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Poll! Pitkanen for Cole

View Poll Results: Do you like this trade?
Yep 158 64.75%
Nope 86 35.25%
Voters: 244. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
07-01-2008, 12:05 PM
  #26
jumptheshark
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I hate this trade--Cole it too injury prone and has one year left before he becomes as UFA

Oilers should have gotten more for Pitkanen

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Old
07-01-2008, 12:06 PM
  #27
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Pitkanen for Cole straight up, no I don't like it. As for all the other moves that Lowe has made so far, loving it. I thought that Joni was worth more, more like Staal if its coming from Carolina. Of course, thats my very biased opinion. Maybe Cole will change my mind, if he's still an Oiler by the beginning of the season.

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Old
07-01-2008, 12:06 PM
  #28
hillbillypriest
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asher View Post
Good point. Those 8 or 9 years Pitkanen has left are easily worth 1 year of the magnificent Erik Cole.
IMO, the "RFAs are better theory is a fallacy" in the present CBA that is dying hard, but will inevitably die. Pitkanen is not under contract, and the offer sheet compensation bands are melting into irrelevance with the taboo of offer sheets now out the window.

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07-01-2008, 12:09 PM
  #29
LoudmouthHemskyFan#2
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The reason lots of people are not happy with this trade is because of the speculation on the board about Pitkanen for Spezza or other top players like that. This trade is going to work out well for us and soon everyone will see how good Cole is.

When I looked through the NHL board, it was amazing to see how many different people who's teams play in the East say "I'm glad we don't have to play against him anyone".

Good job Klo, you just made 3 tremendous trades!

Also for the record if "we could have got more for him".... WE WOULD HAVE...


Last edited by LoudmouthHemskyFan#2: 07-01-2008 at 12:24 PM.
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Old
07-01-2008, 12:10 PM
  #30
Everest
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I just don't like Cole as a player. He's a long-limbed,long strided left winger who loves to carry the puck...but he tends to get carried away at times and he definatley doesn't do anything for us on our powerplay.

That being said...if we signed Hossa...Cole would be looking much more relevant.

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07-01-2008, 12:14 PM
  #31
Asher
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Originally Posted by hillbillypriest View Post
IMO, the "RFAs are better theory is a fallacy" in the present CBA that is dying hard, but will inevitably die. Pitkanen is not under contract, and the offer sheet compensation bands are melting into irrelevance with the taboo of offer sheets now out the window.
About the only way the Oilers do OK in this trade is if Cole manages to last longer than Bertuzzi (assuming they don't lose him to FA) and if Pitkanen is/was playing so tough in negotiations that CAR is forced to give him 5M+ (which I don't believe he is even close to being worth at this time).

No doubt Pitkanen's stock has dropped (despite what some radio show hosts in EDM may think), but he is still young enough and talented enough to get back more than Cole in a deal. And I happen to be one of the bigger Pitkanen bashers on this site, so I know I am not guilty of being a homer on this one. A big, young, offensively talented defenseman that can skate like the wind (even if he is a headcase) is worth more than a 29 year old power forward with a long history of injuries who only has one year left on his contract. You don't need to be a homer to see something is terribly wrong with this deal.

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Old
07-01-2008, 12:16 PM
  #32
Ice Whole
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoudmouthHemskyFan#2 View Post
The reason lots of people are not happy with this trade is because of the speculation on the board about Pitkanen for Spezza or other top players like that. This trade is going to work out well for us and soon everyone will see how good Cole is.

When I looked through the NHL board, it was amazing to see how many different people who's teams play in the East say "I'm glad we don't have to play against him anyone".

Good job Klo, you just made 3 tremendous trades!
I agree. Cole will play very good here if he can stay healthy. I am extremly happy with this trade. Pitkanen is OVERVALUED here. He was drafted 4th overall, That is the only reason I think people like him. He is a good offensive D-man but wouldnt you guys be happy with this.

Green, Torres, Stoll and Pitkanen FOR Visnovsky, Brule and Cole

We get rid of Torres and Stoll who had to leave and we get rid of Greene which isnt to big for us and we get rid of Pitkanen which dissapoints a lot of people but we get 2 termoundous players and we get a young player with a good future ahead of himself.

