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Official Free Agent Frenzy Thread (Deals from other teams)

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Old
06-29-2008, 10:45 PM
  #251
Cyrrus147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoHabsGo247 View Post
Hossa anyone?

Sykora isn't exactly a horrible player either, Malone was well surrounded thats for damn sure. Tanguay had to try and carry an entire 2nd line to himself the majority of this season.
lol yea you're right I forgot that guy. I hope that I will remember him more often July 1st

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06-29-2008, 10:48 PM
  #252
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Originally Posted by nittany View Post
What facts? In this years playoffs Malone was the far superior player and has improved recently while Tanguay's stats are getting worse.

Tanguay was a no show in the playoffs for Calgary this year.

And one more thing Tanguay is not an ELITE player! Let's drop this right now. He's an above average offensive player. Not elite.
Ok fair enough, but Malone is no great shakes. Your insistence Tanguay is inferior would be a good talking point but as I recall from your history on hfboards, you just love to spew negative arguments that expose Hab weaknesses. I've never understood the reason for pointing fingers in reactionary fervour instead of looking at the situation and analyzing it with a clear head. Sure, we are not a perfect team but to say Malone is better is silly.

Can you imagine Tanguay's #'s on the Penguins? And despite his soft label, he'd produce in the playoffs too. Look what the over-focusing teams do on Malkin and Crosby did for Malone and to a greater extent, Mr. "Disappointment" Marian Hossa, who couldn't miss in the playoffs. Just cause of that, someone will give Hossa 5-year (or more) deal at 7-8 million. I sure hope it isn't us. Almost every contract ever signed to a guy not considered an elite superstar (and I don't consider Hossa one of the league's top 10 players) has been regretted and desperately moved off the books to another team. Good drafting always kicks the **** out of free agent bonanzas.

And even sure bets like Jagr turned out to be failures. When you hand out cash like water, you run that risk. So I guess signing Sundin ain't a sure thing. But at least he'll be our big singing and not one of 3 or 4 big signings designed to make us loaded for a cup now but in cap hell come tomorrow. Luckily for us, we're already loaded with depth to make it feasible to target big ticket items. And no it's not arrogance, it's fact. We're set for the future which is more than I can say for other franchises. THe Habs proved it in 07-08. It's why I think Buffalo will rebound next year. Never overlooked teams on the rise. Out West it's harder but one of Phoenix, Chicago, Columbus or Edmonton could really break through next season even without FA signings.

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Old
06-29-2008, 10:50 PM
  #253
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Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
For the fourth time... myth.... read my later posts dispelling this.
I might be slow but from that post "The converse is true - if the amout paid was less than the averaged cap hit, they get a cap credit back against the buyout." isn't it a front loading advantage?

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Originally Posted by nittany View Post
How many teams do you think would seriously be interested in Tanguay at 5.25 mill?
29, if they could afford it.

Quote:
Compare that to how many teams would have been interested in Malone.

The fact that Tampa had to trade for his rights speaks to that.
The fact that you forgot Tanguay's NTC which means he was choosing the team he was going to speaks to... something I won say to avoid been warned...


Last edited by Ra: 06-29-2008 at 10:57 PM.
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Old
06-29-2008, 11:10 PM
  #254
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Ridiculous Malone contract!!

7 years 31.5 million paying him 8 and 7 million in the first two years , Overpaid much?
http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=242037&l...=topStory_main

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06-29-2008, 11:13 PM
  #255
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The Habs acquired Sundins rights from the Leafs too!

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Old
06-29-2008, 11:13 PM
  #256
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Originally Posted by avim86 View Post
7 years 31.5 million paying him 8 and 7 million in the first two years , Overpaid much?
http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=242037&l...=topStory_main
another lock out coming

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06-29-2008, 11:17 PM
  #257
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Why is every contract everybody signs ridiculous? Every team has cap room to spend. It's wishful thinking that our team is going to resign all it's players for lower, reasonable contracts.

I see everybody complaining Carter bad contract, Malone bad contract, Lecavalier bad contract. Is it a bad contract if those players player 5 productive years for their team, while we don't have them? Seems like a good contract to me.

Prices are going up. Deal with it.

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06-29-2008, 11:21 PM
  #258
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Originally Posted by avim86 View Post
7 years 31.5 million paying him 8 and 7 million in the first two years , Overpaid much?
http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=242037&l...=topStory_main
How much would you value Malone? 2,5M - 3M per year? Now add the fact that you have to pay for his liberty, add an other 1,5M - 2M per year...

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Old
06-29-2008, 11:22 PM
  #259
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Originally Posted by lou4gehrig View Post
Why is every contract everybody signs ridiculous? Every team has cap room to spend. It's wishful thinking that our team is going to resign all it's players for lower, reasonable contracts.

I see everybody complaining Carter bad contract, Malone bad contract, Lecavalier bad contract. Is it a bad contract if those players player 5 productive years for their team, while we don't have them? Seems like a good contract to me.

