has to be concerns:

- He's very streaky..
Yes, he is but there are a ton of players around the league who can be streaky. Just cause he is streaky means he should be moved or scratched. he proved he can score at this level, so when ever he does its fine. he is still putting the puck in the net.
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
- He's small for the type of game he plays.
- He takes an awful pounding...
Any one his size will take a punding. Be it Dawes, Gionta or Prucha. The thing is Gionta and Dawes dont play fiesty like Prucha, which can things worse for them. Prucha playing like that shows a bit of toughness, whhc makes him being small not matter in so much of a sense maybe he can take a beating more often then not. He needs to learn to get his elbows in peoples faces, since most look to hit him when they can. The kid should also try to put on about 15 more punds, maybe even 10 would help.
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
- Looking at his past, he doesn't have a history of being a goal scorer.
- He had fewer goals in more games last season than he did his rookie season....
Ok, with showing in his past he wasnt a big time scorer why did so many pople have these big expectations of him coming here and being a top 6 player?
Also thats the problem he had 2 good seasons. and when people have good season goal scoring wise they expect to be like that regularly. now wether or not he does it consistently, or streaky or gets hot for 10 games and slows down for 10-15 games, who cares the point is he is still producing, so i dont see hwat the complaint is. he works hard night in and out and never slows down, its shows he wants to score and play good, but he struglles, its not like he is being lazy and giving up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
- The majority of his goal scoring came from the PP. And with this team as it is, he's not going to get much time on the PP.
- If this trend continues, it is going to greatly diminish his trade value.
To the first comment about the PP. he will not get much, but he should cause thats where he has succeeded most, so why not put him there. Especially when he plays so well with Jagr. Prucha should be on line 1 with jagr instead of 3. I also figure Renney is trying to spread out scroing and defensive players through the lineup in jopes of havin3 top lines that can just about score somewhat equally.As for his trade value dimiinshing, ts not really his fault. he is not given proper minutes and PP to succeed, and thats where he is most valuable, and other teams do know that. which is why when people say trade him its to a team where he will get 2nd line/ first line mnutes power play time etc... exactly what he needs. in so much of a sense Prucha is not being used right here, but i think renney exp[ects more from him then the type of player he is. prucha doesnt creat plays he finishes them and does a great job at that. thats just his game. And its been no different since he first started here in NY.

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Originally Posted by BigE View Post
I think the reason that people care for Prucha so much is three-fold:

1.) He was one of the first home grown talents that this team had brought along in years and he scored 30 goals in his rookie year.

2.) He plays "hard" meaning he skates really fast and tries to hit people on the forecheck. He's also not afraid to blockshots. This usually wins points with people more so than some other, more important things.

3.) Much maligned players like Hossa have been given better opportunities for arguably less "production."

He's got potential, sure, but he's got to be used properly. I'm also not sure that he's been the same since his injury last year. Very tentative and he still refuses to shoot the puck (with the exception of the other night). If we could even get him shooting more, as opposed to dipsy-doodling past every player, his point production would increase.
some more valid points about Prucha, and just about every reason I like the guy. especially your second point. hard work is a major thing. Wanting to play the game and playing with emotion is a big thing and truley matters. Teams need player like that, cause thats what helps you win, watching a player play like that can be a big boost for a team and it can be big on nights when a team is feeling like its not on there game. almost ike a player dropping the gloves to give his team a boost.


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11-16-2007, 04:12 PM
  #95
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Any one his size will take a punding. Be it Dawes, Gionta or Prucha. The thing is Gionta and Dawes dont play fiesty like Prucha, which can things worse for them. Prucha playing like that shows a bit of toughness, whhc makes him being small not matter in so much of a sense maybe he can take a beating more often then not. He needs to learn to get his elbows in peoples faces, since most look to hit him when they can.

you must be watching a different prucha. no one in the nhl gets train wrecked more than prucha.

and yes he is tought, no doubt, but that toughness won't help him from having a injury.

he needs at least another 15 lbs. that will help him take hits better, and not be rubbed off the puck so easily.

