I don't care about the "numbers". His overall game tailed of some at the end but there were parts of his game that improved dramatically. I liked his aggressiveness moving forward. He was demanding the puck by the end of the year when he joined the rush. I liked his play around and behind the net. He improved his ability to control forwards with the body more than simply playing with his stick and skating. He was always one of, if not the best skater on the ice and he used that to cover the full ice surfce.
He has a bright future and one that I'm excited to watch going forward. He'll be a good top 4 dman for a long time. He still has work to do but he's shown glimpses. No stats can show what a player looks like in the games. They provide some points of reference and in some places help identify a skill set but don't tell the whole story.
I personally don't want to see AJ on the team next year at all and also I don't want to see overwhelmed John Moore. He has to improve to be in the NHL next year.
You do realize that is not unusual for a rookie defenseman right? He's going to be improving for the next 7 or 8 years. <insert the "... like saying the sun will rise tomorrow" comment here>. No duh he "Has to improve".
Look at me I took the splits and made something meaningful out of it! Yay me.
You do realize that is not unusual for a rookie defenseman right? He's going to be improving for the next 7 or 8 years. <insert the "... like saying the sun will rise tomorrow" comment here>. No duh he "Has to improve".
Look at me I took the splits and made something meaningful out of it! Yay me.
We usually notice only those guys who improve. And never remember those guys that regressed. Luke Schenn anyone? He was treated like the next defensive superstar and last year he was scratched a couple times. Bryan Lee? Cam Barker? Thousands other top-prospects who disappeared after a promising short stint in the NHL? Even Eric Johnson... I hope Moore will be better, but improvement isn't a given thing.
People saying that he was a good NHL d-man should explain me why he's never been used in the top-4 role even when we had only 2 NHL defensemen remaining? Richards, who was fighting for his next season job, was preferring Lebda and AJ on the top-4 and we all know how bad they are. The answer "Richards is an idiot" isn't acceptable cause he was trusted to head the team by 2 different NHL franchises and obviously can evaluate his players.
I get what you're saying about John Moore, I really do. However, let's compare him to another rookie offensive defenseman, Mike Green, of the Washington Capitals:
Through his first 92 games in the league, Green posted 3 goals, 12 assists, and a -18 rating. This was on a team with Alexander Ovechkin, who finished those two seasons with 70 points, each time. Their goal differential? -69, and -51, overall.
Now, John Moore and the Jackets, this year:
67 games, 2 goals, 7 pts, a -23 rating, on a team that finished with 65 points and a -60 goal differential.
Now, I'm not saying he'll turn out like Mike Green did - that would be placing unfair expectations upon him. However, for a guy who was thrust into a role that he likely wasn't ready for - much as Green was as a rookie - how big were your expectations for him this season?
I agree with the sentiments above. John Moore should be a long-term, top-4 defenseman, who spends time on the powerplay unit and averages around 40-50 points per year. A very serviceable player, if you ask me. And, if you look back at my posts, I will also admit to being very skeptical of Moore's progress at the beginning of the season. I truly think we'll see some development in his game, as early as next year.
I get what you're saying about John Moore, I really do. However, let's compare him to another rookie offensive defenseman, Mike Green, of the Washington Capitals:
Through his first 92 games in the league, Green posted 3 goals, 12 assists, and a -18 rating. This was on a team with Alexander Ovechkin, who finished those two seasons with 70 points, each time. Their goal differential? -69, and -51, overall.
Now, John Moore and the Jackets, this year:
67 games, 2 goals, 7 pts, a -23 rating, on a team that finished with 65 points and a -60 goal differential.
Now, I'm not saying he'll turn out like Mike Green did - that would be placing unfair expectations upon him. However, for a guy who was thrust into a role that he likely wasn't ready for - much as Green was as a rookie - how big were your expectations for him this season?
I agree with the sentiments above. John Moore should be a long-term, top-4 defenseman, who spends time on the powerplay unit and averages around 40-50 points per year. A very serviceable player, if you ask me. And, if you look back at my posts, I will also admit to being very skeptical of Moore's progress at the beginning of the season. I truly think we'll see some development in his game, as early as next year.
I hope you're right. As I see the situation with Moore:
if he plays like at the beginning of the year I'm OK with having him as a 6-7 guy.
if he plays like at the end of the year - he has to be in the AHL.
if he improves as a young guys capable of I could see him as a bottom pairing guy who can fill the hole on top-4 in case of injury.
I still remember the phrase about Zherdev - he's got tools, but he needs a tool box. Z has never found that box, here's the hope Moore can get it as far as next fall. Looks like I've got some support to my view from Portzline who also mentioned that Moore wasn't as good at the end of the year as he was in the first half:
Quote:
Although he appeared to tire down the stretch, Moore used his skating and passing ability to get the puck quickly out of danger.
