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OT: Best Ranger fighter

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Old
02-06-2008, 12:33 PM
  #51
Sad London Ranger
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the Twister!

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Old
02-06-2008, 12:42 PM
  #52
Fletch
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I didn't think...

anyone wanted to fight Twist. That guy had such a quick right hand (actually arm, and it may've been left - I keep going over it in my head and am not recalling now). He seemed to **** it back pretty far and fling it like it had springs. Langdon fought him - didn't seem like a fair fight but Darren hung on and Twist didn't get in any good shots.

I liked Langdon as a fighter. He didn't seem to be a heavyweight (because he was about 6'1 200 lbs), but still fought them and had his share of wins against them. He didn't have a great punch, but he seemed to be able to get in an lot of shots (due to that crazy stamina). He was able to take a punch, and avoid being punched by the best of them. I really only remember two losses, and I think I saw about all his fights (the Grissom loss, which somebody already mentioned, and I'd say Twist beat him since he really just hung on for dear life and avoided being hit hard).

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Old
02-06-2008, 01:05 PM
  #53
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what about dan cloutier?


http://youtube.com/watch?v=kqp19EdCvJg

haha, he challenges the isles bench after, too bad he stinks at goalie.

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Old
02-06-2008, 01:06 PM
  #54
Anthony Mauro
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Malik, ya'll had no idea!

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Old
02-06-2008, 01:40 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy London Ranger View Post
Colton Orr woudn't make the top 10

In no exact order i would rate following pugilist superior to Orr.

Mess - noone would Mess with him
Fotiu
Stock
Kocur
Poeschek
Mallette
Jansens
Domi
Beck
Nilan - but not for the Rangers
Graves
Cairns
Langdon
McPhee
Greshner was another tough customer
Hardy


Can't judge Kurtenbach
Vickers


Worse than him
McKenna
Sandy McCarthy
boxcar Hospodar - enthusiastic but soft
Moeller



Mess - no one would Mess with him ( not a good fighter at all tuff yes fights no
Fotiu
Stock
Kocur
Poeschek
Mallette
Jansens
Domi
Beck
Nilan - but not for the Rangers (then why mention him? he was shell in NY)
Graves
Cairns (tried like hell but not very good with the Rangers.)
Langdon
McPhee
Greshner was another tough customer ( Tough but not a great fighter at all )
Hardy (what when vs who? The guy had a few never won lol )


Can't judge Kurtenbach
Vickers ( won a lot on teams that didn't fight often but wasn't great won big or lost big)

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Old
02-06-2008, 02:13 PM
  #56
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Shanny ha

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Old
02-06-2008, 05:16 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy London Ranger View Post
Colton Orr woudn't make the top 10

In no exact order i would rate following pugilist superior to Orr.

Mess - noone would Mess with him
Fotiu
Stock
Kocur
Poeschek
Mallette
Jansens
Domi
Beck
Nilan - but not for the Rangers
Graves
Cairns
Langdon
McPhee
Greshner was another tough customer
Hardy


Can't judge Kurtenbach
Vickers


Worse than him
McKenna
Sandy McCarthy
boxcar Hospodar - enthusiastic but soft
Moeller
Kocur i will give you. Fotiu too...technically better than Orr. Faster hands, better balance. Langdon I think would also be him, in a marathon fight. But the rest of them? C`mon London, let's give some props here to Orr.

Never has any of the aforementioned fighters even come close to doing the damage that Orr did with the Rangers. You can make the argument for Kocur, but most of the devastation Kocur did was with the Wings. Look at what Orr has done since coming into the NHL.

Wade Belak- Broken Nose
Joe Rullier- Broken Nose
Andre Roy- Fractured Orbital Bone
Eric Godard- Broken Nose
Eric Godard- TKO
Todd Fedoruk- KO
Eric Boulton- TKO
Jody Shelley- Bloodied
Riley Cote- Dropped with one punch
Wade Brookbank- Stunned and Bloodied
Andy Sutton- TKO
Cam Janssens- Dropped with a huge Left hand
Jesse Boulerice- TKO

Say what you will about Orr. The guy doesn't win them all. But...he has left a path of destruction that nobody to play for this team has ever done with the exception of Joe Kocur. Every one of the afore mentioned fights can be pretty much youtube'd. Do the comparision yourself.

