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Hey GuyF, can we get an update on Rita?

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Old
01-30-2004, 08:39 PM
  #76
Master Lok
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marconius
Exactly, it's hard to make a decision if you refuse to see exactly what you have. So give him a 20 game try out, see what you
have with Rita and then make an informed decision.
Why should the Oilers give him a shot if he hasn't deserved it? The entire AHL season is a tryout. Just because you don't see him here in Edmonton, doesn't mean that others aren't watching him in Toronto and therefore MAKING AN INFORMED DECISION. You're not the coach, and certainly none of the posters are. Why don't you guys ask Geoff Ward for his opinion on Rita? He coaches the guy every game. Why are you guys assuming that you can see something in Rita that Ward, MacT and Lowe hasn't?

Rita's stats
2003-04*Toronto AHL 28 8 13 21 12
2002-03 Hamilton AHL 64 21 27 48 18
2001-02 Hamilton AHL 76 25 17 42 32

Heck, Jarret Stoll's stats are similar and I wouldn't consider him a top two line offensive threat.
2002-03 Hamilton AHL 76 21 33 54 86

Or Pisani, our 3rd line defensive dude.
2001-02 HAMB, AHL 79 26g 34a 60pts 60 pims

I'm not opposed to bringing up Rita, but I get the feeling that Rita was called up due to his impending contract status than the fact that he earned his callup.

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Old
01-30-2004, 08:41 PM
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgbone
Fernando Pisani

81 GP 14g 13a 27pts - which is, interestingly enough, a 0.33p/g average.

Jani Rita

12 GP 3g 1a 4pts - even ignoring his one game callup 2 years ago, is a 0.33 p/g average.

Wow, so Fernando, who you are hating on right now has produced just as well as Rita has, but is better defensively. Any other arguments?
Yep, I was referring to Pisani's season this year. The one in which the evidence suggests that he isn't getting it done. I would love to see Rita get a 20 game tryout and then evaulate the evidence of his play this season as well. If his offensive output equals Pisanis and Pisani has a much better defensive game then I'll be right there beside you asking for Rita to be benched.
The fact is WE DO NOT KNOW.
The fact is the limited NHL time Rita has had suggests he may be capable of something that half this years squad has proven incapable of, namely scoring.
But I'm sure in your world good asset management means ignoring potential and keep on riding the same horses that aren't getting it done, even if it means thowring that potential down the toilet

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01-30-2004, 08:43 PM
  #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marconius
A matter of opinion, I suppose
No, it's fact, look up their stats.

Quote:
Unfortunately not every player is a mentally tough, complete 2-way player. You have to guage strengths & weakness. And yes, I believe that after repeated failures to give Rita a REAL shot, maybe it's getting to him. Maybe he's starting to lsiten ot that voice in his head that says: "No matter what you do, they aren't going to give you a chance, just play out the season and get the hell out of this organization"
Did he not have a 12 game look last year? Did he not watch several of his teammates get called up throughout the past 2 seasons, most of whom did it through hard work and consistant play? What little voice? If Rita honestly feels that he has done everything he can to make it to the NHL, and he feels it is just a matter of management holding him back, then label him bust right now, and move on.

Quote:
The sad part is once again MacT has stubbornly stood by his favorites, even when it's horribly apparent to the media & the fans that those 'hosses', those heart & soul grinders aren't doing the job.
And Rita will? If he can't even dominate the same level of play that those heart and soul grinders dominated before him, why would he get a shot? Rita hasn't gotten a shot because he hasn't earned it yet. You have to accomplish something at the AHL level in order to get a shot. Rita is not a top flight offensive player. He will be referred to one of those grinder guys when he makes the NHL. Yes, he can score 20, but so could Mike Grier... and what kind of player was he?

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01-30-2004, 08:47 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizral
However, I cannot understand where this myth comes from that Rita is good defensivly. Where? How? When did this happen? Last I checked he was still terrible defensivly. And I just saw like, 4 road runners games this month! Rita is NOT very good defensivly, in fact I'd say he's still well below average.
Really Miz - your uninformed comments regarding ALL things Oiler is getting a bit much (and I'm not the first to point this out). If you bothered to watch any RR games this year - or even just checked Rita's stats - you would see he has been pretty sound defensively this year. The guy is leading the team in +/- with a +8 and that is no small feat on a team as poor as the RR.

