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RUMOR: Kovalev wants a 3-year extension before camp

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Old
07-07-2008, 10:46 PM
  #301
centrehice
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
53pts in 77GP isn't good either, so thats 3Bad seasons.
If you want to be really critical considering his talent, 66Pts over 82GP is quite a disappointment as well.

66pts in 81GP was extremely disappointing for Vinny Lecavalier, even when he posted 75pts people were saying he was disappointing.
If Crosby has around 80ish points next year, it'll be a bad season for him to.

66pts for Kovalev is not that good at all, but we can call it a mediocre season..

That's 3bad seasons with 1 mediocre one over 10years. It is inconsistent. Especially if we look at the fact this guy is part of the elite of the league in terms of raw talent.


Well.. the 66 points was a career high for him at the time... so I wouldn't call it a mediocre season, he hadn't broke out yet.

People blame WAY too much on Kovalev.

He loves playing in montreal, he HAS HEART (where's that video of him with his helmet off with the C), despite what people say, and he's played at a very good point per game ration in his time with the habs.

STOP COMPLAINING, and find another scape goat.

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Old
07-07-2008, 11:53 PM
  #302
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
53pts in 77GP isn't good either, so thats 3Bad seasons.
If you want to be really critical considering his talent, 66Pts over 82GP is quite a disappointment as well.

66pts in 81GP was extremely disappointing for Vinny Lecavalier, even when he posted 75pts people were saying he was disappointing.
If Crosby has around 80ish points next year, it'll be a bad season for him to.

66pts for Kovalev is not that good at all, but we can call it a mediocre season..

That's 3bad seasons with 1 mediocre one over 10years. It is inconsistent. Especially if we look at the fact this guy is part of the elite of the league in terms of raw talent.
Marian Hossa had 66 points last year, weren't you one of those going and was willing to pay him 6 +.. Im seeing double standards here.

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07-07-2008, 11:59 PM
  #303
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Originally Posted by King Kovalev View Post
Marian Hossa had 66 points last year, weren't you one of those going and was willing to pay him 6 +.. Im seeing double standards here.

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07-08-2008, 03:22 AM
  #304
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Originally Posted by BaseballCoach View Post
If 66 points is a bad season, then Patrick Marleau has, what, 8 TERRIBLE seasons out of 10? Well, he's making a whopping $6.3M and some of the same people who don't want to extend Kovalev are calling for the Habs to GIVE UP ASSETS in a trade to get Marleau!!

We can re-sign Kovalev (and Koivu and Tanguay) without giving up ANY assets!!

For the curious, Marleau has had one season of 32 points, 3 seasons of 40-48 points, 3 seasons of 52-57 points and two seasons of 78-86 points. VERY CONSISTENT!
I actually hate Marleau and wouldn't even give up Chipchura heads up for him. The guy is tremendously overrated in MTL and had great production years only when paired with Thornton.
Even Cheechoo had 52Goals, and boy does he suck!..

Kovalev has way much more potential than Marleau, that's why I said 66pts in 82GP for Kovalev is not really a good season, call it mediocre or average, but not good.
That was the only thing I was saying.

Kovalev and Koivu will be resigned and im all up for that. Even better if we can resign them now.
As for Tanguay though, that really depends how he fits in with us next year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by centrehice View Post
Well.. the 66 points was a career high for him at the time... so I wouldn't call it a mediocre season, he hadn't broke out yet.

People blame WAY too much on Kovalev.

He loves playing in montreal, he HAS HEART (where's that video of him with his helmet off with the C), despite what people say, and he's played at a very good point per game ration in his time with the habs.

STOP COMPLAINING, and find another scape goat.
Kovalev had the talent to become part of the best in this league. He was a very promising prospect that never really lived up to his expectations until 00-01. He was often injured and very inconsistent, therefore was a disappointment. His inconsistency continued over the next seasons.

All that being said, I think he's a crucial element to our team and I want him signed.
So im not in the least complaining about him nor making him a scapegoat.
Unlike many people here, i can be critical, realistic and still like/want the man to play for us.

