HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > National Hockey League Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
National Hockey League Talk Discuss NHL players, teams, games, and the Stanley Cup Playoffs.

Can Anaheim turn it up and contend?

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-17-2004, 06:50 AM
  #26
MojoJojo
Registered User
 
MojoJojo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 9,351
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Legionnaire
Sure they do. Look at who they play in their remaining games. They still have a bunch of "four point" games left

Dallas-Twice
Nashville-Twice
St Louis-Twice
LA-Three times
Calgary-Once
Edmonton-Once
Minny-Twice
Phoenix-Twice
Since those are the teams competing for the last three spots, they cant all be "four point games", especially since Annaheim isnt competing for one of the last three spots, but the last spot. So remove Calgary from that list, since they are pretty comfortably 13 points ahead of the Ducks. Remove Minny, Edmonton, and Phoenix too, since they are not going to make the playoffs either. If the Ducks think they have a shot at the playoffs they have to knock out of contention two of the following list: Nashville, LA, Dallas, and St Louis.

MojoJojo is offline  
Old
02-17-2004, 07:00 AM
  #27
HughJass*
 
HughJass*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: High Point, NC
Country: United States
Posts: 5,677
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to HughJass* Send a message via Yahoo to HughJass*
Quote:
Originally Posted by guinness
Doubtful, they aren't the same team that they were last year, missing character guys like Oates and Thomas, Prospal isn't playing the way the managment hoped, although Feds is doing alright.
You haven't been paying attention to them the past month. Fedorov, Prospal, and Sykora are heating up a bit. With Leclerc back, and if Ozolinsh comes back 100% (hopefully the Oz from last year and not career Oz) then this team has a chance. March and April always shake up different than what the standings are in April, and in the West there seems to be one team every year that makes a strong push from out of the race into in the race. It should be exciting to watch.

For the record: my money is on Nashville.

HughJass* is offline  
Old
02-17-2004, 10:13 AM
  #28
Spankatola Jamnuts*
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: ...sucka?
Country: United States
Posts: 10,982
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WHurricane16
You haven't been paying attention to them the past month. Fedorov, Prospal, and Sykora are heating up a bit.
More than just a bit:
Fedorov 19 points last 12 games
Prospal 19 points last 14 games
Sykora 16 points last 13 games
Havelid also gets overlooked, he has 10 points in his last 14.

Ducks have their top line and their power play clicking right now. If one of Rucchin, Lupul, or McDonald could catch fire I'd like their chances a lot better.

Spankatola Jamnuts* is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 01:01 AM
  #29
190Octane
Registered User
 
190Octane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Fullerton, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 7,224
vCash: 500
Prospal scores the game winner tonight against the BJ's and Giguere stones Nash point blank twice in the last 3 minutes to seal the victory.

10 points out of a possible 12 in the last 6 games and 8 points out.

If they can get within 4 points going into March, they're right there.

190Octane is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 01:04 AM
  #30
BG43
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,730
vCash: 500
I'd like for the Ducks to turn it up and contend. Giguere and Gerber make a good pair.. and despite his struggles this season.. I still think Giguere is solid and he will be good again. The Ducks have a good enough team.. I'd like to see them do better.

BG43 is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 01:06 AM
  #31
Epsilon
#TeamHolland
 
Epsilon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Florence, SC
Posts: 39,150
vCash: 500
The way the Ducks are playing right now I think they have a legitimate shot at sneaking in as one of the bottom 3 seeds. I think LA's injuries may just be too great to overcome, and they would be the most likely team to lose out to a late Ducks surge.

Epsilon is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 01:12 AM
  #32
Randall Graves*
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Country: United States
Posts: 18,621
vCash: 500
sure they "Can" but only and ONLY if Jiggy continues his fantastic play.

Infact, of our last 4 regulation losses 3 have been to Calgary,a week ago I said no chance in hell,now i'm a little more optimistic but everything has to go right in a season where almost everything has went wrong.

I hope they make it! i'd love to see Ducks/Avs rd 1!

Randall Graves* is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 02:15 AM
  #33
mmbt
Cheeky Monkey
 
mmbt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: California
Country: United States
Posts: 9,383
vCash: 500
I still have to think it's too late. They're finally starting to get some wins now, but at this point they're probably just hoping to build up the chemistry and re-establish their identity for next season.