You have officially graduated to my ignore list - congratulations

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Old
01-30-2004, 08:51 PM
  #80
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Holy crap...this is like watching the Royal Rumble replay, with Dawgbone playing the role of The Big Show!

I think we might all have to agree to disagree here, it's going in circles now.

Rita's up here now, whether some people like it or don't like it. I say let's sit back and see what happens, IMO one way or the other this crap's going to get sorted out soon enough.

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Old
01-30-2004, 08:51 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marconius
Yep, I was referring to Pisani's season this year. The one in which the evidence suggests that he isn't getting it done. I would love to see Rita get a 20 game tryout and then evaulate the evidence of his play this season as well. If his offensive output equals Pisanis and Pisani has a much better defensive game then I'll be right there beside you asking for Rita to be benched.
The fact is WE DO NOT KNOW.
The fact is the limited NHL time Rita has had suggests he may be capable of something that half this years squad has proven incapable of, namely scoring.
But I'm sure in your world good asset management means ignoring potential and keep on riding the same horses that aren't getting it done, even if it means thowring that potential down the toilet
You mean this dismal season where he is only averaging .30 points per game (14 points in 46 games)? This dismal season where is is 4 among forwards in +/- at +8? He deserves to lose ice time so you can see some kid who can't be bothered to show up everynight in the AHL?

I'm not ignoring potential... potential just means you haven't done anything yet (thanks Ronnie), which Rita has managed to parlay into a definition with his picture beside it. We wouldn't be talking about this if Rita's play dictated this callup, not his contract.

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01-30-2004, 08:51 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neogeo69
Why should the Oilers give him a shot if he hasn't deserved it? The entire AHL season is a tryout. Just because you don't see him here in Edmonton, doesn't mean that others aren't watching him in Toronto and therefore MAKING AN INFORMED DECISION. You're not the coach, and certainly none of the posters are. Why don't you guys ask Geoff Ward for his opinion on Rita? He coaches the guy every game. Why are you guys assuming that you can see something in Rita that Ward, MacT and Lowe hasn't?

Rita's stats
2003-04*Toronto AHL 28 8 13 21 12
2002-03 Hamilton AHL 64 21 27 48 18
2001-02 Hamilton AHL 76 25 17 42 32

Heck, Jarret Stoll's stats are similar and I wouldn't consider him a top two line offensive threat.
2002-03 Hamilton AHL 76 21 33 54 86

Or Pisani, our 3rd line defensive dude.
2001-02 HAMB, AHL 79 26g 34a 60pts 60 pims

I'm not opposed to bringing up Rita, but I get the feeling that Rita was called up due to his impending contract status than the fact that he earned his callup.
As dawgbone has stated AHL does not equal NHL. I completely understand what your saying: failure at the AHL level translate into bigger failure at the NHL level. I guess I believe that it's more complex then that and that there could be various mental issues floating around that is causing inconsistent play in the AHL. As for why I'm assuming I can see something that MacT can't, because I strongly believe that the organization has certain biases and when said organization seems to be an old boys club, maybe they need someone with a different perspective to freshen things up. I believe that MacT has a biase for heart & soul checking players. This is understandable. It's how he played the game himself. I'm sure there were occasions when MacT the player, the player who gave 110% every shift, was pissed to see guys with twice the talent, but half the heart get ahead of him. But the fact is a good coach should realize theres value in heart & soul, but your not going to win a lot of games without talent. And sometimes, just sometimes, a player with twice the talent & half the heart is going to produce more then a player with half the talent & twice the heart.
In a fair world, he who gave it his all would be the best player on the ice, but it's not a fair world. I would rather see a 1 Satan skating around the ice producing offense then 15 Pisani's skating around the ice not producing much. Theres still place for a Pisani player on the team, no doubt, but theres not room for 15 of the same type of player, which is what we seem to have right now

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Old
01-30-2004, 08:53 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digger12
Holy crap...this is like watching the Royal Rumble replay, with Dawgbone playing the role of The Big Show!

I think we might all have to agree to disagree here, it's going in circles now.

