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Old
06-23-2008, 11:59 PM
  #26
Stoneman89
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Can't speak for Pitkanen, but here's the dirt on Bouwmeester, and it's the best dirt you'll get. A good buddy of mine visits Jay in the winter in Florida and hangs with him here in summers. This is what Jay told him. He will NOT sign long-term in Florida and has NO intention of staying there past his UFA term. Whether he wants to be traded to the Oil or another Canadian team is not known, but he does not, and has not liked the direction the Panthers have been headed the last few years, and great weather in Florida be dammed, he wants out. The Panthers have already tried to sign him to big bucks long-term and kissed his arse, and will continue to do so, but he is adamant about leaving. And this was BEFORE the Jokinen deal went down.

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06-24-2008, 12:08 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Stoneman89 View Post
Can't speak for Pitkanen, but here's the dirt on Bouwmeester, and it's the best dirt you'll get. A good buddy of mine visits Jay in the winter in Florida and hangs with him here in summers. This is what Jay told him. He will NOT sign long-term in Florida and has NO intention of staying there past his UFA term. Whether he wants to be traded to the Oil or another Canadian team is not known, but he does not, and has not liked the direction the Panthers have been headed the last few years, and great weather in Florida be dammed, he wants out. The Panthers have already tried to sign him to big bucks long-term and kissed his arse, and will continue to do so, but he is adamant about leaving. And this was BEFORE the Jokinen deal went down.
Well I can believe you, but I doubt he feels any different about his hometown.

Jaybo is just not the kind of player needed on the Oilers when you have a guy like Pitkanen who is in the same situation,Pitkanen is a mirror image of Bouwmeester and everyone prefers Bouwmeester?

Please explain why everyone has a mad Love-fest with Jay Bouwmeester?

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06-24-2008, 12:11 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by TheLastoftheBest11 View Post
Can you blame JayBo's parents's for caring about their son's life in the NHL, and going as far as saying that they would not welcome the idea of him playing in Edmonton?

Look at what happened to guys like Comrie,Chimera,Whitney and Lupul, do you actually believe Parents would risk having their kids endure that same amount of pressure and scrutiny, that others have recieved playing here?
Wow! Do your homework bud! Comrie was a contract mess. He's hated NOW for wanting too much money and when not getting then demanding a trade. Nothing ever "happend" to Chimera, Whitney (that's the best one, the guy was here for one freaking training camp!), and Lupul. In Lupul's case, he simply didn't play well while here. This is like saying "who would want to play in Ottawa, look at what they did to Daigle, Yashin, Lalime, and Redden". Canadian city....I don't know why Edmonton is the only town that gets this kind of treatment. We've been screwed over twice and the fans don't like it I guess would be the reason. The reaction won't be any different in Toronto if Sundin signs with Montreal at 12:01 AM on July 1st, there for not only signing with the hated rivals but costing the Leafs a player or pick in the process.

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06-24-2008, 12:16 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by TheLastoftheBest11 View Post
Well I can believe you, but I doubt he feels any different about his hometown.

Jaybo is just not the kind of player needed on the Oilers when you have a guy like Pitkanen who is in the same situation,Pitkanen is a mirror image of Bouwmeester and everyone prefers Bouwmeester?

Please explain why everyone has a mad Love-fest with Jay Bouwmeester?
This I agree with. And the mad love in with J-Bo is A) because he's been highly touted since he was 14, and B) because he's very simular to Scott Neidermayer in style of play there for people believe he'll be the winner that Scott was.....although he's only ever made the playoffs once since being drafted.....the WHL draft that is.(2005 with the Chicago Wolves)

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06-24-2008, 08:23 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by TheLastoftheBest11 View Post
Well I can believe you, but I doubt he feels any different about his hometown.

Jaybo is just not the kind of player needed on the Oilers when you have a guy like Pitkanen who is in the same situation,Pitkanen is a mirror image of Bouwmeester and everyone prefers Bouwmeester?

Please explain why everyone has a mad Love-fest with Jay Bouwmeester?
They are not mirror images. Bouwmeester is better (certainly more consistent) defensively and has played all 82 games in 4 out of 5 seasons in the NHL (unlike, Pitkanen who has had all kinds of problems staying heatlthy). Pitkanen gets the edge offensively, but not by a big enough margin that I'd take his overall game over JayBo. True, Bouwmeester has been often called a "disappointment" offensively, but if he can score 10-15G, 35-40PTS a year while logging 30min/game in a shutdown Dman role, I would be more than happy with those scoring numbers.

