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Old
03-10-2008, 11:15 PM
  #1
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Canadiens Top 20 prospects, Spring 2008

Carey Price remains atop the Canadiens prospects list, though not for long.

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03-11-2008, 12:12 AM
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Sergei Kostitsyn should be behind only to Carey Price...

He's now a 8.0 B now

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03-11-2008, 12:16 AM
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Wow Sergei's 8.0B is a huge jump from his former 6.5C (or something like that).

edit: it was 7.5C.

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03-11-2008, 12:37 AM
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I think I am always a bit amazed when I read our new top 20 because I seem to forget just how good our prospect depth is.

When we've got guys like D'Agostini, Carle and White near the bottom of our Top 20, you know things are going well. These guys would probably be at least top 10 on most other lists and all have the potential to be important parts of an NHL team.

Timmins
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03-11-2008, 12:39 AM
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Compiled some info using archive.org

<html><table border=1><thead><td>Rank</td><td>Name</td><td>Prev. Rank</td><td>Rating</td><td>Prev. Rating</td><td>Comment</td></thead><tr><td>1.</td><td>Carey Price, G</td><td>1</td><td>9.0C</td><td>8.0B</td><td>Okay.</td></tr><tr><td>2.</td><td>Ryan McDonagh, D</td><td>2</td><td>8.0B</td><td>8.0C</td><td>--</td></tr><tr><td>3.</td><td>Sergei Kostitsyn, LW</td><td>9(+6)</td><td>8.0B</td><td>7.5C</td><td>Okay.</td></tr><tr><td>4.</td><td>Max Pacioretty, LW</td><td>5(+1)</td><td>7.0B</td><td>7.5C</td><td>--</td></tr><tr><td>5.</td><td>Ryan O'Byrne, D</td><td>13(+8)</td><td>7.0A</td><td>7.0C</td><td>Makes sense.</td></tr><tr><td>6.</td><td>Kyle Chipchura, C</td><td>4(-2)</td><td>6.0A</td><td>7.5B</td><td>Wow, but not totally crazy.</td></tr><tr><td>7.</td><td>Ben Maxwell, C</td><td>6(-1)</td><td>7.0B</td><td>6.5C</td><td>Injuries drop his stock.</td></tr><tr><td>8.</td><td>Mikhail Grabovski, LW</td><td>11(+3)</td><td>7.0C</td><td>7.5C</td><td>Okay, I guess.</td></tr><tr><td>9.</td><td>Jaroslav Halak, G</td><td>10(+1)</td><td>7.0B</td><td>7.0C</td><td>I'd agree.</td></tr><tr><td>10.</td><td>David Fischer, D</td><td>7(-3)</td><td>8.0C</td><td>8.0C</td><td>Yep.</td></tr><tr><td>11.</td><td>P.K. Subban, D</td><td>14(+3)</td><td>6.0C</td><td>6.5C</td><td>--</td></tr><tr><td>12.</td><td>Yannick Weber, D</td><td>NR</td><td>7.0C</td><td>6.5C</td><td>--</td></tr><tr><td>13.</td><td>Mathieu Carle, D</td><td>18(+5)</td><td>7.0B</td><td>7.0C</td><td>Okay</td></tr><tr><td>14.</td><td>Matt D'Agostini, RW</td><td>17(+3)</td><td>6.0C</td><td>6.5C</td><td>Not progressing quickly.</td></tr><tr><td>15.</td><td>Alexei Yemelin, D</td><td>12(-3)</td><td>7.0D</td><td>7.5B</td><td>Not being in NA hurts exposure a bit.</td></tr><tr><td>16.</td><td>Brock Trotter, C</td><td>NR</td><td>7.0C</td><td>???</td><td>--</td></tr><tr><td>17.</td><td>Ryan White, C</td><td>16(-1)</td><td>6.0B</td><td>6.0C</td><td>6.0 seems arbitrary. White = Locke?</td></tr><tr><td>18.</td><td>James Wyman, RW</td><td>NR</td><td>6.0D</td><td>5.0C</td><td>Okay.</td></tr><tr><td>19.</td><td>Pavel Valentenko, D</td><td>15(-4)</td><td>6.0C</td><td>6.5C</td><td>Umm.. what?</td></tr><tr><td>20.</td><td>Andrew Conboy, LW</td><td>NR</td><td>5.0B</td><td>???</td><td>--</td></tr><tr><td>Others of note:</td></tr><tr><td>NR</td><td>Corey Locke, C</td><td>NR</td><td>6.0D</td><td>7.0D</td><td>Yeah, I guess.</td></tr><tr><td>NR</td><td>Niklas Torp, D</td><td>NR</td><td>5.0C</td><td>???</td><td>Injuries I guess.</td></tr></table></html>

The only updated rating I really have issue with is the Valentenko one, which seems unreasoned. Chipchura's massive drop is pretty shocking, too. The rest seem bang on or close. IMO Trotter could have started off outside the top 10, and in no way is he higher than Wyman or Valentenko in my head.
If anyone can remember other previous prospects ratings, let me know and I'll update the list.