Anyone care to give me an update on how Savard and Goloubef are progressing in the minors? Columbus is rumoured to be one of the frontrunners in the Schneider sweepstakes this summer so I'm trying to get a better sense of your prospect pool. Thanks in advance!
Anyone care to give me an update on how Savard and Goloubef are progressing in the minors? Columbus is rumoured to be one of the frontrunners in the Schneider sweepstakes this summer so I'm trying to get a better sense of your prospect pool. Thanks in advance!
Savard, weirdly. Was OK in Springfield. But was very good in the NHL. Goloubef bounced back nicely after a bad rookie year.
I hope you're right. As I see the situation with Moore:
if he plays like at the beginning of the year I'm OK with having him as a 6-7 guy.
if he plays like at the end of the year - he has to be in the AHL.
if he improves as a young guys capable of I could see him as a bottom pairing guy who can fill the hole on top-4 in case of injury.
I still remember the phrase about Zherdev - he's got tools, but he needs a tool box. Z has never found that box, here's the hope Moore can get it as far as next fall. Looks like I've got some support to my view from Portzline who also mentioned that Moore wasn't as good at the end of the year as he was in the first half:
.
I agree. If Moore struggles out of the gate, we can't have an obligation to keep him in a struggling situation. So, that means adding something this franchise hasn't had much of since it's inception - depth - to allow him to further hone his skills at a more suitable level.
We need to look for progress, not success, with our young players.
Glad to hear most of you are pleased with his play. Seems like his strengths are still his strengths: Great skater, great vision, great passer, good on gap control and stick work, and still working on becoming more physical in the corners. Hope he keeps on developing well for you guys.
Here's a blurb from Porty's column this morning regarding mathieu Corbeil
"The fourth-round pick (No. 102 overall) won the Jacques Plante Trophy as the top goaltender in the Quebec Major Junior Hockey League. He was 37-10-0-1 with a league-best 2.38 goals-against average and .911 save percentage, and he led the league with six shutouts."
Apparently Jackets aren't sure they are going to sign him. Shouldn't this be a no-brainer? or maybe because of all the excellent goalie depth in the organization they feel they can pass?
Here's a blurb from Porty's column this morning regarding mathieu Corbeil
"The fourth-round pick (No. 102 overall) won the Jacques Plante Trophy as the top goaltender in the Quebec Major Junior Hockey League. He was 37-10-0-1 with a league-best 2.38 goals-against average and .911 save percentage, and he led the league with six shutouts."
Apparently Jackets aren't sure they are going to sign him. Shouldn't this be a no-brainer? or maybe because of all the excellent goalie depth in the organization they feel they can pass?
Here's a blurb from Porty's column this morning regarding mathieu Corbeil
"The fourth-round pick (No. 102 overall) won the Jacques Plante Trophy as the top goaltender in the Quebec Major Junior Hockey League. He was 37-10-0-1 with a league-best 2.38 goals-against average and .911 save percentage, and he led the league with six shutouts."
Apparently Jackets aren't sure they are going to sign him. Shouldn't this be a no-brainer? or maybe because of all the excellent goalie depth in the organization they feel they can pass?
He plays on perhaps the best junior team over the past decade or so. The Sea Dogs are ridiculous, and they haven't lost a game yet in the playoffs, but it's not because of him. They almost could have had anyone in net. Take a look at his numbers before coming to Saint John - they were awful in Halifax.
I think he will get signed based on his size and physical attributes. He has some potential, sure, but he's got a ways to go.
Also, he was an overager this year, so those numbers - at least - had to be expected on that team.
He plays on perhaps the best junior team over the past decade or so. The Sea Dogs are ridiculous, and they haven't lost a game yet in the playoffs, but it's not because of him. They almost could have had anyone in net. Take a look at his numbers before coming to Saint John - they were awful in Halifax.
I think he will get signed based on his size and physical attributes. He has some potential, sure, but he's got a ways to go.
Also, he was an overager this year, so those numbers - at least - had to be expected on that team.
While I agree his numbers with St. John should be taken with a grain of salt, he was playing for a terrible Halifax team before he got traded. They only really turned the corner after he was gone.
He should get a contract on the basis of us having zero depth. Plus he's at least got size and athletic ability. And to be frank, if you're gonna take him just a few picks ahead of Aittokallio, you sure as **** make sure he doesn't pan out before you cut him loose
Here's a blurb from Porty's column this morning regarding mathieu Corbeil
"The fourth-round pick (No. 102 overall) won the Jacques Plante Trophy as the top goaltender in the Quebec Major Junior Hockey League. He was 37-10-0-1 with a league-best 2.38 goals-against average and .911 save percentage, and he led the league with six shutouts."
Apparently Jackets aren't sure they are going to sign him. Shouldn't this be a no-brainer? or maybe because of all the excellent goalie depth in the organization they feel they can pass?
I've been yelling for this team to start a concentrated effort to draft at least one tender every year or every other year and really start a developmental effort for years now. Yes, take the junior stats with some trepidation, but seriously considering not signing one of your organizational bright spots at a critical position is not good asset management.
