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Pens' 2009-10 Salary Cap/Lineup Discussion (UPDATED: June 13)

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Old
06-15-2009, 01:22 PM
  #276
Greaves
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Also if we can somehow turn Talbot into a permanent top 6 guy that would save us from cap hell. His 1.05M salary will give us the flexibility we need to keep the team together for awhile.

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06-15-2009, 01:23 PM
  #277
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Quote:
Originally Posted by <Mr Jiggyfly> View Post
The Pens aren't going to chase after him if they allow him to hit UFA.

Not too worried about that.

They can't really afford to give him 3m a season.

Shero may have to give him years over dollars to make it work.
Exactly if Fedz wants to be here, he will take 2.25M or less. Besides there are lots of other guys out there who would kill to be on Malkin's wing.

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06-15-2009, 01:25 PM
  #278
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob View Post
What if Guerin is willing to take less of a cap hit but for more guaranteed money on a multi-year deal?

Let's say he goes to Shero with two offers, either 1 year at $3 million (3m cap hit) or 2 years at $4 million. (2m cap hit).

Do you take that second one?

Perhaps an agreement could be made that if Guerin decides to retire at any point, he tells Shero, and Shero waives him to get him off the books. THEN he retires? Or if they fenangle using the LTIR that the Flyers seemed to easily exploit.

I wonder if his hit still counts against the cap if he retires after clearing waivers.
this is the big issue with guerin. i don't think there's any way to get that cap hit off the books -- not retirement, not waivers... the only way to get around it (i think) would be for him to be injured enough to go on LTIR, allowing the pens to go above the ceiling.

it has to be a one-year deal if he's going to come back. maybe if it's dirt cheap... say, guerin doesn't care about the money but doesn't want to move his family again next summer, so he takes 2 years for less than $2mil per. the pens just can't afford to have any dead cap space for 2010-11.

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06-15-2009, 01:31 PM
  #279
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You're forgetting one thing which is that Shero won't sign Guerin to a multiyear deal under any circumstances. He doesn't even give 3 year deals if you're pushing 30 unless your name is Hossa. In my estimation hopefully Guerin will take 1 year/$2.5 million. If he asks for $3m even then it will be a debate for Shero if you ask me. I'm not sure what would be the right thing to do there.

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06-15-2009, 01:32 PM
  #280
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I'm thinking it really depends on how much Guerin will accept. Will he take a 2M per yr deal? If so we are in really good shape.

Then we can re-sign:
Scuderi for 2M / yr (if we want him at that price)
Goligoski for 1M / yr
2nd line LW for 3.5-4M

Our lineup will look like this...

Kunitz 3.725, Crosby 8.7, Guerin 2 = 14.425
UFA 4, Malkin 8.7, Talbot 1.05 = 13.75
Cooke 1.2, Staal 4, TFK 0.725 = 5.925
UFA 0.75, UFA 0.75, Godard 0.75 = 2.25

Gonchar 5, Orpik 3.75 = 8.75
Eaton 2, Letang 0.835 = 2.835
Scuderi 2, Gogo 1 = 3

Fleury 5, UFA 0.75 = 5.75

TOTAL: 56.67M

But I guess this all depends on how little Guerin will take and if he wants 3M, then our 2nd line LW can only get 3M...

We are in good shape.

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06-15-2009, 01:43 PM
  #281
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greaves View Post
I'm thinking it really depends on how much Guerin will accept. Will he take a 2M per yr deal? If so we are in really good shape.

Then we can re-sign:
Scuderi for 2M / yr (if we want him at that price)
Goligoski for 1M / yr
2nd line LW for 3.5-4M

Our lineup will look like this...

Kunitz 3.725, Crosby 8.7, Guerin 2 = 14.425
UFA 4, Malkin 8.7, Talbot 1.05 = 13.75
Cooke 1.2, Staal 4, TFK 0.725 = 5.925
UFA 0.75, UFA 0.75, Godard 0.75 = 2.25

Gonchar 5, Orpik 3.75 = 8.75
Eaton 2, Letang 0.835 = 2.835
Scuderi 2, Gogo 1 = 3

Fleury 5, UFA 0.75 = 5.75

TOTAL: 56.67M

But I guess this all depends on how little Guerin will take and if he wants 3M, then our 2nd line LW can only get 3M...

We are in good shape.
If I were a betting man I'd say someone will go after Scuderi for more than two so I think $2 mil. a year is wishful thinking but it's not impossible. I imagine FedEx will be that LW for $3 million or $5 mil. over 2 years.

