HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Florida Panthers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Bouwmeester Files For Arbitration

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-06-2008, 12:22 PM
  #126
NJ_CATS_FAN
We Suck Yet Again
 
NJ_CATS_FAN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: N.J.
Country: United States
Posts: 4,801
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghoste View Post
The additions of Ballard and Boynton are supposed to compliment Bouw. Like others have said, we need a good defenseman coming back if Bouw leaves. If we don't, we're in trouble.

We have a Ryno who is a huge question mark at the moment. According to GP, we have the same player in Boynton and Skras. Smurf gets pushed around. Scoring is nice but without Bouw -- who also scored 27 goals the last two years -- our defense would be on the same level as Tampa's. Bouw is the one that makes our defensive corp a good one. This is why it would be very important to acquire a solid defenseman in return.

-ghoste
Like someone said earlier, if we trade Bouw we wont be getting a D man that is around his level, it would be similar to what we have. We could get a top line scorer and still have a defense that will step in. Again, you cant win if you dont score.

NJ_CATS_FAN is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 12:43 PM
  #127
Georgia Panther
Registered User
 
Georgia Panther's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: BufordGA/FranklinNC
Posts: 4,837
vCash: 500
A Center has to be the centerpiece of a Bouw trade. That's the biggest hole in the Panthers right now. I just don't get why people want or think they can get a top defenseman for Bouw. Why would the other team do that? The reason to acquire Bouwmeester would be to upgrade their blueline. They wouldn't send anything close to Bouwmeester in return. What you would get is another Ballard, another Boynton, another Skrastins. Guess what, we already have those players in numbers. What JM should be looking for is a team with an excess amount of scoring line centers in need of a top of a line blueliner. That's the match for a Bouwmeester trade.

Georgia Panther is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 12:47 PM
  #128
Blad Meaning Gud
Yu - Behr - Doe
 
Blad Meaning Gud's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,596
vCash: 50
If Philly gave us Carter and JVR I'd wave him goodbye

Blad Meaning Gud is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 12:50 PM
  #129
NJ_CATS_FAN
We Suck Yet Again
 
NJ_CATS_FAN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: N.J.
Country: United States
Posts: 4,801
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Georgia Panther View Post
A Center has to be the centerpiece of a Bouw trade. That's the biggest hole in the Panthers right now. I just don't get why people want or think they can get a top defenseman for Bouw. Why would the other team do that? The reason to acquire Bouwmeester would be to upgrade their blueline. They wouldn't send anything close to Bouwmeester in return. What you would get is another Ballard, another Boynton, another Skrastins. Guess what, we already have those players in numbers. What JM should be looking for is a team with an excess amount of scoring line centers in need of a top of a line blueliner. That's the match for a Bouwmeester trade.
Exactly my point and now that I hear PHI has a strong interest, I would work on a package centered on Carter.

NJ_CATS_FAN is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 12:53 PM
  #130
Georgia Panther
Registered User
 
Georgia Panther's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: BufordGA/FranklinNC
Posts: 4,837
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthias4Prez View Post
If Philly gave us Carter and JVR I'd wave him goodbye
If Philly gave us Carter and less than JVR I would drive him to the airport. Bouwmeester, Kreps (because Philly would need a third line center this year) for Carter and a first round draft choice. Of course I would do the Ottawa deal instead of that one but A.You then have to sign 2 RFA's to long term contracts which might not be the easiest thing to do and B. I just can't see JM doing a deal with Ottawa.

Georgia Panther is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 12:55 PM
  #131
NJ_CATS_FAN
We Suck Yet Again
 
NJ_CATS_FAN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: N.J.
Country: United States
Posts: 4,801
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthias4Prez View Post
If Philly gave us Carter and JVR I'd wave him goodbye
Now that is a home run deal.

NJ_CATS_FAN is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 01:03 PM
  #132
Laus723
Future Now
 
Laus723's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 27,051
vCash: 500
It's apparent that Bouw wants to move on. If that's the case, as I've said before, then so be it. He'll move on and be a top defenseman in the NHL and could be a Norris winner. It was great to have him and watch him develop. There are things I don't like about him, but they're things I don't like about a lot of players. There are a lot of teams who lose top players, like Briere, Drury, Gomez, Campbell, etc. to name only a few. Would obviously be a lot smarter to move Bouw for a nice package than to let him just walk.

Hopefully, when teams find out Bouw's available, a bidding war starts and we come out ahead in this deal. I'm really hoping this is a 'give to get' type situation. I felt that when Martin got two (well, three) defensemen for Olli that it was in his mind to move Bouw. I'd like to see a top forward and defenseman come back in return. Vermette and Meszaros (and apparently +) would make me VERY happy. I'd also like Carter/Lupul/ and Coburn perhaps from Philly. With Matthias possibly making the team, I'd like to see a top winger come in.

