HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Could Knuble be the odd man out at the deadline?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-13-2008, 08:58 PM
  #51
Chainsaw
Registered User
 
Chainsaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,799
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by sickamore View Post
This is really becoming curious to me.

3rd in +/-, but not because of anything he does especially well, and days like today he costs them quite a bit.

The PK thing seems more like he's getting credit for the aggressive play of everyone else. They are extra dangerous in that they get a lot of scoring chances from that aggressive play. Hatcher plays a lot of PK time because he is better when he doesn't have to move up ice, but I don't see him being the reason the PK improved. That distinction in my mind in the aggressive mobile guys.

Logs large ice time, but does it in fewer shifts. He can't clear the zone effectively or with any consistency and stays on the ice much longer than he should at his age and with his knees. That is not a plus as far as I'm concerned. That's horrible time management and hurts him more at the end of games, thus hurting the team. I'd be very curious to see if he's on the ice for all or most of the late period goals because of it.

Not knocking you, just see this support of hatcher and it doesn't seem realistic to me.
To me The defence is our heel right now and Hatcher is one of our better guys. Beside Coburn, it's maybe not that i like him so much it's that the other guys are so bad.

Chainsaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-13-2008, 09:08 PM
  #52
wrx27
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: PA
Country: Germany
Posts: 167
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vancouver_Flyers_fan View Post
Maybe.....On the otherhand Naslund is gone at the end of this season. Canucks have to make a run this year!
naslund for knuble, sign forsberg

I can dream

wrx27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-13-2008, 09:15 PM
  #53
mercury
Registered User
 
mercury's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: South Philly/SoCal
Country: United States
Posts: 11,114
vCash: 500
I could see Detroit offering a 2nd and a decent prospect/cheap roster player for Knuble at the deadline. Andersson, maybe?

mercury is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-13-2008, 09:20 PM
  #54
penguinonapole
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 272
vCash: 500
With lack of ice time Upshall and Kukkonen have seen, I see one of these two being traded before Knuble.

penguinonapole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-13-2008, 09:24 PM
  #55
wrx27
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: PA
Country: Germany
Posts: 167
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by penguinonapole View Post
With lack of ice time Upshall and Kukkonen have seen, I see one of these two being traded before Knuble.
i sure hope not!!

wrx27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 05:47 AM
  #56
panayiotis
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,254
vCash: 500
good deal

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyersguru View Post
It is a subject that has been talked about over and over again. And the more I think about it, the more I get the feeling Knuble could be moved at the deadline. There are a couple of reason why I think this.

First, his age and salary. Knuble is a great player on the power play but his even strength abilities are starting to leave him. His puck control and speed are starting to decline quickly. With him being moved, you can use some his cap money to resign Carter and Umberger.

Secondly, with the rumors of Forsberg coming back, Lupul's pending return within a month (hopefully) and the recent play of Downie and Hartnell finding his game, Knuble seems to be the odd man out, unless you place him on the 4th line, which I don't see happening. As off right now, without Forsberg, here is the Top 9 forwards on this team, in no order.

1) Briere
2) Gagne
3) Richards
4) Lupul
5) Umberger
6) Hartnell
7) Carter
8) Downie
9) Upshall

And that is not including Forsberg or Knuble.

Finally, moving a Knuble could land you some decent prospects or picks in which Homer can use as ammo to move up in this years draft to pick up a solid right handed dman.

As much as Knuble has meant to this team the past couple of years, it's looking more and more like he could be the odd man out.
Trading him and Jason Smith would be great moves. The next 2 drafts are suppose to be killers. The money could be spent to lock in Carter.

panayiotis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 07:42 AM
  #57
JXC
#LaviPondHockeyFail
 
JXC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Country: United States
Posts: 13,976
vCash: 500
I doubt we will be havuing this discussion roundabout deadline time; the Flyers have a problem to solve on defense, and it would appear that they have a little bit of a glut up front (or will, if Downie keeps playing the way he has, and when Lupul returns).

If there's a team out there with a glut on D, maybe we'll see a deal. Unfortunately what the Flyers lack on defense is a #1 to play alongside Timonen, and those aren't exactly lying around out there.

JXC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 07:48 AM
  #58
sickamore
 
sickamore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 785
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JXC View Post
I doubt we will be havuing this discussion roundabout deadline time; the Flyers have a problem to solve on defense, and it would appear that they have a little bit of a glut up front (or will, if Downie keeps playing the way he has, and when Lupul returns).

