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Flyers trade for Vaclav Prospal

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Old
02-25-2008, 09:35 PM
  #101
mikedifr
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Originally Posted by Breeze 44 View Post
I like the trade, I think he'll be with danny cause he likes to play the middle slot and does it well.
If he plays with Danny and Umberger goes back with Carter, that is fine. We then can reunite the Richards/Downie/Hartnell line when healthy.

If they brought him here just to move Umberger, I rather have Umberger.

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02-25-2008, 09:36 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Devonator View Post
Actually I think this is a tremendous trade...I didn't know Vinnie had 57 points?? And is only 33 years of age!!

And really, Picard wasn't all that much of a prospect...

All we have to do now is get healthly and get into the playoffs and anything can happen...

But I am hoping that tomorrow we make some kind of deal for a defenceman.....
Jones gives us basically what we expected from Picard, without the size. I suspect either another trade is coming, or they will sign a dman in the offseason. This is a good trade that doesnt hurt us in the future, but will help us get into the playoffs this year.

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02-25-2008, 09:38 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by FlyHigh View Post
So just kicking around our top 9 for next year.

Briere, Carter, Richards, Gagne, Umberger, Lupul, Upshall, Downie, Giroux, Hartnell, Knuble.

So that's 11 guys not even including Prospal. So that leads me to believe one of a few things.

A) Prospal won't be resigned.

B) Another big trade is on the table, probably involving 1 or more of our forwards, maybe a prospect like Nodl, that brings a defenseman here.

C) Umberger or Carter won't be resigned and this is the quick replacement for a year or two.

I'm personally going with A. The fact that the conditional pick revolves around the Flyers postseason performance and not the possibility of Prospal resigning makes me think that Feaster doesn't think the Flyers are resigning him.

Since I think it's only a rental, I'm not a fan of it because we lose a decent prospect for a top-6 forward in a year where we aren't going to contend and will be in a dogfight to make the playoffs.

EDIT:

I forgot to add...

D) Downie and Giroux might both be in the AHL next year

and

E) Gagne's problems are a lot more serious than the Flyers are letting on and they are very concerned about his ability to continue his career. If that's the case, this is an extremely astute move while we wait for JVR.

Still think it's A though.

Some pretty valid points but Umberger and Carter could be tendered contract offers that make it darn near impossible for the flyers to match. I think for the injuries we have and our lack of scoring punch right now it was a good move. Picard wasn't coming up and Lase still can't get on the ice so that just keeps Picard even deeper on the pine.

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02-25-2008, 09:38 PM
  #104
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pretty happy about this trade


with all the injuries, he was a good guy to get; not under contract after this year, so if he fits they sign him, if not let him go.


astute move by Homer!



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02-25-2008, 09:39 PM
  #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orange and black48 View Post
Why would they bring in Prospal if they dont plan on resigning him? If Gags doesnt come back he is the replacement I would assume!!!

Theyll sign em
With what money guys?

Knuble is signed for another year and so is Hatcher. Knuble is definitely marketable to some extent, but where the hell is a market for Hatcher?

Keep in mind we are also looking at resigning Jones who could be on pace for a 35 point season.

Carter is going to be at least 4 mill, I'd say Umberger is at least 2.5 mill as well. Jones could be 1.5-2 mill.

We have nothing coming off the books either except for Smith's 2 mill, Cote's 500K, and Modry.

This organization needs to do some serious looking ahead.

In the next 2-3 years, we have Lupul coming up who could easily get 4.5-5.5 mill (that's about a 2.5 mill raise over what he makes now), Upshall who could get bumped to 2-3 mill (about a 1.5 mill raise) and Coburn who could easily go up to 5 mill (that's a 4 mill raise).

I'm not saying it's the end of the world, but this organization needs to be extremely careful about who they sign and I don't want a 35 year-old Prospal at 3.5 mill costing us Coburn or Lupul.

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02-25-2008, 09:40 PM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boyle's timing View Post
So what can you tell me about Picard?
It seems the general feeling around here is that he is good but would never play. He came up for injuries and was never good enough to steal a spot. He's very offensive minded, sub-par (but not horrible) defensively. think he tops out 3-4 Defenseman on a decent club, maybe Qbing the 2nd powerplay unit. Good shot.

