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Fire Renney (merged)

View Poll Results: Is it time for a change?
Yes 91 43.75%
No 117 56.25%
Voters: 208. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
01-06-2008, 03:10 PM
  #101
TrueBlue9
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Everyone's freaking out about Avery in the shootout, I would hope (based on the ridiculous comments in this thread) that all or most of you have played on some sort of a competitive team in your life. In that case you would understand its very possible that Avery communicated with Renney asking to take the shot. In that case, as the coach, you go with the player everytime. We all know hes been taking a lot of heat from the Canadian Team fans so it wouldn't suprise me if he asked to take the shot in an attempt to stick it to them. But no, lets fire a coach that is just as much an important piece of this rebuilding as anyone else. Even though we are playing so terribly bad, this team is in the playoffs if the season ended today. We all know there will be some moves at the deadline, wait and see what happens then. Stop being so disloyal, its embarrasing.

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01-06-2008, 03:10 PM
  #102
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a few things...

1st, this team has had 1 real hot streak this whole season centered on a bunch of bad/mediocre streaks. that should alarm ppl right now.

2nd, this team last season didn't perform well until they had to do a serious roster facelift...good luck trying that trick again this season.

3rd, anybody who thinks that quinn and jagr wouldn't co-exist is likely kidding themselves. quinn has done well with every offensive star forward he's had (see: bure, mogilny, sundin) so i don't think that's an issue.

and finally, yes i'd like quinn to take over either now or shortly before the all-star to get used to the rangers.

p.s.- quinn is someone renney idolizes, so i think even though he'd hate for it to happen renney would step aside and stay with the team to let fat pat do this thing.

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01-06-2008, 03:14 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by MountVancouver'94 View Post
Look, while I agree fans can be idiots and I'm not asking my head coach to be a knee-jerk moron...I compare winning teams to losing teams in professional sports, and sometimes this attitude can borderline an acceptance of mediocrity. Its not like we are one game away from clicking...alot of this is unacceptable. And history has shown that motivation in an international sport like hockey can translate improperly.

And I used Willie Randolph as an example for a reason...down the stretch he remained positive. How'd that work out?

Players' coaches very rarely win at the professional level. Players passion usually reflects that. Acceptance of losing becomes apparent.


That's true, Joe Torre didn't win much either.

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01-06-2008, 03:21 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Hplaya94 View Post
I cannot believe some people are so thick headed to actually believe that Renney knows what he is doing, and that his record as a Ranger coach is not solely because of Jagr. Look, Jagrs not producing this year, and what? He didnt produce last year for a while, look what happened, at this point we were in the same boat.

05-06 is the only exception since Jagr had what 54 goals and 110 points?

Renney's winning is because of Jagr. His loosing now with out a happy Jagr is because he has no idea what hes doing. He has no idea how to make in game adjustments. How to prepare for the three man forecheck. How its more about the team and not idividual players, a la Sean Avery taking the first shot in the shoot out to try and get him out of a slump. Sorry but when points are on the line, you give that to more experienced shooters in Hossa who has been MONEY in the shoot outs, Prucha, if Shannahan and Straka were hurt, hell go with captain clutch Chris Drury who scored with 7 seconds left.

The way Renney coaches, Im surprised he didnt make Orr or Betts his extra attacker

This coach needs alot of and so does every one who thinks hes deserves to stay around.
He didn't put Avery in there to try to get him out of a slump, he put him in there because Avery and Garon were teammates in L.A., and Avery probably said something to Renney about being familiar with him.

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01-06-2008, 03:26 PM
  #105
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In reality a trade is needed more than firing Renney. Malik's antics are becomming a distraction for no reason.


Either trade him or put him in Hartford.

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01-06-2008, 03:38 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by in the hall View Post
and sound like the rest of you guys? no thank you.

