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The "Lets propose tradez thread"

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Old
12-11-2007, 04:48 PM
  #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obobo23 View Post
Guys, just ignore the Toronto poster. He didn't propose that crappy trade here, it was on the main boards awhile ago. He got properly reamed for it there, he doesn't need to defend it here. The only relevence is it shows how little his opinion of fair trade value is worth.
My problem isn't the proposal, I got little to no beef with that. Sure, I don't like it, and would never do it, but it's not like Schneider and edm 1st for 2nd. My beef is that he has the stupidity to call a player who can't even legally drink in the states a bust.

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12-11-2007, 04:52 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by McLovin View Post
My problem isn't the proposal, I got little to no beef with that. Sure, I don't like it, and would never do it, but it's not like Schneider and edm 1st for 2nd. My beef is that he has the stupidity to call a player who can't even legally drink in the states a bust.
Yeah but it's just his reasoning for the proposal. Just let him live in ignorant bliss. Ignore it and he'll go away.

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Old
12-11-2007, 05:05 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by DougGilmour93 View Post
He was taken with the 2nd overall choice in 2005. That's almost 3 years ago and still hasn't made a splash yet while other players taken after him have made some noise or at least made the NHL by now.
It's way too early to write off Ryan. Not everybody can be like Crosby/Ovechkin and have a huge impact within 2 years of their draft year.

It's not about how fast you get to the NHL, else Mike Milbury would be hailed as a genius. The 1990s Islanders screwed up enough of their prospects by pushing them too soon.

On the other hand, good teams like the Avalanche, Red Wings, and Devils could take their time with their prospects and bring them in at the right time. Hejduk/Drury were 22 when he made the NHL. Zetterberg was 22 while Datsyuk was 23.

Ryan hasn't even turned 21 yet. A bit premature to label him the next Pavel Brendl. Zach Parise was 21 when he debuted in the NHL and he was awful his first ~40 games. Obviously Parise's turned out fine, but that shows you can't judge a guy this early. Especially if you're trying to make an argument for guys like Luc Bourdon, Nicklas Bergfors, etc who are equally unproven.

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12-11-2007, 05:24 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Brodeur View Post
On the other hand, good teams like the Avalanche, Red Wings, and Devils could take their time with their prospects and bring them in at the right time.
What's so often overlooked when Ryan bashers get going is that good teams never draft second overall. Here the Ducks are, a team that went to the SCF, the WCF, then won the cup, drafting 2nd overall because of the screwy lottery.

They have no need for Ryan to be in the NHL so he's not. Its less a reflection on Ryan than that of the team that drafted him.

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12-11-2007, 06:33 PM
  #55
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I hope you guys realize, we're probably not going to get anything of real value back, unless we trade Beauchemin. If we get a 3rd round pick for Schnieder, I'll be happy. Sure, his value is higher than that, but with his cap hit, his value shoots down. So...don't be expecting a big return.

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12-11-2007, 07:00 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by DucksRule00 View Post
I hope you guys realize, we're probably not going to get anything of real value back, unless we trade Beauchemin. If we get a 3rd round pick for Schnieder, I'll be happy. Sure, his value is higher than that, but with his cap hit, his value shoots down. So...don't be expecting a big return.
The return for Schneider will be better than that. The only way he is traded is if the team is somehow improved as a result.

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Old
12-11-2007, 07:56 PM
  #57
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I don't know what team would take Marchant and his inflated salary - even for free. Anaheim would almost have to give up a pick as well just to get rid of Todd. I hope I'm wrong!

Is trading McDonald out of the question? For what he's getting paid, he's been below average this season. Do you keep him around just in case Selanne returns? I wouldn't. The problem is, Anaheim cant afford to lose more offense, and while Andy is not providing any at the moment, I don't think you can receive anyone in return who will put up 20+ goals a season for 2 million or so. If you can, I say do it!

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Old
12-11-2007, 08:09 PM
  #58
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As someone noted in the other thread, Atlanta made some odd moves, sending down 2 forwards in Little and Haydar. They only have 12 forwards now. Could we be sending them a forward and a defenseman?

Marchant + OD for Holik and a prospect? (Holik fills the forward spot for this year, the prospect provides some future value).

Marchant + mid pick for Perrin?

Would anyone be comfortable with trading for Hossa knowing he's a rental? Say Schneider + Moen + a forward prospect (like Carter/Milller... someone who could play in the NHL to fill up a spot if needed) for Hossa?

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Old
12-12-2007, 09:37 AM
  #59
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I think if the Ducks trade Schneider--they may have trouble trying to land UFA in the future---UFA pay attention when players get traded less then a year after signing with the a team.