Prices are going up. Deal with it.
Ummmm, that's not true. As far as bad contracts go, Malone's is at the top of the heap. Carter recently got a 3yr-15m deal. That was a good one. Maybe perhaps the glut of bad deals being complained about means that (gasp) the owners are stupid and not so easy to sympathize with as before. Geez, my innocence has been lost!

P.S. You comparing Malone to Carter and Lecavalier is out of whack. He is not even in the top 50 forwards in this league but is being paid that way. If the Habs made this deal, people would freak out... in a bad way.

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Old
06-29-2008, 11:24 PM
  #260
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Originally Posted by preston View Post
The Habs acquired Sundins rights from the Leafs too!
Yeah, only difference is that Mats has had a solid career with no bad years and Malone has one good year...anyone remember the name Sheldon Souray?

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Old
06-29-2008, 11:25 PM
  #261
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They have cap space and they are spending it. I wouldn't say he's worth the frontload of the deal, but the overall cost is pretty much market rate when you consider the cap. Now they will give Rolston the same deal and every team's plan B behind Hossa and Sundin has been screwed. Good strategy for Tampa.

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06-29-2008, 11:25 PM
  #262
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The cap is up, but shouldn't be. So these numbers are too high. Reality is, if it weren't for canadian dollar and how well the canadian teams are doing the cap would be lower still.

When the cap was 39 mil teams were losing money, now with canadian teams shyrocketing the salary cap i doubt the other US teams are going any further from wanting to sell. They couldn't afford it then, now they still can't spend and we can, only we can't spend unlimited. They still can't reach us, nashville didn't even make the salary cap floor and i think they dont have enough money to even get close to the cap.

So these inflated salaries are not a representation of the market but just some teams doing really well. The only thing people can do when bidding for a player is overbid, if a team like the caps didnt pay ovechkin what he wanted, someone else would and in certain cases they have to overspend or risk not being competitive at all.

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Old
06-29-2008, 11:32 PM
  #263
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4-5mil is what 45-60 point producers make now, it's just the way she goes. Forget about logic and just accept it for fact.

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Old
06-29-2008, 11:42 PM
  #264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
The cap is up, but shouldn't be. So these numbers are too high. Reality is, if it weren't for canadian dollar and how well the canadian teams are doing the cap would be lower still.

When the cap was 39 mil teams were losing money, now with canadian teams shyrocketing the salary cap i doubt the other US teams are going any further from wanting to sell. They couldn't afford it then, now they still can't spend and we can, only we can't spend unlimited. They still can't reach us, nashville didn't even make the salary cap floor and i think they dont have enough money to even get close to the cap.

So these inflated salaries are not a representation of the market but just some teams doing really well. The only thing people can do when bidding for a player is overbid, if a team like the caps didnt pay ovechkin what he wanted, someone else would and in certain cases they have to overspend or risk not being competitive at all.
The only good thing about the cap going up, and no one would have ever guessed this is that there are more opportunities for teams to leave the bad markets in the States like Atlanta, Florida, Nashville and even Tampa to come to Canada!

Who would of thought at the lock out that Winnipeg and Quebec City looked like NHL destinations? Not to mention a 3rd Ontario team in the Golden Horseshoe area...they could have 3 in that area with Toronto because of the 9 million people in the Southern Ontario area.

Quote:
Originally Posted by preston View Post
4-5mil is what 45-60 point producers make now, it's just the way she goes. Forget about logic and just accept it for fact.
Ryder, congrats on your long term 4-5 million contract!


Last edited by Beakermania*: 06-30-2008 at 07:56 AM.
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Old
06-29-2008, 11:57 PM
  #265
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Originally Posted by RE-HABS View Post
Ryder, congrats on your long term 4-5 million contract!
Well, the ones not coming off of 30 point seasons, but I'm sure you know what I meant.

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Old
06-30-2008, 01:54 AM
  #266
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Jay Feaster may have lost his mind.

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Old
06-30-2008, 03:33 AM
  #267
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i actually really like what k-lowe did to bring in visnovsky.. stoll, although a really good young kid and really good player, was pretty well expendable given they have the kids (gagner and cogliano) and horcoff to man the first 2 lines down the middle.. since they got a dman back, greene is expendable and now the best part of it all, they can trade pitkanen who's both young and talented and if a team misses out on guys like campbell, redden or rozsival might overpay to acquire pitkanen, (supposedly the canes are offering "cole+" for him but thats according to ek so take that for what its worth). either way tho, the youth of that team (and therefore cheap salaries) coupled with the trade gives the oil with more options to trade pitkanen and actually get better

as for the lightning.. if they sign rolston as well, thats 50 goals theyve added to their lineup (and im completely ignoring roberts and prospal). at this point theyve parlayed richards salary into prospal and malone.. theyve always had the guns to do well but just not enough talent beyond the big 3 but now the big 3 has become the big 2 plus the hotshot rookie and increased depth in the forward ranks.. although its not sustainable so koules will hopefully (for their sake i mean) throw money at their scouting department and improve their drafting beyond taking guys 1st overall lol

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06-30-2008, 04:37 AM
  #268
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Originally Posted by avim86 View Post
7 years 31.5 million paying him 8 and 7 million in the first two years , Overpaid much?
http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=242037&l...=topStory_main
Well, look at some of the contracts out there...