Rita's up here now, whether some people like it or don't like it. I say let's sit back and see what happens, IMO one way or the other this crap's going to get sorted out soon enough.
LOL... I missed this years rumble, so I am not sure if this is a compliment or an insult...

I just wish Rita's play dictated his callup, not his contract.

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Old
01-30-2004, 08:55 PM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digger12
Holy crap...this is like watching the Royal Rumble replay, with Dawgbone playing the role of The Big Show!

I think we might all have to agree to disagree here, it's going in circles now.

Rita's up here now, whether some people like it or don't like it. I say let's sit back and see what happens, IMO one way or the other this crap's going to get sorted out soon enough.
I think he may be right lads (and lasses, if it applies). If my boss catches me spending the entire day on here defending Rita, I'm a dead man
I'm out, but thanks for the spirited discussion dawgbone, I look forward to our next encounter. But be warned, I plan on being the Chris Benoit to your Big SHow (Best. Rumble. Ever.)

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Old
01-30-2004, 08:58 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marconius
I think he may be right lads (and lasses, if it applies). If my boss catches me spending the entire day on here defending Rita, I'm a dead man
I'm out, but thanks for the spirited discussion dawgbone, I look forward to our next encounter. But be warned, I plan on being the Chris Benoit to your Big SHow (Best. Rumble. Ever.)
lol... I am the boss

Meh it's all good.

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Old
01-30-2004, 09:34 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgbone
lol... I am the boss

Meh it's all good.
This is a good argument though...would be better if more people joined in. Dawgbone is getting a little outnumbered...(although he's holding his ground quite well :p )

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Old
01-30-2004, 09:40 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by USC Trojans
This is a good argument though...would be better if more people joined in. Dawgbone is getting a little outnumbered...(although he's holding his ground quite well :p )
I was gonna say (before I had actual work to do) that hes doing a pretty good at defending a stance that is becoming much harder to defend these days.

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Old
01-30-2004, 11:41 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Asiaoil
Really Miz - your uninformed comments regarding ALL things Oiler is getting a bit much

You have officially graduated to my ignore list - congratulations
haha i don't know why just found that really funny.

It is obvious though how much the guy hates the Oil.

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Old
01-30-2004, 11:50 PM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asiaoil
Really Miz - your uninformed comments regarding ALL things Oiler is getting a bit much (and I'm not the first to point this out). If you bothered to watch any RR games this year - or even just checked Rita's stats - you would see he has been pretty sound defensively this year. The guy is leading the team in +/- with a +8 and that is no small feat on a team as poor as the RR.

You have officially graduated to my ignore list - congratulations
sorry i have bad news for you Asiaoil moderators can't be put on ignore everyone is going to have to put up with Mizrable for a long time

in any case what happened in the Royal Rumble?

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Old
01-31-2004, 01:26 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Mizral
And the mark of a good defensive player is consistancy.
The mark of a good moderator is moderation.

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Old
01-31-2004, 02:27 AM
  #91
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Unlike some of our goofy damn first rounders over the years, Rita looks like a hockey player. He has a solid shot, puts up numbers (more later) isn't 5'8 and can pedal.

But here, right now in the middle of my "Month Long MacTavish Mad On" I can't really get to down on the organization because:

1. Rita hasn't dominated ala Jozef Balej, who shot from 5 goals one year to 20+ this season, and

2. The Oilers have other, attractive options.

3. The guy who really took his spot, Hemsky, is a much better hockey player.


If you're asking me if Jani Rita can have an NHL career, I bet he can. But MacT has Chimera, Rita and Salmelainen still knocking on the door, and Hemsky and Torres who kicked the door down and ran off with the playing time.

Right now, I'd say there's a 70% chance Rita is in Finland next season. Why on earth would he stay?

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Old
01-31-2004, 02:32 AM
  #92
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Why is thread addressed to me anyway? lol, I clearly am not the one with the plethora of opinions on this guy. Rita's a nice kid, grew a goatee since September and it makes him look a lot less boyish. He also speaks better English than he did 4 months ago. Other than that... the quotes I provided about 5 pages ago seem to have been lost in all the debate...

