HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Notices

Hats Off To Sather

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-03-2007, 02:29 PM
  #76
RangerBoy
1994 FOREVER
 
RangerBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 31,536
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedtrials View Post
If you read Nightmare on 33rd Street a book written by Carpiniello about Sather's first season, he brings up that a deal was worked out that would have sent Tkachuk and Khabibulin to the Rangers for Fluery and a package of prospects. However, Fluery went to rehab, and the deal fell apart. I really wonder if that deal was made, and Richter was also moved for something, what those years before the lockout would have been like?
It was Richter,Fleury,Brendl and Lundmark for Tkachuk and the Bulin Wall.Al Strachan wrote that in the Toronto Sun.October 2000

RangerBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2007, 02:32 PM
  #77
The Thomas J.*
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Staten Island, NY
Posts: 18,847
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by chosen View Post
Sather wasn't the GM when Gretz and Mess came aboard. He lasted a long time because he had handed to him the greatest pair of players ever to play at the same time on the same team. He is revered as a God of Hockey in Canada because of those teams even though he didn't draft the two most important parts (by far).

If you look through Sather's history of drafting it is beyond terrible, aside from one season where he got Kurri, Coffey and Fuhr (I think). I didn't check.

ok, according to this...........

From wikiapedia
Sather became head coach of the Oilers in 1977 and maintained the post when they joined the NHL in 1979-80. After taking them to the first round of the playoffs in their inaugural season, he was promoted to General Manager. This was the start of a tremendous run for the Oilers, who became a genuine NHL dynasty with him as the coach and GM. The team made the playoffs with Sather as head coach from 1979-80 until 1984-85. From 1985 until 1989, Sather split coaching duties with John Muckler, but retained the title of head coach. With Sather at the helm in various duties, the team won five Stanley Cups in seven years, after losing in the finals to the New York Islanders in 1983.

Dynasty years (1979-1990)

The Oilers after their 1988 Stanley Cup victory.The Oilers lost most of the players from 1978-79 when the NHL held a reclamation draft of players who had bolted to the upstart league. However, they were allowed to keep one key player, the 18-year-old Wayne Gretzky. However, GM/coach Glen Sather carefully restocked the roster in the expansion draft. This enabled the Oilers to put together a fairly respectable team quickly. In marked contrast, the Jets finished dead last in the league two years in a row. The Oilers benefited from an early run of success in the Entry Draft, acquiring within three years an outstanding core of young players, including Mark Messier, Glenn Anderson, Jari Kurri, Paul Coffey, Kevin Lowe, Grant Fuhr, and Andy Moog.

It appears Gretzky wasn't drafted by Sather, although its not clear @ all who drafted Gretzky, one could assume Sather played a role in Dreafting the great one, How ever its quite clear in the article that Sather DID DRAFT MESSIER, he also drafted Glenn Anderson, Jari Kurri, Paul Coffey, Kevin Lowe, Grant Fuhr, and Andy Moog.

So, as far as being an overrated GM who was handed the teams two best players you are incorrect.

The Thomas J.* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2007, 02:32 PM
  #78
JerseyRangers
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Jersey City, NJ
Country: Ukraine
Posts: 1,606
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Thomas J. View Post
you have to remember that Smith traded alot of picks in 99 to get Lundmark & Brendl, those trades SMITH MADE handcuffed us draft wise in 99', 00' & 01' thats 3 years right there, Sather did what he had to do, got free agents that should have preformed & dealt them for picks & younger talent, when it blew up in his face, which I think part of him knew it would.

As frustrated as I was with Sather I always knew he had a plan, the one move that would have killed me was if he dealt Richter, cause there was NOTHING Goaltending wise in the system, I mean look @ the goaltending we had when Richter was hurt , Maclean, Hebert, Dunham & marraken, These were all b level goalies, I'm not counting Blackburn because he was too young to really have any impact.
Yep, Smith ravaged the system and left nothing there after the 99 draft. Sather was brought in at a time when we had no youth, a very old roster and in the middle of some of the worst Rangers teams we'd seen in a while. Without any tradeable assets in the system he continued to sign free agents. Granted some of his signings were absolutely awful! Some of his signings and trades (Bure and Lindros come to mind) blew up in his face when the assets got injured.