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Old
07-01-2008, 12:23 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asher View Post
About the only way the Oilers do OK in this trade is if Cole manages to last longer than Bertuzzi (assuming they don't lose him to FA) and if Pitkanen is/was playing so tough in negotiations that CAR is forced to give him 5M+ (which I don't believe he is even close to being worth at this time).

No doubt Pitkanen's stock has dropped (despite what some radio show hosts in EDM may think), but he is still young enough and talented enough to get back more than Cole in a deal. And I happen to be one of the bigger Pitkanen bashers on this site, so I know I am not guilty of being a homer on this one. A big, young, offensively talented defenseman that can skate like the wind (even if he is a headcase) is worth more than a 29 year old power forward with a long history of injuries who only has one year left on his contract. You don't need to be a homer to see something is terribly wrong with this deal.
You forgot to add IMO, after 2 or 3 of those statements. A big young offensively talented but inconsisitent and questionable determination, may be more accurate.

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Old
07-01-2008, 12:26 PM
  #34
Asher
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Originally Posted by In Lowe I Trust View Post
You forgot to add IMO, after 2 or 3 of those statements.
I usually don't forget, but I feel more than a little agitated with Lowe for making this deal.

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Old
07-01-2008, 12:27 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asher View Post
About the only way the Oilers do OK in this trade is if Cole manages to last longer than Bertuzzi (assuming they don't lose him to FA) and if Pitkanen is/was playing so tough in negotiations that CAR is forced to give him 5M+ (which I don't believe he is even close to being worth at this time).

No doubt Pitkanen's stock has dropped (despite what some radio show hosts in EDM may think), but he is still young enough and talented enough to get back more than Cole in a deal. And I happen to be one of the bigger Pitkanen bashers on this site, so I know I am not guilty of being a homer on this one. A big, young, offensively talented defenseman that can skate like the wind (even if he is a headcase) is worth more than a 29 year old power forward with a long history of injuries who only has one year left on his contract. You don't need to be a homer to see something is terribly wrong with this deal.
My perspective on Cole being a UFA is somewhat different. The last few years have shown us the quality UFAs WITH expiring contracts who are difference makers in the playoffs have a lot of deadline value. From this perspective, we get a jump on making Cole our playoff rental now, and the option at deadline time of converting him to a propsect with upside and/or picks. It's still really really unclear that Pitkanen will become a superstar, even though he may still have that potential, he could just as easlly be an asset on the decline because of the "headcase" effect. I like the asset management.

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Old
07-01-2008, 12:38 PM
  #36
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Love this trade. We get a top line winger who can put the puck in the net. And a body that Should run a little protection for hemmer.
For a guy who is going to command 5+/year, gets injured if its to windy and has a hard time keeping himself motivated for an entire year. Also with Vishnovsky, it makes pits redundant. Love this trade... only issue, is cole is ufa after this year.

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Old
07-01-2008, 12:43 PM
  #37
Asher
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Originally Posted by hillbillypriest View Post
My perspective on Cole being a UFA is somewhat different. The last few years have shown us the quality UFAs WITH expiring contracts who are difference makers in the playoffs have a lot of deadline value. From this perspective, we get a jump on making Cole our playoff rental now, and the option at deadline time of converting him to a propsect with upside and/or picks. It's still really really unclear that Pitkanen will become a superstar, even though he may still have that potential, he could just as easlly be an asset on the decline because of the "headcase" effect. I like the asset management.
You're assuming the Oilers miss the playoffs again when you refer to Cole's deadline value. If the Oilers are anywhere near a playoff spot at the deadline I highly doubt Lowe trades him.

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Old
07-01-2008, 12:48 PM
  #38
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Based on need then yes it was a good trade. The Oilers needed some size and grit with scoring up front. But as far as asset management goes... its a terrible trade. Cole is 29 with 1 year of $4m left, Pitkanen 25 (who we could loose in 2 years UFA). I would had like to had gotten atleast a 2nd for 09 along with Cole.

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Old
07-01-2008, 01:04 PM
  #39
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Cole is a player I really like, but if he's not signed to an extention the Oilers lose this trade IMO.