Quote:
Originally Posted by King Kovalev View Post
Marian Hossa had 66 points last year, weren't you one of those going and was willing to pay him 6 +.. Im seeing double standards here.
No I wasn't.
I didn't want Gainey to move Higgins-Grabo-Halak and 1st for Hossa.
Because I knew there was a 99% chance of him not resigning here next year.
I also didn't believe Hossa was going to make us win the cup.

All in all, just like in Pittsburgh, It would just cripple the team in the long run.

Just to clear something up as well. Kovalev had 66pts in 82GP, Hossa 66 in 72GP, there's a little difference there.
Also, 66pts in 72GP is disappointing from Hossa. We can all admit that, even he would.
The same can be said about Kovalev's season of 66pts in 82GP.


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Old
07-08-2008, 06:50 AM
  #305
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Also, 66pts in 72GP is disappointing from Hossa. We can all admit that, even he would.
The same can be said about Kovalev's season of 66pts in 82GP.
I disagree. Kovalev's 66 point season at age 25 was his BEST up to that point in his career. It was, in fact, the stepping stone to his best seasons.

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Old
07-08-2008, 12:25 PM
  #306
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Originally Posted by BaseballCoach View Post
I disagree. Kovalev's 66 point season at age 25 was his BEST up to that point in his career. It was, in fact, the stepping stone to his best seasons.
Correct me if im wrong but wasn't his 7th or 8th season in the league??..wasn't he 28 and not 25??..
Although it was his best season so far(only by 8pts), he still wasn't living up to his expectations.

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07-08-2008, 12:37 PM
  #307
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Correct me if im wrong but wasn't his 7th or 8th season in the league??..wasn't he 28 and not 25??..
Although it was his best season so far(only by 8pts), he still wasn't living up to his expectations.
He was 26. It was 1999-2000

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Old
07-08-2008, 12:59 PM
  #308
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Correct me if im wrong but wasn't his 7th or 8th season in the league??..wasn't he 28 and not 25??..
Although it was his best season so far(only by 8pts), he still wasn't living up to his expectations.
So, Kovalev was 26, had just got out of dysnfunctional New York, had his best season so far in his career with 66 points, was moving in the direction of fulfilling whatever potential he had, and we are supposed to label it a "BAD" season.

This gives a whole new meaning to the term "BAD".

For example, Andrei Kostitsyn last year scored 53 points. He has a lot of potential, is moving in the right direction toward fulfilling it, but if this year he scores 60 and next year he scores 65, we are to label next year as "BAD" and this year as, what, "TERRIBLE" and last year as, what, "HORRIBLE"???

I'm sorry, but for some people it seems Kovalev can never satisfy them.

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07-08-2008, 01:47 PM
  #309
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Originally Posted by BaseballCoach View Post
So, Kovalev was 26, had just got out of dysnfunctional New York, had his best season so far in his career with 66 points, was moving in the direction of fulfilling whatever potential he had, and we are supposed to label it a "BAD" season.

This gives a whole new meaning to the term "BAD".

For example, Andrei Kostitsyn last year scored 53 points. He has a lot of potential, is moving in the right direction toward fulfilling it, but if this year he scores 60 and next year he scores 65, we are to label next year as "BAD" and this year as, what, "TERRIBLE" and last year as, what, "HORRIBLE"???

I'm sorry, but for some people it seems Kovalev can never satisfy them.
Kostitsyn?..Come on man..its not even close to comparable.

A.Kost just finished his first real NHL season. If he scores 60 next year and 65 the year after, at least he'll have had a consistent, even if small, production growth over the past 3years( 53-60-65)

Kovalev was playing his 7th or 8th season when he hit 66pts. I never labeled it as bad btw, all i said is it wasn't a good season.

If we start comparing what it means to each player in the league to net 66pts, it'll vary quite a lot. For Lapierre to get 66pts would be a career year, for Kovalev it's mediocre/average at best.
What is it for Hossa or Ovechkin or Crosby to get 66pts?..its a very bad season.

Given all the skills and potential Kovalev had shown as a youngster, scoring 66pts was still not that good of a season, even though it was a career year.