Doesn't change the fact that since 2004 he's completely retooled and we have a young team with alot of talent in Hartford. Whether or not that pans out is one thing. However, as Uncle Larry points out there are alot of tradeable assets in the system -- something that we didn't have in 2000. For that he deserves credit!

JerseyRangers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2007, 02:33 PM
  #79
The Thomas J.*
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Staten Island, NY
Posts: 18,847
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
It was Richter,Fleury,Brendl and Lundmark for Tkachuk and the Bulin Wall.Al Strachan wrote that in the Toronto Sun.October 2000
yep remember that well, the Blues wanted Richter BAD that was a 3 team deal, who was the 3rd team?

The Thomas J.* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2007, 02:35 PM
  #80
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,779
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Thomas J. View Post
yep remember that well, the Blues wanted Richter BAD that was a 3 team deal, who was the 3rd team?
I think you are thinking of the potentials three way deal what would have sent Nedved to the Yotes, Primeau to the Rangers and Tkachuk to the Canes. Or something along those lines involving Nedved and Primeau.

__________________
SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2007, 02:36 PM
  #81
JerseyRangers
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Jersey City, NJ
Country: Ukraine
Posts: 1,606
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Thomas J. View Post
It appears Gretzky wasn't drafted by Sather, although its not clear @ all who drafted Gretzky, one could assume Sather played a role in Dreafting the great one, How ever its quite clear in the article that Sather DID DRAFT MESSIER, he also drafted Glenn Anderson, Jari Kurri, Paul Coffey, Kevin Lowe, Grant Fuhr, and Andy Moog.

So, as far as being an overrated GM who was handed the teams two best players you are incorrect.
Actually, I can't remember if he was drafted or not. I know Mess actually played for someone else (Indianapolis Racers) and was traded to Edmonton while in the WHL. Not sure how Gretz came into the WHL -- need to look it up but too lazy!

JerseyRangers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2007, 02:43 PM
  #82
Bluenote13
Believe In Henke
 
Bluenote13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: BKLYN, NYC
Posts: 23,633
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyRangers View Post
Actually, I can't remember if he was drafted or not. I know Mess actually played for someone else (Indianapolis Racers) and was traded to Edmonton while in the WHL. Not sure how Gretz came into the WHL -- need to look it up but too lazy!
Gretz was also on the Indianapolis Racers

Bluenote13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2007, 02:57 PM
  #83
JerseyRangers
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Jersey City, NJ
Country: Ukraine
Posts: 1,606
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Gretz was also on the Indianapolis Racers
Now I'm wondering if I got the two mixed up. I'm pretty sure that Mess started somewhere else. Anyone know for sure?

JerseyRangers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2007, 03:09 PM
  #84
Bluenote13
Believe In Henke
 
Bluenote13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: BKLYN, NYC
Posts: 23,633
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyRangers View Post
Now I'm wondering if I got the two mixed up. I'm pretty sure that Mess started somewhere else. Anyone know for sure?
Mess was on the Indy team also, but later was released and picked up by the WHA's Cincinatti club.

Then the next year when Edmonton became an NHL team the Oilers took Mess 48th overall(3rd round).

Bluenote13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2007, 03:36 PM
  #85
chosen
Registered User
 
chosen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,611
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Thomas J. View Post
ok, according to this...........

From wikiapedia
Sather became head coach of the Oilers in 1977 and maintained the post when they joined the NHL in 1979-80. After taking them to the first round of the playoffs in their inaugural season, he was promoted to General Manager. This was the start of a tremendous run for the Oilers, who became a genuine NHL dynasty with him as the coach and GM. The team made the playoffs with Sather as head coach from 1979-80 until 1984-85. From 1985 until 1989, Sather split coaching duties with John Muckler, but retained the title of head coach. With Sather at the helm in various duties, the team won five Stanley Cups in seven years, after losing in the finals to the New York Islanders in 1983.