If they keep playing like they have been lately, they'll probably put some pressure on the bubble teams, but it's unrealistic to expect much more.

mmbt is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 02:28 AM
  #34
incawg
Registered User
 
incawg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Canuckland
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,009
vCash: 500
I think it's too little too late. While not impossible, they've probably dug themselves too much of a hole. The catch 22 is that this run they're on probably won't be enough to get them into the playoffs, but it will screw up their draft position.

incawg is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 12:30 PM
  #35
The Frugal Gourmet
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York, New York
Posts: 2,529
vCash: 500
Too late for Anaheim.

Consider they have to be at least 5 wins better for the rest of the season than at least 2 of: The Blues, The Kings, The Stars, and the Predators. That's a very tall order.

The Frugal Gourmet is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 12:53 PM
  #36
Legionnaire
Kill! Jeff, Kill!!!
 
Legionnaire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: LA-LA Land
Country: United States
Posts: 35,749
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Frugal Gourmet
Too late for Anaheim.

Consider they have to be at least 5 wins better for the rest of the season than at least 2 of: The Blues, The Kings, The Stars, and the Predators. That's a very tall order.
I'm just going to repost this in case you didn't notice.

Dallas-Twice
Nashville-Twice
St Louis-Twice
LA-Three times

If they win these nine games, they will be right in the thick of things. Is it a lot to ask? Sure it is. Impossible? Nah, impossible would have been the Ducks getting by Detroit in the first round last year.

Legionnaire is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 01:12 PM
  #37
A Good Flying Bird*
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Ann Arbor
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,359
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Legionnaire
I'm just going to repost this in case you didn't notice.

Dallas-Twice
Nashville-Twice
St Louis-Twice
LA-Three times

If they win these nine games, they will be right in the thick of things. Is it a lot to ask? Sure it is. Impossible? Nah, impossible would have been the Ducks getting by Detroit in the first round last year.
They've got an awfully tough road, but so far, so good.

Fedorov has been fantastic in the games I've seen.

A Good Flying Bird* is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 02:21 PM
  #38
The Frugal Gourmet
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York, New York
Posts: 2,529
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Legionnaire
I'm just going to repost this in case you didn't notice.

Dallas-Twice
Nashville-Twice
St Louis-Twice
LA-Three times

If they win these nine games, they will be right in the thick of things. Is it a lot to ask? Sure it is. Impossible? Nah, impossible would have been the Ducks getting by Detroit in the first round last year.
Again, that's a freaking tall order. Do you realize what you're asking? The probability of winning all those games is extremely low.

The Frugal Gourmet is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 03:11 PM
  #39
Gibsons Finest
R-E-L-A-X
 
Gibsons Finest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Saskatoon
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,185
vCash: 500
Friday's game vs. Nashville is the biggest game of the season. If they win, the playoffs becomes a big possibility. If they lose, playoffs becomes nearly impossible.

Gibsons Finest is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 03:26 PM
  #40
BruinFan42
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 561
vCash: 500
We all fell in love with the Ducks during the playoffs last year, but with all that went on leading to Game 7 and their wild offseason, everyone was saying that they weren't going to pull a Carolina, but I think deep down everyone knew it was bound to happen for a number of reasons.

1) No one knew who Giguere was until the playoffs, and that was when everyone expected him to be better than anything else. Sure Giguere has been a consistent goalie all his career, but there was no way he was going to have a season the media and fans were hyping him up to have after all the publicity.

2) Losing Kariya, Oates and Thomas and replacing them Prospal and Federov looks good on paper, but you can't bring in two star players and expect the team to mesh and Prospal and Federov to understand the new system and put up points like they were expected to. This also affects Sykora's game in that he lost both his linemates and had to learn to play with two new players.

3) Going into the season with Carney hurt. He's been a horse on the Ducks defense, and without him there, the D had no real idea of what their role had become.

The Ducks have an outside chance at making the playoffs this season, but with Federov and Prospal finally comfortable on the pond, as shown by their current production rate and Giguere playing well on a consistent basis, Havelid picking his game up significantly, the Ducks have the pieces to be playoff-contending team once again next year. They would be wise to hold onto Carney, they know what it's like not having him on the ice.

BruinFan42 is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 03:28 PM
  #41
punchy1
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Kiwiville.
Posts: 2,444
vCash: 500
I don't think so mate. If they win they keep on rolling if not then they have the next several games to get it. They are playing well enough lately and JS looks loads better, if he gets hot he can be the second best in the game and steal loads of wins for you. There have been many who have said that you have too much talent to suck as bad as you have all season and it is starting to show that way now. Is it too late? I don't know, you have 20 games to get 28 points to ensure a playoff spot. Not out of the question. You will win some and lose some. I don't think it is the Preds you will be fighting for the final two spots. I feel it will be the Kings struggling to hold on to 8th with the Blues. Both of those teams are struggling to find wins at this point. If you got hot, I could see you passing both of them.

punchy1 is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 05:28 PM
  #42
PecaFan
Registered User
 
PecaFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Ottawa (Go 'Nucks)
Posts: 8,919
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Legionnaire
I'm just going to repost this in case you didn't notice.

