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Is Hossa really our #1 player?

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Old
02-10-2004, 11:13 AM
  #1
Sting
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Is Hossa really our #1 player?

I've seen almost every game this year and I often wonder how Hossa gets all the points he does. He's an incredible player I know, one of the best, but it has always seemed to me that the goals he scores are kind of weak. Anyone else noticed that? I mean, he doesn't create the opportunities that Havlat does and doesn't forecheck like Alfredsson. He's got a ton of speed tho...but it just seems like he doesn't always put 100% into his game, and I am always seeing Bonk and their other linemate for that night doing all the work.

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02-10-2004, 11:18 AM
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Yes he is, he has a little Alf and a little Havlat and a lot of strength. I think you should clean your TV set off, it is blurring your vision (or have a couple less beers ). He plays hard every night and is one of the best back checkers on the team. I'm not sure where you are coming with this.

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02-10-2004, 11:19 AM
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The Lehner
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I think Hossa's combination of speed and his ability to shoot the puck contributes to his statistics. IMO he is our most skilled forward and probably our all around best forward. He is a very responsible player who can dominate a game with his speed.

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02-10-2004, 11:26 AM
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I think what the first poster is saying is that Hossa is a quiet player.. he scores all of his points quietly, and in the big picture, he has managed to sneak into the scoring leaders in the NHL over the last few years without drawing much, if any, attention from the media and whatnot. Some of his goals may be "soft"... but still... he was the #5 "Power" forward in the ESPN rankings earlier this year because of what he does around and in front of the net.

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02-10-2004, 11:31 AM
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Personally, I think Alfredsson is still our #1 player, but I believe that Hossa will surpass him in maybe a year or two. Hossa CAN dominate at times, but I find Alfredsson to be the more consistent threat on the ice. Plus, his ability to play the point makes him perhaps the more critical of the two in terms of driving the team's offensive engine.

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02-10-2004, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting004
I've seen almost every game this year and I often wonder how Hossa gets all the points he does. He's an incredible player I know, one of the best, but it has always seemed to me that the goals he scores are kind of weak. Anyone else noticed that? I mean, he doesn't create the opportunities that Havlat does and doesn't forecheck like Alfredsson. He's got a ton of speed tho...but it just seems like he doesn't always put 100% into his game, and I am always seeing Bonk and their other linemate for that night doing all the work.
Yes! Someone who kind of agrees with me. I mentioned this within the last couple of weeks and was chastised for my comments.

I agree that he seems to be a bit of a quiet player. Sometimes I wonder if he was out there but then at the end of the game he has 3 points. Maybe it's because he too often plays with Bonk? Personally, I don't care if he scores "weak" goals because a goal is a goal, regardless.

Alfredsson is the team's leader and as Alfie goes, so goes the rest of the team - except Lalime. Alfie is the most consistent forward on the team, IMO.

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02-10-2004, 12:21 PM
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Hossa dominates most shifts whereas Alfie is good every shift. I think that when Hossa is not dominant, it's noticable and that's why he doesn't seem like he's consistent. But he does give it his all every shift and has more tools than Alfie does(size, speed, puck control, etc.).

What I will say about Hossa is that for a guy who is a sniper, he's not the best on breakaways for some reason, I can't explain it. Guys like him usually bury it 80% of the time but it seems like 20% for Hossa...am I off here?

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02-10-2004, 12:41 PM
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The huge difference for me is that Hossa is a fantastic defensive player and an important penalty killer as well. He's much more valuable in these areas than either Alfie or Havlat at this point. Right now, Hossa is a lot closer to that superstar level then either of those other guys, although I could see the argument Alfie is a more valuable player at this point too. As to Havlat, I'm quite interested to see him as our go-to guy at some point. Maybe both Alfie and Hossa are struggling or hurt (not that that is desirable), but I think Havlat in some ways really benefits from being on our so called third line, because teams simply can't focus on him or else Hossa and Alfie burn him. Nonetheless, all three are first line players at this point, and all three are all-stars most likely. How many teams have three players scoring at or above a point-a-game (Havlat is like 41 points in 42 games...close enough)? Now how many can say those three players always play on different lines at even strength? Ya....that's pretty valuable.