Dynasty years (1979-1990)

The Oilers after their 1988 Stanley Cup victory.The Oilers lost most of the players from 1978-79 when the NHL held a reclamation draft of players who had bolted to the upstart league. However, they were allowed to keep one key player, the 18-year-old Wayne Gretzky. However, GM/coach Glen Sather carefully restocked the roster in the expansion draft. This enabled the Oilers to put together a fairly respectable team quickly. In marked contrast, the Jets finished dead last in the league two years in a row. The Oilers benefited from an early run of success in the Entry Draft, acquiring within three years an outstanding core of young players, including Mark Messier, Glenn Anderson, Jari Kurri, Paul Coffey, Kevin Lowe, Grant Fuhr, and Andy Moog.

It appears Gretzky wasn't drafted by Sather, although its not clear @ all who drafted Gretzky, one could assume Sather played a role in Dreafting the great one, How ever its quite clear in the article that Sather DID DRAFT MESSIER, he also drafted Glenn Anderson, Jari Kurri, Paul Coffey, Kevin Lowe, Grant Fuhr, and Andy Moog.

So, as far as being an overrated GM who was handed the teams two best players you are incorrect.
The draft of Messsier took place on August 9, 1979.


http://www.oilersheritage.com/legacy...lensather.html

The following is an excerpt from the above link from the Oilers site:

After the Edmonton Oilers completed their first National Hockey League (NHL) season in 1979-80, Peter Pocklington made a bold move.

The Oilers’ colourful and controversial owner gave Glen Sather complete control of the team as general manager and president. Sather, a native of High River, Alberta, was already the head coach of the club. Now, he would be expected to build it up.
__________________________________________________ ____________________

If Sather took over after the 79-80 season and Messier was drafted in August of 1979 how could Sather have selected Messier?

He didn't draft either of them.

By the way, whoever drafted Gretzky was no genius. Everyone already knew he would be great.

Sather had one excellent draft....... in all of his years in Edmonton.

I think I'm correct unless you have some other proof of your opinion.

Sather is a myth, not a legend.


Last edited by chosen: 12-03-2007 at 03:56 PM.
chosen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2007, 04:56 PM
  #86
JerseyRangers
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Jersey City, NJ
Country: Ukraine
Posts: 1,606
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by chosen View Post
The draft of Messsier took place on August 9, 1979.


http://www.oilersheritage.com/legacy...lensather.html

The following is an excerpt from the above link from the Oilers site:

After the Edmonton Oilers completed their first National Hockey League (NHL) season in 1979-80, Peter Pocklington made a bold move.

The Oilers’ colourful and controversial owner gave Glen Sather complete control of the team as general manager and president. Sather, a native of High River, Alberta, was already the head coach of the club. Now, he would be expected to build it up.
__________________________________________________ ____________________

If Sather took over after the 79-80 season and Messier was drafted in August of 1979 how could Sather have selected Messier?

He didn't draft either of them.

By the way, whoever drafted Gretzky was no genius. Everyone already knew he would be great.

Sather had one excellent draft....... in all of his years in Edmonton.

I think I'm correct unless you have some other proof of your opinion.

Sather is a myth, not a legend.
I don't completely agree. The Oilers drafted pretty well until the mid 90's. Then the bottom fell out. Also, you forget that he made some pretty good trades during the 80's and even in the 90's when the Oilers where a small budget team he kept them competitive. Did he draft as well as the Detriot or NJ orgs? Probably not! But he certainly did better than alot of gm's during that time.

Still, how can you completely overlook what he's done the last 3 or 4 years with the Rangers. His drafting record during that time is very good. Are you saying that his earlier work with the Rangers cancels anything good he has done since? I don't subscribe to the train of thought that says he is a legend. I do, however, believe that he is a good gm and probably one of the better gm's the Rangers have had in a long, long time!

