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Yay!!! (Prucha returns...)

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Old
03-25-2008, 11:11 AM
  #51
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prucha will be invisible tonight. i love how he's the savior on the PP. what does he do? what he goes to the net that's great it's kinda hard to score when we don't utilize the point men. prucha can't create opportunities for himself when have you seen him take a pass and skate into the zone and create something? usually when he tries that he gets leveled for having his head down. and when he fights for pucks in the corners, what happens? he gets leveled. once the off season comes he's a goner

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03-25-2008, 11:15 AM
  #52
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From Sam's blog:

Quote:
Mara will also take Rozsival’s place alongside Backman on the power play. The new power play configurations have that pairing with the first line of Martin Straka, Jaromir Jagr, and Brandon Dubinsky. On the other power play, Brendan Shanahan will be with Chris Drury and Sean Avery, along with Fedor Tyutin and Dan Girardi. Petr Prucha is back in the lineup tonight, but is not expected to see any power play time.

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03-25-2008, 11:17 AM
  #53
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we are due for a powerplay goal.. lol.. watch in the playoffs this team will just beast it on the powerplay... renney is playing with our minds, he wants them not to show their true potential! .. im on to you renney like white on rice

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03-25-2008, 11:19 AM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squishy View Post
There's already about a dozen threads pissing on him here on HF, so why not just keep doing it in those threads, and let folks who are looking forward to seeing him play enjoy their excitement?
I know!! Tired of seeing the Prucha hate.

It's simple, Prucha isn't a puck carrier, he's a great forechecker to create loose pucks and ultimately someone with a great release and definitely quick snap/wrist shot. Gives 100% hustle every shift. People need to quit complaining about what he isn't.

I hope in the coming years he puts on about 20-30 pounds.

GO PRUUUUU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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03-25-2008, 11:19 AM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mergnemi View Post
prucha will be invisible tonight. i love how he's the savior on the PP. what does he do? what he goes to the net that's great it's kinda hard to score when we don't utilize the point men. prucha can't create opportunities for himself when have you seen him take a pass and skate into the zone and create something? usually when he tries that he gets leveled for having his head down. and when he fights for pucks in the corners, what happens? he gets leveled. once the off season comes he's a goner
I dont think he will be invisible. He's hardly ever invisible. He is constantly bouncing around all the place. He tries extremely hard but I just don't think he is good enough. He will forecheck hard, and play decent d but that is about it. he will definately also be visible carrying the puck into the zone only to have somebody tap him and he goes flying, while coughing up the pill.

He can maybe do something on the PP but I doubt it. The more and more, I watch him and think back the last two years, the more I come to realize that he just took advantage of Jagr playing well. He can capitalize when players around him are hot but you are correct in saying that he doesn't do anything by himself. He will only be as good as the players he plays w/, and won't make anybody around him better.

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03-25-2008, 11:21 AM
  #56
Jaromir Jagr
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Originally Posted by Forechecker View Post
Lol. Expected that.

So worthless without PP time.

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Old
03-25-2008, 11:31 AM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
I'll be excited if he puts some points up.
I'll be excited if he doesn't suck

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03-25-2008, 11:58 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Cherapanov View Post
Lol. Expected that.

So worthless without PP time.

PP is not going to be in the lineup for the playoffs so why work on the power play with him on it? I'd rather work on the PP with the players that will be there.

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03-25-2008, 12:58 PM
  #59
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Straka..

does have a PP goal in the last 10 games - so it makes sense that he would continue to see PP time.

The Rangers' PP worked in the past - it's odd that they cannot figure out why it's currently not working (#24 in the league? Pathetic!).

I will keep saying it - Dubi, unfortunately, shouldn't be out there with Jagr on the PP. It hasn't been working. Unfortunately with Gomez injured there aren't other options, but to me, that's an issue because Jagr isn't moving around with him enough.

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03-25-2008, 01:04 PM
  #60
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I would love to see Prucha step up and become a regular scoring force on this team......

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03-25-2008, 01:12 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by mergnemi View Post
what does he do? prucha can't create opportunities for himself when have you seen him take a pass and skate into the zone and create something? when he fights for pucks in the corners, what happens? once the off season comes he's a goner
Take a step back and read the points you made about Prucha above and tell me you couldn't replace Prucha's name in your rant with Shanny's? The only difference is that Prucha makes 1.6 mill and Shanny makes 5 mill. I've never seen a player who makes 1.6 mill, is in his mid 20's, plays hard every single second he is on the ice and who scored 52 goals for us in his first two years get this kind of hate thrown his way in his 3rd year. I understand that NY is a what have you done for me lately town but this is bordering on the absurd now.

