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Old
07-20-2008, 10:29 AM
  #926
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggest Canuck Fan View Post
In DN's defense, a paper cannot produce any story w/out some truth to it. Otherwise they would face lible, yet they stand by their story. Seems to me they may have broken a story that was not in the Sundin timetable.
Or the journalist got it from someone connected to the KHL team in question (like a swedish scout or agent).

And despite having it denied by CAA Sports he found the story so juicy that he decided to publish it anyway.

It's a slow summer for hockey journalists you know.

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07-20-2008, 10:37 AM
  #927
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hdw View Post
Or the journalist got it from someone connected to the KHL team in question (like a swedish scout or agent).

And despite having it denied by CAA Sports he found the story so juicy that he decided to publish it anyway.

It's a slow summer for hockey journalists you know.
If there was no truth to what was published, they would not stand by this story. To me it seems they broke a story that was not meant to be leaked so early.

It could also be that Mats just wants to talk to Vancouver freely, and they were one of the teams, but the only one mentioned.

DN did not print supposition however. And a story this big just would not be haphazardly printed.

I believe the story.

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07-20-2008, 10:54 AM
  #928
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Originally Posted by Biggest Canuck Fan View Post
If there was no truth to what was published, they would not stand by this story. To me it seems they broke a story that was not meant to be leaked so early.
The actual story is 100% true. An anonymous source, by phrasing in the original article clearly connected to some KHL team, told the reporter that Barry had told the KHL agent with a big offer that they could forget about it because Sundin had already decided to sign with Vancouver.

The question is if the source told the truth or was just making stuff up to keep the reporter happy (and maybe get a few more free beers).

It's also fully possible that Barry told the KHL dudes to get lost because he knew that Sundin wouldn't even ponder Russia, and just pointed to the Vancouver offer to convince them sod off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggest Canuck Fan View Post
DN did not print supposition however. And a story this big just would not be haphazardly printed.

I believe the story.
The reporter also spoke to Claes Elefalk (CAA's rep) but did a very fine job of cut'n'paste in the answers to remove the outright denial he got from him.

The reporter later wrote on his own blog that he knew that it was a wild rumour but stated that it was big enough to publish anyway.

I bet that he's hard on his knees praying that it turns out to be correct, or his time on DN will be short.

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07-20-2008, 10:54 AM
  #929
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Originally Posted by Biggest Canuck Fan View Post
If there was no truth to what was published, they would not stand by this story. To me it seems they broke a story that was not meant to be leaked so early.

DN did not print supposition however. And a story this big just would not be haphazardly printed.

I believe the story.
So all his talk about taking his timt to decide was posturing? He decided right away, but just wanted to make a big scene? I don't buy it. I fully expect this to take at least two weeks into August before he announces he's going back to the Leafs. Mats also knows better than to tell anyone what he's thinking. No friends, no family, nothing. He will tell the team he's signing wih and his agents. That's it.

As for printing supposition, a Russian newsie printed Shanny to the KHL about a week ago.

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07-20-2008, 10:59 AM
  #930
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Here is an article from insidehockey.com. The writer is Farhan Devji

Quote:

by Farhan Devji

Late Saturday night, a story written by Dusan Umicevic sports reporter of the leading Swedish daily morning newspaper, Dagens Nyheter (DN) broke that Mats Sundin has indeed decided to accept Vancouver's two year, $20 million offer. The story suggests that J.P. Barry Sundin's North American agent declined to negotiate with the KHL (new Russian league) on the grounds that the long time Maple Leaf is set on joining the Vancouver Canucks.

Claes Elefalk Sundin's Swedish based agent - was interviewed by the Swedish daily and acknowledged that he talked to the Canucks on Friday. Elefalk believes Vancouver was one of the front runners, but wasn't aware of the new developments.

When contacted, the author of the piece, Dusan Umicevic, refused to reveal his source but suggested that "this man has never been wrong before." Umicevic also admitted that he's "built [his] whole career upon this person."

Just like the entire Vancouver Canucks organization and all of its supporters, Umicevic is hoping that his source won't fail him now.

"Sure, this could be his first [blemish], but I hope not, because my reputation lies on this," said Umicevic. "But I think [Mats] will speak soon. I think Vancouver is the right team for him."

Television stations in Sweden are reporting that Sundin will join the Canucks, but none of the leading hockey news sites in Sweden or North America - have picked up on the story as of yet.

Another source stated that judging solely on the reliability of the newspaper in which the story was published, he is convinced that Sundin will be a Canuck in the near future.
It would seem from this that the reporter, Umicevic, is sticking by his story. WOuld his source be that unreliable that he would risk lible?