JerseyRangers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2007, 10:08 PM
  #87
The Thomas J.*
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Staten Island, NY
Posts: 18,847
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I think you are thinking of the potentials three way deal what would have sent Nedved to the Yotes, Primeau to the Rangers and Tkachuk to the Canes. Or something along those lines involving Nedved and Primeau.
Maybe, I remember the talk of the trade, but not all the key players.

The Thomas J.* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2007, 10:11 PM
  #88
The Thomas J.*
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Staten Island, NY
Posts: 18,847
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by chosen View Post
The draft of Messsier took place on August 9, 1979.


http://www.oilersheritage.com/legacy...lensather.html

The following is an excerpt from the above link from the Oilers site:

After the Edmonton Oilers completed their first National Hockey League (NHL) season in 1979-80, Peter Pocklington made a bold move.

The Oilers’ colourful and controversial owner gave Glen Sather complete control of the team as general manager and president. Sather, a native of High River, Alberta, was already the head coach of the club. Now, he would be expected to build it up.
__________________________________________________ ____________________

If Sather took over after the 79-80 season and Messier was drafted in August of 1979 how could Sather have selected Messier?

He didn't draft either of them.

By the way, whoever drafted Gretzky was no genius. Everyone already knew he would be great.

Sather had one excellent draft....... in all of his years in Edmonton.

I think I'm correct unless you have some other proof of your opinion.

Sather is a myth, not a legend.
The expansion draft was held in Auguest.

The Thomas J.* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-04-2007, 12:05 AM
  #89
McRanger
Registered User
 
McRanger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,703
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by chosen View Post
Smith ravaged and happened to win a Cup. You and several others are ignoring that part of his tenure. For us older fans that is worth something.

Sather kept us in the Dark Ages well after the effect of Smith was gone. We are now supposed to pay tribute to a man who had the helm of a team that couldn't get a Playoff spot for the best part of a decade?

He bought Jagr when that was still possible under the old setup. Without Jagr this team would still probably be a borderline playoff team at best. If it were not for Lundqvist this whole story would be playing out a whole lot differently.

We are all happy about what appears to be in the pipeline but those of us that have been around more than a few years understand that the leap from pipeline to NHL success is very far from a given.

Staal is the real deal. Girardi, despite his recently relevantly poor play will probably be a success story. All of the others, like Callahan, Prucha etc. may blossom or may turn out to be nothing worth tooting a horn about.

With all of this great "success" I still don't see any great offensive players happening. Perhaps Cherry will be that but it's way too early to consider it.

Keep in mind that Sather is the most overrated GM of my lifetime. What he accomplished in Edmonton was done on the backs of Gretzky and Messier, neither of whom were drafted by Sather. Sather had one excellent drafting year in his entire time there.

We are NOT comparing Sather and Smith. Lets get that straight right off the bat. Aside from that being irrelevant its also one sided since Smith has won a cup in NY and Sather has not.

What we are talking about is responsibility for the debacle that was 97-98 to the year before the lockout. 7 years of no playoffs with little to show for it.

Sather kept us in the Dark Ages well after the effect of Smith was gone? You are a fool if you think we aren't still feeling the effects of Smith. The guys from the mid-to late 90's drafts are just hitting there prime. They are the players that should be forming the core of our team right now. We wouldn't need to tie up 100 million dollars in Gomez and Drury if we had developed our own players. I have no problem with any of the cup trades (aside from maybe the Gartner trade which) but they are irrelevant anyway, the players Smith traded for the cup are all leaving their prime.

If you want to give Smith a pass for screwing up the team, fine. But to deny his part is insane. Both Smith and Sather are responsible, and Smith more so IMO.

As for the lack of young offensive superstars, might that be because the majority of our top picks under Sather have been Goalies and Defensemen?