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02-10-2004, 01:02 PM
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Yeah I guess I came off a little strong..he's our #1 backchecker in my opinion. One reason COULD be the fact that he plays with Bonk and usually another lesser known left winger. I just feel that he doesn't always make his presence known like Alfie usually does, and often Havlat. You could be right, maybe he does need a couple more years.

About Havlat...I really do hope he becomes a superstar. He's my favourite Sen right now because he always seems to create exciting and dangerous plays. Remember last year, right before the playoffs Havlat stepped it up and every single game he was their best player. I think he's got the potential to be the best.. only time will tell.

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02-10-2004, 01:08 PM
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What is your definition of #1 Player:

The player that can lift the game on his shoulders and make things happen?
Hossa has the power and the drive to fight to the net and either score, or cause a rebound which can be swept in.

The player that your team rallies behind?
I would say that is a tie between Hossa and Alfie.
Alfie plays hard every shift and the other players feed off that.
He is the definate Power Play quarterback.
Hossa can make an individual play which will put a smile on your face and I am sure it is the same for his team mates. With Hossa, that play could be on offense or defense.

Who is the better leader?
Alfredsson hands down.

It is a matter of perspective and it does remind me a bit of Colorado:
Alfredsson - Sakic type, Hossa - Forsberg type.

I am just happy both of these great players are on OUR team!

Just my two cents.

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02-10-2004, 01:28 PM
  #11
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Hossa

The only bad thing I've noticed about Marian's game is that he misses a lot of easy chances. He may not be the most talented player on the Senators (I believe that honour goes to Havlat), but his size and strength along with skill will probably make him our go-to guy for years to come.

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02-10-2004, 02:07 PM
  #12
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My vote goes to Alfie based on his great leadership skills. Although Hossa is awesome and a hell of a lot better than Alfie was at the same age. I expect he will surpass Alfie in overall value in the next couple of years.

PS It will be interesting to see who the best Sen is in a couple of years when Havlat and Spezza are also both top notch established stars.

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02-10-2004, 03:41 PM
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One thing that I seem to notice is that Hossa isn't playing as good as he's able to and that is something that must be scary for teams across the NHL. I also agree that Alfie's game resembles Sakic's and Hossa's Forsberg although, I think, that he looks like a mini-Jagr. On a side note I always thought that Saku Koivu played like a carbon copy of Forsberg.

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02-10-2004, 04:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by murph_man15
One thing that I seem to notice is that Hossa isn't playing as good as he's able to and that is something that must be scary for teams across the NHL. I also agree that Alfie's game resembles Sakic's and Hossa's Forsberg although, I think, that he looks like a mini-Jagr. On a side note I always thought that Saku Koivu played like a carbon copy of Forsberg.
He is like a Jagr with the heart and drive..but Hossa is in a bit of a slump right now..he hasn't scored for like wat four games? But sometimes u have to expect that in a long season. IMO..this guy is our main offensive threat and quite arguably our best player. Shut him down and you have just shut down the whole line because he makes players around better. ( Look at Shaun Van Allen last year)

I was reading an article and ESPN called him the purest power forward to come out of Europe...and I agree with that sentiment.

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02-10-2004, 05:56 PM
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Don Draper
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just thought this was pretty interesting in comparing the two players
hossas stats
SPLIT GP G A PTS +/- SOG SPCT
In wins 27 18 24 42 19 82 22.0
In losses 19 1 9 10 -14 50 2.0

alfies
SPLIT GP G A PTS +/- SOG SPCT
In wins 28 15 21 36 23 83 18.1
In losses 18 8 9 17 -12 50 16.0

I thought this was pretty interesting. Even in losses, alfie is still a point a game player, where as hossa drops off significantly. His consistancy is shown much more here, but you also see, as Hossa goes, so goes the team. If he is on, look out, cause it doesnt look like we are going to lose


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02-10-2004, 07:34 PM
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To determine who the #1 forward on our team is pretty simple, just look at the player who most consistently plays against the other teams top defensive pairing.

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02-10-2004, 08:18 PM
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The Lehner
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Can the originator of this thread please post this before every Senators game - first period done, Hossa with 2 goals.

Hossa's pretty good.

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02-10-2004, 09:18 PM
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Sure thing haha...you know it seems every time I doubt him he comes up with his best performance of the year. I think that rest REALLY helped him...he is absolutely dominating the blues right now. The rest also helped Lalime a ton it seems.

