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Old
04-27-2008, 08:44 PM
  #1
NYR Viper
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Kovalchuk

on the rangers board we were discussing what it would take to get kovalchuk and i think what i have below is a fair proposal....please, any comments would be great, but no flaming if possible...i did try on this proposal:
dubi
sauer
prucha
dawes
1st 08
2nd 08
1st 09

kovalchuk

???

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04-27-2008, 08:54 PM
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The Thrashers would probably want to win some hockey games if they trade Kovalchuk, so I don't think the draft picks are of any interest....especially since we already have 2 1st rounders in the 2008 draft.

To be honest Dubinsky is the only player you have listed who I have the slightest interest in. Dawes and Prucha are 3rd liners, we have plenty of those, and Sauer is not exactly one of your top young D.

If you are serious about getting Kovalchuk, it has to start with Dubinsky, Staal, and another of your top D propects or the Russian you drafted last year.

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04-27-2008, 08:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btn View Post
The Thrashers would probably want to win some hockey games if they trade Kovalchuk, so I don't think the draft picks are of any interest....especially since we already have 2 1st rounders in the 2008 draft.

To be honest Dubinsky is the only player you have listed who I have the slightest interest in. Dawes and Prucha are 3rd liners, we have plenty of those, and Sauer is not exactly one of your top young D.
If you are serious about getting Kovalchuk, it has to start with Dubinsky, Staal, and another of your top D propects or the Russian you drafted last year.
sauer projects as a top 2 defensive defenceman with snarl...he is big and physical and a very good prospect.......

dawes isnt a third line player....he had more ppg than dubinskyand he played some of the year in the ahl and didnt play with jagr....

how about callahan and one of tyutin/girardi?

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04-27-2008, 09:06 PM
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This would be the starting point, maybe not enough:

Staal
Dubinsky or AA
Cherepanov or Sanguetti

3 of those 5, at the very minimum.

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04-27-2008, 09:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btn View Post
This would be the starting point, maybe not enough:

Staal
Dubinsky or AA
Cherepanov or Sanguetti

3 of those 5, at the very minimum.
.....there is no way any team would pay that....you are talking about a #2 defenceman in the nhl right now who is 21.....a player who has the top potential of a 1st line center with size and defensive awareness.....and either a gifted offensive defenceman or a 1st line winger who was the mvp of the WJC...

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04-27-2008, 09:21 PM
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That is what NHL superstars cost. Kovalchuk has 2 more years left on his contract.

You want to take the Thrashers future, fine....give us yours.

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04-27-2008, 09:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
.....there is no way any team would pay that....
Yes there is...

If not, there is no way a team would come close to getting Ilya

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Old
04-27-2008, 09:32 PM
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NYR Viper
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ok...lets try this

dubinsky
sanguinetti
dawes
1st 08
1st 09
2nd 08

three explosive young players, plus three good picks....

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04-27-2008, 09:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Willie For Captain View Post
Yes there is...

If not, there is no way a team would come close to getting Ilya
do you realise what he is asking for......marc staal is going to be a premier defenseman in this league for more than 10 years.....dubinsky is a hard nosed center who scores goals and sets up plays and has great size.....sanguinetti is in the exact mold of brian leetch and grew up idolizing him....many people think that is what he will turn into.......you realise that is a HUGE overpayment for any player not named ovechkin or crosby

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04-27-2008, 09:35 PM
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Close, but still not enough immediate help.

I know you don't care about the Thrashers winning sooner rather than later, but we do.

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04-27-2008, 10:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
do you realise what he is asking for......marc staal is going to be a premier defenseman in this league for more than 10 years.....dubinsky is a hard nosed center who scores goals and sets up plays and has great size.....sanguinetti is in the exact mold of brian leetch and grew up idolizing him....many people think that is what he will turn into.......you realise that is a HUGE overpayment for any player not named ovechkin or crosby
Kovalchuk had more points this season than Dubinsky and Dawes had in their entire NHL careers combined, including this year's playoffs so far. Considering what Ilya brings to the table, I don't think asking for Staal, Dubinsky, + is a huge overpayment.

Also don't expect the Thrashers to trade away their franchise player without some sort of overpayment.