In the minors the guy also TKO'd Ryan Flynn, Mark Jerant. He also bested George Parros 2x, and in one of the fights he totally KO'd the guy.

The guy fights to win. Not too hold on, and squeeze out decisions. But to say he wouldnt crack the top ten is crazy. Not only would he, but he would probably crack half of those guys wide open in the process.

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Old
02-06-2008, 05:35 PM
  #58
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I'm in the same age bracket as Fletch (I'm 39), so my memories of Vickers are somewhat vague. Funny thing is that I have a really vivid memory of being at the Garden and hearing Ranger fans harassing Dave Schultz to no end....strange what sticks in your mind.

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Old
02-06-2008, 06:48 PM
  #59
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Agree that Orr is one of the better ones as far as damage he can cause. He hasn't been able to break into the upper tier more or less because he's not as big as some others who are experienced enough to keep him at arms length. Difficulties witht he Brashear's. Orr is not really a monster--he's just real tough. He's willing and like Langdon in a lot of ways--a good teammate who will sticky up for anybody but kind of a lousy hockey player.

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Old
02-07-2008, 05:30 AM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lion Hound View Post
Kocur i will give you. Fotiu too...technically better than Orr. Faster hands, better balance. Langdon I think would also be him, in a marathon fight. But the rest of them? C`mon London, let's give some props here to Orr.

Never has any of the aforementioned fighters even come close to doing the damage that Orr did with the Rangers. You can make the argument for Kocur, but most of the devastation Kocur did was with the Wings. Look at what Orr has done since coming into the NHL.

Wade Belak- Broken Nose
Joe Rullier- Broken Nose
Andre Roy- Fractured Orbital Bone
Eric Godard- Broken Nose
Eric Godard- TKO
Todd Fedoruk- KO
Eric Boulton- TKO
Jody Shelley- Bloodied
Riley Cote- Dropped with one punch
Wade Brookbank- Stunned and Bloodied
Andy Sutton- TKO
Cam Janssens- Dropped with a huge Left hand
Jesse Boulerice- TKO

Say what you will about Orr. The guy doesn't win them all. But...he has left a path of destruction that nobody to play for this team has ever done with the exception of Joe Kocur. Every one of the afore mentioned fights can be pretty much youtube'd. Do the comparision yourself.

In the minors the guy also TKO'd Ryan Flynn, Mark Jerant. He also bested George Parros 2x, and in one of the fights he totally KO'd the guy.

The guy fights to win. Not too hold on, and squeeze out decisions. But to say he wouldnt crack the top ten is crazy. Not only would he, but he would probably crack half of those guys wide open in the process.
I don't think Orr would have beaten Domi either - in his dreams maybe. I have seen Domi going toe/toe with the best - Probert. Fearless, fast, resilient and antagonizing. In the same vein albeit not as good were Stock and King.

Neither Kocur, Nilan and Cairns were at their prime as Rangers but still some of the very best, Joey
arguably the best not called Behn Wilson, Probert, Grimson.

Clearly I threw in some names just to be controversial but....

Poeshek was an animal - no chance for Orr
Beck would have made mincemeat of Orr
Mess would take 2nd seat to noone
Mallette was very good and willing

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Old
02-07-2008, 08:44 AM
  #61
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Nicky Foitu might of been the greatest fighter in the history of the NHL

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Old
02-07-2008, 10:04 AM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy London Ranger View Post
I don't think Orr would have beaten Domi either - in his dreams maybe. I have seen Domi going toe/toe with the best - Probert. Fearless, fast, resilient and antagonizing. In the same vein albeit not as good were Stock and King.

Neither Kocur, Nilan and Cairns were at their prime as Rangers but still some of the very best, Joey
arguably the best not called Behn Wilson, Probert, Grimson.

Clearly I threw in some names just to be controversial but....

Poeshek was an animal - no chance for Orr
Beck would have made mincemeat of Orr
Mess would take 2nd seat to noone
Mallette was very good and willing

Domi I will give you too. I think in a best of 3 Domi would win at least 2 of them. That is going Prime vs Prime. But I think Orr would edge him out in one. Now there another thing to factor in here. Orr is playing the game in a much different NHL. Meaning, when he came to the team he was listed around 6’ 3” 235lbs. He dropped 20 lbs to be able to skate in the “New NHL”. Before he lost the weight, he rarely lost a fight in the AHL, or in Jrs. He was literallt running through everyone. If Orr played in the 80’s and 90’s he probably would have been able to not only keep the weight on, but also juice it up like the Domi’s, the Twist’s, the Vukota’s etc. That was running rampant through the NHL at that time. But in a tilt vs Domi, if it went into the spin cycle that Domi was noted for, I think Orr would lose balance and lose two out of three.