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02-10-2004, 10:39 PM
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As Dean Brown or one of the guys from Sportsnet announced

"That injury sure did Hossa good"....lol...nice

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02-10-2004, 11:58 PM
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As a Flyers fan, Alfie scares me much more than Hossa.

Especially playing the point on the PP.

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02-11-2004, 12:42 AM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
As a Flyers fan, Alfie scares me much more than Hossa.

Especially playing the point on the PP.
You've said that before and it surprises me a fair bit. I mean, the Flyers player who scares me the most if Keith Primeau becuase he seems to love running the goalie (although some would believe Primeau seriously running Patty Lalime right now would be a god-send).

In all seriousness, I think this is quite telling, although I would expect most people to go the other way. I think the difference in most people's minds is that Alfie is more consistent and more of our leader, whereas Hossa is more capable of "taking over" a game. An opposing team's fan saying Alfie is scarier, goes against that notion entirely.

I mean, when healthy, Alexander Mogilny scares me a lot more than Mats Sundin, but Sundin is the better player and more of a team leader. It's kind of the opposite, but an example of how the scarrier player and the better player are two different things.

That being said, I'd be very interested to know a bit more of a break-down on why you feel this way. I was talking about this with a friend of mine today. It's pretty clear to me that this is Alfie's team, the same way the Avs are Sakic's team even if Forsberg is the better player (health aside) at this point. Anyways, a bit of an elaboration (or any other contribution from an opposing fan) would be quite interesting.

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02-11-2004, 01:08 AM
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One thing to remember is that a lot of fans believe it or not still look at the 'C' and expect to see the best player on a team. It is the case a lot of the times, and I think Alfredsson is more well known to other people than Hossa is right now. Also, Alfy shoots a lot more...Hossa doesn't score as many goals on the PP as last year it seems.

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02-11-2004, 08:27 AM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hossa
You've said that before and it surprises me a fair bit. I mean, the Flyers player who scares me the most if Keith Primeau becuase he seems to love running the goalie (although some would believe Primeau seriously running Patty Lalime right now would be a god-send).

In all seriousness, I think this is quite telling, although I would expect most people to go the other way. I think the difference in most people's minds is that Alfie is more consistent and more of our leader, whereas Hossa is more capable of "taking over" a game. An opposing team's fan saying Alfie is scarier, goes against that notion entirely.

I mean, when healthy, Alexander Mogilny scares me a lot more than Mats Sundin, but Sundin is the better player and more of a team leader. It's kind of the opposite, but an example of how the scarrier player and the better player are two different things.

That being said, I'd be very interested to know a bit more of a break-down on why you feel this way. I was talking about this with a friend of mine today. It's pretty clear to me that this is Alfie's team, the same way the Avs are Sakic's team even if Forsberg is the better player (health aside) at this point. Anyways, a bit of an elaboration (or any other contribution from an opposing fan) would be quite interesting.
The biggest reason I feel that way is that the majority of the goal the Senators have scored against the Flyers over the last two years have been on the PP. At even strength the Flyers have contained the Sens pretty well.

Alfredsson is the one that makes your PP go. Take him off the team and IMO you'll see the Sens drop from the top PP in the league down to the 10-15 range. Having good point men, is the most important aspect of a good PP IMO.

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02-11-2004, 09:26 AM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
The biggest reason I feel that way is that the majority of the goal the Senators have scored against the Flyers over the last two years have been on the PP. At even strength the Flyers have contained the Sens pretty well.

Alfredsson is the one that makes your PP go. Take him off the team and IMO you'll see the Sens drop from the top PP in the league down to the 10-15 range. Having good point men, is the most important aspect of a good PP IMO.
Alfie is always a threat on point but thats weird that you say that he is most dangerous than Hossa since I remember seeing Hoss run a clinic on a play against the FLyers last postseason.

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02-11-2004, 09:35 AM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by south-sentral
Alfie is always a threat on point but thats weird that you say that he is most dangerous than Hossa since I remember seeing Hoss run a clinic on a play against the FLyers last postseason.
NOt so much about alfie scoring from the point, but he's the one that gets the puck into the zone, sets everything up, and keeps the puck moving. He also has a nice hard low one-timer from the point.

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