Of course I would, I'm a fan of this team and am a greedy *******. I want the most for Bouw. One thing's sure, this will be a new team next season.

__________________
So you're saying there's a chance!
Laus723 is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 01:12 PM
  #133
Panthers_Fan
Registered User
 
Panthers_Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 1,083
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ_CATS_FAN View Post
Now that is a home run deal.
That's the kind of return I want. Why settle for less when we're trading a future Norris candidate?

The problem with Philly is that they are over the cap as is. So we would have to take salary. I looked at the thread on their board and they have been mentioning Carter, Lupul, and also Gagne as players that they would move in the deal to save salary. Prospect wise I would really want JVR coming to us even if it meant we had to add something else to our side.

Panthers_Fan is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 01:55 PM
  #134
FlaPanthers7
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Denver, CO
Country: France
Posts: 4,624
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Panthers_Fan View Post
That's the kind of return I want. Why settle for less when we're trading a future Norris candidate?

The problem with Philly is that they are over the cap as is. So we would have to take salary. I looked at the thread on their board and they have been mentioning Carter, Lupul, and also Gagne as players that they would move in the deal to save salary. Prospect wise I would really want JVR coming to us even if it meant we had to add something else to our side.
But is he really a Norris candidate??? He's a top pairing defenseman, but he is not in the same league as Lidstrom, Pronger, Nieds, etc. He may never reach that eschelon either. I think sometimes we tend to overvalue our players. Yes, defensemen are at a premium, but I think Carter & JRV is absolutely a solid deal and so is Mezaros/Vermette. Bouwmeester is 1 year away from UFA status too, so I could see the pick being conditional on his re-signing.

FlaPanthers7 is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 01:58 PM
  #135
zeroG
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Somerville, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 6,177
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ_CATS_FAN View Post
I dont think he will go ALL offense in a trade with Jay, but offense would be the MAIN part of it. With the rumors now involving the Flyers, if we could get a package centered around Jeff Carter, I would be all over that. Even the package rumored from OTT of Vermette and Meszaros is a decent one, but a trade would be a combination.
and i completely disagree. a big offensive peice would like nice but not at the expense of the defensive return.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ_CATS_FAN View Post
Like someone said earlier, if we trade Bouw we wont be getting a D man that is around his level, it would be similar to what we have. We could get a top line scorer and still have a defense that will step in. Again, you cant win if you dont score.
here again is a fundamental difference in our opinion - the problem with the team last year was first and foremost DEFENSE. we do not have a defense capable of starting the offense and shutting down the opponent without jay (and with nobody else coming back). yes, we won't get another jay coming back to us but a guy like meszaros could fill out the defense suitably. we'd still have questions, imo, but you can imagine building a very solid defense around ballard and meszaros. and vermette, in this scenario, also returns some scoring. there are still questions - does someone like vermette bring enough finish to consistenly produce on the top 2 lines with our Fs? don't know, but i'd like to see how that would work out.

zeroG is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 02:18 PM
  #136
TheHMan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,426
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
does someone like vermette bring enough finish to consistenly produce on the top 2 lines with our Fs? don't know, but i'd like to see how that would work out.
I'd say yes, the last couple of years he's managed to put up decent points playing on the third line with Chris Neil and Chris Kelly. Kelly is known for his hands of stone (missing GREAT scoring opportunities) and Chris Neil isn't known for being an offensive dynamo either. If you've looked up some of Vermette's highlight reel goals, you'll see a good portion of them are on individual efforts, which he does quite well. He can still play with good line mates though, he had a short stint with Stillman and was fantastic. They were broken up later in the year due to injuries and other depth problems.

TheHMan is online now  
Old
07-06-2008, 02:32 PM
  #137
Ghoste
Vigo the Carpathian
 
Ghoste's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: San Diego, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 3,039
vCash: 835
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlaPanthers7 View Post
But is he really a Norris candidate??? He's a top pairing defenseman, but he is not in the same league as Lidstrom, Pronger, Nieds, etc. He may never reach that eschelon either. I think sometimes we tend to overvalue our players. Yes, defensemen are at a premium, but I think Carter & JRV is absolutely a solid deal and so is Mezaros/Vermette. Bouwmeester is 1 year away from UFA status too, so I could see the pick being conditional on his re-signing.
Those three guys are a lot older. Lidstrom is 38, Pronger is 33, and Niedermayer is 34. Bouw will be 25 in September. He has a lot of time to get to that level. He's not even in his prime yet. This doesn't mean that I think he should make more money than them either. If his camp is looking for $8 or $9 million, that sux.