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07-20-2008, 11:10 AM
  #931
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I am a canucks fan,as for Price in goal,there is no worries,he has been through pressure cookers in his short career already,incl a gutsy move by Gainey to trade Huet.Like Van,TO Montreal is a pressure cooker with the media and fans.Price is a solid goalie with very good calmness regardless of what swirling around,hell be a top notch goalie for a long time.I did think he looked nervous for him,but you could see Montreal looked a little tense(playoff hockey).You can see that Montreal's PP let them down a bit in the playoffs.I really liked Gainey's move to go with Price (shocked at first not keeping Huet).He is basicaly saying he will win us the cup down the road,lets get him the experince and see if we can win now.

As for the report it looks funny(maybe some truth to it ???)Guess the media and fans are as stressed over the pond as well as here.Montreal can survive not getting Sundin,Canucks can not (off depth).Both would be much better with Sundin.Van would (as opposed to some posters) be a legitimate contender to go very deep into the playoffs and the ultimate goal-SC.

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07-20-2008, 11:11 AM
  #932
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggest Canuck Fan View Post
Here is an article from insidehockey.com. The writer is Farhan Devji



It would seem from this that the reporter, Umicevic, is sticking by his story. WOuld his source be that unreliable that he would risk lible?
He's not risking lible. Who cares enough to sue? He's just reporting what a source told him. Eklund does the same. If players or teams were allowed to sue Eklund, he'd be living in a van down by the river by now, to the delight of all.

I don't get why both these teams are so hard after Sundin. Both have serious cap troube going into next season, and risk losing players who can contribute more to their teams than two years worth of Sundin. VAN has 27 M committed next year with Sedin, Sedin, Ohlund, Pyatt, Burrows, with Bernier, Shannon, Edler and Krajicek RFAs. MTL might even be in even worse shape, with 21 M committed, but Tanguay, Koivu, Kovalev, Komisarek, with Higgins, Pleks, Latendresse RFAs. Not to mention they have Price's contract to think about the year after (Sundin would probably be gone by that point).

Does VAN really think Sundin is worth trying to cram all that talent into 17 M in cap space? And MTL trying to do the same with ~25 M?

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07-20-2008, 11:16 AM
  #933
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggest Canuck Fan View Post
In DN's defense, a paper cannot produce any story w/out some truth to it. Otherwise they would face lible, yet they stand by their story. Seems to me they may have broken a story that was not in the Sundin timetable.
perhaps that is how it is in the us or canada but sweden has more lax laws. isnt piratebay in sweden?

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07-20-2008, 11:17 AM
  #934
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Originally Posted by Guillemin View Post
He's not risking lible.
Nope, he's just risking his career.

But that's quite bad too for most people.

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07-20-2008, 11:18 AM
  #935
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guillemin View Post
He's not risking lible. Who cares enough to sue? He's just reporting what a source told him. Eklund does the same. If players or teams were allowed to sue Eklund, he'd be living in a van down by the river by now, to the delight of all.

I don't get why both these teams are so hard after Sundin. Both have serious cap troube going into next season, and risk losing players who can contribute more to their teams than two years worth of Sundin. VAN has 27 M committed next year with Sedin, Sedin, Ohlund, Pyatt, Burrows, with Bernier, Shannon, Edler and Krajicek RFAs. MTL might even be in even worse shape, with 21 M committed, but Tanguay, Koivu, Kovalev, Komisarek, with Higgins, Pleks, Latendresse RFAs. Not to mention they have Price's contract to think about the year after (Sundin would probably be gone by that point).

Does VAN really think Sundin is worth trying to cram all that talent into 17 M in cap space? And MTL trying to do the same with ~25 M?
Actually he is risking lible as reporters have to be 100% for their stories to be run.

As for why the Canucks are so hard for Sundin? He is a 75-80 point player. He is a gamebreaker and while you might not want to commit that money, Gillis feels he is worth the risk. Especially considering that Sundin may only sign for 1 yr instead of 2. That has been mentioned.

I see your concern, but these guys are pretty smart.

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07-20-2008, 11:26 AM
  #936
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hdw View Post
Nope, he's just risking his career.

But that's quite bad too for most people.
its not entirely career suicide, it is pushing the limits of what should and shouldnt be done however.
your theory that the source basically was told to "buzz off" and that sundin wouldnt sign in russia and mentioned the 'nucks offer as proof of why is what im leaning towards in this case. If that is indeed correct and the source truly believes it to be true (or misunderstood what he was told) the reporter is put in a situation where he has a potential scoop and was going on what he was told (and given the magnitude of his signing on both sides of the atlantic) figured it was in his and DN's best interest to publish it. i dont entirely agree with those tactics but i dont see them as entirely wrong either given everyones in the business to make money

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07-20-2008, 11:27 AM
  #937
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The developments are exactly like what went down with Demitra.