If there's a team out there with a glut on D, maybe we'll see a deal. Unfortunately what the Flyers lack on defense is a #1 to play alongside Timonen, and those aren't exactly lying around out there.
Nor are they cheap. We nee to expect to lose someone we like to bolster the D beyond serviceable guys.

sickamore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 08:10 AM
  #59
JXC
#LaviPondHockeyFail
 
JXC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Country: United States
Posts: 13,976
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by sickamore View Post
Nor are they cheap. We nee to expect to lose someone we like to bolster the D beyond serviceable guys.
Yeah, I keep forgetting about that cap thing. So I guess that narrows my list down to a guy out there getting second pairing minutes who the Flyers think is a legit first pairing guy who doesn't cost a lot of money

They actually MIGHT be able to score a guy like at deadline time, if he is destined for RFA and his current team has a cap issue...

JXC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 08:44 AM
  #60
Kaktus*
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: PA
Posts: 22,389
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Griffin View Post
Maybe, maybe not. If Knuble was 28 years old, I'd agree 100%, but he's not.
If he was 28 why would Flyers trade him?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Griffin View Post
He's 35, will be well into his 36th year by the time the season rolls around next year and it's not uncommon for players in that age range to erode rapidly, especially considering Knuble already is a fairly slow player to begin with. And if he doesn't work out with the Sedins, then what? He'd be next to useless with the Canucks.
Then you waive him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Griffin View Post
I think Nonis would MUCH rather try to acquire a younger player, even a potential UFA, as it would allow him to possibly sign him for longer term. Knuble is basically a crapshoot as far as next season goes IMO and he's not that cheap signed to a $2.8M cap hit. If the Canucks are interested I can guarantee their 1st round pick wouldn't be going the other way, at best probably their 2nd. Believe it or not, Knuble's value would likely be higher if he was an UFA after this season.
Using your Knubles logic.. (Nonis will give up more for someone like that and sign him to more money and longer term) What if younger potential UFA you are talking about becomes useless for whatever reason... Whats next..

Kaktus* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 08:55 AM
  #61
lancer247
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,209
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by penguinonapole View Post
With lack of ice time Upshall and Kukkonen have seen, I see one of these two being traded before Knuble.
bingo!

upshall hardly seemed to play the 2nd half of the 3rd period while downie played the final two minutes in a close game.

i know people love how well hatcher does on the PK but we're talking about the 20th ranked PK and hatch has been a turnover machine.

at the very least, kuks should get to play on back to back games...it seems ridiculous have smith, hatcher and vandy on a team that has a lot of trouble getting the puck out of their own end

lancer247 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 09:04 AM
  #62
BronxBruin
Registered User
 
BronxBruin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Bronx, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 1,790
vCash: 500
I could see Boston being interested in Knuble. While their power play has been good, they are struggling to generate offense 5-on-5 due to injuries (thanks again, Randy Jones) and could use a top 6 forward. Maybe something around Knuble for Aaron Ward? or Andrew Alberts? (though not sure it'd be a good idea to put him in the same room with Hartnell). Not sure if picks/prospects would need to be thrown in to even things up or not. Just a thought.

BronxBruin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 09:09 AM
  #63
Kaktus*
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: PA
Posts: 22,389
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BronxBruin View Post
I could see Boston being interested in Knuble. While their power play has been good, they are struggling to generate offense 5-on-5 due to injuries (thanks again, Randy Jones) and could use a top 6 forward. Maybe something around Knuble for Aaron Ward? or Andrew Alberts? (though not sure it'd be a good idea to put him in the same room with Hartnell). Not sure if picks/prospects would need to be thrown in to even things up or not. Just a thought.
Well Knuble did nothing 5 on 5 this season...

I would take Ward.. but we would have 8-9 NHL d-man.

Kaktus* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 09:17 AM
  #64
mercury
Registered User
 
mercury's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: South Philly/SoCal
Country: United States
Posts: 11,114
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BronxBruin View Post
I could see Boston being interested in Knuble. While their power play has been good, they are struggling to generate offense 5-on-5 due to injuries (thanks again, Randy Jones) and could use a top 6 forward. Maybe something around Knuble for Aaron Ward? or Andrew Alberts? (though not sure it'd be a good idea to put him in the same room with Hartnell). Not sure if picks/prospects would need to be thrown in to even things up or not. Just a thought.
I think a 2nd round pick would do it. You'd be fine cap-wise, right? We could take an expiring UFA back, too, I would think. We don't really need a defenseman unless it's a major upgrade and is signed through at least next year. We have 7 guys as it is (Kukkonen or Vandermeer are scratched every game).

mercury is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 09:28 AM
  #65
Dig Out Your Soul
Ex Storm...
 