It's going to be a little tighter than what you have listed there because you're going to have a 7th defenseman and one more forward on the payroll as well that will be a healthy scratch.

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06-15-2009, 02:16 PM
  #282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderratedBrooks44 View Post
If I were a betting man I'd say someone will go after Scuderi for more than two so I think $2 mil. a year is wishful thinking but it's not impossible. I imagine FedEx will be that LW for $3 million or $5 mil. over 2 years.

It's going to be a little tighter than what you have listed there because you're going to have a 7th defenseman and one more forward on the payroll as well that will be a healthy scratch.
Well if Scuds wants more then 2M and Fedz wants more then 2.25M... then its simple, you let them walk. Ray could consider Feds for 2.5M per year I guess. Anyway, there are lots of suitable replacements.

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06-15-2009, 02:24 PM
  #283
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Billy was telling everyone he wanted to come back at the parade today.

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06-15-2009, 02:40 PM
  #284
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greaves View Post
Well if Scuds wants more then 2M and Fedz wants more then 2.25M... then its simple, you let them walk. Ray could consider Feds for 2.5M per year I guess. Anyway, there are lots of suitable replacements.
Who would you replace him with? I mean he's an average player not saying he's great but I don't remember there being many options out there.

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06-15-2009, 02:54 PM
  #285
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I don't know if you necessarily even replace Scuderi as much as you just use the top-2 pairings more. Lovejoy seems like a good heir to the Scuderi thrown, but Scuderi had a couple rough seasons before he became the stalwart he is today and I think Lovejoy might have a similar learning curve.

There's names out there that will come cheap and, while they won't replace Scuderi, they will help ease the transition a bit. And for cheap. Dipenta, Huskins, Hedican come to mind.

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Old
06-15-2009, 03:13 PM
  #286
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Originally Posted by Bylsmagic View Post
The more I think about it, the more I'd love to see Gionta on Crosby's wing. I barely even notice how small he is half the time, and he's the shortest player in the league.
He's been my #1 target for the offseason for about a month now. Like you said he plays way bigger than he is and is great on the forecheck. And his best seasons came when he played with an up tempo center in Gomez so it would make sense for him to click in our current system and especially with Sid.

If he was willing to come in for less than his current $4m contract I can definitely see him hitting 30+ goals a year here. I don't think it would work out to be honest but he's the top winger that I'll be hoping that we can squeeze under the cap in 2 weeks.

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Old
06-15-2009, 03:46 PM
  #287
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This is how I see it.

We sign:

Goligoski for 750k ( 2+ year deal) No way he makes more than Letang.
Adams for 750k ( 1 year deal)
Johnny Oduya for 2.5-3mil ( 3 year deal)
Steve Sullivan for 2.5mil ( 2 year deal)

I'll figure the rest out when I get home.

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06-15-2009, 04:21 PM
  #288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TravisUlrich View Post
Cooke 1.2 (Market)
Talbot 1.05 (Market, maybe Under)
Orpik 3.75 (Under)
Eaton 2.0 (Over)
I don't agree on all four of them.

Cooke maybe, but spending 1.5 on a guy like him would also be acceptable.
Talbot under!
Orpik = Market
Eaton = Market despite DL-Concerns


And in the end I just want the Pens to sign Kovalev!
He'd be a great fit and maybe he'd take a pay-cut coming back to Pittsburgh and playin in one line with Sid oder Geno...

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06-15-2009, 04:25 PM
  #289
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I"m getting scared we won't be able to find cap room for Letang next summer. I know this is a bridge we can cross when we get there, but it seems almost unlikely to keep both gonchar and letang for 2010/11.

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06-15-2009, 04:35 PM
  #290
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Originally Posted by Ziggyjoe21 View Post
I"m getting scared we won't be able to find cap room for Letang next summer. I know this is a bridge we can cross when we get there, but it seems almost unlikely to keep both gonchar and letang for 2010/11.
If that's the case then it's a no-brainer. A year from now there will be a lot more uncertainty surrounding Gonchar than Letang.

At some point this summer I expect Letang to sign a 3 year, $7.5M extension. I don't think Letang will sign an extension as long as Crosby's or Fleury's. It seems like a reasonable offer for both sides. It's a significant raise for Letang and allows him to become a UFA when he's done the deal. Shero would be wise to let Gonchar play out his existing contract and then re-evaluate the situation a year from now. It's a bit risky, but we're screwed if we sign him to an extension and a couple years down the road he wants to retire.