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07-01-2008, 01:06 PM
  #40
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I'm kind of on the fence on this one. Cole is 30 years old and only produced 50 points last year.. He's a UFA next spring so I hope we sign him before the season's over - which may not be easy. Plus we don't need more injury-prone players on this team.

On the other hand, I feel that Pitkanen is a bit overrated and has a lot of baggage associated with him. Lubo will take his place as the puck rusher and we already have Grebs and Gilbert who are no slouches themselves.

I wish there was more involved in this trade. I say that Carolina won this deal by a slight edge.

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Old
07-01-2008, 01:19 PM
  #41
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on the fence because edm has some great scores but not enough room for them. where does penner or cole fit now. does the kid line get horribly split up that was working so well? hmmm not sure. I like the scoring power but can it work

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07-01-2008, 01:21 PM
  #42
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I think this trade boils down to 1 bird in the hand versus 2 in the bush. Pitkanen was a project. Cole is proven. Today, I think our proven talent went up. Our project/potential talent went down.

Which is better?

If Carolina signs Pitkanen to a $5M+ deal, does this change anyone's opinion on the trade?

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Old
07-01-2008, 01:37 PM
  #43
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Cole sounds really excited to join the team.

He always makes a good interview.

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Old
07-01-2008, 01:42 PM
  #44
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What a pathetic trade, the best we got is an aging washed up, injury prone (more than Joni, ha ha) player. Lowe is a master at these deals. He should of gotten at least a top 4 forward, with Joni.
I thought he may have changed once he landed Lubo, but it didn't take him long to show his true colors again, Lowe seems to be the master at landing washed up players

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Old
07-01-2008, 04:05 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mehta View Post
I agree. Cole will play very good here if he can stay healthy. I am extremly happy with this trade. Pitkanen is OVERVALUED here. He was drafted 4th overall, That is the only reason I think people like him. He is a good offensive D-man but wouldnt you guys be happy with this.

Green, Torres, Stoll and Pitkanen FOR Visnovsky, Brule and Cole

We get rid of Torres and Stoll who had to leave and we get rid of Greene which isnt to big for us and we get rid of Pitkanen which dissapoints a lot of people but we get 2 termoundous players and we get a young player with a good future ahead of himself.
Green and Pit were two young developing d-men. Torres was a gritty, passionate player. Stoll was "our captain of the future" an off ice leader and one of the best faceoff men in the league. In return we get a guy who gets a concussion if he tries to pooh to hard in Cole. Prooveness of nothing in Brule with his 1 goal in 60+ games last year. And a decent defenceman that doesn't speak english and has only had 1 good year.

If we lose Cole to free agency this time next year all we show from the Pronger trade is Smid, aside from a couple of picks that haven't done anything yet. And if the Kid line suffers a sophomore jinx we are gonna be really thin offensively. We have all these offensive defensmen to get the puck to who? Hemsky? So he can dish it to which finisher? Cole? If he's in the line up. We now need Schremp to make the big squad so we have someone that isn't afraid to shoot the puck. Looks to me like we took 1 step forward and two steps back.

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Old
07-01-2008, 05:03 PM
  #46
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If Cole resigns then I love it, until that happens though I would rather have Pitkanen.

Regardless though we are a MUCH better team today then we were before the weekend so props on Lowe.

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07-01-2008, 05:10 PM
  #47
HuMz
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Originally Posted by wreckage View Post
Green and Pit were two young developing d-men. Torres was a gritty, passionate player. Stoll was "our captain of the future" an off ice leader and one of the best faceoff men in the league. In return we get a guy who gets a concussion if he tries to pooh to hard in Cole. Prooveness of nothing in Brule with his 1 goal in 60+ games last year. And a decent defenceman that doesn't speak english and has only had 1 good year.

If we lose Cole to free agency this time next year all we show from the Pronger trade is Smid, aside from a couple of picks that haven't done anything yet. And if the Kid line suffers a sophomore jinx we are gonna be really thin offensively. We have all these offensive defensmen to get the puck to who? Hemsky? So he can dish it to which finisher? Cole? If he's in the line up. We now need Schremp to make the big squad so we have someone that isn't afraid to shoot the puck. Looks to me like we took 1 step forward and two steps back.