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03-25-2008, 01:12 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squishy View Post
There's already about a dozen threads pissing on him here on HF, so why not just keep doing it in those threads, and let folks who are looking forward to seeing him play enjoy their excitement?
i know what you mean, but at the same time we aren't kids here (I think...). Meaning you can love a player, but that doesn't make him more talented. For Example, I love Colton Orr, Blair Betts, and Ryan Hollweg... That doesn't mean im going to defend them on these boards more than I should, or suggest that they take other players spots that have done better jobs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mergnemi View Post
prucha will be invisible tonight. i love how he's the savior on the PP. what does he do? what he goes to the net that's great it's kinda hard to score when we don't utilize the point men. prucha can't create opportunities for himself when have you seen him take a pass and skate into the zone and create something? usually when he tries that he gets leveled for having his head down. and when he fights for pucks in the corners, what happens? he gets leveled. once the off season comes he's a goner
-ahem- ... my sentiments exactly.

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Old
03-25-2008, 01:15 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomLaidlaw View Post
Take a step back and read the points you made about Prucha above and tell me you couldn't replace Prucha's name in your rant with Shanny's? The only difference is that Prucha makes 1.6 mill and Shanny makes 5 mill. I've never seen a player who makes 1.6 mill, is in his mid 20's, plays hard every single second he is on the ice and who scored 52 goals for us in his first two years get this kind of hate thrown his way in his 3rd year. I understand that NY is a what have you done for me lately town but this is bordering on the absurd now.
Shanny has the rings, reputation, toughness, and the experience to earn his money.

edit: I think some peopel underestimate what it takes to win consistently. Some people are just born winners and they have a nack for it, which is what good teams do. That is why any time im talking to a Sabres fan I break their balls about Drury, because where ever he goes he finds ways to win. Same with Shanny. When he knows he can't win anymore, he'll hang em up.

Prucha was a good rookie and sophmore who can't compete at the same level he once was because of his lack of size and ability to create offense. There are a bunch of snipers in the nhl, but if they can't playmake and be compatible with others, they are basically useless.

And its not just NY, its more pro sports in general nowadays. Free Agency....

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03-25-2008, 01:51 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSchwab View Post
Shanny has the rings, reputation, toughness, and the experience to earn his money.

edit: I think some peopel underestimate what it takes to win consistently. Some people are just born winners and they have a nack for it, which is what good teams do. That is why any time im talking to a Sabres fan I break their balls about Drury, because where ever he goes he finds ways to win. Same with Shanny. When he knows he can't win anymore, he'll hang em up.

Prucha was a good rookie and sophmore who can't compete at the same level he once was because of his lack of size and ability to create offense. There are a bunch of snipers in the nhl, but if they can't playmake and be compatible with others, they are basically useless.

And its not just NY, its more pro sports in general nowadays. Free Agency....

This is the type of mentality that got us into trouble during the dark ages. Rewarding players for past accomplishments with money and icetime. Couldn't you say we did the same thing with messier his final couple of years here? Same can be said about Bruce Driver etc etc etc. I don't agree that what Shanny did for the red Wings in the late 90's should somehow be rewarded in 2008. Shanny was 10 years younger. The time for honoring a professional athlete comes when he retires wheter it be by his induction to the hall of fame or retiring his number. Shanny deserves all those things. However, rewarding a player for past accomplishments while he is still playing is a flawed logic and unfortunately one we operated under for a decade.

I don't wanna hijack this thread because it is about prucha. My original point was that Prucha is receiving the type of disdain usually reserved for players who don't play hard or who are locker room cancers. The original post I replied to listed all of pruchas negatives and every single one could be said about Shanny who for some reason is a fan favorite, yet prucha is hated. The other thread Fletch pointed out prucha had just as many goals last year as shanny has this year with less PP time. These aren't speculations they are facts. The only difference is that prucha actually forechecks and goes into high contact areas. A concept that is completely foreign to 2008 Shanny. The last time Shanny made contact with an opposing player was last year when he ran into Knuble. So when you deal with just facts and not past accomplishments why does Prucha get killed by so many yet shanny gets a free pass?


