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Jani Rita's 6:01 of fame

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Old
02-19-2004, 01:01 PM
  #51
J.Money
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgbone
Not a problem (see I can admit when I'm wrong).
It's too bad you don't realize it more often then...

This year's a write off for the Oilers, may as well see who can be a player and who can't be.

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02-19-2004, 01:16 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by dawgbone
But they didn't get hurt, so it's irrelevant.
I don't agree with that logic. If the result and consequence doesn't occur, that means that risk being taken in that circumstance is irrelevant? It's like a child playing on a busy road... he didn't get hurt that one time so the risk involved in that act is irrelevant... I know that example is a little extreme but it does follow with the premise.

You just don't put your players into a situation where they can get hurt. You don't put your dmen at near 30 minutes back to back... you don't play 3 lines in a 5-0 blowout especially at the 6-7 minute mark. You don't keep your #1 goaltender in a game where he is being blown out by 6 goals... You do this to protect the players.

Personally, IMO, the risk is just as important as the consequence.

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Old
02-19-2004, 01:25 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by momentai
I don't agree with that logic. If the result and consequence doesn't occur, that means that risk being taken in that circumstance is irrelevant? It's like a child playing on a busy road... he didn't get hurt that one time so the risk involved in that act is irrelevant... I know that example is a little extreme but it does follow with the premise.

You just don't put your players into a situation where they can get hurt. You don't put your dmen at near 30 minutes back to back... you don't play 3 lines in a 5-0 blowout especially at the 6-7 minute mark. You don't keep your #1 goaltender in a game where he is being blown out by 6 goals... You do this to protect the players.

Personally, IMO, the risk is just as important as the consequence.
If we really want to bend this and warp it another way, how about this:

You take a risk that 2 guys who have sat on the bench cold, is there not the risk that some of the very good players on the Avs will exploit them? 2 quick goals can really change an outcome of a game.

What is putting Rita and Bishai out for the last few minutes of the game going to do? Talk about risk injury, these guys have been sitting for 20+ minutes and you are going to throw them out on the ice against an angry group of players who are getting their butts kicked? And really, what is Rita going to be able to show you after sitting for 20 minutes, other than the fact his legs are stiff?

If this is Columbus, Atlanta, Minnesote (heck any team outside of Detroit or Colorado) I agree... but when you have these guys on the ropes, you better damn sure make certain you finish them off, and don't give them a sniff. They weren't getting anything done against the first 3 lines, so you make sure you keep it that way.

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Old
02-19-2004, 01:35 PM
  #54
momentai
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgbone
If we really want to bend this and warp it another way, how about this:

You take a risk that 2 guys who have sat on the bench cold, is there not the risk that some of the very good players on the Avs will exploit them? 2 quick goals can really change an outcome of a game.

What is putting Rita and Bishai out for the last few minutes of the game going to do? Talk about risk injury, these guys have been sitting for 20+ minutes and you are going to throw them out on the ice against an angry group of players who are getting their butts kicked? And really, what is Rita going to be able to show you after sitting for 20 minutes, other than the fact his legs are stiff?

If this is Columbus, Atlanta, Minnesote (heck any team outside of Detroit or Colorado) I agree... but when you have these guys on the ropes, you better damn sure make certain you finish them off, and don't give them a sniff. They weren't getting anything done against the first 3 lines, so you make sure you keep it that way.
You sure are reaching for some hypothetical situations are we now? Are you really advocating the possibility of the Avs scoring 5 goals in 5 minutes? As "possible" as that may be, what are the chances that occurs. 2 goals may have a great affect on a game in normal circumstances. However, I'd hazard to say the chances are not great that a team comes back from a 5-0 deficit in the last 5 minutes. You're more than welcome to prove me wrong and find a recent team that has done it though.

If the Rita/Bishai line comes out onto the ice and gets scored on. What exactly is wrong in this situation. MacT sends out the Smyth/Pisani/Horcoff line that has neutralized any Av threat that night?

Who exactly was angry? The Avalanche? To me, it looked like they were more listless than angry. I didn't expect Tony Granato to start letting the players vent their frustrations in a brawl and I follow the Avalanche quite a bit mind you.

I don't get it. Because 3 lines have been working all night leading to a 5-0 lead... You'd take risking a players' safety and well being in order to get 2 pts in a situation where the game is well in hand. There must not be a lot of confidence in the players on the ice. Maybe it's just me. But risking a player like that in a circumstance where it is not visibly warranted doesn't seem intelligent to me. But then again, maybe it's just me.

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Old
02-19-2004, 01:52 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by momentai
But then again, maybe it's just me.
No, it's me too.

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Old
02-19-2004, 02:01 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by momentai
You sure are reaching for some hypothetical situations are we now? Are you really advocating the possibility of the Avs scoring 5 goals in 5 minutes? As "possible" as that may be, what are the chances that occurs. 2 goals may have a great affect on a game in normal circumstances. However, I'd hazard to say the chances are not great that a team comes back from a 5-0 deficit in the last 5 minutes. You're more than welcome to prove me wrong and find a recent team that has done it though.
Not reaching for anything, but I was bringing up the point that while there was the possibility for injury, there was also the possibility that the Avs could start scoring. 5-1 isn't as impressive as 5-0, but it feels better than 5-2 or 5-3. The Oilers haven't done this in ages... start strong and not let up. there have been other times where a team gets 2 late goals and it does deflate you. Sure you win in the end, but it sucks when you get outplayed in stretches and it costs you.

