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Some kind of BS

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Old
07-03-2008, 12:36 AM
  #1
BlackAces
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Some kind of BS

Alright so here it is, I play at the Bantam level and played "B" this year, so here is the problem next year the coach of the AAA team is the biggest tool I have ever met and has ALREADY picked out the team for next year "Unofficialy". So here is my problem, I don't even have a fair shot at making the AAA team next year even though i know and have been told that I am much better then the guys that will be on the team.

I have written it up to the leauge but I don't expect much, and really don't know what to do. I of course am going to try my best but when practice starts "unofficialy" on July the 24th and the tryouts arn't held till Augest the 21st I don't think i have a good chance.

What I am asking for here is advice, if anybody has been through crap like this and what they did.

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07-03-2008, 12:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NVMHA Star View Post
Alright so here it is, I play at the Bantam level and played "B" this year, so here is the problem next year the coach of the AAA team is the biggest tool I have ever met and has ALREADY picked out the team for next year "Unofficialy". So here is my problem, I don't even have a fair shot at making the AAA team next year even though i know and have been told that I am much better then the guys that will be on the team.

I have written it up to the leauge but I don't expect much, and really don't know what to do. I of course am going to try my best but when practice starts "unofficialy" on July the 24th and the tryouts arn't held till Augest the 21st I don't think i have a good chance.

What I am asking for here is advice, if anybody has been through crap like this and what they did.
What do you expect? its a AAA team thats usually what happens, but if you do well in tryouts they will make a spot. If you dont make it, you can always find another AAA team. However why are were you playing bantam B if you have the skill level of a AAA player.. why werent you playing A or AA???

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07-03-2008, 12:46 AM
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BlackAces
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It goes B2 B1 then AAA here. and I get that but it's NOT because there good and here are some examples:

The coach LIVED in the basement of one of the kids house. We were on the same team this year he was 2nd line I was 1st.
The kid's dad built the deck of the coach's new house.

Out of the 17 kids oon the team from what I've seen only 5-6 people deserve it.

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07-03-2008, 12:50 AM
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db88
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Ok so then why do you want to play for a team where you feel there will only be 6-7 talented deserving players including yourself?

There must be another AAA team around

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07-03-2008, 12:55 AM
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Nepotism is everywhere. If you feel you're not getting a fair share in that organization maybe you should try and find another one.

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07-03-2008, 01:12 AM
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BlackAces
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Playing against talented players, there are some but from what i've heard it's more of the same. However I am trying out for Team BC and have a fairly good chance at making it. I just heard this news today and am sort of venting aswell.

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07-03-2008, 01:24 AM
  #7
db88
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well if its more of the same, then you should possibly be able to make another team, see what their coaches are like too. If not suck it up and play some good hockey and hope for the best.

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07-03-2008, 02:11 AM
  #8
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this politics ******** is everywhere

switch associations and make them regret not choosing you for the team

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07-03-2008, 05:27 AM
  #9
WinCityHypeMachine
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There are politics everywhere, and there is nothing you can really do to get on this team. I wouldn't write a letter because not only are the chances that it'll actually land you on the team less than 1%, it could actually hurt your reputation(deserving or not that's just the way it is).

My advice would just be to evaluate what your next best AAA options are, and see if you can land a spot on those teams. Then, choose from there.

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07-03-2008, 07:24 AM
  #10
Gino 14
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I agree, writing the letter will come back to haunt you. You'll be labeled as a whiner and a baby. Try out and do the best you can, you have to live with what you do, not what others do to you. Look in to other teams and options while you're waiting.

When I started reffing, I had the option of doing about a dozen games a year with a bunch of guys that were basically getting booed off the ice, my local organization, or traveling some and doing 50 -75 games with a top notch organization. The choice was easy, I travel more but ref with a much higher caliber of official even though it does take up more of my free time.

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07-03-2008, 10:02 AM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NVMHA Star View Post
Alright so here it is, I play at the Bantam level and played "B" this year, so here is the problem next year the coach of the AAA team is the biggest tool I have ever met and has ALREADY picked out the team for next year "Unofficialy". So here is my problem, I don't even have a fair shot at making the AAA team next year even though i know and have been told that I am much better then the guys that will be on the team.

I have written it up to the league, but I don't expect much, and really don't know what to do. I of course am going to try my best but when practice starts "unofficialy" on July the 24th and the tryouts arn't held till Augest the 21st I don't think i have a good chance.

What I am asking for here is advice, if anybody has been through crap like this and what they did.
Ok, lets look at it a different way. As a coach for over 30 years, I have coached kids from mites to college.

Everytime, I have a team, all kids get to come back the next year because they have put in their dues. Plan and simple!

Now, if you want to be on my team, I need to have you to show me that you deserve to be on the team. I don't place kids on my team just because the league tells me too. And, I don't place kids on my team just because the kids or parents say that he is better then some of the kids on my team.

Now if this is true, and you come out and show me that you deserve to be on the team, buddy you are on the team.