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02-25-2008, 09:40 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by Breeze 44 View Post
Some pretty valid points but Umberger and Carter could be tendered contract offers that make it darn near impossible for the flyers to match. I think for the injuries we have and our lack of scoring punch right now it was a good move. Picard wasn't coming up and Lase still can't get on the ice so that just keeps Picard even deeper on the pine.
If they are serious about keeping this team together, I think it is just a rental for this year. If Umberger or Carter are being extremely unreasonable in what they are asking for, he is a contingency plan.

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02-25-2008, 09:40 PM
  #108
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The Phantoms are a captive market for Hatcher if we have to go that route.

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02-25-2008, 09:42 PM
  #109
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The only thing bothering me is, why do we always have to bring back former Flyers?

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02-25-2008, 09:42 PM
  #110
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Good deal! I like Vinny.

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02-25-2008, 09:42 PM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyHigh View Post
With what money guys?

Knuble is signed for another year and so is Hatcher. Knuble is definitely marketable to some extent, but where the hell is a market for Hatcher?

Keep in mind we are also looking at resigning Jones who could be on pace for a 35 point season.

Carter is going to be at least 4 mill, I'd say Umberger is at least 2.5 mill as well. Jones could be 1.5-2 mill.

We have nothing coming off the books either except for Smith's 2 mill, Cote's 500K, and Modry.

This organization needs to do some serious looking ahead.

In the next 2-3 years, we have Lupul coming up who could easily get 4.5-5.5 mill (that's about a 2.5 mill raise over what he makes now), Upshall who could get bumped to 2-3 mill (about a 1.5 mill raise) and Coburn who could easily go up to 5 mill (that's a 4 mill raise).

I'm not saying it's the end of the world, but this organization needs to be extremely careful about who they sign and I don't want a 35 year-old Prospal at 3.5 mill costing us Coburn or Lupul.
I wouldn't get upset about signing him until that time comes. As i see it, its a rental unless Vinny is willing to stay for a reasonable amount, or if he shows great chemistry with Carter or Briere. I love Picard, but he was something we could afford to lose for a chance at getting some continuity in our top lines. This is definitely low risk, high reward

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02-25-2008, 09:42 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Breeze 44 View Post
Some pretty valid points but Umberger and Carter could be tendered contract offers that make it darn near impossible for the flyers to match. I think for the injuries we have and our lack of scoring punch right now it was a good move. Picard wasn't coming up and Lase still can't get on the ice so that just keeps Picard even deeper on the pine.
Keeping Carter is not an option for this organization, they have to do it at all costs, losing Carter opens up a huge gap at center and we have no good C prospects right now.

Umberger we may well lose, he's shown before that he wants his money. The thing is that the Flyers should have the inside track on these negotiations and should be able to get something done. I'm a little surprised/worried that Carter hasn't been resigned yet.

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02-25-2008, 09:43 PM
  #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
The only thing bothering me is, why do we always have to bring back former Flyers?
We draft em, trade em, they end up being good, so we want em back.

I guess we haven't learned to be more patient and develop i suppose.

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02-25-2008, 09:43 PM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
The only thing bothering me is, why do we always have to bring back former Flyers?
I think in this case... the familiarity might help... and i also think it was coincidence. He was the type of secondary player we needed without breaking the bank. Not many of those available

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02-25-2008, 09:44 PM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MountainHawk View Post
The Phantoms are a captive market for Hatcher if we have to go that route.
I hate that route though, I mean we already screwed Gauthier over really hard. He's definitely still NHL caliber and he's stuck in a lower level league indefinitely.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kz
I wouldn't get upset about signing him until that time comes. As i see it, its a rental unless Vinny is willing to stay for a reasonable amount, or if he shows great chemistry with Carter or Briere. I love Picard, but he was something we could afford to lose for a chance at getting some continuity in our top lines. This is definitely low risk, high reward.
I don't see where the reward is.

We aren't winning an SC this year and we most likely aren't resigning him unless we want to lose Umberger, so what is the reward here?

I also don't like losing Picard who's one of the extremely few good puckmovers we have in the organization right now.

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02-25-2008, 09:45 PM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyHigh View Post
Keeping Carter is not an option for this organization, they have to do it at all costs, losing Carter opens up a huge gap at center and we have no good C prospects right now.

Umberger we may well lose, he's shown before that he wants his money. The thing is that the Flyers should have the inside track on these negotiations and should be able to get something done. I'm a little surprised/worried that Carter hasn't been resigned yet.
They were exploring a Kaberle deal, which is one of the few that would make sense with Carter. I think now that nothing will happen on that front, more attention will be placed on getting him signed.