I'm glad he's calm and collected. I'm especially glad he is not showing panic or pressure to the media. People react differently in front of reporters and fans etc, and its important that the head coach maintains composure regardless of his feelings in those situations.

mhurley made a great post. typical fan knee-jerk reaction. Take a step back and analyze the situation a little bit more closely.. and I do mean just a tiny bit because it doesn't take much to realize we are JUST NOW at the half way point of the season and for all the doom and gloom you'd think because of posts like this, we still have a winning record and in relatively good shape. We're 4-4-2 in our last 10. Get a grip people.
I don't think of any of this as a fan knee-jerk reaction. IMHO, all of the people who were looking at the team on paper prior to the beginning of this season and counting the Cup as good as won - that was a fan knee-jerk reaction!

I like Renney, I've said it before. The job he did post-lockout, and to a certain degree last year, was respectable. However, this team is not playing well, and rather than point fingers and hash over whose fault it is, that's the bottom line. Everyone has been waiting for chemistry to kick in, and for Jagr to pick up, and for Avery to come back, and for Malik to go away....but here we sit, and nothing is changing. This is the point at which a coach starts to lose the team. Malik's hissy fit upon being scratched is a perfect example. In order to coach well, the guy needs the players' respect and support and 100% effort. Is he getting it? I don't think so. Exactly what the reason is that he isn't getting it, who knows. But (and I'm basing this statement on way too many seasons of watching this team screw up) I don't see it significantly improving. Maybe I've become a total cynic - but I think the team they had first season post-lockout had a better chance of winning than this team does, and that, for seemingly at least the hundredth time since I became a fan in the early 70's, this team is headed in the completely wrong direction.

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01-06-2008, 03:41 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by TheRedressor View Post
In reality a trade is needed more than firing Renney. Malik's antics are becomming a distraction for no reason.


Either trade him or put him in Hartford.
Malik is apart of the problem but hes not the whole thing. Renney's offensive system of revolving around Jagr is not working because the other team just covers Jagr and then our offense wont do anything without him especially on the powerplay. A dramatic change has to happen, whether its a trade, a firing, or change of captain and style of play..something has to happen

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01-06-2008, 03:41 PM
  #108
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I have not read anything on this thread yet, but Im just going to give my opinion since I am rushed for time. I was going to start my own thread but I figured this one contains similar content. First off, Id like to say Im a life long Rangers fan who has deeply appreciated what Tom Renney has done for this organization, but it is clear to me that he is not the man to lead us into the future. My Vote: Fire Renney

I was always iffy on this subject, but the recent western swing has changed my mind. You can make the arguement that we should have beat Calgary, Vancouver, and Edmonton and came away with 6 points. (The fact that we hit more posts than goals scored is beyond the point) But Im not going to make excuses. Here were the problems with the western swing, and other games as well, that can all lead back to Renney:

Trust in the 4th line: Can someone explain to me why, down by one goal, with 4 minutes left in the game I am watching the Betts / Hollweg / Orr line out there? Ok, I understand they work hard, and I understand Renney likes to use them against the other teams 1st line, but enough is enough already. Renney trusts this line way to much and the fact of the matter is they are not that great. Betts is a great PKer. Orr and Hollweg are great agetators. They are the energy line, they are supposed to give you energy when your team is slumping. Ok, I see that energy is needed with 4 minutes to go in the 3rd, but time has already run out. They need that tying goal and the 4th line is not going to bring it for you. Hollweg needs to be benched a few games for his major taken with 7 minutes to go last game. That was clearly avoidable and a message has to be sent to the team that late in a game you cant take a penalty with will jepordize the game. That is exactly what happened, and Edm scored.

Lack of effort on the PP Shoot the puck! Shoot the puck! Im a partial plan holder at the Garden and as we all know this is the chant for the Rangers PP. I am watching all these superstars out there watching and waiting for the superstar next to them to make the play. If the PP unit does not shoot the puck, Bench them untill they do. Its not a hard concept. Put a man in front of the net and things will happen. Jagr seems to be waiting for his guys around to him to make the play, and the guys around him seem to be waiting for him to make the play.

