HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Fire Renney (merged)

View Poll Results: Is it time for a change?
Yes 91 43.75%
No 117 56.25%
Voters: 208. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-06-2008, 11:40 AM
  #76
pld459666
Registered User
 
pld459666's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Danbury, CT
Country: United States
Posts: 16,667
vCash: 500
.

Guys, it has NOTHING to do with a mid-season slump, absolutely nothing.

The team is NOT GETTING BETTER. They have the same flaws today that they had on game 1 and game 20. There's been no progression from day one to today and that is absolutely the coach's fault.

There's been no offensive growth by players such as Dubinsky, Prucha is still struggling, Callahan has REGRESSSED, the whole 4th line is devoid of any offensive ability and the system that they employ is to defensive. There's no ability for a player to create because they are born and bred in this system to think defence first.

Yes we cycle, yes we keep the puck in deep, but we have no presence on the 3rd line that can take advantage of that ability and set up someone for a prime scoring chance.

He's not the guy to lead this team to the cup.

pld459666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 12:17 PM
  #77
reaper
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2005
Country: Sweden
Posts: 469
vCash: 500
With the players this team has we should be a contender not a pretender. I don't think anyone here believes this team can win a cup the way they are playing with Renney as a coach.

The only time we are winning games is when Hank is standing on his head or Jagr plays like the legend he is which he hasn't done this season. Hank is going through a slump right now and look what happens, we loose games. We depend on two guys and when they are not playing lights out we loose.

It's not Renney who wins the games it's Hank and Jagr.

Sure, we will probably squeek in the playoffs and if Hank stands on his head we might win a round but then it's bye bye and we will never win a cup with Renney as a coach.

reaper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 12:25 PM
  #78
Kodiak
Registered User
 
Kodiak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Ranger fan in Philly
Posts: 2,185
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Kodiak Send a message via AIM to Kodiak Send a message via Yahoo to Kodiak
I have a hard time hanging the lack of offense around Renney's neck. It's not his fault, nor is it the system. The team generates plenty of scoring chances on an average night, but no one can capitalize. Take last night as an example. We hit 3 posts and Garon made at least 2 saves that he had no business making. We could have scored 5 goals even without Girardi's fluke and Drury's last minute heroics, but we didn't. It was a microcosm of the season. Every break seems to go against us, so the team losses confidence in its offensive abilities, which causes them to flub subsequent scoring chances. It's a vicious cycle and better coaches than Tom Renney have been flummoxed by it.

It's the easiest thing in the world to blame the coach when the team is doing poorly, and in his current situation, Renney can do no right. He's criticized for not switching up lines when there's no chemistry. He's criticized for not leaving lines together to develop chemistry. He's criticized for playing Lundqvist too much. He's criticized whenever he starts Valiquette. He's criticized for playing the 4th line too much. If he shortened his bench, he'd be criticized for not rolling 4 lines. It just never ends.

Kodiak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 01:25 PM
  #79
NyRangers88
Section 208 Row 15
 
NyRangers88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Long Island, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 10,423
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to NyRangers88
I have not read anything on this thread yet, but Im just going to give my opinion since I am rushed for time. I was going to start my own thread but I figured this one contains similar content. First off, Id like to say Im a life long Rangers fan who has deeply appreciated what Tom Renney has done for this organization, but it is clear to me that he is not the man to lead us into the future. My Vote: Fire Renney

I was always iffy on this subject, but the recent western swing has changed my mind. You can make the arguement that we should have beat Calgary, Vancouver, and Edmonton and came away with 6 points. (The fact that we hit more posts than goals scored is beyond the point) But Im not going to make excuses. Here were the problems with the western swing, and other games as well, that can all lead back to Renney:

Trust in the 4th line: Can someone explain to me why, down by one goal, with 4 minutes left in the game I am watching the Betts / Hollweg / Orr line out there? Ok, I understand they work hard, and I understand Renney likes to use them against the other teams 1st line, but enough is enough already. Renney trusts this line way to much and the fact of the matter is they are not that great. Betts is a great PKer. Orr and Hollweg are great agetators. They are the energy line, they are supposed to give you energy when your team is slumping. Ok, I see that energy is needed with 4 minutes to go in the 3rd, but time has already run out. They need that tying goal and the 4th line is not going to bring it for you. Hollweg needs to be benched a few games for his major taken with 7 minutes to go last game. That was clearly avoidable and a message has to be sent to the team that late in a game you cant take a penalty with will jepordize the game. That is exactly what happened, and Edm scored.