For Nilan though, I just don’t see it. Nialn was tough, he would get in close, and tie you up. A very good technical fighter, but the two styles don’t match up well, and I think it would be a non-event.

Let’s break this down London. Starting with Poeshek. Big guy, rapidfire punches. Exactly the kind of guy that doesn’t matchup well with Orr. He was all offense, and when a guy leaves himself open, he is vulnerable. Let’s not forget, Rudy really only had one really good year in the fight department. That was his rook season with the Rangers. After that, he was effective…but never dominating. In 129 NHL fights Poeshek had 2 TKO’s and was knocked unconscious himself by Wendel Clark. He also has a lot of losses to lesser fighters. Nathan Perrot, Jeff Odgers, Danny Lembert, Dody Wood, Troy Malette, and Mark Tinordi.

Beck was definitely a monster, but rarely did he ever lose a fight…If ever. But, where was Barry Beck when Clark Gillies and Bobby Nystrom ran roughshod over the Rangers? Also, have you ever really watched Barry Beck’s fights? Most of his 47 career fighting majors were total hugfests with some small noogies thrown to the back of the head. Beck had good punching power, in 47 fights he TKO’s Holmgren and Jay Wells…but again, rarely did he ever open up. So to say he would make mincemeat of anyone is a stretch.

So Mess taking a 2nd seat to Kevin Kaminski, and Randy Hillier doesn't count? Messier is one of my favorite players all time. Love the guy, but he is just not in the same class as the fighters we have mentioned above. Yeah, he beat Darius Kasparitus, and Blake…but he was much bigger than both of those guys, and either of them were fighters. Messier struggled in a lot of fights. McSorley whooped his ass 3 or 4 times. Kevin Kaminski, and Randy Hillier also both beat the guys ass. So, while he does have the title of best leader of all time, he wouldn’t in any wey be close to the Rangers best fighter, nor is in the same category as Colton Orr in that department.

Troy Mallette was very willing, but the guy in a Ranger sweater barely if ever won a fight. To say this guy would beat Orr is asinine. The guy had 54 career fighting majors with the Rangers. You know how many times he won? 6…THAT’S RIGHT 6 TIMES!!!! No chance for Mallette here.

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Old
02-07-2008, 10:28 AM
  #63
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lionhound - I am happily learn,ing or admit mistakes.

Beck was strange no doubt about it. Maybe he fought and won when he was coked out - lost when he was hurt - its hard to say after so many years.

I saw every game when Poeshek adn Mallette were playing for the rangers.
I can't believe I would have such a different opinion of those fights.

Size doesn't necessarily mean a good fighter. Cairns was bigger than Orr and his card
is not one sided. Good days - bad days.

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Old
02-07-2008, 10:35 AM
  #64
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Lion Hound...

in the NHL, doesn't Orr appear to be a better fighter at a lighter weight? He didn't seem to win over many fans when he first began playing with the Rangers as he wasn't winning fights, and wasn't skating well. It seemed as though when the weight came off, he became better.

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02-07-2008, 11:13 AM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
in the NHL, doesn't Orr appear to be a better fighter at a lighter weight? He didn't seem to win over many fans when he first began playing with the Rangers as he wasn't winning fights, and wasn't skating well. It seemed as though when the weight came off, he became better.

When Orr was coming up through Jrs, he was bigger than a lot of the competition. He pretty much ran through everyone while with the Swift Current Broncos. He was a boy in a mans body, and while in training camp SC had 4 guys that were all fighting for the position. He beat them all in training camp, and TKO’d three of them in the process. He also bested Derek Boogaard in both of their tilts.