Dallas-Twice
Nashville-Twice
St Louis-Twice
LA-Three times

If they win these nine games, they will be right in the thick of things. Is it a lot to ask? Sure it is. Impossible? Nah, impossible would have been the Ducks getting by Detroit in the first round last year.
And what about the number of times those teams play each other? All those teams will be exchanging guaranteed points numerous times.

Anaheim has won 4 out of 5, and gained what? one point? Again, I point out the big fallacy behind the "we're only 9 points out" thinking. It's a *moving* target. Half the time you win a game, it's just to keep pace, it doesn't get you closer to the playoffs at all. And if you lose one game, you have to win two more just to make up for that one loss to get back to where you would have been.

This is exactly the same as last year's Nashville fans, who got excited when they got within 6 or 8 points.

PecaFan is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 05:36 PM
  #43
PecaFan
Registered User
 
PecaFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Ottawa (Go 'Nucks)
Posts: 8,919
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by punchy1
Is it too late? I don't know, you have 20 games to get 28 points to ensure a playoff spot. Not out of the question.
It's not, but 28 points will almost certainly find them missing the playoffs. The teams ahead of them are all on pace for 90+, so they better plan on 34 points *at least*. Final quarter of 17 and 3, easy as pie, right?

PecaFan is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 05:45 PM
  #44
kenabnrmal
Registered User
 
kenabnrmal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: the beach or rink
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,231
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruinFan42
We all fell in love with the Ducks during the playoffs last year, but with all that went on leading to Game 7 and their wild offseason, everyone was saying that they weren't going to pull a Carolina, but I think deep down everyone knew it was bound to happen for a number of reasons.

1) No one knew who Giguere was until the playoffs, and that was when everyone expected him to be better than anything else. Sure Giguere has been a consistent goalie all his career, but there was no way he was going to have a season the media and fans were hyping him up to have after all the publicity.

2) Losing Kariya, Oates and Thomas and replacing them Prospal and Federov looks good on paper, but you can't bring in two star players and expect the team to mesh and Prospal and Federov to understand the new system and put up points like they were expected to. This also affects Sykora's game in that he lost both his linemates and had to learn to play with two new players.

3) Going into the season with Carney hurt. He's been a horse on the Ducks defense, and without him there, the D had no real idea of what their role had become.

The Ducks have an outside chance at making the playoffs this season, but with Federov and Prospal finally comfortable on the pond, as shown by their current production rate and Giguere playing well on a consistent basis, Havelid picking his game up significantly, the Ducks have the pieces to be playoff-contending team once again next year. They would be wise to hold onto Carney, they know what it's like not having him on the ice.
You make a good attempt, but I think you're off on a few of your points.

1) If no one had heard about Giguere before the playoffs last season, then its their faults...not Jiggy's. He's been one of the better goaltenders in the league for a few seasons going. Ducks fans knew for a while that if he got hot, if he got his confidence going, he'd be extremely hard to beat. He may have been a surprise, but he shouldn't have. Could he have met the expectations fans and media (and the team) had of him going into this season? Yes, and he should have. Its what he got the big contract to do. Expectations were just fine, because he's more than capable of being an elite goaltender. His performance just fell short this season, falling way short of not only his playoff performance of last season, but his work of the previous two seasons. He'll recover, and he'll be fine next year.

2) I still say the Ducks are better off as they are now. You're right, bringing in two key players makes it difficult to maintain the chemisty they built up last season. This did have a considerable amount to do with the Ducks' short-comings this year.

3) Yes and no. Carney without a doubt is the anchor of the d-corps, and him being out hurt severely. However, having Oz out hurt almost as much. The rest of the defense wasn't as rudderless as you suggest. Salei played well. Vishnevski stepped his game up to another level. Simpson and Sauer were fine in their limited roles. The problems on d were simply the two main injuries, and Havelid's step back. The remainder of the defense played relatively fine.