Thanks to Watsatheo for some additional figures.


Last edited by coolguy21415: 03-11-2008 at 11:35 AM.
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Old
03-11-2008, 12:48 AM
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Conboy in the list!!!

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Old
03-11-2008, 12:48 AM
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I see Wyman as more of a 7.0C type of player. Classic high risk high reward player.

Also have Valentenko alot higher as a 7.0B. Other than that I agree pretty much all the way through, though a C for Price?

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03-11-2008, 12:53 AM
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Do you think Wyman will be a Habs one day? I think he has the potential to be a top 6 power forward. He's big and can score.

What do you think?

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03-11-2008, 12:59 AM
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i was wondering where Valentenko was ranked as i kept reading and shocked almost to find him drop that low. I think he is injured right now too so hopefully he comes back healthy and starts climbing that chart quickly

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03-11-2008, 01:07 AM
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From the looks of that list, there may be upwards of 15 players that will be regular contributors to the club in the future. That is a spectacular success rate given the position in which we normally draft every year. Moreover, It bodes well for the future and indicates that this team will strive to maintain an elite status year in and year out. In maintaining this status, a low draft pick will be had. With Timmins at the helm I am not worried. He will find good players. Maybe we are setting ourselves up to getting that elite player we need, Tavares in 09 .

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03-11-2008, 02:09 AM
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Good stuff, these guys are gonna come in handy as Kovalev, Hamrlik and Koivu age. Moreover, Bouillon, Begin, Kostopoulos and Dandanault are all going to be gone after next season. That gives you a lot of open spots and a really really young team.

I think we need to draft another player a la Andrei Kostitsyn though.

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03-11-2008, 03:45 AM
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I have no problem with Maxpac and Mcdonald ( ahhh those nicknames ) being high with Price Sergei & Obyrne ( who are not prospects anymore IMO ) but Halak should be higher than Grabovski , Chipchura ET SURTOUT MAXWELL.Its nonesense

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03-11-2008, 06:08 AM
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Has anyone seen Torp play yet or is he still injured?

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03-11-2008, 07:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedScull View Post
...
McDonagh used to be a 8.0C, Pac used to be 7.5C, Fischer used to be 7.0C, Subban and Weber used to be 6.5C, and D'Agostini was like a 6.0D or something with a D.

I agree with most this time but I don't like how Valentenko is so low, Carle being a 'B', and Weber's potential above Subban.


Last edited by Watsatheo: 03-11-2008 at 07:29 AM.
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03-11-2008, 07:26 AM
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Chipchura's drop can be attributed more to the progress made by S.Kost and O'byrne than by Chip's play.

I agree on Valentenko, he seems a bit low, I think he'll be a better NHLer than Carle and Weber.

I think worst case White will make the NHL as a Maxime Lapierre type energy guy that can chip in 10-15 goals on a 3rd or 4th line, plus will drop the gloves and is good on faceoffs.. I think he'll need 2 years in Hamilton. Best case he develops into a 20-25 goal 2nd liner with speedy linemates.

Trotter it will be interesting to see him next year with a half year already under his belt, Timmins compares him to Whitney(smallish guy with excellent hands and vision) which is good.

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03-11-2008, 07:32 AM
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The cupboard is stacked. I really think it allows Gainey to make a fairly big trade at the draft. Our prospects depth is very rich in NHL talent.

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03-11-2008, 07:52 AM
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Beyond the big hit, Valentenko’s also got the big shot, recently winning the AHL’s hardest shot competition with a 102.7 mph blast – and while that booming cannon isn’t translating into goals, he is creating scoring chances, evidenced by his 12 assists.
Really? I would have sworn it was a team skills competition.

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03-11-2008, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hochelaga View Post
I have no problem with Maxpac and Mcdonald ( ahhh those nicknames ) being high with Price Sergei & Obyrne ( who are not prospects anymore IMO ) but Halak should be higher than Grabovski , Chipchura ET SURTOUT MAXWELL.Its nonesense
Don't underestimate Maxwell. He has the potential to be something really special.

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03-11-2008, 09:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
Really? I would have sworn it was a team skills competition.
Yea it was the team skills

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Chipchura's drop can be attributed more to the progress made by S.Kost and O'byrne than by Chip's play.

I agree on Valentenko, he seems a bit low, I think he'll be a better NHLer than Carle and Weber.

I think worst case White will make the NHL as a Maxime Lapierre type energy guy that can chip in 10-15 goals on a 3rd or 4th line, plus will drop the gloves and is good on faceoffs.. I think he'll need 2 years in Hamilton. Best case he develops into a 20-25 goal 2nd liner with speedy linemates.