Some players take time to break out, apparently it took Kovalev 8seasons, that's a long ass time.
If he got that 66pts in his 2nd or 3rd season, than ya, it'll have been a good season.

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07-08-2008, 02:12 PM
  #310
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Hossa scored 66 points this season... though, a lot were willing to give him 11M$ for the next season. Oh, and he played with Kovalchuck or Crosby...

If after a Very Bad Season Hossa can have 11M$... It will not be easy to sign Kovalev this year.

Watch out with your examples

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07-08-2008, 02:32 PM
  #311
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaseballCoach View Post
I'm sorry, but for some people it seems Kovalev can never satisfy them.

Right on the money.


Here's the true lowdown, without any bias....

1992–93 New York Rangers NHL 65g 38pts (0,58 ppg) Rookie season
1993–94 New York Rangers NHL 76g 56pts (0,74 ppg)
1994–95 New York Rangers NHL 48g 28pts (0,58 ppg) Lockout season
1995–96 New York Rangers NHL 81g 58pts (0,72 ppg)
1996–97 New York Rangers NHL 45g 35pts (0,77 ppg)
1997–98 New York Rangers NHL 73g 53pts (0,73 ppg)

In his first 6 seasons, we can see Kovalev was pretty constant, only getting a drought in production in the lockout year (only his 3rd season) where he played for Lada Togliatti before the 48 game season began, he was 16pts in 12 games with that team.

1998–99 New York Rangers NHL 14g 7pts (0,50 ppg)
1998–99 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 63g 46pts (0,73 ppg)
1998-99 Totals 77g 53pts (0,69 ppg) He remained quite constant to his old habits once with Pittsburg.


1999–00 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 82g 66pts (0,80 ppg) His best ppg average at that point, was entering his prime
2000–01 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 79g 95pts (1,20 ppg) His best ppg average at that point, reached his prime
2001–02 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 67g 76pts (1,13 ppg) Very good season again

2002–03 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 54g 64pts (1,19 ppg)
2002–03 New York Rangers NHL 24g 13pts (0,54)
2002–03 Totals NHL 78g 77pts (0,99 ppg) Good season

Now, KrissE, tell me, was it because Kovy was inconsistent or rather because the Rangers didn't have Jagr and Lemieux that Kovy produced less?

2003–04 New York Rangers NHL 66g 42pts (0,64 ppg)
2003–04 Montreal Canadiens NHL 12g 3pts (0,25 ppg)
2003–04 Totals NHL 78g 45pts (0,58 ppg) Bad season and we know the reasons for it

2005–06 Montreal Canadiens NHL 69g 65pts (0,94) Very god season
2006–07 Montreal Canadiens NHL 73g 47pts (0,64) Bad season
2007–08 Montreal Canadiens NHL 82g 84pts (1,02 ppg) Arguably his best career season as he had no Lemieux or Jagr at his side

So since Kovy entered his prime, he only had 2 bad seasons out of 6.

Before his prime, he had one bad season out of 7, if you can actually call it a bad season (as I wouldn't) as it was only just a bit more than a half season because of the lockout and only his 3rd career season.

So 3 bad seasons out of 13, one because of youth and a lockout, another because of a rotten team with bad work ethics, and a 3rd because of a disfunctional line and a bad relationship with the coach.

Can we really say that Kovy is inconsistent?

I don't think so.

Oh, and he's 95pts in 112 playoff games, for a career ppg of 0,85


The poster boy for inconsistency, huh, Vlad? Don't let the facts hit you on your way out. BTW, I do say that he CAN be inconsistent, some games he just isn't there, but he's not what I'd call the poster boy for inconsistency.


Last edited by Ozymandias: 07-08-2008 at 06:54 PM.
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Old
07-08-2008, 02:33 PM
  #312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperSaku View Post
Hossa scored 66 points this season... though, a lot were willing to give him 11M$ for the next season. Oh, and he played with Kovalchuck or Crosby...

If after a Very Bad Season Hossa can have 11M$... It will not be easy to sign Kovalev this year.

Watch out with your examples
Who was willing to give Hossa 11M... I never saw this report.

Link please??

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07-08-2008, 02:34 PM
  #313
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Can we retitle the thread, this rumour has been shot down.