Later when he went to the AHL, with Providence he was considered a top three heavyweight there. He bulked up to 230 I believe and had a great run. He fought everyone ove rthse two years, and a lot of fight enthusiasts considered him the best fighter in the AHL. Every top heavy there he fought, Gillies, Anglestad, Flynn, Godard, Gratton, Fritz, Fedoruk…etc. He won most of his fights there, and gained a rep for the big right hand. Coming out, he McGrattan, and Boogaard all I believe had their rook seasons together. At the time Orr was considered the best by most of the fight enthusiasts.

In the NHL he sucked a lot of weight, and didn’t have the same results as many of his dominating decisions in the AHL. Basically if he connected he won, but it seemed at the time he was harder to knock off balance at the heavier weight. In the NHL that has happened in a lot of his fights. He gets a couple off and then seems to get knocked off balance and muscled to the ice. See the Peters, Brashear, and first Laraque fights. I think with the weight loss, he struggles if he fights a technical fighter. If he goes to toe to toe with anyone willing to stand he fares really good. See the Godard, Fedoruk, Roy, Boulerice fights. He also seems to struggle against the big lefties too. Namely Brash and Laraque.

But overall I think at the bigger weight, he was a better fighter. He still has a lot of the same results in his fights…TKO’s, KO’s broken bones etc, so the argument is definitely there. But to me, in the fights that go to a decision, he isn’t coming out on top as much.

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02-07-2008, 11:22 AM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lion Hound View Post
Domi I will give you too. I think in a best of 3 Domi would win at least 2 of them. That is going Prime vs Prime. But I think Orr would edge him out in one. Now there another thing to factor in here. Orr is playing the game in a much different NHL. Meaning, when he came to the team he was listed around 6’ 3” 235lbs. He dropped 20 lbs to be able to skate in the “New NHL”. Before he lost the weight, he rarely lost a fight in the AHL, or in Jrs. He was literallt running through everyone. If Orr played in the 80’s and 90’s he probably would have been able to not only keep the weight on, but also juice it up like the Domi’s, the Twist’s, the Vukota’s etc. That was running rampant through the NHL at that time. But in a tilt vs Domi, if it went into the spin cycle that Domi was noted for, I think Orr would lose balance and lose two out of three.

For Nilan though, I just don’t see it. Nialn was tough, he would get in close, and tie you up. A very good technical fighter, but the two styles don’t match up well, and I think it would be a non-event.

Let’s break this down London. Starting with Poeshek. Big guy, rapidfire punches. Exactly the kind of guy that doesn’t matchup well with Orr. He was all offense, and when a guy leaves himself open, he is vulnerable. Let’s not forget, Rudy really only had one really good year in the fight department. That was his rook season with the Rangers. After that, he was effective…but never dominating. In 129 NHL fights Poeshek had 2 TKO’s and was knocked unconscious himself by Wendel Clark. He also has a lot of losses to lesser fighters. Nathan Perrot, Jeff Odgers, Danny Lembert, Dody Wood, Troy Malette, and Mark Tinordi.

Beck was definitely a monster, but rarely did he ever lose a fight…If ever. But, where was Barry Beck when Clark Gillies and Bobby Nystrom ran roughshod over the Rangers? Also, have you ever really watched Barry Beck’s fights? Most of his 47 career fighting majors were total hugfests with some small noogies thrown to the back of the head. Beck had good punching power, in 47 fights he TKO’s Holmgren and Jay Wells…but again, rarely did he ever open up. So to say he would make mincemeat of anyone is a stretch.

So Mess taking a 2nd seat to Kevin Kaminski, and Randy Hillier doesn't count? Messier is one of my favorite players all time. Love the guy, but he is just not in the same class as the fighters we have mentioned above. Yeah, he beat Darius Kasparitus, and Blake…but he was much bigger than both of those guys, and either of them were fighters. Messier struggled in a lot of fights. McSorley whooped his ass 3 or 4 times. Kevin Kaminski, and Randy Hillier also both beat the guys ass. So, while he does have the title of best leader of all time, he wouldn’t in any wey be close to the Rangers best fighter, nor is in the same category as Colton Orr in that department.

Troy Mallette was very willing, but the guy in a Ranger sweater barely if ever won a fight. To say this guy would beat Orr is asinine. The guy had 54 career fighting majors with the Rangers. You know how many times he won? 6…THAT’S RIGHT 6 TIMES!!!! No chance for Mallette here.



Troy Mallette His rookie year he threw punches and took on everyone, Then he became the worlds largest leg humper and wrestler Orr kilss him.