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11-16-2007, 04:27 PM
  #96
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some more valid points about Prucha, and just about every reason I like the guy. especially your second point. hard work is a major thing. Wanting to play the game and playing with emotion is a big thing and truley matters. Teams need player like that, cause thats what helps you win, watching a player play like that can be a big boost for a team and it can be big on nights when a team is feeling like its not on there game. almost ike a player dropping the gloves to give his team a boost.
You would be someone that falls into that category then.

I hope you do not confuse the nature of my post. Those are the reasons why people seem to like him. Are they compelling? I don't think so.

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11-16-2007, 06:11 PM
  #97
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Yes, he is but there are a ton of players around the league who can be streaky. Just cause he is streaky means he should be moved or scratched. he proved he can score at this level, so when ever he does its fine. he is still putting the puck in the net.
No, but being streaky means you might have to put up with 17 games of no offensive production.


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Originally Posted by Jay88 View Post
Any one his size will take a punding. Be it Dawes, Gionta or Prucha. The thing is Gionta and Dawes dont play fiesty like Prucha, which can things worse for them. Prucha playing like that shows a bit of toughness, whhc makes him being small not matter in so much of a sense maybe he can take a beating more often then not. He needs to learn to get his elbows in peoples faces, since most look to hit him when they can. The kid should also try to put on about 15 more punds, maybe even 10 would help...
I love Gionta. That said, I have to wonder how many good seasons he's really going to have because of his size. I think he'll be hard pressed to ever reach 89 points again. Theo Fleury is the exception, not the rule.

Gionta and Dawes also seemed to be more adept at avoiding the big hits. They don't take the kind of hits that Prucha does. And that is going to effect his production.

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Ok, with showing in his past he wasnt a big time scorer why did so many pople have these big expectations of him coming here and being a top 6 player
I don't think anyone had big expectations for him. It's hard to project a guy who's best season was 11 goals to be a top six player. That's why he's such a feel good story. He was always deemed to be a long shot and a guy who was an interesting prospect. He also came along at a very dark time in this team's history (both in where they were and their poor history of developing talent).

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Also thats the problem he had 2 good seasons. and when people have good season goal scoring wise they expect to be like that regularly. now wether or not he does it consistently, or streaky or gets hot for 10 games and slows down for 10-15 games, who cares the point is he is still producing, so i dont see hwat the complaint is. he works hard night in and out and never slows down, its shows he wants to score and play good, but he struglles, its not like he is being lazy and giving up
Did he really have two good seasons? Again, he had fewer goals in more games in his second season compared to his first.

His hustle is great. But when he's not scoring, his not much more than a Jed Ortmeyer.

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To the first comment about the PP. he will not get much, but he should cause thats where he has succeeded most, so why not put him there. Especially when he plays so well with Jagr. Prucha should be on line 1 with jagr instead of 3. I also figure Renney is trying to spread out scroing and defensive players through the lineup in jopes of havin3 top lines that can just about score somewhat equally.
What should happen and what will happen are two different things.

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As for his trade value dimiinshing, ts not really his fault. he is not given proper minutes and PP to succeed, and thats where he is most valuable, and other teams do know that. which is why when people say trade him its to a team where he will get 2nd line/ first line mnutes power play time etc... exactly what he needs. in so much of a sense Prucha is not being used right here, but i think renney exp[ects more from him then the type of player he is. prucha doesnt creat plays he finishes them and does a great job at that. thats just his game. And its been no different since he first started here in NY.
Nobody is blaming Prucha for his trade value diminishing. But there are other players who have produced more consistently in the same type of minutes.

He might need first line minutes to be effective - but he's not going to get them. So you're looking a player that doesn't exist. The bottom line is for right or for wrong, he's got some competition. Maybe last night gets him on a roll. For his sake I hope so.

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11-16-2007, 06:17 PM
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You would be someone that falls into that category then.

I hope you do not confuse the nature of my post. Those are the reasons why people seem to like him. Are they compelling? I don't think so.
I think they are compelling and true. I mean those traits atre great to have in any player.

now the difference is if they loved him for that and lets say he got 15-20 minutes a game season long for the next 2 or 3 seasons and put in 7 or 8 goals, then its a probelem. But overall he has the talent and the heart and thats big thing.