Last edited by TomLaidlaw: 03-25-2008 at 02:06 PM.
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Old
03-25-2008, 01:56 PM
  #65
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Meh. I would rather have seen Sjöström take that spot. He has deserved it.

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03-25-2008, 02:06 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by TomLaidlaw View Post
This is the type of mentality that got us into trouble during the dark ages. Rewarding players for past accomplishments with money and icetime. Couldn't you say we did the same thing with messier his final couple of years here? However, rewarding a player for past accomplishments while he is still playing is a flawed logic and unfortunately one we operated under for a decade.
What are you supposed to reward players on future accomplishments? Of course some of their past will affect how/what they are percieved as. Also don't you bring up that Prucha scored 52 goals his first two years here. Well that rings a bell as being a past accomplishment. So we should disregard that than as well. So what has Prucha done this season so far.

Let's start w/ the positives:
Forechecks hard.

ok done here.

Now Negatives:
Constantly knocked down
Not a good passer
Doesn't create opportunities
not a big hitter
coughs up the pill as if it was cyonide



Quote:
Originally Posted by TomLaidlaw View Post
I don't wanna hijack this thread because it is about prucha. My original point was that Prucha is receiving the type of disdain usually reserved for players who don't play hard or who are locker room cancers. The original post I replied to listed all of pruchas negatives and every single one could be said about Shanny who for some reason is a fan favorite, yet prucha is hated. The other thread Fletch pointed out prucha had just as many goals last year as shanny has this year with less PP time. These aren't speculations they are facts. The only difference is that prucha actually forechecks. A concept that is completely foreign to 2008 Shanny. The last time Shanny made contact with an opposing player was last year when he ran into Knuble. So when you deal with just facts and not past accomplishments why does Prucha get killed by so many yet shanny gets a free pass?
What I bolded is a past accomplishment. This shouldn't be counted for anything according to you. hey I'm just playing by your rules here.

Yes Shanny doesn't forecheck, but this board has slammed him before in many different threads. I for one wished he was never signed and hope he isn't resigned. But you can't deny the fact that he is one of our leading goal scorers. He keeps scoring at a decent rate. Prucha hasn't done that when playing this year. he is also a vocal leader which is important. Prucha doesn't do that either. Shanny also PK's (too much sometimes) but he is decently effective at it. Prucha doesn't do that either (not sure if he can't or that's just Renney)

I admire and appreciate how hard Prucha works its just that I don't see him as a good hockey player. I see him as a boarderline AHL/NHLer. He doesn't make anybody around him better at all. Shanny hasn't really either this year but at least he is putting the puck in the net, of which some were extremely clutch.

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03-25-2008, 02:36 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
What are you supposed to reward players on future accomplishments?

What they can do for you present day. We went over this in the other thread and I have still yet to see someone tell me Prucha couldn't give us identical if not better production than Shanny has given us this year if Prucha was allowed to operate in the same setting as Shanny. Let Prucha sit in the slot and let the other 4 players on the ice do all the work and set his shot up on the PP. Let prucha play with our best playmaking center at even strength in Gomez. Let Prucha avoid any high contact areas wheter it be along the boards or in front of the net. Let prucha make terrible sloppy passes towards the middle of the ice with no worries of consequences for his actions. People somehow think Shanny is the only good thing about our PP and I couldn't disagree more. In my mind Shanny is the problem with our PP. For a PP to be effective you need all 5 players working as a unit, our PP has 4 guys working with puck control and 1 guy standing in the slot waiting for someone to set him up with a perfect pass. If you are gonna stand somewhere at least stand in front of the net and possibly screen the goalie or god forbid get an actual rebound and score an ugly goal, does shanny know what an ugly goal looks like? Sidenote: RAGS why am I arguing you about Shanny??? You are usually right next to me trying to quell the shanny lovefest. Is your hatred for Prucha so deep that you are willing to compromise your shanny beliefs?

Let's start w/ the positives:
Forechecks hard.

ok done here.

Now Negatives:
Not a good passer
Doesn't create opportunities
not a big hitter
coughs up the pill as if it was cyonide

Every single one of those negatives can be said about Shanny, hence my point.





What I bolded is a past accomplishment. This shouldn't be counted for anything according to you. hey I'm just playing by your rules here.

Yes Shanny doesn't forecheck, but this board has slammed him before in many different threads. I for one wished he was never signed and hope he isn't resigned. But you can't deny the fact that he is one of our leading goal scorers.
It is more then just not forechecking, he doesn't enter any high contact areas at all.

he is also a vocal leader which is important. Prucha doesn't do that either.