Dig Out Your Soul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 23,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BronxBruin View Post
I could see Boston being interested in Knuble. While their power play has been good, they are struggling to generate offense 5-on-5 due to injuries (thanks again, Randy Jones) and could use a top 6 forward. Maybe something around Knuble for Aaron Ward? or Andrew Alberts? (though not sure it'd be a good idea to put him in the same room with Hartnell). Not sure if picks/prospects would need to be thrown in to even things up or not. Just a thought.
Knuble's not your man if you're struggling 5 on 5. He's essentially become a powerplay specialist at this point and he's not even that great at that considering how many PPs he evens up with a bad penalty.

Dig Out Your Soul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 10:08 AM
  #66
Dash22
Registered User
 
Dash22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Buckingham, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 951
vCash: 500
As much as it pains me to say, i think that Knuble will be with the Flyer for at least the remainder of this season.

Dash22 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 12:27 PM
  #67
Danko
...the way she goes
 
Danko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Country: United States
Posts: 4,419
vCash: 420
As much as I don't like Knuble right now, if we get Forsberg back which seems likely, then he may fit again with Gagne on the other side. I think the best move would be to let some of our prospects get the chance to play and drop guys like Dowd, Fitzpatrick, and put Kapenen (waivers.)

Another thing I would like to do is drop Randy Jones and bring in Picard...Jones is what he is, he's as old as Gagne I believe and he's really being played and presented like he's a 23 year old prospect still. Same thing with Rosie, **** or get off the pot.

To a lesser extent, maybe Jim Vandermeer can go elsewhere, we should have enough to get Forsberg, and possibly sign a solid 5th spot D-man.

Danko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 12:36 PM
  #68
mikedifr
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 8,359
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by chromemaro View Post
knuble is a very likable guy and seems to be a great team player...but i think he will leave at the deadline. It doesn't seem like he will be playing top 6 min for this team next year or the rest of this year for that matter
Why does he need to play top 6 minutes? He can play on the third line and #1 PP unit

Quote:
Originally Posted by flyersfan97 View Post
Front-office/coaching type of thingy maybe?

As for Knuble, I don't know what to say, I know he isn't what he used to be, but I think his desire is second to none. I am perplexed on all of this, I guess I'll just leave it to the people who know far more than I do to make the decisions. One thing is for certain, though, I do NOT want to see Downie sent back down.
I dont think his skills have left him at all....I see the same player we always saw for the most part, other then the stupid penalties on the PP....Briere doesnt make the soft passes like Forsberg and he had some trouble handling them and keeping up with him. He has been fine when playing with any of the other centers on the team, and has been great on the PP(minus the penalties)

Quote:
Originally Posted by saskyoil View Post
Can Knuble play LW and what would it take from EDM to get him?
Yes he can play LW, he did it for a couple years in Boston.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vancouver_Flyers_fan View Post
Knuble is our leading pp goal scorer. I just don't know with this guy. If we get Forsberg than ya deal him but otherwise I think he is worth moe to us than what we could get for him in a trade. I dont think his trade value is that great
Actually I think if we get Forsberg and we can renunite him with Forsberg, he has more value here then via trade.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Switchblade View Post
I think you could see a team like Vancouver look to pick him up. He has a reasonable contract and needs to play the same cycle style as the Sedin twins to thrive. Living in the area, I know that finding the third Sedin been a major focus for the last few years. 2 years ago, they had Anson Carter. He worked well until he asked for more money than he was worth. Last year, they had Pyatt for much of the year, but he was never consistent and has dropped off his play this year.

The Canucks would not be averse to the extra year on Knuble's contract as it guarantees them another year of him.
Everyone mentions Vancouver when talking about Knuble. He fits the Sedin line perfectly, and he also works with Morrison as well. Who knows.

mikedifr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 01:22 PM
  #69
CantSeeColors
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Country: Seychelles
Posts: 5,472
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Dank View Post
As much as I don't like Knuble right now, if we get Forsberg back which seems likely, then he may fit again with Gagne on the other side. I think the best move would be to let some of our prospects get the chance to play and drop guys like Dowd, Fitzpatrick, and put Kapenen (waivers.)

Another thing I would like to do is drop Randy Jones and bring in Picard...Jones is what he is, he's as old as Gagne I believe and he's really being played and presented like he's a 23 year old prospect still. Same thing with Rosie, **** or get off the pot.

To a lesser extent, maybe Jim Vandermeer can go elsewhere, we should have enough to get Forsberg, and possibly sign a solid 5th spot D-man.
How are people missing this so much? If Forsberg comes back, Knuble once again has his dream center. With Forsberg in the lineup, there would be no reason to move Knuble at the deadline. Given the icetime and lines we've seen over the past few months, Upshall is obviously the odd man out.