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04-27-2008, 11:05 PM
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Bourret?
Honestly I don't see the Rangers getting a franchise player anytime soon, I don't think they are willing enough to give up alot of there assets. Maybe over valuing there players IMHO

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04-27-2008, 11:51 PM
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I love when people think they can trade 5 10 goal scorers in return for one 50 goal scorer and think it's an even trade.

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Old
04-28-2008, 02:11 AM
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im going to start a bidding war here for Kovalchuk. a few ATL fans said that picks don't really help out so ill try to avoid giving a list of 8 picks plus gravboski.

To Mtl-Kovalchuk (we need more KO players!!!)

To Atl-
Gravboski (atlanta is a tiny team, might as well keep the trend going)
1st pick of 08 (this years draft is deep, good players available at 30th pick )
Ryan McDonagh (our highest rated Defensive prospect)
Chris Higgins (fast as Bleep)

I think that this would be enough, considering we nearly got Hossa for spare parts, dang penguins and their bidding war.

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04-28-2008, 04:41 AM
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Wow if that is the price for Kovalchuk, that is a joke...

Bourdon
1st (10th, so higher than that MTL pick)
Shannon
Pyatt (our 1st is higher, Pyatt is a bit worse than Higgins)

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Old
04-28-2008, 10:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kikizaz View Post
Gravboski (atlanta is a tiny team, might as well keep the trend going)

Mikhail Grabovski is a little bigger, but he's not what this team needs. This team needs to get bigger, not stay the same or get smaller. We need bigger players, and a 5'11" guy just isn't going to cut it. With Valabik slated to make the team next year (I'm all but certain he will), he's going to make most everyone else on the ice (at least everyone else on the Thrashers) look like midgets.

We have speed, and we are going to get younger, but we need big bodies, not shrimp.

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04-28-2008, 10:46 AM
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If Kovalchuk played with Gomez, they'd have to rename the Richard trophy the Kovalchuk trophy.

Ilya's been playing with third line centers for the past two years AND on a completely inept powerplay.

Ilya on the Rangers would be a guaranteed 60-70 goals a year.

NYR needs to give up a lot to get that.

BTW, I really really like Dubinsky.

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04-28-2008, 01:14 PM
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I think this is the best you'll get out of us:

Dubinksky, Prucha/Dawes, Artem Anisimov, Alexei Cherepanov and our 1st in 08

Plus our 1st in 09 if he signs long-term with us.

for

Kovalchuk

Unfortunately, Staal just isn't going anywhere. We're too thin on the blue line as it is. I can't see the Rangers dealing off the future of our defensive corps, even if it is for a guy like Kovalchuk.

I just don't think other than that proposal, we have the assets to pull Kovalchuk away, unless ATL wants to go into rebuilding mode.

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Old
04-30-2008, 11:32 PM
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listen..

Rangers would not give staal or lundqivst in any package. The Only reason ATL would even want to trade kovy is to not let him leave for nothing when his contract expires. ATl would be Smart to ask for dubinsky because that kid is gona be something special. Wont be a scoring like Ilya but he will give you an honest balls out shift every time he touches the ice. It seems like he is in the right place at the right time and that is what good players do. If i were ATL i D ask for Dubi and Tytuin to start because they are getting Two solid YOUNG CHEAP players. Then add a top prospect and a first but thats it. Look at it like the Lindros tarde years ago. Listen some fans want a teams top 5 young players and that just isnt realistic. Kovy is great but dont forget the team that trades for him will have to also add 8 milliln to their cap when he resigns. That isn't an easy task these days. Good teams have a core of youth aqnd with Dubi Toots Little, Kari, enstrom ATL would have that and then when the timing is right they add their free agents down the road but they will not be competitve if they just concentrate around one player. I believe Rick Nash is top 5 in the NHL but it doesn't stop the bluejackets from being in the gutter every year. NO young core. and Some rangers fans want to give nothing to get something great which is also not realistic. PROPOSAL

Dubinsky
Tyutin
Cherepanov
1st in 08
2nd 08 or 09

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05-01-2008, 01:16 AM
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You guys don't get it.

Kovalchuk has 2 years on his contract.