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Old
01-31-2004, 03:30 AM
  #93
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This thread sounds suspiciously at times like the Kennedy conspiracy. I have to give a big throw out to Dawgbone who defended his (lonely) position very well. Like all posters we would love to see Rita become 'the guy' and be the magic bullet for a very lackluster Oiler team. However Rita has not demonstrated he can dominate at an AHL level let alone competing in the show.

I personally thought Rita would go down to the minors frustrated and mad and set about to prove the Oiler management wrong for demoting him. In so doing, I predicted a mid-season call in which Jani would push Pisani into the role of cheap, press box depth guy.

This hasn't happened. Instead Rita gets the recall as a 9-1-1 call for a brutal hockey team. He still has holes in his game most notable consistency. Let's hope the conspiracy will finally be debunked with this call up through legitimate ice time.
Playing at the NHL level begins with heart and perseverence. As Dawgbone notes, no one doubts the raw skills which Jani possesses, it is what's inside that counts.
Jani, prove us wrong...please!

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Old
01-31-2004, 03:37 AM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Behind Enemy Lines
This thread sounds suspiciously at times like the Kennedy conspiracy. I have to give a big throw out to Dawgbone who defended his (lonely) position very well. Like all posters we would love to see Rita become 'the guy' and be the magic bullet for a very lackluster Oiler team. However Rita has not demonstrated he can dominate at an AHL level let alone competing in the show.

I personally thought Rita would go down to the minors frustrated and mad and set about to prove the Oiler management wrong for demoting him. In so doing, I predicted a mid-season call in which Jani would push Pisani into the role of cheap, press box depth guy.

This hasn't happened. Instead Rita gets the recall as a 9-1-1 call for a brutal hockey team. He still has holes in his game most notable consistency. Let's hope the conspiracy will finally be debunked with this call up through legitimate ice time.
Playing at the NHL level begins with heart and perseverence. As Dawgbone notes, no one doubts the raw skills which Jani possesses, it is what's inside that counts.
Jani, prove us wrong...please!
I really hope I am wrong, because Rita is going to be a very solid NHLer... my only worry is that it won't be with the Oilers, which would be a shame.

It's like one day, the light will come on and he'll have it... if that happens while he is up here, I will be the first one to post a message saying congrats.

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Old
01-31-2004, 03:54 AM
  #95
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ok after reading enough of this thread dawgbone is a mact clone and that will not change. im curious do you diet as well, breaking all the products down into their consituent elements. maybe you should be a pr man for the pm with your rhetoric.
reading your usual crap i find it hard to understand why you think rita is not nhl material. anyhou dawgbone i admit for the most part i ignore you, however as my avatar suggests rita deserves a chance not the pathetic chance he has been given so far.
horcough,pisani and ferguson have been given a lot more chances than this guy. convince me cmon convince that at least two of them, this is the forwards, are better than him.
i also would love to see your ultimate lineup. hhhhhmm horcoff pisani cleary as the first line to start. good luck mact clone.

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Old
01-31-2004, 04:03 AM
  #96
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Whoever says that Rita never dominated at the ahl level was dead wrong, he's had some scoring streaks where he should have been called up pronto. Whether or not he lets his lack of any reward whatsoever bother him or hamper his play in any way is pure speculation, but who cares about streakiness? We have guys who are only mediocre when they're at the top of their game whom MacT will play day in and day out until we all turn into basketball fans.

Guerin was a streaky player here, he's making $9M right now and people are still bemoaning the loss of our most inconsistant player ever.

Hemsky has been invisible here, Smyth has been invisible (and worse) here, what Oiler fwd hasn't been inconsistant besides York or Dvorak?

Inconsistancy is fine here if you can bait a hook or armour all someone's car, but Rita has to have 1g-1a-2pts, 0pims, +2, 6s every night or he's not working hard enough.

Stowe it Dawg, we need players who can score here (at the nhl level, I don't give a rats patootie what he did in junior or the ahl), and until proven otherwise Rita is still that.

Hopefully he does well on his one shift tryout 'cause you know that Izzy deserves a second chance soon.

