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Carter gets free ride on this board...

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Old
02-13-2008, 01:49 PM
  #51
claude boivin lives
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I don't have the time or energy to add much to this thread, but....as someone who is not an enormous Carter fan, even I would say that trading Carter for Sundin is a flat out awful idea.




Yes, it is horrible, this idea

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02-13-2008, 02:01 PM
  #52
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Carter brings too much to this team at the moment to trade him unless a respectable Centre is coming back this is with or with out Forsberg signing. To be fair Briere should be put to Wing with a 2nd/3rd line centre coming in with another pucking moving defenceman before the transfer deadline if we want a chance of success this season.

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02-13-2008, 02:03 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jroach19 View Post
His best attribute is a wrist shot that misses the f***ing net half the time!
He does need to work on getting more of his shots on net. However, his play over all has been pretty good. His goal scoring has improved this season, he's dropped of a bit recently but he still has a shot at hitting 30 goals this season and should at least get 25. His defensive play is vastly improved, and has become a real asset on the PK. His play making while not fantastic is underrated, and whole be improved with better goal scoring wingers. Also, last season Carter and Gagne missed the net almost the same number of times (I forget the exact number) and I didn't hear anyone complaining about Gagne missing the net. Getting more of his shots on net is something that shouldn't be to hard for him to work on, and it's not something I'm going to really rip a guy for when so much of the rest of his game is improving. Give him time.

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02-13-2008, 02:09 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by whatthef View Post
Also, last season Carter and Gagne missed the net almost the same number of times (I forget the exact number) and I didn't hear anyone complaining about Gagne missing the net.
I'm not ripping on Carter here or taking a side against you in this whole argument, but the argument you are making there is a silly one, eh?

Gagne had 41 goals last season to Carter's 14.

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02-13-2008, 02:12 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claude boivin lives View Post
I'm not ripping on Carter here or taking a side against you in this whole argument, but the argument you are making there is a silly one, eh?

Gagne had 41 goals last season to Carter's 14.
see, what you did there was focus on the important aspect: finishing. how many times a guy misses the net is irrelevant if he's finding the back of the net with regularity.

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02-15-2008, 03:49 AM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claude boivin lives View Post
I don't have the time or energy to add much to this thread, but....as someone who is not an enormous Carter fan, even I would say that trading Carter for Sundin is a flat out awful idea.




Yes, it is horrible, this idea
Office Space references are timeless, as is the movie itself.

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Old
02-15-2008, 08:18 AM
  #57
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Originally Posted by markzab View Post

EDIT: Oh, and he's got a 12.16 shooting percentage. Him missing the net is what you see in your head because you're looking for a reason to try and make a point. That percentage he has going right now is a respectable one.
doesn't that mean that out of the shots that make it on goal, 12.16% of them go in? I don't think that takes into account all the times he misses the net. just wondering...

also, i have been overly critical of carter later and at the end of the day, i'd rather keep him than trade him away for someone who may be with us only one season. i'd like to think that he will continue to develop. however, it is almost unbelievable that he he really does miss the net so much as an nhl player. with such an amazing shot, you'd think he would have practiced enough to be quite the sniper. hell i cant even say his accuracy has improved at all since two years ago. if he can nail that part of his game down, he will be such a great player.

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02-18-2008, 12:06 AM
  #58
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The guy can't see the ice!!!

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02-18-2008, 05:37 AM
  #59
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come on

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jroach19 View Post
His best attribute is a wrist shot that misses the f***ing net half the time!
Get off youre trip. Carter has played better in the second half. If he was given briere's powerplay time. He would another 8 goalsor so. Yeah trade him. Like we have a center in the symtem we can plug in.

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Old
02-18-2008, 09:45 AM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
you can do it for yourself if you really care.

http://www.nhl.com/nhlstats/app?fetc...tssPlayerStats

Alex Ovechkin, the guy who is going to have 60 goals this year, has 50 more missed shots than 2nd place in the league. Complaining about missed shots is missing the larger point that you need to shoot, and miss the net, to score goals.

Jeff Carter leads the Flyers in even strength goals... If anything, he tends to get the short end of the stick from Flyer fans, yourself being evidence. He's a young player that is potentially going to get 30 goals in his third NHL season. His defense has improved IMMENSELY from last year. In three years it's not beyond imagination he'll have a 40 goal season under his belt given his skill-set.

Patience.



I'm sure if you think about it, you'll laugh too


p.s. GL to u guys getting back on track, even though i hate the flyers with pure passion, I have no history with their fans (you guys must be polite or something). I am not trolling

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Old
02-18-2008, 09:55 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Ape Clutch View Post


I'm sure if you think about it, you'll laugh too


p.s. GL to u guys getting back on track, even though i hate the flyers with pure passion, I have no history with their fans (you guys must be polite or something). I am not trolling
not really funny... everyone who takes shots on net is going to miss the net... players that shoot more, will miss the net more. that's the way it goes.

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02-18-2008, 12:11 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
not really funny... everyone who takes shots on net is going to miss the net... players that shoot more, will miss the net more. that's the way it goes.
Read the bolded part more literally and you'll see the humor in it. We all know you meant "You need to shoot, and sometimes you'll miss, to score goals" but what you actually typed is essentially "you'll score if you're missing the net."

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Old
02-18-2008, 12:14 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by CantSeeColors View Post
Read the bolded part more literally and you'll see the humor in it. We all know you meant "You need to shoot, and sometimes you'll miss, to score goals" but what you actually typed is essentially "you'll score if you're missing the net."
the comma is important.