The injury to Leclerc wasn't mentioned, and to me it might have been the most damaging. He provides an element that no one else on the club provides. He fills the power-forward role, and does it in a very underrated fashion. Not having him in the lineup really hurt the team's ability to dominate down low and in the offensive slot as they had in the playoffs last season.

Hell, theres always a chance. They're playing well, so who knows. Maybe they can sneak in. However it appears more likely that they wont. Will those comparing this club to the Hurricanes of the previous season be vindicated then? Not in my eyes. For the most part, while the result may be what they predicted, their reasoning is still faulty and ignorant. Most of the arguments going into the season predicting the Ducks landing out the playoffs were based on these items...

a) The Ducks had a flukey run in the playoffs

- not at all, they were the second best team in the league in the second half. If you didn't think they'd make some noise in the playoffs, you likely weren't paying much attention. They went through some of the best teams the league had to offer and dismantled them.

b)Giguere is a one-year-wonder, and the crackdown on pad sizes will limit his effectiveness

- wrong again, as stated he was good for a few seasons already. The pads crackdown didn't affect him, and his difficulties were entirely mental and mechanical...nothing to do with the pads.

c) Hurricanes and Ducks...both southern US teams who have relatively small followings and who are largely ignored by mass hockey media and fans in the hockey hot-beds

- Because they are both largely ignored, seeing them in the Cup finals surprised many. It was too easy for the lazy ones to equate one with the other, simply because the similarities that existed off the ice. The fact is that the two teams were quite different, moving in different directions. The Ducks were a team on the rise, who just happened to reach success earlier than expected. The Canes were a solid team at the time who got hot.

I don't pretend to know what's gone wrong in Carolina since their Cup finals run. However, I do maintain that the failures of these two organizations to follow up their "surprise" runs with solid regular seasons are stem from different factors. I don't know much about the Canes, but I do know a bit about the Ducks. The changes the Ducks made in the off-season, combined with perhaps Jiggy's new contract, caused the Ducks to take far longer to meld than one would have hoped. Its very difficult to use injuries as any sort of excuse considering the problems the Kings and Avs have had, but losing Carney, Ozolinsh, and Leclerc for most of the season definitely compounded the difficulties that Federov and Prospal had adjusting to their new environments. Now it looks as if the club is beginning to mesh and beginning to play to the level that they're capable. Unlike the Canes, I don't think you'll see a repeat performance next season. This team still has a solid core, it still has top-end talent, and it still has youngsters making upward strides. I think next season will show more of what this club is capable of acheiving, and will establish them among the Western Conference elite.

kenabnrmal is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 05:56 PM
  #45
Gibsons Finest
R-E-L-A-X
 
Gibsons Finest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Saskatoon
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,185
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PecaFan
It's not, but 28 points will almost certainly find them missing the playoffs. The teams ahead of them are all on pace for 90+, so they better plan on 34 points *at least*. Final quarter of 17 and 3, easy as pie, right?
Don't judge by pace. Vinny Prospal was on pace to score 10-15 goals at the 1/2 way point. Now he has 17. St.Louis was once in 5th place, and look what a losing streak got them. Bottom Line: though it's unlikely, if Nashville goes on a bit of a losing streak, even two or so games, that might be enough for Anaheim to beat them out. If Anaheim wins on Friday night, you just might be eating your words eventually.

Gibsons Finest is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 06:23 PM
  #46
Randall Graves*
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Country: United States
Posts: 18,621
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruinFan42
.
1) No one knew who Giguere was until the playoffs, and that was when everyone expected him to be better than anything else. Sure Giguere has been a consistent goalie all his career, but there was no way he was going to have a season the media and fans were hyping him up to have after all the publicity.
If Giguere had been playing in Toronto,Detroit or Colorado people would have been calling him a great up and coming goaltender, every since he arrived in Anaheim he had been a good goaltender, he still is and will get better,I have no doubt Jiggy will one day be an all star.

Quote:
2) Losing Kariya, Oates and Thomas and replacing them Prospal and Federov looks good on paper, but you can't bring in two star players and expect the team to mesh and Prospal and Federov to understand the new system and put up points like they were expected to. This also affects Sykora's game in that he lost both his linemates and had to learn to play with two new players.
While you may be right about Kariya I totally disagree about Oates and Thomas.Oates has fricken 7 points and we have alot of leadership, we'd be worse had we kept Oates and not signed Prospal. As for Thomas he was here for 12 regular season games,that is the single most overrated comment I keep hearing about Thomas being a big difference why the team is worse. He had a magical run here and it had to end that way. I do agree about Sykora though he finally has chemistry w/Fedorov and Vinny.