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06-15-2009, 04:42 PM
  #291
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggyjoe21 View Post
I"m getting scared we won't be able to find cap room for Letang next summer. I know this is a bridge we can cross when we get there, but it seems almost unlikely to keep both gonchar and letang for 2010/11.
he'll be a restricted free agent and barring an incredible 09-10 campaign with something like 50-60 points, i don't think he'll have a ton of leverage.

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06-15-2009, 05:35 PM
  #292
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Next Year Lineup

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/cap-central/team.php?team=PIT

Current Cap Number 46.835-1.4[Dupuis]=45.435

Kunitz-Crosby-TBA
TBA-Malkin-Talbot
Cooke-Staal-Kennedy
Godard-Zigomanis[0.75]-Adams[0.75]
Jeffery[0.51]

Oprik-Gonchar
Letang-Eaton
Lovejoy[0.9]-Goligoski[1.0]
Grant[0.8]

Fleury
Curry[0.5]

45.435+5.210=50.645

How much money will be left to sign 2 forwards to play on the top 2 lines depends on what the cap will be.

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06-15-2009, 05:38 PM
  #293
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Some how I feel they need to keep Feds and Guerin around. I do not think they can afford the a list.

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06-15-2009, 05:49 PM
  #294
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What about trading Kunitz. They can find someone to do what he does for alot less. If I'm not mistaken Brian Burke is a big Kunitz guy from what I can recall.

I think that both Malkin/Crosby need one linemate who is more of a finesse sniper type and the other to be a hardworker type like Talbot or Thomas Holstrom.

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06-15-2009, 05:53 PM
  #295
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FYI, there's a thread about cap room and potential lineups stickied at the top.

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06-15-2009, 06:03 PM
  #296
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggyjoe21 View Post
I"m getting scared we won't be able to find cap room for Letang next summer. I know this is a bridge we can cross when we get there, but it seems almost unlikely to keep both gonchar and letang for 2010/11.
If I'm Shero I get Letang's cap space from Gonchar's.

2009-2010
Gonchar 5M
Letang 0.835M
Total: 5.835M

2010-2011
Gonchar 3.5M
Letang 3M
Total: 6.5M

Give Letang a 2 or 3 year deal. Same thing with Gonchar. Then when Letang is up for his new contract you can allocate 4 or 5M (if he gets to be that good) and Gonchar will be most likely retired at that point.

Give or take half a million.

I.e. contract for Gonchar
Year 1, 5M (age 37)
Year 2, 3M (age 38)
Year 3, 2.5M (age 39)

10.5/3 = 3.5M

And structure Letang's contract as follows:
Year 1, 2M
Year 2, 3M
Year 3, 4M

9/3 = 3M

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06-15-2009, 06:38 PM
  #297
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Who do you see coming to the burgh this offseason?

Whether is be a star winger or a defensemen, what player(s) do you see in a Pens uniform by the start of next season? Also add them into the line system with the current players. Im interested in what you guys think will happen.

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Old
06-15-2009, 06:52 PM
  #298
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheffe View Post
I don't agree on all four of them.

Cooke maybe, but spending 1.5 on a guy like him would also be acceptable.
Talbot under!
Orpik = Market
Eaton = Market despite DL-Concerns


And in the end I just want the Pens to sign Kovalev!
He'd be a great fit and maybe he'd take a pay-cut coming back to Pittsburgh and playin in one line with Sid oder Geno...
I actually think Eaton is around his market value.. if not under. He does all of the small things that go unnoticed but just can't match up against the big guns yet like Scuds can. What he can do, however, is jump into the offensive zone and feel comfortable enough to find the open areas to contribute.

The guy just never gets his rightfully earned credit among this fan base.


edit: I got to watch some of the re-air from the regular season game we had w/ Detroit (Staal hat trick, fedo GWG).. and it completely sold me on keeping Zigomanis around for a few more years. He won some key faceoffs in that game that gave us a chance to win. On the 5 on 3 PP, he beat out Zetterberg and Malkin scored. He also won the faceoff in the closing 30 seconds which inevitably turned into the game tieing goal from Staal.

Ziggy needs to stay here in the burgh.


Last edited by ColePens: 06-15-2009 at 06:58 PM.
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Old
06-15-2009, 07:56 PM
  #299
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seeing how ur right up against the cap i dont see anyone significant, unless staal is moved out but, i cant really see to many teams wanting to take on his contract. He is a third liner

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06-15-2009, 08:04 PM
  #300
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seeing how ur right up against the cap i dont see anyone significant, unless staal is moved out but, i cant really see to many teams wanting to take on his contract. He is a third liner
Every C in the NHL is a 3rd liner on this team.

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