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Sundin to Montreal Rumors and Discussion Part 7

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Old
07-18-2008, 09:21 PM
  #326
FerrisRox
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Delat View Post
This is getting so complicated! I wish MolsonMan was still there...
It's really not complicated at all.

Sundin has said *nothing.*

He's said nothing publicly.

And he's said nothing privately.

JP Barry isn't lying when he's said his mind isn't made up.

It's not.

All of the "inside" posts from the Vancouver board are total nonsense.

The only reason this appears complicated is there is so much speculation and so little information. The more time passes, the more restless people get, so they start trying to find information. But Sundin has said nothing to tip his hand.

NOTHING.

In reality, it couldn't be less complicated.


Last edited by FerrisRox: 07-18-2008 at 09:46 PM.
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07-18-2008, 09:33 PM
  #327
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Originally Posted by FerrisRox View Post
It's really not complicated at all.

Sundin has said *nothing.*

He's said nothing publically.

And he's said nothing privately.

JP Barry isn't lying when he's said his mind isn't made up.

It's not.

All of the "inside" posts from the Vancouver board are total nonsense.

The only reason this appears complicated is there is so much speculation and so little information. The more time passes, the more restless people get, so they start trying to find information. But Sundin has said nothing to tip his hand.

NOTHING.

In reality, it couldn't be less complicated.
Best post of all the editions of this thread.

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07-18-2008, 09:34 PM
  #328
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Sundin has an offer of 2 years for $20 million from a team he does not want to play for. Now he can use the summer to see if he can get a team he does want to play for(NYR, TOR, MTL, OTT) to match the offer, or at least to come close.

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07-18-2008, 09:39 PM
  #329
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Originally Posted by The NHL Rant View Post
Yes, the Messier era certainly showed a lack of enthusiasm for the team. However, I believe that to be a combination of poor play/high expectations (also a factor last year) and the fact that most fans were extremely angry with the management for trading away Linden and generally mismanaging the team into the ground. I don't believe that it simply had to do with missing the playoffs a few times, although that's certainly a factor. The poster I was replying to was suggesting that all Vancouver needed to do was go downhill for the stadium to dwindle to 10,000 for "any" game. That statement is incorrect, as demonstrated last season when the Canucks went downhill.

I'd play in any city for $20 million dollars for two years, regardless of the beauty or ugliness of that city. So, I'm not kidding myself - the $10 million per season is the biggest sell. But we would also be kidding ourselves to believe that Sundin has not considered the city itself, and is factoring that into his decision. Vancouver is beautiful, and, as an added bonus, is hosting the Olympics. I can't speak for Sundin, but if I were planning to play for my country, the fact that the venue would be where I already live and play would tweak my interest. I certainly do not believe that it's THE selling point that pushes him over the edge, I simply think it naive to believe that he wouldn't even factor that into his overall appraisal of the Vancouver offer.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I assume that you intended your list of what Sundin might be thinking to demonstrate the numerous factors that are or may be influencing Sundin's decision, not necessarily as a few possibilities that Sundin is considering independent of one another. I get your point, that there's no real basis for believing one team has an advantage over another, but that wasn't what I was intending to convey in my first post in any case. While you can't say "Vancouver has a better chance than Montreal" one can say that certain conditions and developments may increase the chance of one city, independent of the others. The signing of Demitra, for example, is one of those developments. This isn't to say that this means Vancouver has a better chance than (name city), but simply that it has a better chance.

I disagree that the second item on your list would be bad news for Vancouver. With Vancouver, he'd be getting the highest pay, and would be playing for a stronger squad. People are heavily underestimating Vancouver with Sundin. With a forward corps featuring Sundin, Sedin, Sedin, Bernier, Demitra, and defensive corps featuring Mitchell, Edler, Bieksa, Ohlund, Salo, and Luongo - Vancouver is a playoff team, most likely a division winner. Cup? No, that's probably Detroit. I don't mind being the fan of an underestimated team, in fact, I love it, but it tends to create numerous points of contention on boards like these.

The intent of my post wasn't to argue that Vancouver has a better chance than Montreal. It was, firstly, to rebut an ignorant post and, secondly, to stress that my confidence in Vancouver signing Sundin has been going up lately.
LOLLLLLLLLLLLLL
Ohlund?..Salo??..Demitra?..
It would have to be a miracle year for them to play a full season. None of these players are what they used to be and are way past their prime.
Bernier isn't even a top6 yet.
Without Sundin they barely even have 1 top line. Sundin is good but he's no superstar anymore. They wouldn't magically be cup contenders with him.