Jagr is not captain material! What has he done to lead this team? Nothing. In fact, he has not done much of anything this year. Take away the C, give it to Shanahan. He has the ability to be a leader. For those of you who go to the garden alot, the opening video before the Rangers enter the ice is one where Tom Renney describes his team to us. He says "We are a team of one" How is that the case if all he does is cater to Jagr? This is not team Jagr. Stop finding people to play for Jagr. Its very fustrating to me that Renney is afraid to bench him, give him less minutes, or take away the C. To me, its almost as Renney is playing for Jagr.

Theres a whole lot more I can get into, but I dont have the time now. Some of you may not agree with me, and thats Ok, I am just stating my opinions after a very fustrating week of losses. I can tell you right now that if things keep up, it will not be long before the "Fire Renney" chants come up from the garden crowd. Who knows? Maybe things will change. Maybe they will end up winning the division. From what I can see now though, Renney needs to go and my vote for replacement goes to Bob Hartley. By the way, can anyone explain to me why Sean Avery was first to shoot in the shootout?
Bob Hartley?

Yeah, cuz he's done so well lately, right?

I have to comment on the PP thing. It really bothers me when people just spew this **** out, just shoot, shoot, shoot! You think it's that simple, but it's not. Yes, they should be putting more pucks on net, but that doesn't mean you just shoot every time you have the puck. See, there are these things called defenders, maybe you've heard of them? And there's these things called shooting lanes, see, if you shoot without having a lane and the shot gets blocked, it can and will lead to shorthanded odd-man rushes coming against you, and that's the last thing you want to happen when you have the man advantage. as I said, yes, they need to put more pucks on net, but they are right in waiting for a lane much of the time.

As for the Jagr thing, I hate to break this to you, but this is "Team Jagr" as you put it. This team was built specifically around Jagr coming out of the lockout, and frankly, he's the only reason this team made the playoffs the last two years. Without him, this team isn't capable of making a run into the playoffs. When you have a star player, you cater to him, that's the way it is, period. Of course there's a limit to how far you go, but you don't just treat him like you would, say, Ryan Hollweg. As Renney himself said recently, as Jagr goes, so go the Rangers. Like it or not, that's the way it is, so get used to it. As for taking away the captaincy, that's the dumbest thing you could do. Have you any idea what that would say to the rest of the team, and what it'd do to Jagr himself? If you're going to make someone else the captain, you do it during the off-season, not during the season when the team is slumping. Also, I think you're being too hard on the guy. Obviously you don't remember how he took Petr Prucha under his wing and basically treated him like a brother. And how about recently when he was spotted tutoring Marc Staal on one-timers, just the two of them, following practice? He stayed on the ice longer than required to be a help to this kid, precisely the kind of thing a captain does. It really bothers me that Jagr gets so much flak from so many people, about how he's not a leader, and blah blah blah. How the hell do you know? Are you in the dressing room with these guys? Are you on the ice during practices? Are you on the bench during games? If you're not, then don't speak so confidently about something, without knowledge of it. Think before you say these things, they make no sense. How the hell would a single one of us here know whether Jagr is captain material or not? We wouldn't, so we really shouldn't pretend we know what the hell is going on with this team.

As for Avery being the first shooter last night, I'll say it again. Avery and Garon were teammates in L.A., which is likely the reason he was out there.

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01-06-2008, 03:45 PM
  #109
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What if Drury didn't score that goal last year with 6 seconds left? We would have been in the eastern finals! Was that Renney's fault too? He has taken us progressively further each year. We are in better position this year than last year at this time. Forget this road trip cuz TB, PHI, and MTL are deadmeat at home. And then we will have won, 6 out of 9, and back as a legitimate playoff contender.
Absolutely it is, do you have any idea who was on the ice at that time? I do believe Jagr. Which is the coaches decision. Have Shannahan, Straka or Cullen out there in Jagrs place last year and your looking at the Eastern Conference Finals.