If this coach is selecting player for a favor, then shame on him. However, to be honest, if you come out and show up this kid that lives up stairs from the coach, the chances are really good, that the Coach will tell the guy Dad up stairs that his son didn't make it.

Trust me, if he doesn't, he will loose respect for the players and parents, and then it will be an up hill battle all season long.

Head Coach


Last edited by Headcoach: 07-03-2008 at 10:44 AM.
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07-03-2008, 10:27 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NVMHA Star View Post
Alright so here it is, I play at the Bantam level and played "B" this year, so here is the problem next year the coach of the AAA team is the biggest tool I have ever met and has ALREADY picked out the team for next year "Unofficialy". So here is my problem, I don't even have a fair shot at making the AAA team next year even though i know and have been told that I am much better then the guys that will be on the team.

I have written it up to the leauge but I don't expect much, and really don't know what to do. I of course am going to try my best but when practice starts "unofficialy" on July the 24th and the tryouts arn't held till Augest the 21st I don't think i have a good chance.

What I am asking for here is advice, if anybody has been through crap like this and what they did.

Part of your problem lies in your point of view. You are young and lacking life experience you make many assumptions regarding the Coach. It is very possible for people to interact and do each other favors, work together, etc etc with out thought of compensation. Should the coach of my sons team be in need of ...a custom cam shaft for a car as an example...and i was given permission to use company resources to make this for him, I would. Both of us know that it would not provide any kind of assurance of my sons position on the team.

Do not be so fast to questions a persons moral conviction or lack there of based on the facts you state in your post. I seriously hope that you did not send that letter. It is unfair of you to call the man out based on such weak information and not having first hand exerience. Should you have done that to me, it would be a cold day in hell you would be selected to be a member of my team. Coaches talk and for any who would call this coach a friend, you would stand almost no chance of making their teams. You could be Gretsky great but adding one rotten apple to a barrell...you know the deal.

There is much more than simply being good at a sport to being a member of your top flite team. Attitude is just as important. A season can be spoiled by having poor attitudes, people who exhibit negative attitude...

Train hard, play your best and let the chips fall where they may. Go into try-outs relaxed, interact with you prospective team mates in a positive manner. Deserving to be selected is exhibited in both your play and in how you conduct yourself. I understand your venting your frustration but this very same thing done with team mates can create a cancer on a team.

Change your point of view. Going in expecting to not be selected WILL impact your performance at these try-outs. If your as good as you and others think you are, then you have a chance provided that you have not gained a reputation for negativity or have actually sent that letter. If you have sent that letter and your going to go to this guys try out...better contact him by phone or in person and apologize. I am sure if you explain your frustration and realizing it was brash, he could respect that.

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Old
07-03-2008, 11:11 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Headcoach View Post
Ok, lets look at it a different way. As a coach for over 30 years, I have coached kids from mites to college.

Everytime, I have a team, all kids get to come back the next year because they have put in their dues. Plan and simple!

Now, if you want to be on my team, I need to have you to show me that you deserve to be on the team. I don't place kids on my team just because the league tells me too. And, I don't place kids on my team just because the kids or parents say that he is better then some of the kids on my team.

Now if this is true, and you come out and show me that you deserve to be on the team, buddy you are on the team.

If this coach is selecting player for a favor, then shame on him. However, to be honest, if you come out and show up this kid that lives up stairs form the coach, the chances are really good, that the Coach will tell the guy Dad up stairs that his son didn't make it.

Trust me, if he doesn't, he will loose respect for the players and parents, and then it will be an up hill battle all season long.

Head Coach
Can you clarify that? If a kid puts in his dues but slips somewhat against his peers and a new kid shows him up, who gets cut?

I assume the kid that has put in his dues, for his own good as well as everyone else, to play at an appropriate level, but he then leaves his friends behind when he leaves and someone takes "his place".

What if the new kid is just marginally better? Both kids are quite capable of that level...does the new kid get an equal chance with you?

I know tryouts can be very emotional for both parents and kids (not to mention coaches) and if you are one of the last one's cut, chances are you have some skills that are as good or better than half the team, just possibly overall not quite good enough. Unless a kid is clearly better in all areas it can be tough to make those decisions and even harder if you have to justify them.

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07-03-2008, 11:38 AM
  #14
Henrique Iglesias
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Similar thing happens at my old HS, if you played on any type of elite travel team, you automatically made the team. Someone coulda showed up in a ice house avalanche (elite travel team around here) practice jersey and made the team regardless of how bad they are.

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07-03-2008, 11:49 AM
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Welcome to sports.

There will always be politics. My brother didn't make the AAA team in Bantam because the coach didn't like my dad. My brother had 129 points on the AA team and still got drafted into the dub. His son had 40 points.

Darren Helm was cut from the Jr A team due to politics. Played Jr B and racked up a bunch of points. Then made the Tigers. The rest is history I suppose with him.