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06-24-2008, 09:00 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by TheLastoftheBest11 View Post
Well I can believe you, but I doubt he feels any different about his hometown.

Jaybo is just not the kind of player needed on the Oilers when you have a guy like Pitkanen who is in the same situation,Pitkanen is a mirror image of Bouwmeester and everyone prefers Bouwmeester?

Please explain why everyone has a mad Love-fest with Jay Bouwmeester?
Jay Bouwmeester is very different then Pitkanen. Pitkanen has far more offensive creativity and skill. He has the ability to go coast to coast better then anyone since Coffey. His defensive game has come a long way in the past season as well. Bouwmeester is not as good in the offensive zone (though stats may of recent). Jay's number one priority is keeping the puck out of his own net. He is very strong in his own zone, not injury prone and a little harder on the player with the puck but not overly physical.

I like to think of J Bo as a Pronger with out the shot and with only half the mean streak. There really are not obvious comparables for Pitkanen, he's really on his own as far as styles go.

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06-24-2008, 10:17 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by rigger View Post
There's no link, his agent wouldn't let him say that on the record but he told me. That was a few years ago, he may be tired of losing now. He may have matured and might be more willing to take some pressure and become a part of a winning team, if he's playing for the money we don't want him, if he's playing because he wants to win a cup and is ready to take some leadership then i would love him. He's a phenomenal hockey player.

I'm sorry rigger, but other than you being an advid poster on this forum and a dedicated one at that.. your story is just another; I heard from my sisters friend who slept with Jay and got some pillow talk out of him. I also find it hard to take your word for it even if you say you asked him yourself in person. I dont know if you're fabricating this story to make a point or not. Thats why I ask for a link.

If you were Guy, I'd take your word for it because he actually talks to players and prospects through interviews and what not.. while providing a link.

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06-24-2008, 10:59 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Vagabond View Post
I'm sorry rigger, but other than you being an advid poster on this forum and a dedicated one at that.. your story is just another; I heard from my sisters friend who slept with Jay and got some pillow talk out of him. I also find it hard to take your word for it even if you say you asked him yourself in person. I dont know if you're fabricating this story to make a point or not. Thats why I ask for a link.

If you were Guy, I'd take your word for it because he actually talks to players and prospects through interviews and what not.. while providing a link.
I wouldn't be too hard on Rigger. Yes, it's anecdotal and unsupported by on-the-record quotes, but it is consistent with similar rumours we've heard coming out of Florida for at least a year and a half. Anecdotal stories like this are really the ONLY way we'd hear of a player not being happy in his situation while he is in that situation. Unless the player is incredibly stupid, which JBo obviously isn't. Yes, people can make up BS stories and post them, but IMO they are fairly easy to spot. Most of us have pretty decent BS detectors by now.

I watched JBo play in Med.Hat as a junior and got to see a little of his personality from local media interviews. At that age, 16-17, he was a very shy individual. Because of his shyness he was a very awkward speaker, even in normal conversation, and as a result was a terrible interview. I can easily understand his reluctance to play in any hockey-crazed city as teenager, not just Edmonton. Remember he started in the NHL as an 18 year old. The few times that I've seen him interviewed in the last year or so, he's much better in interviews (though still well below the league average, I'd say) so he's obviously, and as expected, matured a lot. I hope that he's ready to handle a situation with the media scrutiny of an Edmonton or Montreal or Toronto. I honestly don't know. It's this reason that I'm not going to knee-jerk reject the rumours that he still doesn't want to come to Edmonton. They may well be true. However, just as Florida was the best situation for him given his personality, I think (hope?) that playing in a place like Edmonton may be the best thing for him to reach the next stage of his development as a hockey player.

As far as Pitkanen vs JBo, I think overall JBo brings a more complete game to the table. I also think JBo will more likely reach his potential as a future Norris candidate than Pitkanen is likely to reach that potential. I base this prediction on the differences in attitude. I know fanbois will say that the rumours of Pitkanen's difficulty at working w/ coaches and teammates are baseless. However, just like JBo and the reports that he wants out of Florida, where there is smoke, there's fire.