► Reported to be signing with Vancouver in a Slovak newspaper.
► Demitra tells North American newspapers that nothing is official yet.
► Canucks then 'officially' sign Demitra.

I'd expect Sundin to be 'officially' signed by the Canucks within a day or two.

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07-20-2008, 11:32 AM
  #938
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Originally Posted by hdw View Post
The reporter also spoke to Claes Elefalk (CAA's rep) but did a very fine job of cut'n'paste in the answers to remove the outright denial he got from him.

The reporter later wrote on his own blog that he knew that it was a wild rumour but stated that it was big enough to publish anyway.

I bet that he's hard on his knees praying that it turns out to be correct, or his time on DN will be short.
It could also be that sundin wants to announce the signing on his own terms and told his people to deny for now. You yourself said elefalk would deny water was wet if told by sundin to do so.

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07-20-2008, 11:49 AM
  #939
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The developments are exactly like what went down with Demitra.

► Reported to be signing with Vancouver in a Slovak newspaper.
► Demitra tells North American newspapers that nothing is official yet.
► Canucks then 'officially' sign Demitra.

I'd expect Sundin to be 'officially' signed by the Canucks within a day or two.
Except there's more than one team interested in Sundin.

?

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07-20-2008, 11:50 AM
  #940
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guillemin View Post
He's not risking lible. Who cares enough to sue? He's just reporting what a source told him. Eklund does the same. If players or teams were allowed to sue Eklund, he'd be living in a van down by the river by now, to the delight of all.

I don't get why both these teams are so hard after Sundin. Both have serious cap troube going into next season, and risk losing players who can contribute more to their teams than two years worth of Sundin. VAN has 27 M committed next year with Sedin, Sedin, Ohlund, Pyatt, Burrows, with Bernier, Shannon, Edler and Krajicek RFAs. MTL might even be in even worse shape, with 21 M committed, but Tanguay, Koivu, Kovalev, Komisarek, with Higgins, Pleks, Latendresse RFAs. Not to mention they have Price's contract to think about the year after (Sundin would probably be gone by that point).

Does VAN really think Sundin is worth trying to cram all that talent into 17 M in cap space? And MTL trying to do the same with ~25 M?
Several of the players you mentioned there aren't really a big part of the canucks future...

The Sedins - through their agent - have already set their asking price at $5.5mill each.. That's just shy of a $2mill raise for each of them... and that's their starting point in negotiating a new contract.

Edler will get the biggest raise... likely $3mill - putting him with the same salary as the other top 4 guys on the team - around $3.5mill.

Ohlund has constantly said that he doesn't like to play anywhere else - and especially important considering his family situation in Vancouver, and will likely take another discount on his contract ... I wouldn't expect much more than the current $3.5mill he's already making to stick in Vancouver.

Burrows will get a raise, but he's still a 3rd liner.. I wouldn't expect anything more than a $1mill raise, putting him in the $1.5mill range.

Pyatt and Krajicek are both replaceable. Hansen or Grabner will come in fulltime by then (if not this season) and replace Pyatt on a rookie contract. A #6 dman can be signed for probably less than the $1.2mill that Krajicek is making right now.

Shannon is a throw-away... I doubt that he makes the team this year, and wouldn't surprise me if he passes through waivers and plays in Manitoba this year.

Finally Bernier, he just got a big boost in his salary this year at $2.5mill... he has a good year with the Sedins, and at most, maybe a bump of $1mill in salary?

That totals to $9mill in added salary... and with 4th liners line Pettinger and Johnson making over $1mill each, they can create more flexibility... Cowan's $750K (as a 13th forward now) also comes off the books, as does Chouinard's $370K (buyout).. creating another $1mill in space.

Basically the reason why Gillis has been able to offer Sundin this type of contract is because of the majority of the players all locked up to reasonable salaries, negotiated under a much smaller salary cap. This gives the canucks room for a couple years... add the fact that there are still some young players on rookie contracts (Raymond, Hansen, Grabner) and it gives the canucks more flexibility.