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02-25-2008, 09:45 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by kz View Post
I think in this case... the familiarity might help... and i also think it was coincidence. He was the type of secondary player we needed without breaking the bank. Not many of those available
Yeah, I was only being half serious...I like the trade a lot, as long as it doesnt mean Umberger is being moved.

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02-25-2008, 09:45 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Breeze 44 View Post
Some pretty valid points but Umberger and Carter could be tendered contract offers that make it darn near impossible for the flyers to match. I think for the injuries we have and our lack of scoring punch right now it was a good move. Picard wasn't coming up and Lase still can't get on the ice so that just keeps Picard even deeper on the pine.
i agree about picard besides after this year we will probably lose hatch & smith so we will have to bring in a dman with some bite

parent - kimo
coburn - kuks
picard - jones

that's a very talented but soft d so picard or jones would have a tough time cracking the line up next season

parent - kimo
coburn - kuks/UFA (BOYLE!)
jones - gauthier

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02-25-2008, 09:47 PM
  #119
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I like this move!

Holy 42 page GDT Batman!!!!

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02-25-2008, 09:47 PM
  #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyHigh View Post
I hate that route though, I mean we already screwed Gauthier over really hard. He's definitely still NHL caliber and he's stuck in a lower level league indefinitely.



I don't see where the reward is.

We aren't winning an SC this year and we most likely aren't resigning him unless we want to lose Umberger, so what is the reward here?

I also don't like losing Picard who's one of the extremely few good puckmovers we have in the organization right now.
Are we definitely winning a Cup? No, hell the chances are against us... but so many teams before have proven that its not as simple as being the best team in January and February that win the cup. Edmonton came 1 game away and was not a very complete team in the least bit. Maybe if they made another small move to bolster a position they could have won it all.

Point is, as long as we dont do anything crazy like get Hossa, the team needs to make some sort of effort to compete. We held onto our best prospects, we didnt lose a young roster player, and we add a player that can fill Gagne's shoes this year

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02-25-2008, 09:48 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by kz View Post
Are we definitely winning a Cup? No, hell the chances are against us... but so many teams before have proven that its not as simple as being the best team in January and February that win the cup. Edmonton came 1 game away and was not a very complete team in the least bit. Maybe if they made another small move to bolster a position they could have won it all.

Point is, as long as we dont do anything crazy like get Hossa, the team needs to make some sort of effort to compete. We held onto our best prospects, we didnt lose a young roster player, and we add a player that can fill Gagne's shoes this year
Well said. As I said in another thread, there are ways of improving this team to get into the playoffs without giving up Carter/Umberger/Giroux/JVR etc.

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02-25-2008, 09:50 PM
  #122
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Originally Posted by Boyle's timing View Post
So what can you tell me about Picard?

Prospal is an extremely streaky player but he brings so much passion to the game he is truly a treat to watch, the problem with him is nobody knows if he can produce without playing on a line with Lecavalier and St.Louis. He also has one good season, one bad season, one good season, etc.

He is a UFA and has not made it a secret he is looking for big money. he recently turned down 3 years 10 million from the Lightning so it will be interesting to see if you are able to get him to a contract before July 1st.
Basically Stevens gave Picard and Jones both a shot at the big club last year. Personally I thought Picard improved a lot throughout the year and looking back on that year I expected him to be on the Flyers more than I expected Jones to be.

He needs a little work but he is very offensive. Had a 5 assist game against the Devs last year. Great shot, overall great upside. I have no doubt he will be a top 4 defenseman- he just needs a little work.

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02-25-2008, 09:56 PM
  #123
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With the goals by Carter and Hartnell tonight, and this trade, we now have 5 players with 20+ goals. One more by Prospal will give him 30. If Lupul can come back soon and pot a few more, that will make it 6.

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02-25-2008, 09:56 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by FlyHigh View Post
Keeping Carter is not an option for this organization, they have to do it at all costs, losing Carter opens up a huge gap at center and we have no good C prospects right now.

Umberger we may well lose, he's shown before that he wants his money. The thing is that the Flyers should have the inside track on these negotiations and should be able to get something done. I'm a little surprised/worried that Carter hasn't been resigned yet.
Umberger has stated that he'd take a discount to stay here. I personally feel Carter would do the same (even though there's no particular reason to think so).

You really think Homer's gonna let them get to the point as RFAs where they can be yoinked from us?

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02-25-2008, 09:57 PM
  #125
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This trade makes me really excited about the possibility of turning around our current slide beyond this win tonight. I am happy to see him back in a Flyers uniform and think he will fit in nice.

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