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Old
12-12-2007, 10:40 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by lazycrazycanuck View Post
I think if the Ducks trade Schneider--they may have trouble trying to land UFA in the future---UFA pay attention when players get traded less then a year after signing with the a team.
Maybe. Although I think other UFA will see that there's unusual circumstances behind it. This isn't a team moving a player who they've committed to long term, and it's not like he's just being moved because wasn't performing and they didn't give him a chance. UFAs will also ask Schneider how he feels about it. By all accounts Schneider won't hold much of grudge if he's moved.
Quote:
I wasn’t naïve. I knew it was a possibility at any time. I signed my deal without any kind of trade clause in it, so it’s always a possibility.
His word is more important than anything else, free agents won't just discriminate without hearing the full story.

And there's also all the other moves the Ducks have done that will look good in a player's eyes, like moving Bryz to get him a job and allowing Scotty the time he needed to make a decision.

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Old
12-12-2007, 10:41 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by obobo23 View Post
As someone noted in the other thread, Atlanta made some odd moves, sending down 2 forwards in Little and Haydar. They only have 12 forwards now.
They have a bunch of expiring contracts which include Holik, Rucchin and now Recchi

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Old
12-12-2007, 12:44 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Pwnasaurus View Post
They have a bunch of expiring contracts which include Holik, Rucchin and now Recchi
Yeah exactly. Although it looks like Rucchin is done, he hasn't played a single game this season and missed the last 25 games of last season with what might be the same concussion? Because he might not be a bad 4th line center to replace Marchant with slightly less money and an expiring contract.

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Old
12-12-2007, 02:05 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by lazycrazycanuck View Post
I think if the Ducks trade Schneider--they may have trouble trying to land UFA in the future---UFA pay attention when players get traded less then a year after signing with the a team.
I think that's overrated.

After the lockout, the Bruins signed Dave Scatchard to a 4 year contract. About two months into his first season, they traded him across the country to Phoenix. The following offseason, the Bruins managed to land two prized free agents in Zdeno Chara and Marc Savard. Albeit a different GM was in charge.

The Devils infamously signed Alexander Mogilny and Dan McGillis to two year deals and then left them in the AHL. Devils managed to re-sign Patrik Elias and Jamie Langenbrunner afterwards while signing Dainius Zubrus a year later.

I mean it's not the best practice to sign a guy to a multiyear deal, have him relocate his family, and then trade him within a year. But if you do it once due to certain circumstances, it's probably not going to scare off the next guy if you wave enough money at him.

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Old
12-12-2007, 02:08 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by obobo23 View Post
Marchant + OD for Holik and a prospect? (Holik fills the forward spot for this year, the prospect provides some future value).
Off the top of my head, I believe Holik makes more than Marchant/OD combined so I'm not sure how that would affect this year's cap for you guys. The only figure I've heard for sure is having to clear out 880K on next year's cap which this trade would accomplish.

The difference between Holik and a depth defenseman like St. Jacques vs. Marchant/OD would be a prorated amount of ~million.

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Old
12-12-2007, 02:22 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brodeur View Post
I think that's overrated.

After the lockout, the Bruins signed Dave Scatchard to a 4 year contract. About two months into his first season, they traded him across the country to Phoenix. The following offseason, the Bruins managed to land two prized free agents in Zdeno Chara and Marc Savard. Albeit a different GM was in charge.

The Devils infamously signed Alexander Mogilny and Dan McGillis to two year deals and then left them in the AHL. Devils managed to re-sign Patrik Elias and Jamie Langenbrunner afterwards while signing Dainius Zubrus a year later.

I mean it's not the best practice to sign a guy to a multiyear deal, have him relocate his family, and then trade him within a year. But if you do it once due to certain circumstances, it's probably not going to scare off the next guy if you wave enough money at him.
Not only that, but Schneider said himself he understands, and I imagine the Ducks would try to accomdate him, almost to the extent of letting him veto certain deals. Plus, that is very overrated, and I doubt it would affect the Ducks. Many players mentioned how many NHLers want to play here, as they've heard good things. I doubt trading away Mathieu Schneider, when everybody knows the circumstance, will change that.

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Old
12-12-2007, 07:32 PM
  #66
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Just wondering if you Ducks fans are willing to trade Todd Bertuzzi for Matt Cooke? Both players have 7 to 8 points this season. However, Cooke makes 1.5 million, whereas Bertuzzi makes 4 million. The Canucks have 3 million in cap space, whereas the Ducks need cap space for the return of Niedermayer and maybe Selanne.

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Old
12-12-2007, 07:53 PM
  #67
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not bad















for the ducks, i hate bertuzzi (only duck I hate)

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Old
12-12-2007, 08:00 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Popcorn_Shrimp View Post
Just wondering if you Ducks fans are willing to trade Todd Bertuzzi for Matt Cooke? Both players have 7 to 8 points this season. However, Cooke makes 1.5 million, whereas Bertuzzi makes 4 million. The Canucks have 3 million in cap space, whereas the Ducks need cap space for the return of Niedermayer and maybe Selanne.
The Ducks don't have enough scoring as is. They're not going to trade an offensive player for a checker/agitator. Marchant for Cooke? The Ducks will probably throw in a pick for that. Not like Vancouver would do that though.