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01-31-2004, 04:03 AM
  #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hmminvisiblecola
ok after reading enough of this thread dawgbone is a mact clone and that will not change. im curious do you diet as well, breaking all the products down into their consituent elements. maybe you should be a pr man for the pm with your rhetoric.
reading your usual crap i find it hard to understand why you think rita is not nhl material. anyhou dawgbone i admit for the most part i ignore you, however as my avatar suggests rita deserves a chance not the pathetic chance he has been given so far.
horcough,pisani and ferguson have been given a lot more chances than this guy. convince me cmon convince that at least two of them, this is the forwards, are better than him.
i also would love to see your ultimate lineup. hhhhhmm horcoff pisani cleary as the first line to start. good luck mact clone.
Don't ask me to repeat my reasons, when you say you ignore my posts. I clearly stated several times why I don't think Rita is an NHL player yet.

Please explain to me, oh master of everything the Oilers should be (see, I can be a cynical ass as well), exactly why Rita deserves a chance...

And try not to bring up anything that has already been argued.

So, what have you seen this season from Rita's play in the AHL that screams out "I'm ready for the NHL"? Maybe the Oilers should hire you for the scouting staff, because evidently you don't need to see a player play live very much to know all the goods on him.

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01-31-2004, 04:10 AM
  #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgbone
Please explain to me, oh master of everything the Oilers should be (see, I can be a cynical ass as well), exactly why Rita deserves a chance...
Rita has played well at the nhl level. Rita has scored at a decent pace at the nhl level. By KLo's own admission Rita played well and deserved to be here longer when he was here. Rita played better than some of the guys who made the team at training camp. Rita makes half as much money as some people in the lineup who have done jack schmidt all season long. The Oilers need a sniper - Jani Rita is a goal scorer first and a playmaker second.

Oh wait, he's inconsistant. See ya later JR, good luck in the Federal League.

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01-31-2004, 04:12 AM
  #99
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Round Two...**DING**


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01-31-2004, 04:15 AM
  #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oi'll say!
Whoever says that Rita never dominated at the ahl level was dead wrong, he's had some scoring streaks where he should have been called up pronto. Whether or not he lets his lack of any reward whatsoever bother him or hamper his play in any way is pure speculation, but who cares about streakiness? We have guys who are only mediocre when they're at the top of their game whom MacT will play day in and day out until we all turn into basketball fans.
I am not dead wrong. Dominating at the AHL level does not consist of a getting all 31 of your points in 20 games (when you have played 40). He was injured during one of his hot streaks, missing 6 or 7 games, so it's kind of tough to call him up then. Like I've said about 30 times in this thread... being inconsistant in the AHL is going to result in a player being even more inconsistant in the NHL.

Quote:
Guerin was a streaky player here, he's making $9M right now and people are still bemoaning the loss of our most inconsistant player ever.
And is he worth $9mil per year? I don't think so... but even when he is inconsistant, he can still pot 30+ goals... Rita can't, not even at the AHL level.

Quote:
Hemsky has been invisible here, Smyth has been invisible (and worse) here, what Oiler fwd hasn't been inconsistant besides York or Dvorak?

Inconsistancy is fine here if you can bait a hook or armour all someone's car, but Rita has to have 1g-1a-2pts, 0pims, +2, 6s every night or he's not working hard enough.
Once again, let the broken record talk more about how if you are inconsistant at the AHL level, there is a darn good chance you will be an inconsistant NHL player. And when Rita is a marginal AHL player half the time, what kind of NHL player does that translate too?

It isn't just about his stats... they are part of it, but there is no reason he shouldn't be at scoring 1ppg. He takes whole nights off, offensively, defensively, physically. There are nights he literally gets 20 minutes of ice time and does nothing... no hits, no shots, nothing.

Quote:
Stowe it Dawg, we need players who can score here (at the nhl level, I don't give a rats patootie what he did in junior or the ahl), and until proven otherwise Rita is still that.

Hopefully he does well on his one shift tryout 'cause you know that Izzy deserves a second chance soon.
Oh that makes sense, Rita is a 20 goal scorer in the AHL level, but he is an NHL level goal scorer...

How is that? The players at every position are better, but I guess that doesn't matter. If Rita is a proven NHL level scorer, Pisani is an Art Ross candidate.

This would be different if he played all 40 games the way he does 20... but he doesn't, and that is why the only reason he is getting this callup is because of his contract!

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