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Old
02-21-2008, 12:14 AM
  #51
ArizonaGreenTea
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You mean like Dion.
Consistently great?

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02-21-2008, 12:17 AM
  #52
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Apparently he had a lot of potential in Chicago but really hurt a guy and seemed tentative ever since. If Keenan and Sutter can whip him back into shape he'll be a great pick-up. For the sake of my Canucks I hope they cannot.

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02-21-2008, 12:22 AM
  #53
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I can see Sutter gearing up for the playoffs...more trades will be made and soom i'm sure..not saying any blockbusters but i know that Hale and Eriksson are not that great...coughed up the puck many times this year...Vander will definately toughen up our D for sure and replace either of those 2 on any given day. I say Hale is gonna be the odd man out...what do you guys think?

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02-21-2008, 01:02 AM
  #54
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Sutter continues to cycle players through, until he hits with them. For example, Huselius and Nolan, two acquisitions that were questioned but seem to have worked out. Same could be said for Aucoin, Hale and to some extent, Eriksson. Cujo too looks like he is going to be useful. Vandemeer at one time had considerable potential but playing in Chicago and then Philadelphia, he has fallen out of favor. Those cities are pretty hard on defenders it seems, whereas Calgary seems to be able to nurture them back. Aucoin came from Chicago, and ended up having to learn how to play defence all over again. What does that tell you about the Chicago system? And Philadelphia chewed up Pitkanen pretty well too. So he was mired in systems that werent all that helpful to his career. This may be a sleeper pickup at an affordable price. Calgary has developed several defenders over the years. Commodore, Ference are a couple of examples of marginal defenders who developed into decent defenders in the system, not to overlook both Regehr and Phaneuf who both developed into top flight talents. Basically, it is another swing for the fences by Sutter. It will either work or fail, but the cost is minimal and worth a shot.

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02-21-2008, 09:36 AM
  #55
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abracanada, I wish I had time to give a well thought out reply to your comments but I need to head to work shortly.

To be concise, your examples of Commadore and Ferrence (you could even add Lydman and Zuzyn) are not that great because all four of them have fared far better after they left Calgary than their time here.

Hale and Aucoin, might have worked out so far. Personally, Sarich is not playing his best hockey here, Eriksson's play has made him a sacrificial lamb among fans, undeservedly in my opinion, he's been overplayed. This season alone it's been touch and go.

The Flames a team that make defensemen look good? Two years ago Marchmant looked good in a Flames uniform, the equivalent today would struggle on this team.

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02-21-2008, 10:48 AM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abracanada View Post
Sutter continues to cycle players through, until he hits with them. For example, Huselius and Nolan, two acquisitions that were questioned but seem to have worked out. Same could be said for Aucoin, Hale and to some extent, Eriksson. Cujo too looks like he is going to be useful. Vandemeer at one time had considerable potential but playing in Chicago and then Philadelphia, he has fallen out of favor. Those cities are pretty hard on defenders it seems, whereas Calgary seems to be able to nurture them back. Aucoin came from Chicago, and ended up having to learn how to play defence all over again. What does that tell you about the Chicago system? And Philadelphia chewed up Pitkanen pretty well too. So he was mired in systems that werent all that helpful to his career. This may be a sleeper pickup at an affordable price. Calgary has developed several defenders over the years. Commodore, Ference are a couple of examples of marginal defenders who developed into decent defenders in the system, not to overlook both Regehr and Phaneuf who both developed into top flight talents. Basically, it is another swing for the fences by Sutter. It will either work or fail, but the cost is minimal and worth a shot.
on the flip side, once we shipped out commodore and ference (and even montador), they became top minute defenders on those teams.. you can even throw lydman in there but he was already getting top minutes with the flames

so i dont know if we have a system that actually cultivates defencemen.. aucoin for once has stayed relatively healthy and that could skew the appearance of him playing better

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02-21-2008, 11:05 AM
  #57
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8 veteran defenseman for the playoffs, with the top 4 established already on this team I don't think anyone should expect Brian Campbell or Rob Blake headed this way.

Flames fans should neither criticize or hail this deal. It was just to get another guy to compete for the bottom pairing to find the right mix. It also allows two defensive injuries during the stretch run/playoffs.

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02-21-2008, 12:55 PM
  #58
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great depth defencemen for the run.......modry would have been better, but i will take this one.......TSN quote 'tough as nails' that fits our style doesn't it....