Unless your name is among Crosby, Malkin or Ovechkin, there isn't a player on your roster that's "untouchable" for a guy like Kovalchuk.

None.

And especially not young players who have showed promise and talent (i.e., Staal) but are still very raw.

Keep dreaming if you think a player like "Staal" is untouchable for a guy like Kovalchuk.

Every GM in the league would offer up Staal and a hell of a lot more if Kovalchuk was on the table.

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05-01-2008, 04:17 AM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
but no flaming if possible...i did
That's kinda hard when the Thrashers get bend over by the Rangers in your proposal. You get a hellz no from me. You know exactly what Kovalchuk brings to the table, but don't wanna pay the moon. Kovy is our franchise player and the asking price will be very high! Have you even analyzed Atlanta's needs?

Marc Staal would be my basis of negociations. If you are not prepared to give him up, than you are not getting Ilya Kovalchuk.

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05-01-2008, 10:35 AM
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What are Kovalchuk's thoughts about his future?
Is he planning to stay in Atlanta after his agreement ends?

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05-01-2008, 11:22 AM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Storm View Post
What are Kovalchuk's thoughts about his future?
Is he planning to stay in Atlanta after his agreement ends?
I think his comments at the end of the season were pretty pointed. From an article in the local paper (http://www.ajc.com/thrashers/content...rs_0407.html):

"It's six years here now and nothing really changed," Kovalchuk said on Sunday. "Hopefully we can do some moves this summer."

Last summer, Kovalchuk made one request to Thrashers general manager Don Waddell.

Get me a center.

Waddell's answer was Todd White, but by season's end Kovalchuk was playing with checking-line center Bobby Holik, who likely won't be back next season. And Waddell said late in the year that White is best suited in a defensive role on a second or third line.

Kovalchuk still doesn't have his playmaking center, and maybe that's why now he's staying out of the player personnel department.

"I'm not GM this year; he's right there," said Kovalchuk, pointing to Waddell.

So, I'd say it depends on where the team is at the end of next season. If the team is in the playoffs and on the rise again, I see no reason why he wouldn't stay. But, if the team flounders again, I wouldn't blame him for wanting to go somewhere that he has a chance to win.

This team needs a coach, a top-line center, and two top-four defensemen this summer.

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05-01-2008, 02:52 PM
  #24
jay from jersey
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that's what....

I am trying to tell u guys. Todd White for Kovy come on. Rangers won't give staal becuasse it is not their balls in a ringer. They can just wait til he is a free agent and offer him 9 mill a year and ATL will get Nothing back and loose all that they have invested in. In Kovy's eyes is this team ELITE. On the market he will think wow i can get 9 mill a year to play in a great city NY with a playmaking centert in the prime of both our careers(Gomez). You guys gave up Hossa for a second line maybe in christensen. good 3rd liner in armstrong and a Maybe top line player in Espo. !st round pick low. Now granted those are some good player but in my eyes you guys are preparing for the future. Kovy will not be here when this young team, is ready to peak. Dubinsky cherepanov and toots will be part of the young core and progress with these players. That way you will have them all locked into contracts for realitivly cheap and Cherepanov and espo can very well be budding superstars who knows. That package from the rangers is better then what the thrashers got for hossa. And yes he was a UFA but if espo doesn;t turn out you guys lost hossa and heatley for a second and third liner and a first round pick? Do you really want to make the same mistake with Kovy? Because i can guarentee you when his contract is up he is good as gone. With Dubi toots and cherepanov you know what you are goning to get. Top 6 forward top 4 d man (hard hitter) possible star n cherry and a first.Right not hockey is more of a business then value wise. you try not to lose too much without getting something back.. But im am saying this now so remember it. If he walks for nothing you guys are doomed.

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Old
05-01-2008, 03:10 PM
  #25
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It's funny how in the real world a player like Hossa (who had ZERO years left on his current deal) can bring in a package like Esposito, Armstrong, Christiansen, and some picks but here on HF hockeyviper87 doesn't seem to think that a player with more years left on his deal and who is younger and better than Hossa can't bring in a similar return.

Staal, Dubinsky, and a pick is a starting point for Kovy, IMO. It needs to go further from there.

Trade proposals are stupid and 9/10 the people making them are even dumber.

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