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07-08-2008, 02:45 PM
  #314
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Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
Who was willing to give Hossa 11M... I never saw this report.

Link please??
I guess you are not serious... Well, I hope.

Anyways, ok then, because you want accurate numbers :

Red Wings obviously offered 7.4M$
Pens offered 5yrs at 7.5M$ per
As per TheFourthPeriod, Habs offered around 8M$ and Oilers 9M$


I said 11M$... sorry I apologize, I didn't want to confuse you with wrong numbers...
Obviously my mistake, it's normal to offer salaries in the 7M$-9M$ range to players who just had a very bad season.

Whatever, I'm sure that you understood that the point of my previous post was not really about the money. Did you?

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07-08-2008, 02:49 PM
  #315
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Originally Posted by bwoar View Post
Can we retitle the thread, this rumour has been shot down.
where was it debunked?? sorry i haven't read the whole thread... I skipped a bunch of posts where people were arguing in circles.

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07-08-2008, 02:54 PM
  #316
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Right on the money.


Here's the true lowdown, without any bias....

1992–93 New York Rangers NHL 65g 38pts (0,58 ppg) Rookie season
1993–94 New York Rangers NHL 76g 56pts (0,74 ppg)
1994–95 New York Rangers NHL 48g 28pts (0,58 ppg) Lockout season
1995–96 New York Rangers NHL 81g 58pts (0,72 ppg)
1996–97 New York Rangers NHL 45g 35pts (0,77 ppg)
1997–98 New York Rangers NHL 73g 53pts (0,73 ppg)

In his first 6 seasons, we can see Kovalev was pretty constant, only getting a drought in production in the lockout year (only his 3rd season) where he played for Lada Togliatti before the 48 game season began, he was 16pts in 12 games with that team.

1998–99 New York Rangers NHL 14g 7pts (0,50 ppg)
1998–99 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 63g 46pts (0,73 ppg)
1998-99 Totals 77g 53pts (0,69 ppg) He remained quite constant to his old habits once with Pittsburg.


1999–00 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 82g 66pts (0,80 ppg) His best ppg average at that point, was entering his prime
2000–01 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 79g 95pts (1,20 ppg) His best ppg average at that point, reached his prime
2001–02 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 67g 76pts (1,13 ppg) Very good season again

2002–03 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 54g 64pts (1,19 ppg)
2002–03 New York Rangers NHL 24g 13pts (0,54)
2002–03 Totals NHL 78g 77pts (0,99 ppg) Good season

Now, KrissE, tell me, was it because Kovy was inconsistent or rather because the Rangers didn't have Jagr and Lemieux that Kovy produced less?

2003–04 New York Rangers NHL 66g 42pts (0,64 ppg)
2003–04 Montreal Canadiens NHL 12g 3pts (0,25 ppg)
2003–04 Totals NHL 78g 45pts (0,58 ppg) Bad season and we know the reasons for it

2005–06 Montreal Canadiens NHL 69g 65pts (0,94) Very god season
2006–07 Montreal Canadiens NHL 73g 47pts (0,64) Bad season
2007–08 Montreal Canadiens NHL 82g 84pts (1,02 ppg) Arguably his best career season as he had no Lemieux or Jagr at his side

So since Kovy entered his prime, he only had 2 bad seasons out of 6.

Before his prime, he had one bad season out of 7, if you can actually call it a bad season (as I wouldn't) as it was only just a bit more than a half season because of the lockout and only his 3rd career season.

So 3 bad seasons out of 13, one because of youth and a lockout, another because of a rotten team with bad work ethics, and a 3rd because of a disfunctional line and a bad relationship with the coach.

Can we really say that Kovy is inconsistent?

I don't think so.

Oh, and he's 95pts in 112 playoff games, for a career ppg of 0,85
And in 03/04 when he had a 'bad' year, he was arguably our single best player during the playoffs, leading the team to the historical 3-1 comeback against the bruins.

I agree people are too hard on Kovy, and exagerate his inconsistency.