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02-21-2008, 03:05 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vector View Post
Apparently he had a lot of potential in Chicago but really hurt a guy and seemed tentative ever since. If Keenan and Sutter can whip him back into shape he'll be a great pick-up. For the sake of my Canucks I hope they cannot.
In Philly, he found his balls, but his brains, not so much.


I think Vandermeer will do well in Calgary. Vandermeer's 2nd trip through Philly was a situation of "GM giveth to coach, GM taketh away." Stevens was incessant on Vandermeer playing top minutes and with Regehr, Phaneuf, Aucoin and Sarich, that won't be the case.

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02-21-2008, 03:12 PM
  #60
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His biggest drawbacks are pretty much bonehead plays in his own zone, bonehead turnovers, etc.
He'll fit right in with one or two of the others.

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02-21-2008, 03:28 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by claude boivin lives View Post
Flyers fan here...I'd be lying if I told you the high majority of Philly fans aren't going to be thrilled about this move.

Vandermeer is a tough customer, usually plays a good physical game, and even chips in on offense once in awhile.

His biggest drawbacks are pretty much bonehead plays in his own zone, bonehead turnovers, etc. All that crap is what has him being so heavily criticized in Philly...he's cost us one too many goals recently.
Here's the key here, and this is the main reason why Flyers fans are happy to see him go. He WAS everything you described in your second paragraph, and he IS everything that you mentioned in your third.

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Old
02-21-2008, 05:22 PM
  #62
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He was also Dion Phaneufs d partner when Dion was in Red Deer for his first year. Maybe they have a little chemistry.

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02-21-2008, 05:36 PM
  #63
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I'm a fan of the deal.A big 5/6 defenseman thats willing to drop the gloves now and then.Plus, you never know when the injury bug will hit so adding some depth on the blueline is definitley a good thing.

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02-21-2008, 09:38 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Flames 4 Life View Post
He was also Dion Phaneufs d partner when Dion was in Red Deer for his first year. Maybe they have a little chemistry.
Every Philly fan has said he is not suited to play 20mins a night so I hope he's not paired with Dion

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02-22-2008, 12:05 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Flames 4 Life View Post
He was also Dion Phaneufs d partner when Dion was in Red Deer for his first year. Maybe they have a little chemistry.
That can't be true, can it? Vandy is 27 and Dion is 22. Were they in junior at the same time?

I like this deal. He's an UFA so we can dump him for nothing if he sucks but he has lots of upside. He's not the puck mover we need but I think he'll do better at that than Warrener, Sarich and Hale do. I see him as a guy we can develop for cheap and keep on our blueline for a long time on the 2nd/3rd pairing. He can see some secondary minutes on the pp and pk (replacing Sarich on the pp and Aucoin and Eriksson and pk is a bonus unto itself) and he can bring toughness, defense and a little more mobility on the backend than we already have.

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02-22-2008, 04:45 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Cactus Jack View Post
That can't be true, can it? Vandy is 27 and Dion is 22. Were they in junior at the same time?

I like this deal. He's an UFA so we can dump him for nothing if he sucks but he has lots of upside. He's not the puck mover we need but I think he'll do better at that than Warrener, Sarich and Hale do. I see him as a guy we can develop for cheap and keep on our blueline for a long time on the 2nd/3rd pairing. He can see some secondary minutes on the pp and pk (replacing Sarich on the pp and Aucoin and Eriksson and pk is a bonus unto itself) and he can bring toughness, defense and a little more mobility on the backend than we already have.
not sure if they played together but their ages are close enough..

vandermeer could have been 20/21 and phaneuf could have been 15/16

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02-22-2008, 06:15 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by chriss_co View Post
not sure if they played together but their ages are close enough..

vandermeer could have been 20/21 and phaneuf could have been 15/16
I remember I watched a game and they were playing together. It looks like they are playing together tonight as well. Hopefully they still remember each others styles and still possess some chemistry.

I don't know if they played a regular shift together I just remember seeing a few instances when they played together.

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02-27-2008, 09:46 AM
  #68
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During an interview on the Fan 960 yesterday, Sutter spoke on the acquisition of Vandermeer and how he had interest in acquiring him earlier in the year, but the Flyers wanted a player like Prust, and Sutter was only willing to give up a draft pick. So once the Flyers made a deal with the Blackhawks for Eager, Sutter told them that if it didn't work out, to let him know, and that's how it went down. Kudos to Sutter for being patient and not pulling the trigger on that trade. I would have hated to of seen Prust traded.

