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Sens sign Jason Williams [3 yrs @1.9M]: What went wrong, lets pick up the pieces.

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Old
07-11-2008, 10:16 PM
  #51
hoppy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Golden Pheasant View Post
You're probably wrong.

Why would they make a move for a guy to fill a gap in the second line only to lose a second liner in Vermette? There is spceculation that Neil will move for picks so we can fit everyone under the cap like a big happy Neil-less family.

And there is no way we move Mezzy unless it brings a comparable d-man back....again why would we move a d-man when we could still use one?
I think that's plenty feasible, actually.
My interpretation of this move (based on the non-official 1.9 mil/year) is we get a guy who brings almost as much to the table as Vermette, filling the PPQB need, saving a ton of money and at the same time getting an asset back for Vermette who'd be gone next season if we went to arbitration.

Very, verryyyy good asset management on Murray's part if that's the case.

Trading Vermette and or Meszaros would make sense because:
A) We haven't gotten the puckmover we're looking for yet (although Williams fills the desperate need for a PPQB very effectively considering his deal and what was left on the market)
B) Signing Vermette to whatever we're stalling at would be poor asset management since Fisher's locked into the #2 center position (unfortunately) for the next few years
C) Meszaros and Vermette have already been mentioned in potential trades

I don't know if both will be gone, I guess it depends on Willy's contract but I'd say one of them will be moved before the start of the season.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mars Volchenkov View Post
Comparing a guy who had never played a game in North America to a guy whose proven he can put up points and run a powerplay at the NHL level is pretty ridiculous.
Really though, that's just poor logic.


Quote:
Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
That's a real good deal, but at the cost of Vermette? I'm not sure how much I like that trade-off. I guess it depends on the return for Vermette.
Like I mentioned earlier in my post, it's just Murray managing his assets to perfection.
Murray's stuck at paying a lot of money for Vermette or having to pay a little less on a 1-year deal arbitration deal and have Vermette gone next year.
So he then finds the best player suited for our needs, possibly out of all the UFAs since July 1rst at what appears to be an amazing price, and replaces Vermette with him.
He then Flips Vermette for anything from a pick, to the last piece of the puzzle, an offensive defenseman.

So let's rap that up:

Option A Vermette at ~4 mil long term
This doesn't work because Vermette's expendable at that price when Fisher's locked into the #2 center.

Option B - Vermette at ~ <4 mil for a 1-year arbitration deal
A fair price but it still doesn't work for this team and then we get nothing for him next year as a UFA

Option C - Sign a guy who is arguably more useful to this team for half the price, then trade Vermette in either filling a hole or getting a pick in a really big upcoming draft.

I know which one I'd take, but at the same time, we're not 100% sure if that's the deal he's getting and we're not entirely sure what Vermette wanted but even if those estimated numbers are off, it makes a lot of sense for Murray to be doing this.

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Old
07-11-2008, 10:18 PM
  #52
LosT_PropheT
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shef View Post
Heatley Spezza Williams
Foligno Fisher Alfredsson
Kelly Vermette Ruutu
Mcammond Bass Donovan
More importantly....Alfredsson not on 1st line??

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Old
07-11-2008, 10:21 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LosT_PropheT View Post
More importantly....Alfredsson not on 1st line??
Spreads out the offense and Fisher-Alfie is a pretty good combo.

Alfie will still be on the first PP unit.

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Old
07-11-2008, 10:24 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoppy View Post
Option B - Vermette at ~ <4 mil for a 1-year arbitration deal
I'm pretty sure it's 2 years. I thought he just misses the date and so he will be an extra year before UFA.

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Old
07-11-2008, 11:15 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shef View Post
Heatley Spezza Williams
Foligno Fisher Alfredsson
Kelly Vermette Ruutu
Mcammond Bass Donovan
Heatley - Spezza - Fisher
Vermette - Williams - Alfredsson
Kelly - Nikulin/Zubov/Mirnov - Foligno
Ruutu - Bass - Donovan

That's a good lookin team.

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Old
07-11-2008, 11:46 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danishh View Post
quick update to non-sens fans:

a) signing is done, will be made official tommorow. Expect a press release in the morning and a conference in the afternoon.

b) Deal appears to be 3 years @1.9M

c) Vermette may be on his way out.

the-sens-outsider.blogspot.com

props to mattlef, JC.
If so that's pure gold, and an absolute steal, I'd take that Williams over Eaves and a slightly cheaper salary any day. Sorry girls.

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Old
07-12-2008, 12:06 AM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheektovanek View Post
Meh, an alright 40-50 point 2nd-3rd liner.
Really? I thought he had 36 points in 43 games last year. He'd have to really have an off season to fall in point totals that badly, wouldn't he?

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Old
07-12-2008, 12:10 AM
  #58
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Sorry if it's been posted already, but the Brendan Bell signing is official: one year, two-way, from the Senators

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Old
07-12-2008, 12:12 AM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruiser008 View Post
Response to #1: After his concussion during the 2006-07 season he didn't show the same willingness to go to high traffic areas like he used to. Not sure about last year; perhaps a Blackhawks fan can comment.

Response to #2: He was playing on the 3rd and 4th lines his first two years but he never had a checking role. Big difference.