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06-24-2008, 11:03 AM
  #34
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If the Oilers can get Boumeester to sign a Phanuef type contract, I would willingly trade Pitkanen, Stoll, plus for him. He would be a very very steady defender, he would b a 40+ point dman and he always plays 80 games. We would be 10 % better the day after the trade was made.

We would simply be a better team. JayBo will also be one of Canada's top 4 dmen at the Olympics supplanting Pronger or Neidemeyer

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06-24-2008, 11:25 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Vagabond View Post
If you were Guy, I'd take your word for it because he actually talks to players and prospects through interviews and what not.. while providing a link.
There are stories that reporters never get OR only get if they refuse to tell...and those are usually the most interesting and useful ones. With good sources, you tend to know whats going on.

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06-24-2008, 12:28 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by SpikefromDusseldorf View Post
If the Oilers can get Boumeester to sign a Phanuef type contract, I would willingly trade Pitkanen, Stoll, plus for him. He would be a very very steady defender, he would b a 40+ point dman and he always plays 80 games. We would be 10 % better the day after the trade was made.

We would simply be a better team. JayBo will also be one of Canada's top 4 dmen at the Olympics supplanting Pronger or Neidemeyer
Me too. I'd be more than willing to give JayBo the kind of money Pitkanen is after (which I would not give Pitkanen, BTW), even if JayBo 's offensive numbers aren't that great. His defensive contributions are worth it alone, and the offense he supplies is not exactly bad either, just below what you would expect from someone with JayBo's level of skill.

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06-24-2008, 03:26 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WHAfanatic View Post
I wouldn't be too hard on Rigger. Yes, it's anecdotal and unsupported by on-the-record quotes, but it is consistent with similar rumours we've heard coming out of Florida for at least a year and a half. Anecdotal stories like this are really the ONLY way we'd hear of a player not being happy in his situation while he is in that situation. Unless the player is incredibly stupid, which JBo obviously isn't. Yes, people can make up BS stories and post them, but IMO they are fairly easy to spot. Most of us have pretty decent BS detectors by now.

I watched JBo play in Med.Hat as a junior and got to see a little of his personality from local media interviews. At that age, 16-17, he was a very shy individual. Because of his shyness he was a very awkward speaker, even in normal conversation, and as a result was a terrible interview. I can easily understand his reluctance to play in any hockey-crazed city as teenager, not just Edmonton. Remember he started in the NHL as an 18 year old. The few times that I've seen him interviewed in the last year or so, he's much better in interviews (though still well below the league average, I'd say) so he's obviously, and as expected, matured a lot. I hope that he's ready to handle a situation with the media scrutiny of an Edmonton or Montreal or Toronto. I honestly don't know. It's this reason that I'm not going to knee-jerk reject the rumours that he still doesn't want to come to Edmonton. They may well be true. However, just as Florida was the best situation for him given his personality, I think (hope?) that playing in a place like Edmonton may be the best thing for him to reach the next stage of his development as a hockey player.

As far as Pitkanen vs JBo, I think overall JBo brings a more complete game to the table. I also think JBo will more likely reach his potential as a future Norris candidate than Pitkanen is likely to reach that potential. I base this prediction on the differences in attitude. I know fanbois will say that the rumours of Pitkanen's difficulty at working w/ coaches and teammates are baseless. However, just like JBo and the reports that he wants out of Florida, where there is smoke, there's fire.

I wasnt hard on rigger at all. Like I mentioned, rigger contributes well to this forum and I enjoy reading his/her posts.

My problem is hearing it from just about every walk of life without backing. If a player doesnt want to play here before he is even offered a contract, you dont think Lowe would know for an actual fact and avoid making a pitch for that player ? You dont think that player would mention that to Lowe before hand ? Pronger was fine accepting his contract and playing here in Edmonton until he had issues with his marraige. Only through hindsite would you have recognized it pre-emptively before the offer was even made. Most players that dont want to play for a certain team will clearly let that certain GM know and there would not be any beating around the bush.. unless of course its just for a short period like a rental player where it wouldnt be a problem anyways. Unless its made public or a link from a reliable source, I will think nothing of it.