Penner 4.25M$
Lang 4M$
Smyth 6.25M$
Handzus 4M$
Erat 4.5M$
Dumont 4.5M$
Kunitz 3.725M$
Murray 4.15M$
Horton 4M$
Gionta 4M$
Comrie 4M$
Guerin 4.5M$
Fischer 4.2M$
Hartnell 4.2M$
Michalek 4.3M$
Blake 4M$

I'm not comparing their leadership abilities or their 2 way game but overall, when you look at what a guy who can score when playing with a good center, that can implicate himself physically and does well in the playoffs all the while looking like a power forward coming into his own, it's a decent deal for both sides.

They look like they overpay a bit but they buy 7 years of negotiations. What if he keeps on improving and ends up scoring 40 goals on a consistent basis?

Deal looks fine to me.

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06-30-2008, 04:49 AM
  #269
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hab-a-maniac View Post
Ummmm, that's not true. As far as bad contracts go, Malone's is at the top of the heap. Carter recently got a 3yr-15m deal. That was a good one. Maybe perhaps the glut of bad deals being complained about means that (gasp) the owners are stupid and not so easy to sympathize with as before. Geez, my innocence has been lost!

P.S. You comparing Malone to Carter and Lecavalier is out of whack. He is not even in the top 50 forwards in this league but is being paid that way. If the Habs made this deal, people would freak out... in a bad way.
More or less agree. Malone is by far the worst contract. I have no real issue with Vinnie's he has a cup and rocket trophy and has actually done something in the league. I still think Carter was a little overpaid but not as bad as Malone. I really thought the Malone one was a joke when I first heard of it.

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Old
06-30-2008, 05:04 AM
  #270
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More or less agree. Malone is by far the worst contract. I have no real issue with Vinnie's he has a cup and rocket trophy and has actually done something in the league. I still think Carter was a little overpaid but not as bad as Malone. I really thought the Malone one was a joke when I first heard of it.
Agreed, and the guy is over a PPG (275 pts, 127 goals in 243 games) since the lock-out, on the worth team in the NHL...

Vinny had to work his magic just for his team to look half decent in some games last year...

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06-30-2008, 05:45 AM
  #271
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Originally Posted by Tout ptit View Post
Well, look at some of the contracts out there...

Penner 4.25M$
Lang 4M$
Smyth 6.25M$
Handzus 4M$
Erat 4.5M$
Dumont 4.5M$
Kunitz 3.725M$
Murray 4.15M$
Horton 4M$
Gionta 4M$
Comrie 4M$
Guerin 4.5M$
Fischer 4.2M$
Hartnell 4.2M$
Michalek 4.3M$
Blake 4M$

I'm not comparing their leadership abilities or their 2 way game but overall, when you look at what a guy who can score when playing with a good center, that can implicate himself physically and does well in the playoffs all the while looking like a power forward coming into his own, it's a decent deal for both sides.

They look like they overpay a bit but they buy 7 years of negotiations. What if he keeps on improving and ends up scoring 40 goals on a consistent basis?

Deal looks fine to me.
prospal , lecavilier , st. louis , malone , stamkos , boyle , ranger , smith and maybe rolston ! not a bad group going forward for a team that has nowhere to go but up . i'll go out on a limb and predict that tampa makes the playoffs next year .

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06-30-2008, 05:50 AM
  #272
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This is probably the worst contract ever....this guy is sooooooo overrated!!! ...I mean look at the guys he was playing with last year...absolutely brutal

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06-30-2008, 06:26 AM
  #273
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I'm still having trouble figuring out what advantages it gives to the team. The cap hit is the same and from what I remember the buyout is the same. I guess in the end its a plus for the player because he has more money is his pocket if he is bought out.
If they want to move a player to a team, like say Columbus, then the trade is more feasible for Columbus because they are paying less money and could care less what the cap hit is since they don't spend anywhere near it.

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06-30-2008, 06:52 AM
  #274
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This is probably the worst contract ever....this guy is sooooooo overrated!!! ...I mean look at the guys he was playing with last year...absolutely brutal
this guy will be one third of the second line that tampa didn't have last year and will likely play with some guy named stamkos . as for the contract , almost half will be paid out in the first two years which leaves them with approx. a 3.2 million dollar cap hit over the remaining five years of the deal , very manageable and movable(if needed) i think it will turn out to be a good move for tampa .

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06-30-2008, 07:00 AM
  #275
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If Malone is what he was down teh stretch this year, it seems a fair deal. The up front money has no bearing on the cap and if they can afford it, more power to them for using this as a creative tool to get the deal done.

Malone has been criticized over the years by Pitt. fans for lack of intensity/maturity, or whatever reasons, but if he's turned the corner and is now a Murray,Knuble type of player in his prime, he's getting what he's worth. 7 years is a worry, but an average of 4.something isn't. I heard talk of a higher number .

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