Lack of effort on the PP Shoot the puck! Shoot the puck! Im a partial plan holder at the Garden and as we all know this is the chant for the Rangers PP. I am watching all these superstars out there watching and waiting for the superstar next to them to make the play. If the PP unit does not shoot the puck, Bench them untill they do. Its not a hard concept. Put a man in front of the net and things will happen. Jagr seems to be waiting for his guys around to him to make the play, and the guys around him seem to be waiting for him to make the play.

Jagr is not captain material! What has he done to lead this team? Nothing. In fact, he has not done much of anything this year. Take away the C, give it to Shanahan. He has the ability to be a leader. For those of you who go to the garden alot, the opening video before the Rangers enter the ice is one where Tom Renney describes his team to us. He says "We are a team of one" How is that the case if all he does is cater to Jagr? This is not team Jagr. Stop finding people to play for Jagr. Its very fustrating to me that Renney is afraid to bench him, give him less minutes, or take away the C. To me, its almost as Renney is playing for Jagr.

Theres a whole lot more I can get into, but I dont have the time now. Some of you may not agree with me, and thats Ok, I am just stating my opinions after a very fustrating week of losses. I can tell you right now that if things keep up, it will not be long before the "Fire Renney" chants come up from the garden crowd. Who knows? Maybe things will change. Maybe they will end up winning the division. From what I can see now though, Renney needs to go and my vote for replacement goes to Bob Hartley. By the way, can anyone explain to me why Sean Avery was first to shoot in the shootout?

__________________
2013-2014 Eastern Conference Champions!!
NyRangers88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 01:32 PM
  #80
Whoot Whoot
Biased-NYR-Homer
 
Whoot Whoot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Country: United States
Posts: 2,683
vCash: 500
We don't need a finesse coach. We need a General Patton esque coach. We need a static lineup - not new lines/scratches everygame. We need a coach to encourage people to go infront of the net and bench people for overpassing. And to show some enthusiasm and to yell at press conferences over bad calls. Someone needs to give Jagr's ass. This guy is a p#$$y

Whoot Whoot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 01:41 PM
  #81
Gardner McKay
Moderator
#4parsley
 
Gardner McKay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Atlanta
Country: United States
Posts: 10,914
vCash: 931
Quote:
Originally Posted by God Is Avery View Post
Bowman retired for a reason. he's now 74.. a whole year younger than Al Arbour who looked ridiculous behind the bench for the Isles this season.
Pat Quinn or Bob Hartley any one? Before any one bashes Hartley, there was alot more to it then his coaching. Hes won a cup, he knows how to win.

IMO the ideal choice would be Quinn.

Gardner McKay is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 01:44 PM
  #82
Gardner McKay
Moderator
#4parsley
 
Gardner McKay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Atlanta
Country: United States
Posts: 10,914
vCash: 931
Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
Guys, it has NOTHING to do with a mid-season slump, absolutely nothing.

The team is NOT GETTING BETTER. They have the same flaws today that they had on game 1 and game 20. There's been no progression from day one to today and that is absolutely the coach's fault.

There's been no offensive growth by players such as Dubinsky, Prucha is still struggling, Callahan has REGRESSSED, the whole 4th line is devoid of any offensive ability and the system that they employ is to defensive. There's no ability for a player to create because they are born and bred in this system to think defence first.

Yes we cycle, yes we keep the puck in deep, but we have no presence on the 3rd line that can take advantage of that ability and set up someone for a prime scoring chance.

He's not the guy to lead this team to the cup.

That is more key then anything. Our young guys are not getting any better, maybe with the exception of Dubinsky just needing to learn how to finish becuase he is a hell of a player. Callahan HAS regressed absolutely. Same with Prucha, and Hossa, and Staal. Yes Staal. He started out as a Rock, which is so rare for a rookie. His mistakes lately have been glareing, not as bad as Maliks... but...