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06-24-2008, 08:49 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Vagabond View Post
I wasnt hard on rigger at all. Like I mentioned, rigger contributes well to this forum and I enjoy reading his/her posts.

My problem is hearing it from just about every walk of life without backing. If a player doesnt want to play here before he is even offered a contract, you dont think Lowe would know for an actual fact and avoid making a pitch for that player ? You dont think that player would mention that to Lowe before hand ? Pronger was fine accepting his contract and playing here in Edmonton until he had issues with his marraige. Only through hindsite would you have recognized it pre-emptively before the offer was even made. Most players that dont want to play for a certain team will clearly let that certain GM know and there would not be any beating around the bush.. unless of course its just for a short period like a rental player where it wouldnt be a problem anyways. Unless its made public or a link from a reliable source, I will think nothing of it.

I agree with you to some extent...but I can't accept your take on how players would let GM's know if they didn't want to play in a particular city.

I highly doubt that Peca told Lowe he didn't want to be in Edmonton after he was scheduled for UFA. I don't think Dvorak wanted Lowe to know he wanted to test the market that year....Players will feel REALLY guilty and unprofessional if they handled a situation that way.

Just my 2 cents

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06-24-2008, 09:13 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Vagabond View Post
I wasnt hard on rigger at all. Like I mentioned, rigger contributes well to this forum and I enjoy reading his/her posts.

My problem is hearing it from just about every walk of life without backing. If a player doesnt want to play here before he is even offered a contract, you dont think Lowe would know for an actual fact and avoid making a pitch for that player ? You dont think that player would mention that to Lowe before hand ? Pronger was fine accepting his contract and playing here in Edmonton until he had issues with his marraige. Only through hindsite would you have recognized it pre-emptively before the offer was even made. Most players that dont want to play for a certain team will clearly let that certain GM know and there would not be any beating around the bush.. unless of course its just for a short period like a rental player where it wouldnt be a problem anyways. Unless its made public or a link from a reliable source, I will think nothing of it.

Um... I thought we were talking about JBo. Or at least that was what I was responding about - my point is that the speculation that he wants out of Florida rings true. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if he has reservations of coming to Edmonton given what I saw of his personality as a youngster.

I agree with you that it's frustrating to hear these rumours of players not wanting to come to Edmonton, however, our frustration makes them no less likely to be true.

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06-24-2008, 11:18 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLastoftheBest11 View Post
I agree with you to some extent...but I can't accept your take on how players would let GM's know if they didn't want to play in a particular city.

I highly doubt that Peca told Lowe he didn't want to be in Edmonton after he was scheduled for UFA. I don't think Dvorak wanted Lowe to know he wanted to test the market that year....Players will feel REALLY guilty and unprofessional if they handled a situation that way.

Just my 2 cents
I think you miss understood what I was trying to say.

You dont think that if Lowe was to make a trade for a star player that he wouldnt talk to that star player to see if he'd show interest in the team who is trading for him first before the trade is finalized ? If that player is in the plans long term in Lowe's eyes you dont think Lowe would hold a conversation with that player asking what he thought about playing in Edmonton ?

I'm not talking about rental players because most rental players dont know of where they are heading and are UFA statis the following summer.

Also I wasnt talking about UFA's. That being said, you hear all the time players saying they wanna test free agancy.

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06-24-2008, 11:22 PM
  #41
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Frankly I think Bow has underachieved and will not be worth what it will cost in players to get him and in $ to sign him long term.
He is another guy I would pass on.

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06-24-2008, 11:33 PM
  #42
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This I agree with. And the mad love in with J-Bo is A) because he's been highly touted since he was 14, and B) because he's very simular to Scott Neidermayer in style of play there for people believe he'll be the winner that Scott was.....although he's only ever made the playoffs once since being drafted.....the WHL draft that is.(2005 with the Chicago Wolves)
There really isn't much Boumeester can do about that, and it shouldn't be seen as a fault in his game. It's like saying that players like Anze Kopitar can't perform in the playoffs. If they haven't had the opportunity to play in the playoffs, then you can't really determine if they're "winners" or not. Boumeester could be a future Conn Smythe winner for all we know.

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06-25-2008, 12:22 AM
  #43
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Jbou is from Edmonton so I would love to have a home town player on our team. I would give up Pitkanen in a heartbeat for Jbou but doubt that Florida will do that.