I still want to get Bouw re-signed, nothing above $7 million. If it comes out that he truly doesn't want to be here, then we have to do what we have to do. But until then, I'm hoping they can still come to terms.

-ghoste

Ghoste is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 02:32 PM
  #138
Markstrom Rules
Sup
 
Markstrom Rules's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Pennsylvania
Country: United States
Posts: 16,069
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Georgia Panther View Post
A Center has to be the centerpiece of a Bouw trade. That's the biggest hole in the Panthers right now. I just don't get why people want or think they can get a top defenseman for Bouw. Why would the other team do that? The reason to acquire Bouwmeester would be to upgrade their blueline. They wouldn't send anything close to Bouwmeester in return. What you would get is another Ballard, another Boynton, another Skrastins. Guess what, we already have those players in numbers. What JM should be looking for is a team with an excess amount of scoring line centers in need of a top of a line blueliner. That's the match for a Bouwmeester trade.
That's exactly what we're looking for. Another Ballard=Meszaros. It gives us another very good defenseman. If we don't get a defenseman back, we will be severely downgrading our defense from last year. In essence, you have replaced Bouw with Ballard, which will equal disaster. At least if we get someone like Meszaros back, that helps shoulder a good deal of the loss of Bouwmeester. Then you get Vermette also, who I think can be 60-65 pt. scorer. Plus maybe something else? That's a great deal. That's the type of deal we need. We get two good balanced scoring lines, and also still keep a good defense together. That's the ideal trade in this situation.

Markstrom Rules is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 02:34 PM
  #139
Markstrom Rules
Sup
 
Markstrom Rules's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Pennsylvania
Country: United States
Posts: 16,069
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghoste View Post
Those three guys are a lot older. Lidstrom is 38, Pronger is 33, and Niedermayer is 34. Bouw will be 25 in September. He has a lot of time to get to that level. He's not even in his prime yet. This doesn't mean that I think he should make more money than them either.

I still want to get Bouw re-signed. If it comes out that he truly doesn't want to be here, then we have to do what we have to do. But until then, I'm hoping they can still come to terms.

-ghoste
Bouw is better now at his age than Pronger or Niedermayer were.

Markstrom Rules is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 02:40 PM
  #140
Laus723
Future Now
 
Laus723's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 27,051
vCash: 500
Gp, Ballard is a fine defenseman. Getting someone like him plus would be a fine return. Like the rumoured Ottawa deal.

Laus723 is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 02:59 PM
  #141
homegrizown
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: pembroke pines fl
Country: United States
Posts: 524
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
Gp, Ballard is a fine defenseman. Getting someone like him plus would be a fine return. Like the rumoured Ottawa deal.
agreed if bouw is traded we need a d-man back and mezeros would be fine. and if rumored that martin does have a hardon for vermette he'd prob. be able to lock him up long term

remember as of right now bo,boyntn,skrats are all UFA's next season and who knows if van ryn will ever return to form and mst likely he'll be dealt for a pick or prospect.

so that leaves us with allen,ballard,welch with the possibility of ellerby being ready to play 5-6 dman minutes. maybe not sure how he's developing.

homegrizown is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 03:19 PM
  #142
Danny Tanner*
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 282
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by homegrizown View Post
agreed if bouw is traded we need a d-man back and mezeros would be fine. and if rumored that martin does have a hardon for vermette he'd prob. be able to lock him up long term

remember as of right now bo,boyntn,skrats are all UFA's next season and who knows if van ryn will ever return to form and mst likely he'll be dealt for a pick or prospect.

so that leaves us with allen,ballard,welch with the possibility of ellerby being ready to play 5-6 dman minutes. maybe not sure how he's developing.
that defense actually doesn't seem that bad to me, assuming meszaros would be part of the return for bouwmeester. it's young, but you save some money in the process and might be able to add a veteran defensman via trade or ufa. those 3 guys likely free up $12 million or so in the budget ($7 mil for Jay, $3mil for Boynton, $2.5 for Skrastins) while it will only cost about $4mil to lock up Meszaros...that leaves $8 mil to play with in the 09-10 offseason.

meszaros-allen
??-ballard
ellerby-welch for 2009-20010...or you could always re-sign boynton or skrastins for cheaper if ellerby is not ready for full time nhl duty by then. i've seen far worse....the short term and long term situation of our defense doesn't look that bad even with bouwmeester out of the picture (assuming, of course, he is reasonably replaced by someone such as meszaros)

Danny Tanner* is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 03:25 PM
  #143
Georgia Panther
Registered User
 
Georgia Panther's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: BufordGA/FranklinNC
Posts: 4,837
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
Gp, Ballard is a fine defenseman. Getting someone like him plus would be a fine return. Like the rumoured Ottawa deal.
I prefer the Ottawa deal, I just think it more likely a deal with Philly could be done. They have the excess of centers, Carter is already signed for 3 years and Philly doesn't have a history of ill feeling with JM.