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Old
02-18-2008, 12:17 PM
  #64
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listen, carter is/and will always be, a shooter first and foremost. look at gagne, anybody consider him a premier, or even good, passer? didn't think so.

carter also brings defensive responsibility. w/in a couple of years, i think he can be more important in our own zone than even richards. this is based purely on body size; richie is smaller, and can get bodied off easier (playing against malkin comes to mind). if carter fills out, he is going to be huge, and able to move at will, or pummel anybody else with the puck.

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02-18-2008, 05:03 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
the comma is important.
i appologize

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Old
02-18-2008, 09:24 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 27roenick97 View Post
listen, carter is/and will always be, a shooter first and foremost. look at gagne, anybody consider him a premier, or even good, passer? didn't think so.

carter also brings defensive responsibility. w/in a couple of years, i think he can be more important in our own zone than even richards. this is based purely on body size; richie is smaller, and can get bodied off easier (playing against malkin comes to mind). if carter fills out, he is going to be huge, and able to move at will, or pummel anybody else with the puck.

Are you sharing Lupul's herbal refreshment?

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02-19-2008, 08:36 AM
  #67
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Originally Posted by 27roenick97 View Post
listen, carter is/and will always be, a shooter first and foremost. look at gagne, anybody consider him a premier, or even good, passer? didn't think so.

carter also brings defensive responsibility. w/in a couple of years, i think he can be more important in our own zone than even richards. this is based purely on body size; richie is smaller, and can get bodied off easier (playing against malkin comes to mind). if carter fills out, he is going to be huge, and able to move at will, or pummel anybody else with the puck.
People are so damn impatient with Carter, geez.....Do people realize VL didnt score 30 goals until his 5th season. He had a 37 point season in his 4th. BIG GUYS TAKE TIME TO DEVELOP

I dont think he is a better defensive player than Richards, but if he can get better at it, his size will be a big help if he learns how to use it consistently

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Are you sharing Lupul's herbal refreshment?
I wish I was at the moment...

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Old
02-19-2008, 10:44 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by flyersfan97 View Post
Are you sharing Lupul's herbal refreshment?
I was at the Toronto auto show yesterday and there was this booth with some guy selling Chinese herbal remedies. He had little baggies of a green substance that apparently helped you quit smoking (which you just reminded me of), but the funniest part was being offered Chinese viagra, "lasts 14 hours".

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02-19-2008, 11:28 AM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claude boivin lives View Post
I'm not ripping on Carter here or taking a side against you in this whole argument, but the argument you are making there is a silly one, eh?

Gagne had 41 goals last season to Carter's 14.
I didn't say he couldn't improve his goal scoring or getting shots on net. All I said was that both Carter and Gagne were in the top 5 in shots that missed the net last year. And that is true. The point it was trying to make was that missing the net with shots isn't the end of the world, you can still produce good numbers even when you do miss the net with a lot of shots. He could get more shots on net, but he gets a far amount of shots on net now.

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02-19-2008, 01:59 PM
  #70
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Carter is nice player when mood strikes him ...he will be one of leagues big underachievers

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Old
02-19-2008, 02:57 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by flyersfan97 View Post
Are you sharing Lupul's herbal refreshment?
no, seriously. i understand richie's instincts are second to none on the team. but look at what i said, "based on size", he could become more important than cannon. what made prims such an effective shutdown center for us for so long? instinct and size. instinct can be taught; size cannot.

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02-19-2008, 02:59 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by 27roenick97 View Post
no, seriously. i understand richie's instincts are second to none on the team. but look at what i said, "based on size", he could become more important than cannon. what made prims such an effective shutdown center for us for so long? instinct and size. instinct can be taught; size cannot.
Instinct can't be taught, that's why it's instinct.

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02-19-2008, 03:14 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by 27roenick97 View Post
no, seriously. i understand richie's instincts are second to none on the team. but look at what i said, "based on size", he could become more important than cannon. what made prims such an effective shutdown center for us for so long? instinct and size. instinct can be taught; size cannot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Storm in a Teacup View Post
Instinct can't be taught, that's why it's instinct.
I very much doubt Carter will catch up with Richards in many respects defensively, but I do have concerns about Richards' ability to match up with players like Vinny who bring size and speed to the formula that are simply beyond Richards physical tools. Richards survives on brains, but there are a lot of smart guys in the world that cannot play professional athletics due to lack of physical talents.

Instinct can't be taught, but defense can... which is what Hitchcock, Lemaire, etc. have proven. Instinct can make a good defensive player a great defensive player (Richards and Handzus being prime examples)... but then you have examples of a guy like Keith Primeau who was molded into a defensive force and it became a strength due to desire, which is the most important attribute of a defensive player... you gotta WANT to be playing defense to be good at it.

Jeff Carter has improved immensely from last year to this year defensively... his even strength play is remarkable by comparison. He's improved at physically taking players off the puck, using his reach to disrupt attackers, etc. Richards remains significantly better, but the gap has been closed considerably. Whether he ever catches remains to be seen.

Carter won't be catching Richards as a PK'er, however. As that's an area where instinct is rewarded in spades.

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02-19-2008, 03:14 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by Storm in a Teacup View Post
Instinct can't be taught, that's why it's instinct.
swear to god, I was thinking the same thing.

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02-19-2008, 03:17 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Jeff Carter has improved immensely from last year to this year defensively... his even strength play is remarkable by comparison. He's improved at physically taking players off the puck, using his reach to disrupt attackers, etc. Richards remains significantly better, but the gap has been closed considerably. Whether he ever catches remains to be seen.

Carter won't be catching Richards as a PK'er, however. As that's an area where instinct is rewarded in spades.
For sure, it's nice to have a "yeah but" when talking about Carter's scoring slumps. He's not exactly one-dimensional anymore. He's a very responsible player at even strength and that's a huge step forward for him.

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