Gardner McKay is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 01:44 PM
  #83
jake1970*
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 167
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by rangers4ever2007 View Post
0 wins on this roadtrip is alarming

BTW, why wasn't hossa and prucha in the shootout?
Exactly - I love Avery, but why was he in the shootout? Renney has had his chance - time for a change.

jake1970* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 01:45 PM
  #84
jake1970*
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 167
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
Guys, it has NOTHING to do with a mid-season slump, absolutely nothing.

The team is NOT GETTING BETTER. They have the same flaws today that they had on game 1 and game 20. There's been no progression from day one to today and that is absolutely the coach's fault.

There's been no offensive growth by players such as Dubinsky, Prucha is still struggling, Callahan has REGRESSSED, the whole 4th line is devoid of any offensive ability and the system that they employ is to defensive. There's no ability for a player to create because they are born and bred in this system to think defence first.

Yes we cycle, yes we keep the puck in deep, but we have no presence on the 3rd line that can take advantage of that ability and set up someone for a prime scoring chance.

He's not the guy to lead this team to the cup.
Very good points - I think we need a change also.

jake1970* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 01:45 PM
  #85
Mistress Mandy
Registered User
 
Mistress Mandy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 821
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by God Is Avery View Post
I don't mean to sound rude either, but, do you know what a coach's job actually entails?

He's not just standing back there chewing gum hoping that the guys he throws out there get the job done. He's been getting out coached lately. Granted in the last week he's faced Iron Mike and the reigning Jack Adams winner. But look back to our defeats to the Islanders for prime examples, as well as his shootout selections last night.
Everyone's going to be outcoached at some point in the season. Some will have that fall on their shoulders more than others. Ruts will happen. Ups and downs will ensue. People are going to suck, and it's going to be their fault. They might fix their issues a day later, or it might take them longer to correct their faults. Is it really going to be the coach's fault that all of this happens? Depends on what the situation is. But I do not think that it's time to start calling for heads.

I'm not the brightest person on the planet. I can tell you that much. (Apologies for coming across as an airhead in that last post.)

Mistress Mandy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 01:47 PM
  #86
jake1970*
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 167
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThirdEye View Post
Hahah that didn't take long

If you fire Renney you can forget about Jagr. He's not one to be bossed around
Good - Jagr is at the end of his career - the team is catering to him and it has to stop - Jagr should be traded when he still has value and Renney is fired.

jake1970* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 01:50 PM
  #87
MountVancouver'94
Registered User
 
MountVancouver'94's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: New York, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 879
vCash: 500
I've said it earlier, and I will say it again...none of this would've happened last night if they didn't show an Eric Lacroix b-roll clip. I blame him....oh, and Malik.

MountVancouver'94 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 01:50 PM
  #88
jake1970*
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 167
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by danno2530 View Post
You can't fire him at this point. Not when so many teams are bunched together. One hot streak and we're in 4th place.

However, there's no questioning that the guy makes some extremely strange decisions at times...I was in shock that Avery was the one to start the shootout tonight.

But as for the original question...if you fire him, who's taking over? There's nobody that can step in right away. He's not going anywhere. If we lose in round one or miss the playoffs alltogether? Fire him, he would deserve it, but no way do you do anything during the season.
Have you noticed that teams with a midseason coaching change usually catch fire - that is what we need - not the same old Renney system. He is too loyal to certain players to the detriment of the team. Orr, Hollweg, Hossa, callahan, Prucha.....etc.

jake1970* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 01:58 PM
  #89
FLYLine24
The Mac Truck
 
FLYLine24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: NY
Country: United States
Posts: 29,916
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyBasedNYC View Post
For me its more of the players' faults.

Bad penalties, posts, not burying chances, Bad goals, not shooting on the PP, not building on leads. So many games the Rangers have lost they come out feeling they played well enough to win, i don't know how that can be put on Renneys shoulders.

They just cant seem to put all the pieces together on a consistent basis.

But i was a bit puzzled to see the SO lineup tonight.
At what point is it Renney fault then? Halfway through he still cant get the team to score goals. At some point its time to blame the person in charge.