While I think it's true that his play throughout the regular season can be inconsistent, his point production over a full season generally is not. And, his performance during the post-season is extremely consistent. He always, always brings his A game when the post-season rolls around, I believe that's a valuable trait.

I love the fact he wants an extension, it shows commitment to the club and a true desire to be a Hab, something that seems hard to find these days.

Anything around 4mil/year would be excellent, anything above 5 and I'd be a little hesitant, but probably still be happy to keep him.

Remember, if we lose Kovy, we lose our Top 10 PP, and that is a huge factor in our continued success.

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07-08-2008, 03:57 PM
  #317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Right on the money.


Here's the true lowdown, without any bias....

1992–93 New York Rangers NHL 65g 38pts (0,58 ppg) Rookie season
1993–94 New York Rangers NHL 76g 56pts (0,74 ppg)
1994–95 New York Rangers NHL 48g 28pts (0,58 ppg) Lockout season
1995–96 New York Rangers NHL 81g 58pts (0,72 ppg)
1996–97 New York Rangers NHL 45g 35pts (0,77 ppg)
1997–98 New York Rangers NHL 73g 53pts (0,73 ppg)

In his first 6 seasons, we can see Kovalev was pretty constant, only getting a drought in production in the lockout year (only his 3rd season) where he played for Lada Togliatti before the 48 game season began, he was 16pts in 12 games with that team.

1998–99 New York Rangers NHL 14g 7pts (0,50 ppg)
1998–99 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 63g 46pts (0,73 ppg)
1998-99 Totals 77g 53pts (0,69 ppg) He remained quite constant to his old habits once with Pittsburg.


1999–00 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 82g 66pts (0,80 ppg) His best ppg average at that point, was entering his prime
2000–01 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 79g 95pts (1,20 ppg) His best ppg average at that point, reached his prime
2001–02 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 67g 76pts (1,13 ppg) Very good season again

2002–03 Pittsburgh Penguins NHL 54g 64pts (1,19 ppg)
2002–03 New York Rangers NHL 24g 13pts (0,54)
2002–03 Totals NHL 78g 77pts (0,99 ppg) Good season

Now, KrissE, tell me, was it because Kovy was inconsistent or rather because the Rangers didn't have Jagr and Lemieux that Kovy produced less?

2003–04 New York Rangers NHL 66g 42pts (0,64 ppg)
2003–04 Montreal Canadiens NHL 12g 3pts (0,25 ppg)
2003–04 Totals NHL 78g 45pts (0,58 ppg) Bad season and we know the reasons for it

2005–06 Montreal Canadiens NHL 69g 65pts (0,94) Very god season
2006–07 Montreal Canadiens NHL 73g 47pts (0,64) Bad season
2007–08 Montreal Canadiens NHL 82g 84pts (1,02 ppg) Arguably his best career season as he had no Lemieux or Jagr at his side

So since Kovy entered his prime, he only had 2 bad seasons out of 6.

Before his prime, he had one bad season out of 7, if you can actually call it a bad season (as I wouldn't) as it was only just a bit more than a half season because of the lockout and only his 3rd career season.

So 3 bad seasons out of 13, one because of youth and a lockout, another because of a rotten team with bad work ethics, and a 3rd because of a disfunctional line and a bad relationship with the coach.

Can we really say that Kovy is inconsistent?

I don't think so.

Oh, and he's 95pts in 112 playoff games, for a career ppg of 0,85
Have you watched any of the Habs games in the last three years? Kovalev plays when he wants and when confronted with this fact screams "they don't like russians"...

If he actually played every game wanting to win it he'd have 4-5 100 point seasons but that's not the case. He's at the end of his career, decided to play knowing this, and wants more money because of it. It's simple and don't think the guy is stupid for a second.

He's an ass but gainey is smarted and will have to eat the "Kovalev had a crappy season beacuse you didn't extend his contract" while letting him walk next year.

Sign Federov so he can tell him to ****. Federov would be great for our kids.

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07-08-2008, 04:00 PM
  #318
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Have you watched any of the Habs games in the last three years? Kovalev plays when he wants and when confronted with this fact screams "they don't like russians"...