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01-06-2008, 03:47 PM
  #110
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He didn't put Avery in there to try to get him out of a slump, he put him in there because Avery and Garon were teammates in L.A., and Avery probably said something to Renney about being familiar with him.
So you put a guy whos had one career shoot out attempt in because he is familiar with a goaltender Im sorry, Hossa Prucha or Drury should have been in there, end of story.

Every one here who is defending Renney are missing the obvious points. We are not calling for his head simply because of Avery in the shoot out tonight. Nor is it because he refuses to construct a decent power play unit, instead letting two failing units go for a 25+ game period. Its also not only the fact that the fourth line gets as much ice time as the third line does, and are on the ice in key situations in which we need goals, and not to neutralize the oppositions top line. Add them all together, + Malik/Strudwicks playing time+ his refusal to say, "Ok we blew tonight, this is unnacceptable" which for people who have played any team sport, they know some times thats exactly what they need to hear. A coach to let you know how bad you played and that your capable of better. Not sugar coating bad play. As a matter of fact, with all of the above I mentioned im curious as to how he still has a job.

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01-06-2008, 03:49 PM
  #111
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"trust in the 4th line" is a joke. I still cant believe renney constantly rolls four lines. It is becoming almost comical, they barely fight, hollweg is the only one who hits, and though betts deserves the time he gets it on the pk.

its almost as though renney feels he owes it to them to give them more ice time, but guess what, they are paid athletes, and this isn't little league. Not everyone has to play, and he should start double shifting gomez and or jagr, and other scorers rather than leaving the fourth line on with a one goal lead and a minute left.

don't even get me started on avery in the shootout..... Renney deserves credit for the loss last night.

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01-06-2008, 03:49 PM
  #112
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So you put a guy whos had one career shoot out attempt in because he is familiar with a goaltender Im sorry, Hossa Prucha or Drury should have been in there, end of story.
Umm, did I say I agreed with the decision? No, I'm simply offering an explanation. I was screaming at my television last night when I saw Avery out there, and then Gomez, and then Jagr. Should've been Hossa, Prucha & a third.

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01-06-2008, 03:54 PM
  #113
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Umm, did I say I agreed with the decision? No, I'm simply offering an explanation. I was screaming at my television last night when I saw Avery out there, and then Gomez, and then Jagr. Should've been Hossa, Prucha & a third.
Sorry it sounded like you were defending his decision. I dont think Gomez was such a bad choice. However Avery and Jagr? This team needs

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01-06-2008, 04:30 PM
  #114
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I think this is a perfect case of be careful what you wish for!

I have not been the biggest Renney fan in the past, especially considering that his teams in the past have had a tendency to get away from him. With that said, I absolutley do not want to see him fired.

I always preferred a more disciplinarian coach behind the bench in NY, but in this case i totally feel differently about the situation. In ten seasons before Renney got here it was one total debacle after another. Renney at least managed to get this team into the playoffs for two straight seasons.

To me Renney's biggest shortcoming is his lack of emotion behind the bench. That followed by the constant line schuffling. But to go back to the emotion thing. It seems to me that on numerous occasions this team has been the reciepient of really bad calls by the officials. He will question them at times, but I have yet to see this guy lose his cool behind the bench. In a tight situation, in a close game to me at times you have to have a couch that can fly off the handle a little. If not, there's a good chance the next call isn't going to go your way. Also wouldn't mind seeing the guy jaw a little with an opposing coach either. A perfect example is the game a month or so back against Atlanta where Prucha got run not once but twice. If that was a guy like Keenan he would have been over the glass freaking out. But...that is just not Renney's demeanor, and I don't neccessecarily makes him a bad coach. In fact, I think the guy is a very good coach, and has somewhat proved me wrong that a players coach can work in NY. And for this team, I do not count them out by any means right now. Yeah losing three in a row is a tough pill to swallow, but I really like the makeup of this team. I think they are extremely well rounded, and built to go deep into the playoffs, with an excellent netminder between the pipes.