Response to #3: He shouldn't be playing the point on the PP anyways; ideally he should be playing the half boards on the 2nd PP.

He's a team player but it's very unlikely he'll become your hardest worker. Babcock who puts a premium on work ethic was not a fan of him and remarked that Calder (whom he was traded for) provided more grit.

Despite his shortcomings Williams is shifty, has good hockey sense and should easily put up 50-60 points; an EXCELLENT signing by Ottawa.
Blackhawk fan here. Sounds about right. If he stays healthy, JW has some serious upside, I think. He looked great at the beginning of last season before he got hurt, 20 points in 20 games.

Solid signing, great price (if it's legit).

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07-12-2008, 12:14 AM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LosT_PropheT View Post
More importantly....Alfredsson not on 1st line??
Im more a fan of spreading out a teams offense. Williams is a player you could play on any of your top 3 lines and could still be effective. Heatley/Spezza/Williams would still be a awesome first line. Also him being a right handed shot will greatly help on the powerplay and being able to launch one timers when hes getting a pass from Mezaros and vice versa.

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Old
07-12-2008, 01:06 AM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shef View Post
Im more a fan of spreading out a teams offense. Williams is a player you could play on any of your top 3 lines and could still be effective. Heatley/Spezza/Williams would still be a awesome first line. Also him being a right handed shot will greatly help on the powerplay and being able to launch one timers when hes getting a pass from Mezaros and vice versa.
Williams with Speatley isn't a good idea. Alfredsson is such an effective player because he is such a complete player. That spot needs to be filled by a guy who is a solid forechecker, has great puck possesion skills and skates fast to make up for the fact that Spezza and Heatley aren't the fastest skaters. Fisher would be perfect if he was willing to move to the wing or Foligno is he continues his progress. That being said putting Williams with Alfredsson is just asking for trouble... if your a goaltender on the opposing team.

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Old
07-12-2008, 01:29 AM
  #62
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If that's the price, great deal for the Sens

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Old
07-12-2008, 01:32 AM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shef View Post
Heatley Spezza Williams
Foligno Fisher Alfredsson
Kelly Vermette Ruutu
Mcammond Bass Donovan
I'd like to see something like:

Williams-Spezza-Alfredsson
Vermette-Fisher-Heatley
Foligno-Kelly-Neil
Ruutu-McAmmond-Donovan
Ex: Bass

I don't think Vermette is going anywhere, neither is Neil.

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Old
07-12-2008, 04:59 AM
  #64
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Could be the steal of the summer and more so if for 3 years @ that price IMO. He is a guy that I think can run rough shot on a line with Heatley or Alfredsson because of his superior offensive instincts.

The hernia thing is nothing, I was more concerned about him when Raffi Torres nearley killed the guy with a headshot couple seasons ago.

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Old
07-12-2008, 11:27 AM
  #65
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Is this Williams thing done yet?

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07-12-2008, 12:01 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
Is this Williams thing done yet?
3 years @ $1.9m sounds too good to be true. If it is Ottawa will be stacked at forward if Vermette is resigned.

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Old
07-12-2008, 12:13 PM
  #67
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he's as streaky as hell..

seriously he'll dissapear for half the season, you just have to hope he's not injured for the other half

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Old
07-12-2008, 01:07 PM
  #68
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FWIW, NHLSCAP.com has Williams on the Sens at 1.9M. He had Ehrhoff up before the deal was announced as well.

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Old
07-12-2008, 01:13 PM
  #69
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i'm gonna pm IB to ask. If he says yes, i'm changing this to official.

per IB, contract signed last night, has yet to be approved by NHL
(formality really as far as I know).

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Old
07-12-2008, 01:19 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
Is this Williams thing done yet?
Apparently the only reason it hasn't been made official yet is because Murray's neck deep in a significant trade.
I already forget where I heard it, maybe from the Sens insider that broke this deal, but it could be anything from a deal surrounding Khabi + Barker to a straight up swing for a dman in Vancouver.

More to come

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Old
07-12-2008, 01:22 PM
  #71
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He's not a powerplay QB. He's the point shooter.

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Old
07-12-2008, 02:12 PM
  #72
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Unless they Frogren us.

Edited: Dysleia + bad keyboard = A lot of mistakes, reading what I write is like listening to Yoda.


Last edited by Laoghaire: 07-12-2008 at 02:26 PM.
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Old
07-12-2008, 02:14 PM
  #73
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Unless the Frogren us.
***?

edit: oh.... THEY.

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Old
07-12-2008, 02:18 PM
  #74
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What a steal at 1.9 million!

Somehow Radim Vrbata gets 3 million and Murray locks up Williams at that price... awesome work.

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Old
07-12-2008, 02:20 PM
  #75
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I hope Murray keeps Vermette and we have a legit second line of Vermette-Fisher-Williams OR we get a top four defenseman back like Kevin Bieksa.

Bieska-Meszaros would be gold as our second pairing. I don't think Foligno is ready for top six minutes so that's the reason I want Murray to keep Vermette.

Our PP unit #1:
Heatley-Spezza-Alfredsson
Williams-Meszaros

PP unit #2:
Vermette-Fisher-Foligno
Schubert-Lee

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