If he actually played every game wanting to win it he'd have 4-5 100 point seasons but that's not the case. He's at the end of his career, decided to play knowing this, and wants more money because of it. It's simple and don't think the guy is stupid for a second.

He's an ass but gainey is smarted and will have to eat the "Kovalev had a crappy season beacuse you didn't extend his contract" while letting him walk next year.

Sign Federov so he can tell him to ****. Federov would be great for our kids.



Now run Forrest, run!

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07-08-2008, 04:37 PM
  #319
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[QUOTE=Ozymandias;14770021]And get paid more than Zetterberg?


The lesson here :

You can't base yourself on other player's contracts... Especially when they are on another team and especially when the player used on comparison was signed on the market whereas Kovy probably won't, he'll signed an extention.

And before you reply, yes I know that Zets will be on the last year of his contract he signed long ago.[/QUOTE]

I won't reply then ...

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07-08-2008, 04:41 PM
  #320
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
And get paid more than Zetterberg?


The lesson here :

You can't base yourself on other player's contracts... Especially when they are on another team and especially when the player used on comparison was signed on the market whereas Kovy probably won't, he'll signed an extention.

And before you reply, yes I know that Zets will be on the last year of his contract he signed long ago.
I won't reply then ...
Damn... you on the slow side of things? I posted that, like 2-3 days ago?

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07-08-2008, 05:05 PM
  #321
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Originally Posted by Le Slow Poke View Post
Have you watched any of the Habs games in the last three years? Kovalev plays when he wants and when confronted with this fact screams "they don't like russians"...
Have you?

03-04 - Dominant in the playoffs, playign to the best of his ability.
05-06 - nearly a PPG, excellent for kovalev, top of his ability
06-07 - one bad year, playing with a lazy ribeiro and even lazier samsonov.
07-08 - nearly a PPG, top of his ability.

Quote:
If he actually played every game wanting to win it he'd have 4-5 100 point seasons
This is the crap people spout so they can crap all over Kovy no matter what he does.

Fact is, Kovy is a great player, but IS NOT CAPABLE of getting 100pts. Lets let that myth die... He's never done it, he's only come close one time out of 17 seasons, so what basis is there for these claims that he could score '100 pts if he wanted to'?

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07-08-2008, 05:47 PM
  #322
znk
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Originally Posted by Le Slow Poke View Post
Have you watched any of the Habs games in the last three years? Kovalev plays when he wants and when confronted with this fact screams "they don't like russians"...

If he actually played every game wanting to win it he'd have 4-5 100 point seasons but that's not the case. He's at the end of his career, decided to play knowing this, and wants more money because of it. It's simple and don't think the guy is stupid for a second.

He's an ass but gainey is smarted and will have to eat the "Kovalev had a crappy season beacuse you didn't extend his contract" while letting him walk next year.

Sign Federov so he can tell him to ****. Federov would be great for our kids.

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07-08-2008, 06:55 PM
  #323
Ozymandias
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Originally Posted by znk View Post
That should be his avatar. nuff said

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07-08-2008, 09:03 PM
  #324
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Le Slow Poke View Post
Have you watched any of the Habs games in the last three years? Kovalev plays when he wants and when confronted with this fact screams "they don't like russians"...

If he actually played every game wanting to win it he'd have 4-5 100 point seasons but that's not the case. He's at the end of his career, decided to play knowing this, and wants more money because of it. It's simple and don't think the guy is stupid for a second.

He's an ass but gainey is smarted and will have to eat the "Kovalev had a crappy season beacuse you didn't extend his contract" while letting him walk next year.

Sign Federov so he can tell him to ****. Federov would be great for our kids.
Kovalev isn't being paid as though he had 4-5 consecutive 100 point seasons. Fedorov is 39 and he hasn't had a productive season since 2003-04, so I'd prefer to keep Kovalev. The "kids" are doing just fine with Kovalev and don't ned an over-the-hill playboy who panted after Anna Kournikova.

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Old
07-08-2008, 11:32 PM
  #325
Slick Nick
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Not thread worthy so..

Kovy said in an interview in the russian press that he won't go back to the RSL, thinks the league is not very professionnal...

I guess it's good news.

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