But...instead of firing Renney I think some minor tweaking needs to be done here. And to me it is more of a job for Glen Sather rather than Tom Renney. There is a wealth of talent on this team, and log jams in certain areas.

To me I think the team has needed a Blueline presence for quite sometime. Not so much of an offensive one, as the defense to me is pretty good at joining the rush. Girardi and Roszival both contribute extremely well from the Blueline. But there is a lack of that physical presence still. And to me it has been a glaring hole since Thomas Kloucek was moved. The 2nd weakness is lack of scoring from the 3rd and 4th line. I think with a different face or two this problem could be addressed.

With that, I think it is time for a couple of the fowards, and a defenceman of this club to move on. At center there is a logjam as far as I am concerned. Drury 4 more years, and Gomez I beleive for 6. With Dubinsky as 3rd line Pivot, and Betts signed I believe through 2010 where does an Artem Anisomov come into play here? Yeah, it's the possibility that he and Cherepanov can be a very productive tandem for the Rangers is very inticing...but is Anisimov going to be able to beat out any of the aforementioned for a roster spot? To me it makes him a very appealing chip to try and boost other areas. For Sather I think he needs to make a move to 1) bring in a player to boost scoring on the 2nd or 3rd lines. 2) Figure out a way to once and for all move Marek Malik out of the linreup. There are just so many chips here that Slat's has that he can work with that I am very surprised that he hasen't done so already. But with almost half a season gone, to me the time is now to make this move rather than sometime around St Patty's day where players don't have much time to play with one another. I do think there will be a move shortly, and after the watching Sather turn this club around over the past few season, and make some damn good moves, I have total confidence in the guy that when the time is right, he will do the right thing here.

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01-06-2008, 04:41 PM
  #115
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I think this is a perfect case of be careful what you wish for!

I have not been the biggest Renney fan in the past, especially considering that his teams in the past have had a tendency to get away from him. With that said, I absolutley do not want to see him fired.

I always preferred a more disciplinarian coach behind the bench in NY, but in this case i totally feel differently about the situation. In ten seasons before Renney got here it was one total debacle after another. Renney at least managed to get this team into the playoffs for two straight seasons.

To me Renney's biggest shortcoming is his lack of emotion behind the bench. That followed by the constant line schuffling. But to go back to the emotion thing. It seems to me that on numerous occasions this team has been the reciepient of really bad calls by the officials. He will question them at times, but I have yet to see this guy lose his cool behind the bench. In a tight situation, in a close game to me at times you have to have a couch that can fly off the handle a little. If not, there's a good chance the next call isn't going to go your way. Also wouldn't mind seeing the guy jaw a little with an opposing coach either. A perfect example is the game a month or so back against Atlanta where Prucha got run not once but twice. If that was a guy like Keenan he would have been over the glass freaking out. But...that is just not Renney's demeanor, and I don't neccessecarily makes him a bad coach. In fact, I think the guy is a very good coach, and has somewhat proved me wrong that a players coach can work in NY. And for this team, I do not count them out by any means right now. Yeah losing three in a row is a tough pill to swallow, but I really like the makeup of this team. I think they are extremely well rounded, and built to go deep into the playoffs, with an excellent netminder between the pipes.

But...instead of firing Renney I think some minor tweaking needs to be done here. And to me it is more of a job for Glen Sather rather than Tom Renney. There is a wealth of talent on this team, and log jams in certain areas.

To me I think the team has needed a Blueline presence for quite sometime. Not so much of an offensive one, as the defense to me is pretty good at joining the rush. Girardi and Roszival both contribute extremely well from the Blueline. But there is a lack of that physical presence still. And to me it has been a glaring hole since Thomas Kloucek was moved. The 2nd weakness is lack of scoring from the 3rd and 4th line. I think with a different face or two this problem could be addressed.