Beck If the ram rod was closed the night before and Barry was angery Orr is dead and never heard from again. If Barry pulled the crap he did with Dave Brown by wrestling him to the ground 3 times and never throwing a single punch and scolding him who needs him.

Messier Thats a joke the guy was a terrible fighter

Poeschek was a pillow puncher with no power Orr cleans his clock.

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02-07-2008, 11:43 AM
  #67
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Lion...

perhaps he just struggles against two of the best (Brash and Laroque) and it's not really his weight or the fact that they're lefties.

I had thought he wasn't a good fighter in the NHL before he sucked the weight - I don't have a timeline though.

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02-07-2008, 11:45 AM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dagoon44 View Post


Troy Mallette His rookie year he threw punches and took on everyone, Then he became the worlds largest leg humper and wrestler Orr kilss him.


Beck If the ram rod was closed the night before and Barry was angery Orr is dead and never heard from again. If Barry pulled the crap he did with Dave Brown by wrestling him to the ground 3 times and never throwing a single punch and scolding him who needs him.

Messier Thats a joke the guy was a terrible fighter

Poeschek was a pillow puncher with no power Orr cleans his clock.
Do you really think Mess was a terrible fighter??? I seem to remember, especially earlier in his career that Mess wasn't too bad (never great, but not bad). He was never a great puncher but his raw strength made it tough to do much against. Seem to remember some battles with him and Otto where he didn't do to badly. So many years and so many beers ago that my memory may be fading! Figured you if anyone would remember!

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02-07-2008, 12:11 PM
  #69
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Nicky Foitu might of been the greatest fighter in the history of the NHL
Yeah.

And Brian Noonan might have been the greatest goal scorer in the history of the NHL.

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02-07-2008, 01:17 PM
  #70
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Yeah.

And Brian Noonan might have been the greatest goal scorer in the history of the NHL.
Hey Choosen do you have anything to back up Nicky not being that good? I am personally involved in 3 major hockey fights sites and i won one of the top 3 largest collections pf hockey fight dvds and vhs in the world. I am 100% in agreement that Nicky ranks in top 3 on many score cards and number 1 on more then alot. He wasfeared in his day and distroyed Probert in the AHL and Behn Wilson was almost out on his feet from one punch. Schultz publicly states that he was scared sh44less of Nicky. So go back in your film room and comment when you have something to bring to the table

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02-07-2008, 01:23 PM
  #71
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Not that he did it much, but whenever Mess would fight he would beat a guys ass

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02-07-2008, 01:27 PM
  #72
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Hey Choosen do you have anything to back up Nicky not being that good? I am personally involved in 3 major hockey fights sites and i won one of the top 3 largest collections pf hockey fight dvds and vhs in the world. I am 100% in agreement that Nicky ranks in top 3 on many score cards and number 1 on more then alot. He wasfeared in his day and distroyed Probert in the AHL and Behn Wilson was almost out on his feet from one punch. Schultz publicly states that he was scared sh44less of Nicky. So go back in your film room and comment when you have something to bring to the table
How do you prove this argument in any direction? Answer: It can't be done.

I'm going by what I saw.

He was a very good fighter but to call him the greatest ever is a joke.

Thankfully, I don't have a film room. Maybe you should stay in yours.

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02-07-2008, 02:20 PM
  #73
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Fotiu was unquestionable one of the best ever at his trade. The proof is in the vid's, in the conversations with ex-players, his win/loss record. He was about as feared as they come. Definate top 10 material.

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02-07-2008, 04:18 PM
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chosen View Post
How do you prove this argument in any direction? Answer: It can't be done.

I'm going by what I saw.

He was a very good fighter but to call him the greatest ever is a joke.

Thankfully, I don't have a film room. Maybe you should stay in yours.

On Schultz being scared sh*tless of Fotiu--he admitted it in his book 'The Hammer'.

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02-07-2008, 05:02 PM
  #75
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He killed Probert in the AHL and took care of many of the NHL baddest dudes in the 80's. He handled people like Baxter and Randy Holt with easy and Gillies went no where near Nicky. Jay Wells and Gordie lane out pointed him but other that and towards the end when a NY RAnger named Joe Patterson beat a Flyer Nicky Fotiu Nicky was feared

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