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06-25-2008, 12:37 AM
  #44
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I don't think Bouwmeester is worth that much, especially with petry or another first in there. I don't even think adding schremp in there is worth it. To me it would be:

To edm: Bouwmeester

To fla: stoll, torres, smid/grebeshkov, and a first
Even Florida isn't dumb enough to do that.

Realistically the package for a player like that would be Cogliano + Pitkanen + picks/prospect.

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06-25-2008, 12:46 AM
  #45
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Even Florida isn't dumb enough to do that.

Realistically the package for a player like that would be Cogliano + Pitkanen + picks/prospect.
+1 .. Pitkanen + Cogliano for Boumeester would be a trade fans of both team would hate thus making it a very fair one. Cogliano is great but I think Lowe would make this swap if JayBo agrees to a 5 yr deal.

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06-25-2008, 07:05 PM
  #46
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Heard Around...

With the trade of Olli Jokinen, a person close to Jay Bouwmeester told Newsday that the defenseman wants out of Florida.
HF Post:

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?p...2#post14570672

Actual Article:

http://weblogs.newsday.com/sports/hockey/rangers/blog/

Sorta an aside, saw JBo a month or so ago during the Cup Finals here in EDM. Looked like he had just finished a round of golf with a couple buddies when Staios, Sanderson and Pisani walked in. They chatted a bit and shook hands with one another (Staios and JBo has just come back from the World Championships). Nobody bothered any of them from what I had seen.

The Media's one thing, but I don't think he'd have to worry much about the public as much. He'd probably get it more from his buddies than us.

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06-25-2008, 10:14 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soli View Post
HF Post:

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?p...2#post14570672

Actual Article:

http://weblogs.newsday.com/sports/hockey/rangers/blog/

Sorta an aside, saw JBo a month or so ago during the Cup Finals here in EDM. Looked like he had just finished a round of golf with a couple buddies when Staios, Sanderson and Pisani walked in. They chatted a bit and shook hands with one another (Staios and JBo has just come back from the World Championships). Nobody bothered any of them from what I had seen.

The Media's one thing, but I don't think he'd have to worry much about the public as much. He'd probably get it more from his buddies than us.
I'll tell you what. If Jay-Bo DOES want out, man oh man would it be a dream come true if he came here(and wanted to play here). Defensivly he's a stud, better than Pitkanen(though Pit's D awareness isn't anything to sneeze at), he calm and poised with the puck, and his skill-set would have our coaches licking their lips. Ever wanted a franchise rock on Defence, Jay-Bo is the guy. If he is available, K-Lowe better be on that phone, offering:

Pitkanen + Chorney/Petry + Cogliano + Schremp + Torres.

I have no idea on value, but I'm sure, after the hack of a deal they pulled of at the draft, they'd want something more.....substantial...

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06-25-2008, 10:29 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Oilbleeder View Post
I'll tell you what. If Jay-Bo DOES want out, man oh man would it be a dream come true if he came here(and wanted to play here). Defensivly he's a stud, better than Pitkanen(though Pit's D awareness isn't anything to sneeze at), he calm and poised with the puck, and his skill-set would have our coaches licking their lips. Ever wanted a franchise rock on Defence, Jay-Bo is the guy. If he is available, K-Lowe better be on that phone, offering:

Pitkanen + Chorney/Petry + Cogliano + Schremp + Torres.

I have no idea on value, but I'm sure, after the hack of a deal they pulled of at the draft, they'd want something more.....substantial...
Looking at what FLA got for Olli, I can't imagine JayBo costing as much as you are offering. My offer would be: Pitkanen, one of Staios/Smid/Greene/Grebs, and one of Schremp, MAP, Torres, Stoll, or a draft pick.

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06-25-2008, 10:53 PM
  #49
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Jokinen was just traded for peanuts. Now Jaybo wants out. What if the Oilers could get him and KEEP Pitkanen. World Class D immediately.

I'm not very good at trade proposal's but what about

Stoll, Smid, Cogliano. I'd say that's pretty close to what they got for Olli.

Imagine

Pitkanen Jaybo
Grebs Gilbert
Souray Staios

without a doubt would equal playoffs.

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06-26-2008, 09:34 AM
  #50
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I would try getting JayBo without giving up Pitkanen. That means bye bye Gilbert.

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