Quote:
If the Rita/Bishai line comes out onto the ice and gets scored on. What exactly is wrong in this situation. MacT sends out the Smyth/Pisani/Horcoff line that has neutralized any Av threat that night?
Possibly, but you've also taken away the best chance for the Oilers to get the ultimate team prize... a shutout win against a high powered team without relying much on your goaltender. Is risk of injury vs team unification.

Quote:
Who exactly was angry? The Avalanche? To me, it looked like they were more listless than angry. I didn't expect Tony Granato to start letting the players vent their frustrations in a brawl and I follow the Avalanche quite a bit mind you.
Then obviously the risk for injury is downgraded a bit isn't it? Peter Worrell sure got a lot of ice time in the 3rd period, and he isn't really known as a guy who likes to be embarrased.

Quote:
I don't get it. Because 3 lines have been working all night leading to a 5-0 lead... You'd take risking a players' safety and well being in order to get 2 pts in a situation where the game is well in hand. There must not be a lot of confidence in the players on the ice. Maybe it's just me. But risking a player like that in a circumstance where it is not visibly warranted doesn't seem intelligent to me. But then again, maybe it's just me.
If the Oilers are completely eliminated from the playoffs, or they are 10 points safely in, it might just be about 1 game. But it isn't. You need your key guys to build off this win. This team continues to hang onto a thread, and as long as you are holding that thread you need to try and find ways to get a hold of something more substantial. Playing Rita more in the 3rd period and sitting the guys who got you that 5-0 lead doesn't really promote that. I mean guy out on the ice yesterday minus Moreau has been benched at some point in this season and crticized. And yesterday each one of them came through. While the risk for injury is there, sometimes you need to risk trying and make the team a unit.

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Old
02-19-2004, 02:15 PM
  #57
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Just to add...

If it was Smyth-Pisani-Horcoff injured instead of York-Torres-Dvorak, I'd probably be more inclined to agree with you because YTD has been a marvel of consistency and our best line.

But all of these guys have struggled and it's more of a confidence thing than anything else.

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Old
02-19-2004, 02:40 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgbone
Just to add...

If it was Smyth-Pisani-Horcoff injured instead of York-Torres-Dvorak, I'd probably be more inclined to agree with you because YTD has been a marvel of consistency and our best line.

But all of these guys have struggled and it's more of a confidence thing than anything else.
But by your logic, if you leave them out there and they get scored against, it will deflate them even more than if it happened with Rita and Bishai out there. I just think that was Rita's chance to go out and play his game. There would have been a lot less pressure on him, especially because he wouldn't have to be such a two-way player as the Avs let up in the 3rd. Giving regular shifts instead of top-heavy line changes will not hurt the confidence of your team. Smyth, Pisani, Horcoff.. they had all done their part and did not need the meandering 3rd period to bulk up their confidence. Periods 1 and 2 did an admirable job of that.
Again, we can arge all day and I have no problem with it. But you aren't going to change my mind and I'm quite certain I won't change your's.
Kills the work day though.

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Old
02-19-2004, 03:05 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle
But by your logic, if you leave them out there and they get scored against, it will deflate them even more than if it happened with Rita and Bishai out there. I just think that was Rita's chance to go out and play his game. There would have been a lot less pressure on him, especially because he wouldn't have to be such a two-way player as the Avs let up in the 3rd. Giving regular shifts instead of top-heavy line changes will not hurt the confidence of your team. Smyth, Pisani, Horcoff.. they had all done their part and did not need the meandering 3rd period to bulk up their confidence. Periods 1 and 2 did an admirable job of that.
Again, we can arge all day and I have no problem with it. But you aren't going to change my mind and I'm quite certain I won't change your's.
Kills the work day though.
lol... true enough.

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Old
02-19-2004, 04:36 PM
  #60
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Worrel was getting ice

because the game was out of hand.

and why all the menstruation jokes? BTW, last time I knew about a 14 year old girl "on the rag" as you so eloquently put it, it was because I was 15 years old and dating her

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Old
02-19-2004, 04:44 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matts
Worrell was getting ice because the game was out of hand.
Really? I wouldn't have guessed... but how exactly does that counter my point about the fact that he was on the ice.

Quote:
and why all the menstruation jokes? BTW, last time I knew about a 14 year old girl "on the rag" as you so eloquently put it, it was because I was 15 years old and dating her
Because you sound like my frigging sister, crying and whining about everything that doesn't conform specifically to your day by day plan.

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02-19-2004, 04:56 PM
  #62
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Worrel got icetime becauseit was a blowout

Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgbone
Really? I wouldn't have guessed... but how exactly does that counter my point about the fact that he was on the ice.



Because you sound like my frigging sister, crying and whining about everything that doesn't conform specifically to your day by day plan.

so should have some Oilers like Bisahi and Rita.

yeah it's becuase you have a sister or at least I hope. I looked up your age because I was hoping you were 16 years oldor something. at least that would explain some things

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Old
02-19-2004, 05:49 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matts
so should have some Oilers like Bisahi and Rita.

yeah it's becuase you have a sister or at least I hope. I looked up your age because I was hoping you were 16 years oldor something. at least that would explain some things
This coming from a guy who can't write an article without tossing in insults on every line unless talking about his daddy...

and I'm 16?

Thanks.

And maybe Rita should have done something in his first 4 shifts aside from lose every battle for the puck and being the slowest player on the ice for a possible 3 on 2 break for the Oilers. He has to give the Oilers a reason to put him out on the ice, and he hasn't done that yet.

This doesn't mean scoring a goal, or creating an offensive chance... hell winning a battle for a few pucks here and there would suffice, and that he can do in 3 or 4 shifts.

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