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03-01-2008, 12:05 AM
  #69
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Nice work on Parros tonight, Vandy!!!

BTW- Ludzy on the Score said Vandermeer can bench press 460 lbs.!

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03-01-2008, 12:21 AM
  #70
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Nice work on Parros tonight, Vandy!!!

BTW- Ludzy on the Score said Vandermeer can bench press 460 lbs.!
460! Really.

He did have a good game tonight, and really has been solid for the Flames since he got here. He and Dion seem to complement each other rather well, hopefully it lasts.

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03-01-2008, 12:27 AM
  #71
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i remember hearing somewhere that phaneuf was in his first year and vandermeer was one of the older guys on his way out, only had that one season together i believe

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Originally Posted by Cactus Jack View Post
That can't be true, can it? Vandy is 27 and Dion is 22. Were they in junior at the same time?

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03-02-2008, 02:27 AM
  #72
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I knew Vandermeer would be awesome in the right situation and I'm kind of annoyed that the Canucks didn't grab him especially for the very reasonable price of a 3rd. I really enjoy his game and I enjoy watching him play. You guys got an awesome player and I think you guys got a steal.

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03-02-2008, 05:26 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Beetmaster General View Post
i remember hearing somewhere that phaneuf was in his first year and vandermeer was one of the older guys on his way out, only had that one season together i believe

Phaneuf played some exhibition games and I think one or two regular season games together with Vandermeer in the 2000-01 season. Vandermeer was an OA and Phaneuf a 15 year old AP (e.g. he was drafted by the Rebels but not old enough to play with them full time).
The WHL drafts player a year younger than the OHL or the Q and they have to play a year Midget or Jr. A before they can play in the WHL regularly (they are allowed to play up to five games and can join the team full time once their Minor teams season ends).
When Phaneuf joined the Rebels as a 16 year old rookie in 2001-02, Vandermeer already moved on to the AHL.

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03-02-2008, 10:15 AM
  #74
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abracanada, I wish I had time to give a well thought out reply to your comments but I need to head to work shortly.

To be concise, your examples of Commadore and Ferrence (you could even add Lydman and Zuzyn) are not that great because all four of them have fared far better after they left Calgary than their time here.

Hale and Aucoin, might have worked out so far. Personally, Sarich is not playing his best hockey here, Eriksson's play has made him a sacrificial lamb among fans, undeservedly in my opinion, he's been overplayed. This season alone it's been touch and go.

The Flames a team that make defensemen look good? Two years ago Marchmant looked good in a Flames uniform, the equivalent today would struggle on this team.
Actually, Commodore and Ferrence were doing much worse prior to coming to Calgary and in particular, in the playoffs of 03/04. Commodore was a spare part who languished in the minors for good parts of his career. Ference had fallen out of favor. Both of these players were fairly cheap pickups and those playoffs established their value. To say they were of no value prior to leaving Calgary is to ignore the role they played in the Cup Run.

To quote Aucoin, he stated he had to relearn the position and Playfair is the guy responsible for helping him there. Playfair has been instrumental in Regehr's and Phaneuf's development as well.

Granted, this teams focus off of the defensive game when they acquired Tanguay is easily proved, but you can't deny the effectiveness this club has had over the years helping Kiprusoff develop into a top flight goalie. Players coming out of a system like that, are prized.

Time will tell.

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Old
03-05-2008, 09:58 AM
  #75
Badger Bob
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I knew Vandermeer would be awesome in the right situation and I'm kind of annoyed that the Canucks didn't grab him especially for the very reasonable price of a 3rd. I really enjoy his game and I enjoy watching him play. You guys got an awesome player and I think you guys got a steal.
In the game against the Bluejackets, he showed a willingness to dish out some punishment. That's an attribute that was in short supply, last year, against the Red Wings in the playoffs. Warrener became the designated whipping boy, but he was forced into inappropriate assignments, due to Regehr's injury. Tomas Holmstrom was taking liberties with Kiprusoff's space. Before the deadline, there's always "puck-moving defenseman" on the wish list, but crease-clearers are valuable for the post-season. This is a useful skill that Vandermeer brings to the table.

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