Vancouver's a bad partner, the Ducks want to deal defense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brodeur View Post
Off the top of my head, I believe Holik makes more than Marchant/OD combined so I'm not sure how that would affect this year's cap for you guys. The only figure I've heard for sure is having to clear out 880K on next year's cap which this trade would accomplish.

The difference between Holik and a depth defenseman like St. Jacques vs. Marchant/OD would be a prorated amount of ~million.
Yes Holik makes more. That's why Atlanta would consider it, to drop some money. This would only be if they decide they can't sign Hossa, because they probably like Holik's expiring contract for Hossa money. The Ducks are fine cap-wise (although over budget... we're not sure if they're going to stick to it this year or not).

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Old
12-12-2007, 08:14 PM
  #69
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Vancouver would probably do Marchant for Cooke. With Morrison out for 2 months, we're in need of another center. Vancouver/Anaheim could be good partners if Burke has a hard time finding a home for one of his extra dmen. Both Bertuzzi/Marchant wouldn't fit too badly into our lineup.

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Old
12-12-2007, 08:29 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by obobo23 View Post
Yes Holik makes more. That's why Atlanta would consider it, to drop some money. This would only be if they decide they can't sign Hossa, because they probably like Holik's expiring contract for Hossa money. The Ducks are fine cap-wise (although over budget... we're not sure if they're going to stick to it this year or not).
Resigning Hossa would have no effects on this year's cap. So trading Holik and getting two guys under contract for 2008-09 would tie up more money they could spend on Hossa.

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Old
12-12-2007, 08:47 PM
  #71
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Can I just say, as a Pens fan in desperate need of D, I'd jump at O'Donnell for our 3rd rounder.

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Old
12-12-2007, 09:14 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Brodeur View Post
Resigning Hossa would have no effects on this year's cap. So trading Holik and getting two guys under contract for 2008-09 would tie up more money they could spend on Hossa.
Yes... that's why I said they'd only do that move if they decided the CAN'T sign Hossa. They get some players who are signed for next year, and they can trade Hossa away in a different move. You essentially repeated what I said when I said "because they probably like Holik's expiring contract for Hossa money."

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12-12-2007, 09:42 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by obobo23 View Post
As someone noted in the other thread, Atlanta made some odd moves, sending down 2 forwards in Little and Haydar. They only have 12 forwards now. Could we be sending them a forward and a defenseman?

Marchant + OD for Holik and a prospect? (Holik fills the forward spot for this year, the prospect provides some future value).

Marchant + mid pick for Perrin?

Would anyone be comfortable with trading for Hossa knowing he's a rental? Say Schneider + Moen + a forward prospect (like Carter/Milller... someone who could play in the NHL to fill up a spot if needed) for Hossa?
HELL YEAH! We need Hossa. Thats about the only way I would want to see Schnieder go.

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Old
12-12-2007, 11:24 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by McLovin View Post
Not only that, but Schneider said himself he understands, and I imagine the Ducks would try to accomdate him, almost to the extent of letting him veto certain deals. Plus, that is very overrated, and I doubt it would affect the Ducks. Many players mentioned how many NHLers want to play here, as they've heard good things. I doubt trading away Mathieu Schneider, when everybody knows the circumstance, will change that.
I doubt it would make an impact on the Ducks, althought I agree with Engblom's commentary that Schneider's situation should make a GM interested in him cautious to bring him onboard.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?post_id=11677

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Old
12-14-2007, 07:18 AM
  #75
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PURE SPECULATION, NO INFORMATION FROM ANY SOURCE!

How would Ducks look trade with Montreal?

To ANA: Koivu + Ryder (~7,7 mil. cap hit, Ryder of the books next season)

To MTL: Bertuzzi + McDonald (~7,3 mil. cap hit, both count also for next year)

Add picks/prospect to even out the deal.

Anaheim saves close to 3 millin in tagged dollars, allowing them to dress Niedermayer and get Koivu to play behind Getzlaf for at least 2 seasons (might be more, I doubt it won't be hard to persuade Koivu continue up to 2010 if the circumstances are right). Ryder can keep the spot warm for Selanne and even be traded for picks before deadline if the new baby really cries sufficiently. Also getting Koivu could well be incentive enough for Selanne to return (helping a good friend to get the ring).

From Montreal's perspective, I am not that sure. McDonald is 3 years younger than Saku, but so far he haven't looked like real #1 center. Naturally team then could try to move him or Plekanec later on for upgrade, but trade should not be based on that.

Bert is huge gamble (and I doubt Burke would like to trade him). If he could mentor Lats and play through his contract, great, but overall it does not look like move Gainey would do.

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