McRanger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-04-2007, 01:11 AM
  #90
tailfins
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 390
vCash: 500
I think you have to give Sather a lot of credit for where the Rangers are today. The fact that the Rangers were so bad (yet never truly terrible) for so long says that not just anyone could have turned the ship around - otherwise someone would have done it earlier.

That said, Sather certainly had a hand in the Rangers failures. The Ron Low and Bryan Trottier regimes were miserable. The Holik signing was the hallmark of mismanagement. Meanwhile, how did Sather do in drafting? Here are Sather's top two picks by year since 2001:

2001: Blackburn and Tyutin
2002: Falardeau, Jonasen
2003: Jessiman, Baranka
2004: Montoya, Korpikoski
2005: Staal, Sauer
2006: Sanguinetti, Anisimov
2007: Chrepanov, Lafleur

Other notables from this time include Prucha, Hollweg, Dawes, Byers, Dubinsky, Callahan.

Overall, this seems like a pretty mixed record, particularly considering where the Rangers were or could have been drafting. Clearly, 2004 has turned out to be a strong draft, and 2005 looks promising. 2006 and 2007 is too early to tell, but 2001 - 2003 is pretty miserable.

It is remarkable what a turnaround there's been, and how big of a year 2004 is becoming for Sather / the Rangers. His draft picks started getting better, his trades improved (getting Jagr, shedding Leetch and Kovy) and his FA signings have been better. Risky moves that probably would have blown up in his face have actually worked - namely picking up Avery.

Is the current success worth the amateur-hour mismanagement of the Rangers pre-2004? If they win a Cup soon, I think everyone would say yes. If the Rangers turn into another version of the late 90s early 2000s St. Louis Blues, though? Hard to tell.

tailfins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-04-2007, 02:05 AM
  #91
chosen
Registered User
 
chosen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,611
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by McRanger View Post
We are NOT comparing Sather and Smith. Lets get that straight right off the bat. Aside from that being irrelevant its also one sided since Smith has won a cup in NY and Sather has not.
One sided is the best way to describe it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by McRanger View Post
What we are talking about is responsibility for the debacle that was 97-98 to the year before the lockout. 7 years of no playoffs with little to show for it.

Sather kept us in the Dark Ages well after the effect of Smith was gone? You are a fool if you think we aren't still feeling the effects of Smith. The guys from the mid-to late 90's drafts are just hitting there prime. They are the players that should be forming the core of our team right now. We wouldn't need to tie up 100 million dollars in Gomez and Drury if we had developed our own players. I have no problem with any of the cup trades (aside from maybe the Gartner trade which) but they are irrelevant anyway, the players Smith traded for the cup are all leaving their prime.

If you want to give Smith a pass for screwing up the team, fine. But to deny his part is insane. Both Smith and Sather are responsible, and Smith more so IMO.

As for the lack of young offensive superstars, might that be because the majority of our top picks under Sather have been Goalies and Defensemen?
The majority of his picks have been defensemen and goalies is now an excuse (untrue) for producing zero impact forwards in 10 years?

To date, his best forward drafted is who? Is it Prucha? Based just on luck he couldn't better that? Sure some may be coming that are better. Maybe after a 20 year tenure he can draft an impact forward.

chosen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-04-2007, 02:07 AM
  #92
chosen
Registered User
 
chosen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,611
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Thomas J. View Post
The expansion draft was held in Auguest.
And?

chosen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-04-2007, 02:36 AM
  #93
Beacon
Sent to HF Minors
 
Beacon's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 8,029
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vatchern View Post
My hat is off for now. If he dares to sign Mara or Malik or Strudwick in the off season, my hat goes back on.
What's wrong with Strudwick? He's a decent 6-7 dman who comes cheap. Good vet, makes the right play.

Beacon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-04-2007, 02:39 AM
  #94
Beacon
Sent to HF Minors
 
Beacon's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 8,029
vCash: 500
"I'd like to agree with you here, but Sather will have a lot of work to do this summer, specifically on the blueline.. and we can't expect there to be a significant upgrade made in each roster spot. That said, if any one of those guys stays, but takes less money, I wouldn't complain, as they are capable of being 4th/5th/6th dmen."