Quote:
3) Going into the season with Carney hurt. He's been a horse on the Ducks defense, and without him there, the D had no real idea of what their role had become.
I agree, Forcing Salei into Carneys spot and being stuck with Simpson hurt.

Quote:
The Ducks have an outside chance at making the playoffs this season, but with Federov and Prospal finally comfortable on the pond, as shown by their current production rate and Giguere playing well on a consistent basis, Havelid picking his game up significantly, the Ducks have the pieces to be playoff-contending team once again next year. They would be wise to hold onto Carney, they know what it's like not having him on the ice.
The Ducks won't make the playoffs but I enjoy seeing my team win,I don't care if it affects draft position I just want something positive going into next year. If they get within 4 before the end of the month then we can talk about the playoffs but right now the easy answer is no.

Randall Graves* is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 06:27 PM
  #47
Randall Graves*
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Country: United States
Posts: 18,621
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PecaFan
And what about the number of times those teams play each other? All those teams will be exchanging guaranteed points numerous times.

Anaheim has won 4 out of 5, and gained what? one point? Again, I point out the big fallacy behind the "we're only 9 points out" thinking. It's a *moving* target. Half the time you win a game, it's just to keep pace, it doesn't get you closer to the playoffs at all. And if you lose one game, you have to win two more just to make up for that one loss to get back to where you would have been.

This is exactly the same as last year's Nashville fans, who got excited when they got within 6 or 8 points.
We have one with Dallas left this Sunday in Dallas. I prefere to take things 1 at a time the team has won 5 of 6 games but considering the team hasn't won four in a row all season I expect a loss vs Nashville tomorrow night.

Randall Graves* is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 07:30 PM
  #48
PecaFan
Registered User
 
PecaFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Ottawa (Go 'Nucks)
Posts: 8,919
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ducksflytogether
Don't judge by pace. Vinny Prospal was on pace to score 10-15 goals at the 1/2 way point. Now he has 17. St.Louis was once in 5th place, and look what a losing streak got them. Bottom Line: though it's unlikely, if Nashville goes on a bit of a losing streak, even two or so games, that might be enough for Anaheim to beat them out. If Anaheim wins on Friday night, you just might be eating your words eventually.
Surely you understand the difference between an individual pace, and a team pace. First, it's much easier for an individual to go on a hot or cold streak. They're just one person, for a team to go on a hot streak you need *20* guys all performing at peak efficiency.

Secondly, there's a *huge* difference between projecting at the half way mark as compared to the three quarter mark. The closer you get to the end of the season, the more accurate the projections get.

Finally, remember that every game that is played *guarantees* at least two points being handed out in the standings, possibly three. With the way the schedules are created, and teams playing the majority of their games against teams in the same conference, the result is that it's a mathematical certainty that the 8th place team will have a given number of points. Barring a mathmatical proof, we have to rely on repeated trials to tell us what that point is. History has shown that's around the 90 point mark since the OTL point came in. And surprise surprise, that's exactly where everybody is headed for again this year.

PecaFan is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 08:52 PM
  #49
Spankatola Jamnuts*
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: ...sucka?
Country: United States
Posts: 10,982
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PecaFan
Anaheim has won 4 out of 5, and gained what? one point?

5, actually. They were 13 out before the break, and 8 out as of this morning.

Spankatola Jamnuts* is offline  
Old
02-19-2004, 10:35 PM
  #50
Gibsons Finest
R-E-L-A-X
 
Gibsons Finest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Saskatoon
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,185
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PecaFan
Surely you understand the difference between an individual pace, and a team pace. First, it's much easier for an individual to go on a hot or cold streak. They're just one person, for a team to go on a hot streak you need *20* guys all performing at peak efficiency.

Secondly, there's a *huge* difference between projecting at the half way mark as compared to the three quarter mark. The closer you get to the end of the season, the more accurate the projections get.

Finally, remember that every game that is played *guarantees* at least two points being handed out in the standings, possibly three. With the way the schedules are created, and teams playing the majority of their games against teams in the same conference, the result is that it's a mathematical certainty that the 8th place team will have a given number of points. Barring a mathmatical proof, we have to rely on repeated trials to tell us what that point is. History has shown that's around the 90 point mark since the OTL point came in. And surprise surprise, that's exactly where everybody is headed for again this year.
Well, the Ducks have broken out of team pace. They've won 4 out of 5, and the loss was by 1 goal. I think that's just a bit of a hot streak, don't you.

Gibsons Finest is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:00 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.