It should be a no brainer. Signing him doesn't mean you have to immediately throw him to the fire in the NHL or even the AHL.
I'll reiterate that this team's top minor league affiliate had to rely on a 39 year old last season in the net, nevermind the reasons, thats pathetic.
He plays on perhaps the best junior team over the past decade or so. The Sea Dogs are ridiculous, and they haven't lost a game yet in the playoffs, but it's not because of him. They almost could have had anyone in net. Take a look at his numbers before coming to Saint John - they were awful in Halifax.
I think he will get signed based on his size and physical attributes. He has some potential, sure, but he's got a ways to go.
Also, he was an overager this year, so those numbers - at least - had to be expected on that team.
I agree. Jacob DeSerres couldn't even hold down a job in the Western Hockey League - Philadelphia drafted him in the third round a few years back, and he had regressed so badly that nobody even wanted him anymore.
Then, as a CHL "free agent", he was free to play anywhere - Saint John won the Memorial Cup with him last year.
Don't get too into Corbeil-Theriault guys ... I think if he gets a contract, it's less than a no-brainer, as he could really flop in the AHL next year.
Corbeil's Sea Dogs play Chicoutimi Sags (CBJ draft pick Lukas Sedlak) next. The Sags' goalie is Christopher Gibson, who played for the Finns in the U20. He's been stellar lately so it will be interesting to see Corbeil go up against a legit NHL prospect goalie.
One thing I like about Corbeil is that he seems really committed to off-ice fitness unlike Mason. Corbeil came in 2nd in the VO2 Max test at the 2010 combine. He seems like the type of prospect Ian Clark can work with. The question is if he has the natural ability.
I hope both Corbeil and Hunwick get invited to camp. There's a full foot difference in their heights.
I agree. Jacob DeSerres couldn't even hold down a job in the Western Hockey League - Philadelphia drafted him in the third round a few years back, and he had regressed so badly that nobody even wanted him anymore.
Then, as a CHL "free agent", he was free to play anywhere - Saint John won the Memorial Cup with him last year.
Don't get too into Corbeil-Theriault guys ... I think if he gets a contract, it's less than a no-brainer, as he could really flop in the AHL next year.
I would see him signed and playing in the ECHL, not the AHL. York will be one of the AHL goalies and depending on how the CBJ feel about his game he'll either be the workhorse or split time with another potential NHL goalie - say Dekanich? (I wouldn't mind a 2 way on him to see if injuries were a fluke and whether he can actually play)
CBJ needs to sign 3 goaltenders (or trade) this off season to stock the NHL and AHL. Corbiel can play in the ECHL and continue to learn. Wouldn't cost the CBJ much to hope he develops.
He plays on perhaps the best junior team over the past decade or so. The Sea Dogs are ridiculous, and they haven't lost a game yet in the playoffs, but it's not because of him. They almost could have had anyone in net. Take a look at his numbers before coming to Saint John - they were awful in Halifax.
I think he will get signed based on his size and physical attributes. He has some potential, sure, but he's got a ways to go.
Also, he was an overager this year, so those numbers - at least - had to be expected on that team.
While I don't purport to know how he played having never seen him, it is in my opinion, a bit ridiculous to not give him any credit.
That's the reverse of saying if Mason had a better defense he would have won the Vezina this year.
And for all the examples of guys who looked good in juniors and tanked, I'm guessing there are some who did ok?
Because the Jackets have no depth at goalie (or at any other position except maybe D) I still think you've got to take a flyer on him. if it doesn't work, so be it but geez, beggars can't be choosers.
Because the Jackets have no depth at goalie (or at any other position except maybe D) I still think you've got to take a flyer on him. if it doesn't work, so be it but geez, beggars can't be choosers.
The argument is that there are only so many goalies that can be developed at a time at the pro level. Does Corbeil have the potential to develop if given playing time in the ECHL/AHL and is he worth the goalie coach's time? Or, would the Jackets be better off signing a free agent, or Paul Dainton or Mike Clemente if they have more potential?
The Jackets do have some depth. Allen York should be in the AHL next season. Anton Forsberg will be playing in Sweden next season for Modo as a backup. Not sure if the Jackets would rather he come over to NA and play in the AHL or if he could since he's signed with Modo through 2013. There's just no goalie ready to step up to the NHL and that's not going to change by signing Corbeil.
I would see him signed and playing in the ECHL, not the AHL. York will be one of the AHL goalies and depending on how the CBJ feel about his game he'll either be the workhorse or split time with another potential NHL goalie - say Dekanich? (I wouldn't mind a 2 way on him to see if injuries were a fluke and whether he can actually play)
CBJ needs to sign 3 goaltenders (or trade) this off season to stock the NHL and AHL. Corbiel can play in the ECHL and continue to learn. Wouldn't cost the CBJ much to hope he develops.