Let's see how Pasta develops in Juniors. He has 40 pointsin 28 games so far, looking increasingly like Zubov. When you consider that we already have Staal, Girardi and Tyutin, we may not need as much help on D as I previously presumed.

Beacon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-04-2007, 08:47 AM
  #95
Shadowtron
Registered User
 
Shadowtron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Earth
Posts: 5,509
vCash: 500
Gretzky was not drafted. He was signed by the Racers of the WHA and then, when the writing was on the wall for the WHA, was sold to the owners of the Edmonton Oilers (who were still in the WHA at that time). They moved up to the NHL and took Gretz with them.

Shadowtron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-04-2007, 08:47 AM
  #96
Shadowtron
Registered User
 
Shadowtron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Earth
Posts: 5,509
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynHockey99 View Post
"I'd like to agree with you here, but Sather will have a lot of work to do this summer, specifically on the blueline.. and we can't expect there to be a significant upgrade made in each roster spot. That said, if any one of those guys stays, but takes less money, I wouldn't complain, as they are capable of being 4th/5th/6th dmen."

Let's see how Pasta develops in Juniors. He has 40 pointsin 28 games so far, looking increasingly like Zubov. When you consider that we already have Staal, Girardi and Tyutin, we may not need as much help on D as I previously presumed.
Who?

Shadowtron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-04-2007, 09:01 AM
  #97
clmetsfan
Registered User
 
clmetsfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 3,780
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowtron View Post
Who?
Sanguinetti...no idea when he became Pasta

clmetsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-04-2007, 09:24 AM
  #98
Shadowtron
Registered User
 
Shadowtron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Earth
Posts: 5,509
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by clmetsfan View Post
Sanguinetti...no idea when he became Pasta
They must have forgot us when they sent out the name-change memo.

Shadowtron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-04-2007, 10:12 AM
  #99
The Thomas J.*
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Staten Island, NY
Posts: 18,847
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by chosen View Post
And?
And............If you want to hate Sather thats fine, but you can't sit here & say he is overrated & ilrelavant, than you're either spiteful or crazy, Even if Sather did not draft messier & Gretz he still coached them & molded them into great players & people.
Sathers draft history has been decent, he always drafted NHL players for the most part.
We both posted team history stats, I'll lean in the direction that yours may be more accurate since you took it from the ilers website.

The Thomas J.* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-04-2007, 11:11 AM
  #100
chosen
Registered User
 
chosen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,611
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Thomas J. View Post
And............If you want to hate Sather thats fine, but you can't sit here & say he is overrated & ilrelavant, than you're either spiteful or crazy, Even if Sather did not draft messier & Gretz he still coached them & molded them into great players & people.
Sathers draft history has been decent, he always drafted NHL players for the most part.
We both posted team history stats, I'll lean in the direction that yours may be more accurate since you took it from the ilers website.
So you agree with my facts but disagree with my conclusions.

If you want to present him as being a good coach for his tenure in Edmonton, that would at least have a chance of being true and I can't make an argument against it.

After admitting that he did not draft Gretzky or Messier, based on his overall body of work, how can you justify his being hailed as an outstanding GM while at Edmonton, and he is pretty much thought of that way. He is the definition of overrated because he is given credit for great things that he had zero to do with as a GM.

The reason is that there is this tremendous misconception surrounding the building of the great Oilers teams. Most people, like yourself, operate under the impression that Sather is responsible for bringing Gretzky and Messier there. Since that isn't true, the rest of his work there is somewhere between poor and terrible aside from one good draft.

If you are Canadian, I understand, because there they are blind when it comes to him.

As to his molding of Messier, perhaps, but Gretzky was already fully molded before he knew who Sather was.

By the way, I loved Sather as a player. He was a clever dirtbag. I don't hate him. I hate all of the false accolades.

chosen is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:23 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.