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07-03-2008, 12:21 PM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crosbyfan View Post
Can you clarify that? If a kid puts in his dues but slips somewhat against his peers and a new kid shows him up, who gets cut?
The kid that get cut is the kid that doesn't meet the skill level, stamina, or attitude to be on the team. Like you said, it's pretty emotional for all involved. I guess, one of the biggest things for me, when I look for players, are those three things that I just mentioned. I guess I could spend hours taking about those three. But how much time do you have?

Quote:
I assume the kid that has put in his dues, for his own good as well as everyone else, to play at an appropriate level, but he then leaves his friends behind when he leaves and someone takes "his place".
One of the biggest mistakes that I see every August, it's the AAA player that has decided not to train during the Summer and decides he would rather spend his Summer season going fishing. Then he shows up to try-out and sucks wind the whole try-outs. So do you say..."Oh it's ok, he'll get his act together in a couple of months" or the new kid that trained all Summer long to make the team. What to you tell his parents? "Sorry, my player that took off during the Summer, the one that's throwing up on the bench, made the team because your son had his act together...sorry, maybe next year!

Quote:
What if the new kid is just marginally better? Both kids are quite capable of that level...does the new kid get an equal chance with you?
By all means...Yes! He gets the same rights to make the team as the next kid. Sorry, I don't play favorites.

Let me tell you a story. After I left a hockey club internationally, I returned home and settled in Phoenix, hockey hot bed capital of the world.

I was asked by a local youth club to help the head coach, select his AAA peewee team. So I was given a list of kids, mind you, I was new to the area and didn't have any political agenda, nor did I owe any favors

After I had made the selection for the coach, I mentioned to him that this kid needs to stay and this kid needs to go. He told me No! And that was ok, it was his team...not mine. However, when I asked, he said that this kid that I wanted to cut, comes with benefits. When I asked him what does he mean by benefits? He told me that his Dad has money and when they travel, they stay in better hotels. Now, what does one say to the parnets of the kid that just got cut? "Sorry, you don't have the kind of money like this other parent has, so you son didn't make the team!" Not. You cut the kid who's parents that have the money, not because they have money and you stay at the Hilton. You cut the kid because he's not good enough.


Quote:
I know tryouts can be very emotional for both parents and kids (not to mention coaches) and if you are one of the last one's cut, chances are you have some skills that are as good or better than half the team, just possibly overall not quite good enough. Unless a kid is clearly better in all areas it can be tough to make those decisions and even harder if you have to justify them.
This is why I evaluate on a point system. And, I have all of my assistant coaches use it. Then we look at each coaches scoring and then take an average. I keep all of the "5's" as many as I can get, then I select the "4's" and so on until the team is selected. Generally for a AAA team, it's all fives.

During the cut stage, I bring each player into the room, show them the evaluation sheet, and explain to them why they didn't make the team. Generally, first, it's due to poor skating skills. Second, puck handling skills. Third, system knowledge. Fouth, shooting skills. Last, attitude! I explain to them what they need to do to bring up this level for next year and I hope they come back.

Why is attitude last? You can have a kid with great attitude, but if he can't skate, I can use him. Don't get me wrong, I would rather of had the kid with the great attitude sometimes. But when it comes time to compete against another team. If everyone is not up to speed, you are only as good as the weakest link in the chain. Everyone can try to make up for this weakness. But in the long run, as a coach, you better take the best kids on the road, or you will not be back next year.

I have seen to many times, where coaches made selections on favors and not on talent, they go compete and get their a** kicked. Then everyone starts to talk about the kids that the coach cut and how things would have been better. I call that the...would have, could have, should have, Syndrome! Then you hear...maybe the team is losing because he was incapable of making the proper selection at the start of the year. Maybe, we sould start looking else where for next year.



Head coach


Last edited by Headcoach: 07-03-2008 at 12:33 PM.
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Old
07-03-2008, 03:28 PM
  #17
BlackAces
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Ok I get what you are saying, but when a coach starts practice for the AAA team a Month before try-outs do you see how it can feel that you don't have a chance? I found out last night that we have professional people coming in and doing the evaluations and placing them on the teams then there are only 3 guys from each squad that can get cut when the coach steps in. So hopefully I can land a spot on the AAA team before the coach get's his hands on the team.

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07-03-2008, 03:56 PM
  #18
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Here's my advice: do your best, have fun, and don't worry. If it's out of your control, then there's no point getting an ulcer over it.

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07-03-2008, 04:39 PM
  #19
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Like the poster above me said...

Just forget about it, play your ass off and make the coach regret not choosing you..

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Old
07-04-2008, 05:11 PM
  #20
Crosbyfan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NVMHA Star View Post
Ok I get what you are saying, but when a coach starts practice for the AAA team a Month before try-outs do you see how it can feel that you don't have a chance? I found out last night that we have professional people coming in and doing the evaluations and placing them on the teams then there are only 3 guys from each squad that can get cut when the coach steps in. So hopefully I can land a spot on the AAA team before the coach get's his hands on the team.
This sounds like a pretty good system if an organization can afford it and if there are good people available to provide that service.



To Head Coach: Thanks for the replies.

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