I think most people are saying "well we brought us to the playoffs twice, so hes got to be a good coach, it must be the players"..that a horrible way to look at it.

FLYLine24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 02:01 PM
  #90
RMcDonagh
New York Rangers Cup
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Long Island, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 6,267
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
At what point is it Renney fault then? Halfway through he still cant get the team to score goals. At some point its time to blame the person in charge.

I think most people are saying "well we brought us to the playoffs twice, so hes got to be a good coach, it must be the players"..that a horrible way to look at it.
Thank you.

As people have stated, the meer point of this is that something needs to be done because the team is not improving, the team is not playing the way it could.

RMcDonagh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 02:04 PM
  #91
MountVancouver'94
Registered User
 
MountVancouver'94's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: New York, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 879
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
At what point is it Renney fault then? Halfway through he still cant get the team to score goals. At some point its time to blame the person in charge.

I think most people are saying "well we brought us to the playoffs twice, so hes got to be a good coach, it must be the players"..that a horrible way to look at it.
Agreed...but it's also a poorly constructed team. Its a team full of centers playing wing. Therefore we have no pure sniper or hungry goal scorer. The only one we have is 40+ years old...and I'm tired of Prucha (also a center in his pre-nhl career) wasting set ups in our designed plays. Hell, even Gomez is the recipient of set ups in our system, and I have a better shot than he does (no I don't).

We need a selfish, cocky, goal scorer. One who is a selfish, horrible two way player, who's wants nothing more than the puck, and to laser it top shelf.

MountVancouver'94 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 02:10 PM
  #92
Kostik
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Country: Czech_ Republic
Posts: 876
vCash: 500
These boards are so painfull to read after losing streak...phew

Kostik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 02:11 PM
  #93
MountVancouver'94
Registered User
 
MountVancouver'94's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: New York, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 879
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kostik View Post
These boards are so painfull to read after losing streak...phew
Agreed...but somehow I'm still reading.

MountVancouver'94 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 02:17 PM
  #94
Whoot Whoot
Biased-NYR-Homer
 
Whoot Whoot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Country: United States
Posts: 2,683
vCash: 500
If you subtract those three wins in a row - this has been a LONG LONG losing streak.

Whoot Whoot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 02:26 PM
  #95
mhurley
Registered User
 
mhurley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Long Island
Country: Jamaica
Posts: 485
vCash: 500
Renney isn't going anywhere, nor should he. Fire Renney and you throw out the baby with the bath water.

The response to fire Renney is a typical Ranger fan, impatient, knee jerk reaction. Does anyone think the Rangers were seriously going to make a Cup run this year? Why? Because Shanny and Jagr said so at the beginning of the season? What were they supposed to say "We are here to try to improve the entertainment product but no one can seriously think the Rangers are going to beat the elite teams and win the Stanley Cup!"

Because the Rangers don't have 50 points and aren't leading their division and conference, Renney should be fired? Because they lost all three games on this last road trip, Renney has to be fired? Because the Rangers are 3 games over .500 and are in the thick of their divisional race, NOW is the time to Fire Renney!

Everyone is up in arms because the Rangers lost to the "lowly" Oilers! The Oilers are 18-21-3 and have 40 points. But, consider who is in their division and who they have to play on a regular basis. The Rangers, at 20-17-5 and 45 points are playing in a division being led by the Devils with 49 points, the resurgent Penguins with 47 and followed by the Fish and the Flyers each with 44. Except for Carolina at 46 points, the Southeast is a joke.

Five teams in the Western Conference have more then 50 points. Only Ottawa has better then 50 in the East. I would be more worried about if the Rangers continue to suck against teams in their own division and conference. The Rangers played 3 games in 4 nights against two of the top teams in the Western Conference.

Let's hope Malik just bought himself his ticket outta here by going AWOL and Hollweg too if he gets suspended. The same goes for Hossa. Time to fill in the third and fourth lines with Hartford kids like last year and see how they get on.

Let's put this road trip behind us, move forward and work towards winning the division. It can be done. One step at a time. If the Rangers don't make the playoffs then you have have every right to start *****ing.