As for the Habs, I don't see why we wouldn't be considered cup contenders..We have the same team, Tanguay should net as many if not more points than Streit, and we added Laraque.
Our youngsters are full of clear potential and just keep growing.

Even WITH Sundin, VAN wouldn't be stronger than us..Only in goaltending do they surpass us. We dominate by a pretty nice margin in terms of Offense and Defense.

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Old
07-18-2008, 09:49 PM
  #330
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
LOLLLLLLLLLLLLL
Ohlund?..Salo??..Demitra?..
It would have to be a miracle year for them to play a full season. None of these players are what they used to be and are way past their prime.
Bernier isn't even a top6 yet.
Without Sundin they barely even have 1 top line. Sundin is good but he's no superstar anymore. They wouldn't magically be cup contenders with him.

As for the Habs, I don't see why we wouldn't be considered cup contenders..We have the same team, Tanguay should net as many if not more points than Streit, and we added Laraque.
Our youngsters are full of clear potential and just keep growing.

Even WITH Sundin, VAN wouldn't be stronger than us..Only in goaltending do they surpass us. We dominate by a pretty nice margin in terms of Offense and Defense.
Adding Sundin would give the Habs immense offensive depth. Besides, he's too big to be pushed around.

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07-18-2008, 10:10 PM
  #331
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Originally Posted by Joe Malone View Post
Monday "Hey J.P., Mike Gillis here. How's Mats? Still fishing, eh? Well, we got Pavol Demitra. Talk to you tomorrow...."

Tuesday "J.P., what's happening? Talk to Mats? Still fishing? Yeah, so am I.....tell him I said hello, aaaaaand, we got Pavol Demitra. Yeah."

Wednesday "J.P. old buddy, Mike here............Mike.......Mike Gillis? GM with the Vancouver Canucks.....remember? Vancouver? Where the Olympics will be held? Mats still fishing is he? Tell him I said hello, and I got lots of money. Lots of money. Did I tell you we signed Pavol Demitra?"

Thursday "J.P., J.P., J.P., how's it going today? Talk to Mats? Still fishing.....wow, fish must really be biting, eh? We've got Pavol Demitra, the Olympics, lots of money and better weather than Montreal. Markus Naslund? No, he's gone. Mats wouldn't like him anyway. Talk to you tomorrow."

Friday "J.P., how come I'm getting your answering machine today? Have you gone fishing with Mats? Oh man, why didn't you tell me? I would have gone too. I love fishing. Pavol Demitra's in town today. He wanted to meet Mats - maybe we could set something up. Give me a call.....O.K.?"

Saturday "Damn answering machine again.... Yeah, J.P., Mike Gillis here. I've got Pavol Demitra with me. He wants to talk with Mats....here, I'll pass him the phone."

"Hi Mats, this is Pavol. Come to Vancouver. It's really nice. They got lots of money, the olympics and me, Pavol Demitra.........did I say that right Mike?"

"Yeah, yeah. Gimme the phone. Give us a call J.P. We got lots of money, the olympics, the Sedin twins, Mathias Ohlund and Pavol Demitra. Looking forward to hearing from you."

Sunday "J.P., you're there! No answering machine today. How's Mats.....still fishing? He signed with Montreal?!! But, but,.....we got Pavol Demitra.....the olympics. And Pavol Demitra...."

hahaha, awesome post.

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Old
07-18-2008, 10:15 PM
  #332
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My opinion on the whole Sundin affair is that he will either sign with the Habs or Rangers or retire. I honestly can't picture him coming back to the Leafs or entertaining an offer from Vancouver at this point of his carreer...

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Old
07-18-2008, 11:33 PM
  #333
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Originally Posted by FerrisRox View Post
It's really not complicated at all.

Sundin has said *nothing.*

He's said nothing publicly.

And he's said nothing privately.

JP Barry isn't lying when he's said his mind isn't made up.

It's not.

All of the "inside" posts from the Vancouver board are total nonsense.

The only reason this appears complicated is there is so much speculation and so little information. The more time passes, the more restless people get, so they start trying to find information. But Sundin has said nothing to tip his hand.

NOTHING.

In reality, it couldn't be less complicated.

Agree...not complicated, but certainly frustrating. Sundin has had how many months to make up his mind? Leafs were done playing in April. So he's had how many months to decide if he's coming back to the NHL? 3?

If he's coming back....there's only a shortlist of team that can afford him, and an even shorter list he wants to play for.