With that, I think it is time for a couple of the fowards, and a defenceman of this club to move on. At center there is a logjam as far as I am concerned. Drury 4 more years, and Gomez I beleive for 6. With Dubinsky as 3rd line Pivot, and Betts signed I believe through 2010 where does an Artem Anisomov come into play here? Yeah, it's the possibility that he and Cherepanov can be a very productive tandem for the Rangers is very inticing...but is Anisimov going to be able to beat out any of the aforementioned for a roster spot? To me it makes him a very appealing chip to try and boost other areas. For Sather I think he needs to make a move to 1) bring in a player to boost scoring on the 2nd or 3rd lines. 2) Figure out a way to once and for all move Marek Malik out of the linreup. There are just so many chips here that Slat's has that he can work with that I am very surprised that he hasen't done so already. But with almost half a season gone, to me the time is now to make this move rather than sometime around St Patty's day where players don't have much time to play with one another. I do think there will be a move shortly, and after the watching Sather turn this club around over the past few season, and make some damn good moves, I have total confidence in the guy that when the time is right, he will do the right thing here.
I'd move Dubinsky before I moved Anisimov.

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01-06-2008, 05:29 PM
  #116
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I wish we would've kept Cullen and Nylander and only signed either Gomez OR Drury. Our team simply isn't as exciting as last year's team, nor do we seem to have the same passion. I'm just not liking this team's chances anymore. It's not that we're trying to do too much, it's that we're not doing enough.

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01-06-2008, 05:43 PM
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Maybe we can trade Renney, Malik, and Hollweg for Mike Keenan.

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01-06-2008, 05:47 PM
  #118
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I don't think of any of this as a fan knee-jerk reaction. IMHO, all of the people who were looking at the team on paper prior to the beginning of this season and counting the Cup as good as won - that was a fan knee-jerk reaction!

I like Renney, I've said it before. The job he did post-lockout, and to a certain degree last year, was respectable. However, this team is not playing well, and rather than point fingers and hash over whose fault it is, that's the bottom line. Everyone has been waiting for chemistry to kick in, and for Jagr to pick up, and for Avery to come back, and for Malik to go away....but here we sit, and nothing is changing. This is the point at which a coach starts to lose the team. Malik's hissy fit upon being scratched is a perfect example. In order to coach well, the guy needs the players' respect and support and 100% effort. Is he getting it? I don't think so. Exactly what the reason is that he isn't getting it, who knows. But (and I'm basing this statement on way too many seasons of watching this team screw up) I don't see it significantly improving. Maybe I've become a total cynic - but I think the team they had first season post-lockout had a better chance of winning than this team does, and that, for seemingly at least the hundredth time since I became a fan in the early 70's, this team is headed in the completely wrong direction.

come onnn. that's painful.

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01-06-2008, 05:51 PM
  #119
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at the end of a 2nd period pp the puck got cleared and with a decent amount of time left to at least gain the zone and set up a shot the 4th line came onto the ice. the descions that renney makes make me want to punch babies.

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01-06-2008, 07:17 PM
  #120
Stoney La Rock
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Originally Posted by robruckus View Post
come onnn. that's painful.
Their play is what's painful.

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01-06-2008, 07:34 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
At what point is it Renney fault then? Halfway through he still cant get the team to score goals. At some point its time to blame the person in charge.

I think most people are saying "well we brought us to the playoffs twice, so hes got to be a good coach, it must be the players"..that a horrible way to look at it.
Thank you thank you thank you.