This is what every shanny debate turns too. He provides intangibles. It has to because if you just use facts shanny is overpaid and slows down our offense at even strength and someone who avoids any contact on the ice at all. So we somehow have to convicne ourselves that shanny transcends what we see with our eyes. That he is giving Herb Brooks like talks in the locker room that makes up for those sloppy passes towards the middle of the ice

I admire and appreciate how hard Prucha works its just that I don't see him as a good hockey player. I see him as a boarderline AHL/NHLer. He doesn't make anybody around him better at all. Shanny hasn't really either this year but at least he is putting the puck in the net, of which some were extremely clutch.

It is hard for someone to put the puck in the net from the press box. Put Prucha in the same scenario shanny was allowed to operate in and if prucha fails then I will agree with you.

I replied within the quote in red...

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03-25-2008, 02:41 PM
  #68
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Tough job for Prucha because his value comes from scoring. I read someone somewhere comparing his return to Cally's return, but unlike Cally, Prucha doent hit and skate like that.

So seen as it usually takes a while to get back a scoring touch....I doubt that anyone will be singing his praises during this brief stint back on the ice.


Hope I'm wrong though.

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03-25-2008, 02:45 PM
  #69
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What I bolded is a past accomplishment. This shouldn't be counted for anything according to you. hey I'm just playing by your rules here.
Rags I am givng you the benefit of the doubt that you don't need me to go in depth and explain why someone like shanny, messier and bruce driver who's best years were 7-10 years in the past is different then a player who is in his mid 20's and in his 3rd year in the NHL and who's future is still ahead of him, not behind him.

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03-25-2008, 02:47 PM
  #70
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prucha represents what it means to wear a new york rangers jersey...not 1 second whens not leaving it all out there

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03-25-2008, 03:09 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by TomLaidlaw View Post
I replied within the quote in red...
Don't worry, I still don't like Shanny and think he actually hurts the team more than he helps sometimes (most of the time). I just don't think that Prucha is ever going to produce like he did those first two years.

And frankly while Shanny loves (and I can't stand) to drive down the side and shoot into the goalies chest, it still is a little better than Prucha who drives than gets knocked down and coughs up the puck to the opposing team.

Both are vastly overrated, overpaid and I hope that neither of them are w/ the team next year. If I had to choose one or the other for next year I would choose pruchs over Shanny however.

But also don't Blame the PP problems solely on Shanny as it is a teamwide (and coachwide problem). We don't have a Dman who can truly man the point on the PP. Our team doesn't like to shoot for some reason but pass. And our passing is still atrocious.

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03-25-2008, 03:10 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by TomLaidlaw View Post
Rags I am givng you the benefit of the doubt that you don't need me to go in depth and explain why someone like shanny, messier and bruce driver who's best years were 7-10 years in the past is different then a player who is in his mid 20's and in his 3rd year in the NHL and who's future is still ahead of him, not behind him.
yeah I know what you were talking about. I just wanted to bust your chops a little.

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03-25-2008, 03:18 PM
  #73
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yeah I know what you were talking about. I just wanted to bust your chops a little.
I figured.

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03-25-2008, 03:26 PM
  #74
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The PP is a coaching issue...

and it has been for three seasons. Previous seasons deferred to Jagr. At least now Renney splits it up a bit but cannot figure out how to get Jagr's unit more productive (and it isn't as easy as shooting more pucks at the net).

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03-25-2008, 04:28 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
I'm not sure if anyone can help on the PP. There's an issue that goes beyond who is on Jagr's left side. If Jagr does not get the puck to the left winger for a shot, he cannot score, no matter what the left winger does. And with one PP point in 10 games for Jagr, there's a serious problem and it isn't who's been on the left side, and honestly, I'm not sure why Dubi (zero PP points in 10 games and 5 all season) is centering Jagr on the PP - it just isn't working - he's not the puck carrier Nylander was and Gomez is the closest this team has to one.
I'm not saying that he's the solution or that the problem is necessarily with who is playing with Jagr, I'm merely citing the tremendous success Prucha had playing LW with Jagr on the PP. They also clicked well with the Czech Republic National Team. I was hoping maybe letting them have some time together on the PP could recreate an ounce of that.

Right now our PP is dead, so it's not like there's something to lose by trying that.

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