For God sake, stop the insanity here and get a grip!

mhurley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 02:26 PM
  #96
Ian
Mike York fan club
 
Ian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Long Island, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 1,628
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MountVancouver'94 View Post
Switch Renney and Willie Randolph...see if the results differ.
Underachieving players would still make fans call for both guy's heads.

The two situations are pretty much identical to me.

Both coaches have yet to seem to lose the locker room. With the personalities on the team, you would really be rolling the dice whether changing coaches either energized the team or pretty much ended the season for them. Especially since there really is no heir apparent in either situation.

I don't get what you want Renney to do though. The team has the 4th highest SOG per game average. Can he tell the players to hit the net more?

Ian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 02:31 PM
  #97
MountVancouver'94
Registered User
 
MountVancouver'94's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: New York, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 879
vCash: 500
From Renney's post game comments:

"So you've got to be careful that the guys stay positive and embrace the things they've been doing well over those two games…Keep them buoyant psychologically and really engaged and excited about playing. Just maintain that and I think we'll be fine."

Does that sound like a NHL Head Coach? Maybe a bench coach...I am getting a little tired of positiive reenforcement. I know that souns naive, but still...a coach should act like he is under pressure every once and a while. And benching Hossa and Malik isn't enough for me.

MountVancouver'94 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 02:31 PM
  #98
ohbaby
Registered User
 
ohbaby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 955
vCash: 500
What if Drury didn't score that goal last year with 6 seconds left? We would have been in the eastern finals! Was that Renney's fault too? He has taken us progressively further each year. We are in better position this year than last year at this time. Forget this road trip cuz TB, PHI, and MTL are deadmeat at home. And then we will have won, 6 out of 9, and back as a legitimate playoff contender.

ohbaby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 03:24 PM
  #99
in the hall
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 5,009
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MountVancouver'94 View Post
From Renney's post game comments:

"So you've got to be careful that the guys stay positive and embrace the things they've been doing well over those two games…Keep them buoyant psychologically and really engaged and excited about playing. Just maintain that and I think we'll be fine."

Does that sound like a NHL Head Coach? Maybe a bench coach...I am getting a little tired of positiive reenforcement. I know that souns naive, but still...a coach should act like he is under pressure every once and a while. And benching Hossa and Malik isn't enough for me.
and sound like the rest of you guys? no thank you.

I'm glad he's calm and collected. I'm especially glad he is not showing panic or pressure to the media. People react differently in front of reporters and fans etc, and its important that the head coach maintains composure regardless of his feelings in those situations.

mhurley made a great post. typical fan knee-jerk reaction. Take a step back and analyze the situation a little bit more closely.. and I do mean just a tiny bit because it doesn't take much to realize we are JUST NOW at the half way point of the season and for all the doom and gloom you'd think because of posts like this, we still have a winning record and in relatively good shape. We're 4-4-2 in our last 10. Get a grip people.

in the hall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-06-2008, 03:46 PM
  #100
MountVancouver'94
Registered User
 
MountVancouver'94's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: New York, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 879
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by in the hall View Post
and sound like the rest of you guys? no thank you.

I'm glad he's calm and collected. I'm especially glad he is not showing panic or pressure to the media. People react differently in front of reporters and fans etc, and its important that the head coach maintains composure regardless of his feelings in those situations.

mhurley made a great post. typical fan knee-jerk reaction. Take a step back and analyze the situation a little bit more closely.. and I do mean just a tiny bit because it doesn't take much to realize we are JUST NOW at the half way point of the season and for all the doom and gloom you'd think because of posts like this, we still have a winning record and in relatively good shape. We're 4-4-2 in our last 10. Get a grip people.
Look, while I agree fans can be idiots and I'm not asking my head coach to be a knee-jerk moron...I compare winning teams to losing teams in professional sports, and sometimes this attitude can borderline an acceptance of mediocrity. Its not like we are one game away from clicking...alot of this is unacceptable. And history has shown that motivation in an international sport like hockey can translate improperly.

And I used Willie Randolph as an example for a reason...down the stretch he remained positive. How'd that work out?

Players' coaches very rarely win at the professional level. Players passion usually reflects that. Acceptance of losing becomes apparent.

MountVancouver'94 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:04 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.