Trotter it will be interesting to see him next year with a half year already under his belt, Timmins compares him to Whitney(smallish guy with excellent hands and vision) which is good.

I would have Valentenko higher as well, imo he should see some games with us next year. He has made some big strides this year, I wasn't too impressed with him early on but wow did he turn things around, really like what I've seen from him.

Trotter, I really don't know how he can get rated in our top 20, the guy twice went undrafted, if Timmins liked him so much, why not draft him last summer instead of Kishel? As for comparing him to White, I don't like it either, White has way, way more grit, will drop the gloves, take the body, block shots, he's got a more compact frame as well and he's better along the boards. Trotter is smallish, lacks strength and doesn't have much of a physcial game. So far he hasn't been too impressive in Hamilton, although it's got to be tough going from the NCAA to the AHL midseason. He was really good in the NCAA but I have to wonder how he'll handle the physical aspects of the AHL.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeRo.O View Post
Has anyone seen Torp play yet or is he still injured?
Still injured

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03-11-2008, 09:11 AM
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I thought Valentenko was underrated last year at 15. 19 seems very low to me.

I've always thought O'B was overrated around these parts. This ranking will probably compound that problem. I get that he's already made the NHL, so he's a sure bet, but I still don't see the upside in him to warrant a top-5 spot on the list.

I'm surprised Trotter is so high. But then I know nothing about Trotter, so I'll take that as a positive surprise.

All in all, this list just really impresses me with it's depth. Pretty much everyone on the list has a credible shot at making the NHL some day, which is really impressive. Timmins and his staff deserve a medal or something.

Quote:
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As for comparing him to White, I don't like it either, White has way, way more grit, will drop the gloves, take the body, block shots, he's got a more compact frame as well and he's better along the boards. Trotter is smallish, lacks strength and doesn't have much of a physcial game. So far he hasn't been too impressive in Hamilton, although it's got to be tough going from the NCAA to the AHL midseason. He was really good in the NCAA but I have to wonder how he'll handle the physical aspects of the AHL.
I made that mistake at first too, but they're not comparing him to White, they're comparing him to Ray Whitney. Whitney's been just shy of a PPG player in the new NHL, so I can live with that comparison, even if Timmins did back away from it immediately.


Last edited by Beakermania*: 03-11-2008 at 09:25 AM.
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Old
03-11-2008, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by sakukoivu2003 View Post
Do you think Wyman will be a Habs one day? I think he has the potential to be a top 6 power forward. He's big and can score.

What do you think?
Hard to say how he will translate to the pros. I have seen a lot of him over the last 4 years and I like what I've seen, the one area he struggled was with his offensive game, but this year he broke out while on the top line playing a new position. I can't wait to see him in Hamilton to see how he does. I do think he can make the nhl if all goes well, as he can play in a checking role if his offense doesn't translate as he's big, skates well with good speed, will take the body and he's smart in his own end.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
I made that mistake at first too, but they're not comparing him to White, they're comparing him to Ray Whitney. Whitney's been just shy of a PPG player in the new NHL, so I can live with that comparison, even if Timmins did back away from it immediately.
My bad, read it too fast I guess. I personally don't see Trotter as an NHLer at this point as he's not that fast, not that strong, but he's young so we'll see how much he progresses/develops over the next few years. He is skilled with the puck though, so if he can bulk up a bit and get stronger, quicker then he might turn into a solid player for us.

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03-11-2008, 09:46 AM
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Valentenko seems a bit low considering the progress he has made this season.



Why is Francis Lemieux still there?

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03-11-2008, 10:06 AM
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So it's written Yemelin and not Emelin...

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03-11-2008, 10:07 AM
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Hard to say how he will translate to the pros. I have seen a lot of him over the last 4 years and I like what I've seen, the one area he struggled was with his offensive game, but this year he broke out while on the top line playing a new position. I can't wait to see him in Hamilton to see how he does. I do think he can make the nhl if all goes well, as he can play in a checking role if his offense doesn't translate as he's big, skates well with good speed, will take the body and he's smart in his own end.


I'm real anxious to see how JT Wyman does in the AHL, I hope he can get signed and brought over to the Dogs for the end of the season and into the playoffs (btw, is he eligible to play?)

As you mentionned, he's big, right handed, good speed, physical and has enough hockey sense to have doubled as a forward and defensman. Maybe 1 year in the AHL and this guy could contribute on a 4th line and eventually 3rd line for the Habs. I think that's the Habs biggest weakness right now, there's alot of skill/speed, but not enough quality role players on the bottom lines.

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03-11-2008, 10:14 AM
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I'm real anxious to see how JT Wyman does in the AHL, I hope he can get signed and brought over to the Dogs for the end of the season and into the playoffs (btw, is he eligible to play?)
As long as he signs a contract, yes he's eligible.

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