Thirty some odd games through the season and we STILL can't get it done. Outside, of coaching, I really can't see any other way to spark this team. It's obvious if we made any big trades we won't get chemistry until 2010, so let's not go that way. Possibly a small trade, maybe a change on the 2nd/3rd line or 3rd defensive pairing would help. Maybe not right this moment, but it is slowly becoming more and more the strategy and/or the coaching that is flawed. The players aren't completely left out of blame, but the coaches aren't either.

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01-06-2008, 09:05 PM
  #122
NyRangers88
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Bob Hartley?
Yeah, cuz he's done so well lately, right?

Bob Hartley won a stanely cup with the Aves a few years back, and took them deep into the playoffs another year. Just because he got off to a bad start doesnt make him a bad coach, your judgement seems to be off there. Im not saying he would be perfect for the job, but certainly an option. He is an offensive minded coach and the way our team seems to be built he may fit in well. Pat Quinn, as others said earlier, is a good choice as well.

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I have to comment on the PP thing. It really bothers me when people just spew this **** out, just shoot, shoot, shoot! You think it's that simple, but it's not.
Oh no, its not that simple? How else can you score if you dont shoot? If you watched any Ranger games at all youd know that they pass up countless times to shoot when they have a perfect shooting lane. Rozsival in particlar loves to pass the puck when he has a lane, and he has a great shot too. Your right though, there are sometimes these things called "lanes" (dont appreciate the sarcaism) and defenders can get in the way, but the fact of the matter is they must shoot more to get better results. They try to make the perfect passing play when in fact simpler plays are more effective.


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As for the Jagr thing, I hate to break this to you, but this is "Team Jagr" as you put it. This team was built specifically around Jagr coming out of the lockout, and frankly, he's the only reason this team made the playoffs the last two years. Without him, this team isn't capable of making a run into the playoffs.
So if the team isnt capable of making a playoff run without Jagr, singing Gomez and Drury to extended deals was a complete waste, since Jagr will not be with the team in the future. Your are right though, this team was built around Jagr after the lockout, but your forgetting one thing-- We are not rebuilding anymore. It may have been team Jagr in the past, but its not all about him now. Gomez, Drury, Lundqvist, Shanahan and others are all an important part of this team in addition to Jagr. I am not bashing on Jagr in anyway, I love the guy and he just happens to be in an off season, it happens. But I dont like the fact the everyone must make Jagr "happy" in order for the team to be successful because that is not the case.

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How the hell would a single one of us here know whether Jagr is captain material or not? We wouldn't, so we really shouldn't pretend we know what the hell is going on with this team.
Your 100% right. But, one thing I do know is that the team is not winning with him as captain, therefore it leads me to belive there are better choices for captain than Jagr. Shanahan was a great leader in Detroit, and from his experience with the wings he is a logical choice to replace him. And I dont know how you say captains cannot be changed in mid-season, because I hope you know the Devils named a new captain just recently.

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As for Avery being the first shooter last night, I'll say it again. Avery and Garon were teammates in L.A., which is likely the reason he was out there.
I know that already, you dont have tell me the facts. What I would like you tell me is how Renney is justified for choosing Avery when there are so many better options out there such as a Drury, a Hossa, or a Prucha. I dont care if they were teammates for 10 years, he should not have been in that shootout.

Look, we are both Ranger fans here so this is just a friendly debate, Im not looking to get in an arguement here We are both entitled to our opinions. Lets just hope whatever the case (if he is fired or not) we can fix this season and get back on the right track and start getting ready for the playoff atmosphere at the Garden.

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Old
01-06-2008, 09:09 PM
  #123
MountVancouver'94
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Originally Posted by TrueBlue9 View Post
[/B]

That's true, Joe Torre didn't win much either.
The Yankees don't count.

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01-06-2008, 10:26 PM
  #124
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instead of fat quinn and hartley what do you guys think about larry robinson?

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Old
01-06-2008, 10:29 PM
  #125
NyRangers88
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Originally Posted by devito1192 View Post
instead of fat quinn and hartley what do you guys think about larry robinson?
You took the words the right out of my mouth!

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