CantSeeColors is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 01:25 PM
  #70
mikedifr
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 8,359
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CantSeeColors View Post
How are people missing this so much? If Forsberg comes back, Knuble once again has his dream center. With Forsberg in the lineup, there would be no reason to move Knuble at the deadline. Given the icetime and lines we've seen over the past few months, Upshall is obviously the odd man out.
I agree with reuniting Knuble and Forsberg but I dont want to separate Gagne and Briere. I also dont wont to lose Upshall cause I think he has a lot more to offer then Stevens is giving him the opportunity to show.

mikedifr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 01:33 PM
  #71
Larry44
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 5,741
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Dank View Post
Another thing I would like to do is drop Randy Jones and bring in Picard...Jones is what he is, he's as old as Gagne I believe and he's really being played and presented like he's a 23 year old prospect still. Same thing with Rosie, **** or get off the pot.
Jones is 17 months younger than Gagne, and only two months older than Kukkonen. Does Kukko have to go to, if all '81s must go?

Seriously, Jones is 26 right now, just the age when young D men start playing the way Jones has this year: which is very well. He's matured into a good all around Dman. He can play the PP and PK, he hits, he's good a moving the puck, he's a big mobile player.

Ruzicka was drafted in the same class as Carter, Richards, Coburn, Potulny, Tolpeko (1985 models). Rosie's played very weill when he's in the lineup, but he's still a young player by any reasonable standard. Not every player is ready by the time they are 20 to be a full-time NHLer.

Larry44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 01:36 PM
  #72
mikedifr
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 8,359
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebel Banker View Post
bingo!

upshall hardly seemed to play the 2nd half of the 3rd period while downie played the final two minutes in a close game.

i know people love how well hatcher does on the PK but we're talking about the 20th ranked PK and hatch has been a turnover machine.

at the very least, kuks should get to play on back to back games...it seems ridiculous have smith, hatcher and vandy on a team that has a lot of trouble getting the puck out of their own end
It seems like everyone realizes this except the guy that gets paid to....

mikedifr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 02:12 PM
  #73
CantSeeColors
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Country: Seychelles
Posts: 5,472
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
I agree with reuniting Knuble and Forsberg but I dont want to separate Gagne and Briere. I also dont wont to lose Upshall cause I think he has a lot more to offer then Stevens is giving him the opportunity to show.
Agreed on both points. Briere needs Gagne. I don't want to lose Upshall either, I'm just facing the reality that Stevens doesn't like him. By odd man out I simply meant not getting minutes, not necessarily being dealt. He could return next year after Forsberg and maybe someone else are going.

CantSeeColors is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 03:17 PM
  #74
mikedifr
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 8,359
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CantSeeColors View Post
Agreed on both points. Briere needs Gagne. I don't want to lose Upshall either, I'm just facing the reality that Stevens doesn't like him. By odd man out I simply meant not getting minutes, not necessarily being dealt. He could return next year after Forsberg and maybe someone else are going.
Agreed. As much as I like Knuble, I want Downie and Upshall to step up and start playing more, not to mention Giroux potentially making the team next year. I know we are deep on the wings and someone will be used as a trading chip but I hope it isnt Upshall.

mikedifr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2008, 03:51 PM
  #75
krantan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 376
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry44 View Post
Jones is 17 months younger than Gagne, and only two months older than Kukkonen. Does Kukko have to go to, if all '81s must go?

Seriously, Jones is 26 right now, just the age when young D men start playing the way Jones has this year: which is very well. He's matured into a good all around Dman. He can play the PP and PK, he hits, he's good a moving the puck, he's a big mobile player.

Ruzicka was drafted in the same class as Carter, Richards, Coburn, Potulny, Tolpeko (1985 models). Rosie's played very weill when he's in the lineup, but he's still a young player by any reasonable standard. Not every player is ready by the time they are 20 to be a full-time NHLer.
I agree with your evaluation of Jones. He's above average in just about every attribute for a defenseman, though he doesn't have any real strengths to hang his hat on.

Ruzicka is still a prospect by any reasonable definition, and has been at least acceptable in the time he has spent with the Flyers. His window is starting to close however, so I'd be pretty surprised if he is still with the Flyers by next season. He could probably contribute to a good half dozen teams in the league, but he looks to be pretty throughly blocked with all the young talent/prospects in our system. I think Ruzicka + Kukkonen could probably get us something worth talking about at the deadline.

krantan is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:30 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.