Georgia Panther is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 03:27 PM
  #144
homegrizown
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: pembroke pines fl
Country: United States
Posts: 524
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny Tanner View Post
that defense actually doesn't seem that bad to me, assuming meszaros would be part of the return for bouwmeester. it's young, but you save some money in the process and might be able to add a veteran defensman via trade or ufa. those 3 guys likely free up $12 million or so in the budget ($7 mil for Jay, $3mil for Boynton, $2.5 for Skrastins) while it will only cost about $4mil to lock up Meszaros...that leaves $8 mil to play with in the 09-10 offseason.

meszaros-allen
??-ballard
ellerby-welch for 2009-20010...or you could always re-sign boynton or skrastins for cheaper if ellerby is not ready for full time nhl duty by then. i've seen far worse....the short term and long term situation of our defense doesn't look that bad even with bouwmeester out of the picture (assuming, of course, he is reasonably replaced by someone such as meszaros)
no i totally agree but what i'm saying we need someone like mezaros or similar in a return deal for bo cuz without one that only leaves ballard and allen under contract for next season.

homegrizown is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 03:56 PM
  #145
Laus723
Future Now
 
Laus723's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 27,051
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny Tanner View Post
that defense actually doesn't seem that bad to me, assuming meszaros would be part of the return for bouwmeester. it's young, but you save some money in the process and might be able to add a veteran defensman via trade or ufa. those 3 guys likely free up $12 million or so in the budget ($7 mil for Jay, $3mil for Boynton, $2.5 for Skrastins) while it will only cost about $4mil to lock up Meszaros...that leaves $8 mil to play with in the 09-10 offseason.

meszaros-allen
??-ballard
ellerby-welch for 2009-20010...or you could always re-sign boynton or skrastins for cheaper if ellerby is not ready for full time nhl duty by then. i've seen far worse....the short term and long term situation of our defense doesn't look that bad even with bouwmeester out of the picture (assuming, of course, he is reasonably replaced by someone such as meszaros)
Would likely be:
Mez-Allen
Ballard-Ellerby
Welch-???

In fact, if Bouw is shipped, I'd try to get hard after Smith if I were Martin. Imo, Ryno and Smurph should be moved out. I'd rather see Welch or Cullimore make the team. And Johansson over Murphy.


Last edited by Laus723: 07-06-2008 at 04:01 PM.
Laus723 is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 03:59 PM
  #146
homegrizown
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: pembroke pines fl
Country: United States
Posts: 524
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
Would likely be:
Mez-Allen
Ballard-Ellerby
Welch-???
i don't know how ellerby is developing would u say he's a year away though i was thinking possibly 2

homegrizown is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 04:02 PM
  #147
Laus723
Future Now
 
Laus723's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 27,051
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by homegrizown View Post
i don't know how ellerby is developing would u say he's a year away though i was thinking possibly 2
Good point, I dunno. I'm sure it will have to depend on how he does this next season. I think they could be great partners, though.

Laus723 is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 04:17 PM
  #148
Biggzy*
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Country: United States
Posts: 3,454
vCash: 500
Ellerby is probably not going to be ready to play next season. Plus we already have like 38 defenseman that could be on the roster for next season. I'm more interested in what forwards will be making the team.

Biggzy* is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 04:22 PM
  #149
homegrizown
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: pembroke pines fl
Country: United States
Posts: 524
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggzy View Post
Ellerby is probably not going to be ready to play next season. Plus we already have like 38 defenseman that could be on the roster for next season. I'm more interested in what forwards will be making the team.
we are talking about next next season.

and as far as fowards for this season i'm guessing if we're done it'll look something like this which is sad and scary

booth-weiss-horton
olesz-matthias-stillman
mcclean-kreps-zednik
belak/pelt-campbell-dvo

very very sad

homegrizown is offline  
Old
07-06-2008, 04:39 PM
  #150
zeroG
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Somerville, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 6,177
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by homegrizown View Post
we are talking about next next season.

and as far as fowards for this season i'm guessing if we're done it'll look something like this which is sad and scary

booth-weiss-horton
olesz-matthias-stillman
mcclean-kreps-zednik
belak/pelt-campbell-dvo

very very sad
on its own, yeah - it's a bit scary. i don't believe that's what it will end up being, tho (nobody really does, do they?) and everyone is neglecting to factor in (if we Fs stay as is and we ice a D corps including ballard and jay) the potential increase in offensive production from the defense AND the fact that we likely would improve SA/GA significantly. i don't think that can be discounted.

zeroG is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:06 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.