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11-16-2007, 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by BigE View Post
I think the reason that people care for Prucha so much is three-fold:

1.) He was one of the first home grown talents that this team had brought along in years and he scored 30 goals in his rookie year.

2.) He plays "hard" meaning he skates really fast and tries to hit people on the forecheck. He's also not afraid to blockshots. This usually wins points with people more so than some other, more important things.

3.) Much maligned players like Hossa have been given better opportunities for arguably less "production."

He's got potential, sure, but he's got to be used properly. I'm also not sure that he's been the same since his injury last year. Very tentative and he still refuses to shoot the puck (with the exception of the other night). If we could even get him shooting more, as opposed to dipsy-doodling past every player, his point production would increase.
I think there's a lot to this. Great post BigE.

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11-16-2007, 06:36 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
1-No, but being streaky means you might have to put up with 17 games of no offensive production.

2-Gionta and Dawes also seemed to be more adept at avoiding the big hits. They don't take the kind of hits that Prucha does. And that is going to effect his production.

3-Did he really have two good seasons? Again, he had fewer goals in more games in his second season compared to his first.

4-His hustle is great. But when he's not scoring, his not much more than a Jed Ortmeyer.

5-Nobody is blaming Prucha for his trade value diminishing. But there are other players who have produced more consistently in the same type of minutes.

6-He might need first line minutes to be effective - but he's not going to get them. So you're looking a player that doesn't exist. The bottom line is for right or for wrong, he's got some competition. Maybe last night gets him on a roll. For his sake I hope so.
1- I cold deal with a steak of lets say no points for 17 games. but this is hockey and its a team soport you know that as well as i do. And it dont matter what team it is, usually slacking players get picked up by other players.Which is why teams, especially the team NYR built this year is basically constructed like that. They have lines 1-3 and those 3 lines should be able to just abut produce, not exactly equally but close in all offensve aspects of the game. and with that it helps when players have slumps, knowing other lines and or players can pick it up.

2-yes they do avoid hits and the funny thing is i was going to say its what Prucha has to try to do. unfortubatley his hits ar ********. he really hasent gotten leveled or flattened. ( Stevens on lindors in the playoffs type of hit ). But more basically some one over powers him along the boards he falls on his ass and gets right up. He is yet to really put himself in any sort of career ending injury by hit position. he is a good puck carrier if he wants to be, not great but is good when to dish it off and avoid a big hit to that extent.

3- yes in so much a sense he did. In season one he got some solid ice time, plenty of first line minutes and PP time, and netted 30 goals as a rookie, first year in NA. proper time and being with the proper players helped out a ton.

Now for season 2. he went from first and second line minutes, to being a healthy scratch, to being moved to the 3rd and 4th lines all year. Ice time cut drastically. Still played the same every night no mater where in the lineup he was. Still; managed to put 22 away. So i do believe he had 2 solid seasons. had he been treated last year the way he was in his rookie year and not **** on because of some slow or bad games, i believe he would have netted 33-35 goals. prucha is not a playmaker but needs a player to help him finish,which he does. You got goal scroers,finishers, play makers and all around guys. Prucha is just a finisher.

4- Well when just about anyone isnt scoring there just the same. What makes Prucha so comparable to Ortmeyer cause he aint scoring. What use is Jagr , Shannahan, Straka, Callahan etc... they are just like Ortmeyers as well. your comparison is just a shot at Prucha.

5-Like who? Dawes, thats bogus. Cause callahan, Dubinsky Dawes are not. Maybe seasoned veterans, but not any one on NYR with just his 3 year in the NHL, going through such discrimination in so many ways ( by fans and especially the coaching staff, who obviusley has this problem with Prucha but this huge love for a completly crappy player in Hossa ), has done anything like he has. he has been a + here more than a - IMO.

6- i hope it gets him on a role. but putting player with Jagr, Shanny, Gomez, Straka is a huge help. Dawes and Drury arent exactly ighting up the league and helping Prucha. 3 players per line they all need to contribute, one cant do it all. So its all about who are playing with. I mean hossa looks like crap out there, meanwhile Prucha should be in his spot. Him and jagr work quit well together, IMO atleast.

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