I would totally agree with your description of the players above 3 years ago. Now Torres is far from passionate, even after his huge off season commitment last summer in which we saw zero improvement. Stoll does have good leadership and faceoff skills, but at over 2 million a year those needs can be filled very easily by a older veteran.

As for the other players we got in return, Stoil has alot more questions regarding his head then Cole does. In fact all the reports ive read from Carolina fans say his injury troubles are behind him. And Brule is strictly based on potential and we dumped a bad contract in the process. Any why no mention of Vishnovsky?

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07-01-2008, 05:15 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Tommy35 View Post
What a pathetic trade, the best we got is an aging washed up, injury prone (more than Joni, ha ha) player. Lowe is a master at these deals. He should of gotten at least a top 4 forward, with Joni.
I thought he may have changed once he landed Lubo, but it didn't take him long to show his true colors again, Lowe seems to be the master at landing washed up players
1. Cole by all reports is 100% healthy.

2. If Pitkanens value is so high why did he only fetch Lupul to get in the first place? And after a average season offseason were just supposed to automatically open the book for him at 5 million plus?

3. Cole and Vishnovsky are both in there prime and are far from washed up.

4. WE are a much better team now then were were before, and just about every analyst and fan judging are trades have said Kevin Lowe has done a great job thus far.

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Old
07-01-2008, 05:35 PM
  #49
wreckage
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I would totally agree with your description of the players above 3 years ago. Now Torres is far from passionate, even after his huge off season commitment last summer in which we saw zero improvement. Stoll does have good leadership and faceoff skills, but at over 2 million a year those needs can be filled very easily by a older veteran.

As for the other players we got in return, Stoil has alot more questions regarding his head then Cole does. In fact all the reports ive read from Carolina fans say his injury troubles are behind him. And Brule is strictly based on potential and we dumped a bad contract in the process. Any why no mention of Vishnovsky?
Like who? Ethan Moreau? I think the guy is alergic to the puck with the amount of time he's spent on the IR the last 3 years.

I did mention of Vish. He's a decent defenseman thats had one good season, well ok maybe two, that hasn't tried to learn english in his 7 seasons in North America.

All in all I think we didn't become any better. We need help putting the puck in the net. That was our biggest downfall last year. Until the middle of the season, when the kid line started popping them in, we lacked finishing. Sure we were 10th overall, but we need help. Mind you TSN is reporting this minute that we are still heavily involved in the Hossa sweepstakes. If all these moves are made to open that space, and we land him, its a win. Otherwise I believe we've taken a step back.

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Old
07-01-2008, 05:46 PM
  #50
HuMz
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Like who? Ethan Moreau? I think the guy is alergic to the puck with the amount of time he's spent on the IR the last 3 years.

I did mention of Vish. He's a decent defenseman thats had one good season, well ok maybe two, that hasn't tried to learn english in his 7 seasons in North America.

All in all I think we didn't become any better. We need help putting the puck in the net. That was our biggest downfall last year. Until the middle of the season, when the kid line started popping them in, we lacked finishing. Sure we were 10th overall, but we need help. Mind you TSN is reporting this minute that we are still heavily involved in the Hossa sweepstakes. If all these moves are made to open that space, and we land him, its a win. Otherwise I believe we've taken a step back.

Edit: Also to add im not worried about the leadership lost from Stoll at all, from all reports the Oilers are probably the cloest knit team in the league and there is plenty of leadership to be provided from Moreau, Pisani, Souray, Staois, Horc, and Penner.
Stoll hurt us last year more then he helped, and I saw no improvement in Greene's game outside of less dumb penalties taken, but he was still far from reliable in his own zone. And too give up those 2 for a number 1-2 puck moving defenseman makes us better which I don't know how you can argue, at least not based on last year.

You won't find too many Kings fans happy with that trade and thats because of how good Vishnovsky is. Lets not forget the gongshow of a goaltending situation they've had the last couple years which reflects on the defenseman in front of them.

I do agree tho if Hossa does get signed (and it sounds like were the front runners) then all of these trades come together very well and I see us as being very close to contenders.

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