Whether he's worth $10mill is a different question altogether... and really no player probably is... with all the great things that Sundin can bring to the canucks (not only scoring, but leadership, experience and a legitimate veteran superstar to have around your young players), at $10mill he's still overpaid... but thanks to the canucks current cap situation they have the flexibility to overpay him for a couple years, before they'll need the room (and flexibility) to get Luongo locked up.

of course another worry is that Luongo sees this organization offer up $10mill a year for Sundin, what will he think he's worth when the canucks look to get him signed longterm??

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07-20-2008, 11:52 AM
  #941
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Except No one gives a rats ass about Demitra.
Fixed

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07-20-2008, 11:53 AM
  #942
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Except there's more than one team interested in Sundin.

?
Yes. Just like there was more than one team interested in Demitra. Yet the foreign newspaper reported him signing with the Canucks well before the 'official' signing.

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07-20-2008, 12:33 PM
  #943
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Except there's more than one team interested in Sundin.

?
Apparently Edmonton, Colorado, Florida, Atlanta, Tampa Bay, Washington, Buffalo and New York Rangers all made contract offers to Demitra. Add in Vancouver, and that's almost 1/3 of the league.

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07-20-2008, 12:37 PM
  #944
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personally, I find the Mats Sundin "Will He or Won't He sign" saga as annoying as the Brett Favre one.

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07-20-2008, 12:45 PM
  #945
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Claes Elefalk – Sundin’s Swedish based agent - was interviewed by the Swedish daily and acknowledged that he talked to the Canucks on Friday. Elefalk believes Vancouver was one of the front runners, but wasn’t aware of the new developments.

When contacted, the author of the piece, Dusan Umicevic, refused to reveal his source but suggested that “this man has never been wrong before.” Umicevic also admitted that he’s “built [his] whole career upon this person.”

Just like the entire Vancouver Canucks organization and all of its supporters, Umicevic is hoping that his source won’t fail him now.

“Sure, this could be his first [blemish], but I hope not, because my reputation lies on this,” said Umicevic. “But I think [Mats] will speak soon. I think Vancouver is the right team for him.”

Television stations in Sweden are reporting that Sundin will join the Canucks, but none of the leading hockey news sites – in Sweden or North America - have picked up on the story as of yet.

Another source stated that judging solely on the reliability of the newspaper in which the story was published, he is convinced that Sundin will be a Canuck in the near future.

UPDATE: I can now also confirm that the author’s source is indeed one close to the the Kontinental Hockey League (new elite Russian league). The source has correctly predicted several signings including Jaromir Jagr to Avangard Omsk, Nils Ekman to Khimik, Andreas Johansson to SKA Saint Petersburg, and Mika Hannula to HC CSKA Moscow.
http://insidehockey.com/columns/1881

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07-20-2008, 12:47 PM
  #946
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Originally Posted by TOMapleLaughs View Post
The developments are exactly like what went down with Demitra.

► Reported to be signing with Vancouver in a Slovak newspaper.
► Demitra tells North American newspapers that nothing is official yet.
► Canucks then 'officially' sign Demitra.

I'd expect Sundin to be 'officially' signed by the Canucks within a day or two.
You forgot another point, Demitra made it public knowledge that Vancouver was his first choice.

Sundin:

Was impressed by Montreal.
Was impressed by Vancouver
Has a history with Toronto

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07-20-2008, 12:52 PM
  #947
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Originally Posted by TOMapleLaughs View Post
The developments are exactly like what went down with Demitra.

► Reported to be signing with Vancouver in a Slovak newspaper.
► Demitra tells North American newspapers that nothing is official yet.
► Canucks then 'officially' sign Demitra.

I'd expect Sundin to be 'officially' signed by the Canucks within a day or two.
I must've missed the part where Naslund was seen with Sundin, showing him around Vancouver.

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07-20-2008, 12:56 PM
  #948
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The bottom line is if sundin wants to get paid, play with the best goalie in the world and have a chance for the cup he signs with vancouver. If he wants to betray the leafs and sign with the habs then it will show how much of a classless guy he really is. I don't think sundin is classless and lacks character like that, so I don't see him signing with montreal. If he did though, I wouldn't want a classless guy like that on my team anyways. Saku Koivu would never do such a thing, so I could never see sundin doing it either.

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07-20-2008, 12:56 PM
  #949
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Eklund has also picked the story up, and 'conveniently' slipped in that one of his sources texted him yesterday afternoon (thereby trumping the Swedish leak) to say Sundin was again leaning to Vancouver. That being said, his point on European press is pretty interesting, as the Euro-papers have been breaking quite a few signings this off-season.

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07-20-2008, 12:56 PM
  #950
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So some dude in the KHL is now a reputable source according to this guy.



So HFF is now posing as a Russian spy?

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