By waiting so long, Sundin is partially letting his mind get made for him....as teams move to Plan B's.

This whole drama should not be playing out this long...and as much as Sundin would fill a need for the Habs...I really wish BG had of moved to his Plan B.

I question a guy that takes this long to make up his mind. Do you wanna play hockey or not? If you do, do you want to play for top dollar or a contender? It's not that hard, really....certainly not as hard as Sundin is making it out to be.

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Old
07-18-2008, 11:52 PM
  #334
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Originally Posted by sergejean View Post
My opinion on the whole Sundin affair is that he will either sign with the Habs or Rangers or retire. I honestly can't picture him coming back to the Leafs or entertaining an offer from Vancouver at this point of his carreer...
Rags are clearing cap space to bring back Shanny. Once that happens, we cand stop talking bout the Rags. Unless they cheat the cap again this year, and the league lets them get away with it... again.

Leafs are still in this. Their team got better, in spite of the criticism Fletcher took, and he still loves the Leafs. I'd put their chances above ours and above Vancouver's.

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Old
07-18-2008, 11:57 PM
  #335
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FerrisRox View Post
It's really not complicated at all.

Sundin has said *nothing.*

He's said nothing publicly.

And he's said nothing privately.

JP Barry isn't lying when he's said his mind isn't made up.

It's not.

All of the "inside" posts from the Vancouver board are total nonsense.

The only reason this appears complicated is there is so much speculation and so little information. The more time passes, the more restless people get, so they start trying to find information. But Sundin has said nothing to tip his hand.

NOTHING.

In reality, it couldn't be less complicated.
Sorry, I forgot it, there it is... --- >

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Old
07-19-2008, 01:21 AM
  #336
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Originally Posted by FerrisRox View Post
It's really not complicated at all.

Sundin has said *nothing.*

He's said nothing publicly.

And he's said nothing privately.

JP Barry isn't lying when he's said his mind isn't made up.

It's not.

All of the "inside" posts from the Vancouver board are total nonsense.

The only reason this appears complicated is there is so much speculation and so little information. The more time passes, the more restless people get, so they start trying to find information. But Sundin has said nothing to tip his hand.

NOTHING.

In reality, it couldn't be less complicated.
I don't think the "inside" posts are total nonsense. It's apparent that the posters are well-respected and reliable.

But you have to wonder who's feeding the information to the Canucks employees who are passing it on to the board insiders. Quite possibly it's GM Mike Gillis, who's indulging in wishful thinking of the most fantastic kind.

His statement that the 2010 Winter Olympics could be an incentive for Sundin to sign with Vancouver tells me that this guy is really reaching. How in blue blazes does the Winter Olympics two years in the future have ANYTHING to do with where Sundin signs?

That's one of the most ridiculous flights of fancy I've heard in this whole wacky process. Gillis needs to have his head examined.

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Old
07-19-2008, 01:31 AM
  #337
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Sundin................!!!!

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Old
07-19-2008, 04:31 AM
  #338
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Originally Posted by greyboy67 View Post
I don't think the "inside" posts are total nonsense. It's apparent that the posters are well-respected and reliable.

But you have to wonder who's feeding the information to the Canucks employees who are passing it on to the board insiders. Quite possibly it's GM Mike Gillis, who's indulging in wishful thinking of the most fantastic kind.

His statement that the 2010 Winter Olympics could be an incentive for Sundin to sign with Vancouver tells me that this guy is really reaching. How in blue blazes does the Winter Olympics two years in the future have ANYTHING to do with where Sundin signs?



That's one of the most ridiculous flights of fancy I've heard in this whole wacky process. Gillis needs to have his head examined.
I dont understand that either. I try to imagine myself in the same scenario as mats and I wonder why I would even give a damn about the olympics being in the same city I play in. Its not like mats is going to play on the other side of the continent if he doesn;t play in vancouver, so I dont think travel is an issue.

I would understand the selling point if mats was born and bred in vancouver or anywhere in BC, but under these circumstances, I think its a stretch to use this olympic thing as a selling point.

The canucks do have a solid selling point in their very generous contract on the table, but the olympic thing? I dont think so.

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Old
07-19-2008, 07:08 AM
  #339
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Originally Posted by Hackett View Post
I dont understand that either. I try to imagine myself in the same scenario as mats and I wonder why I would even give a damn about the olympics being in the same city I play in. Its not like mats is going to play on the other side of the continent if he doesn;t play in vancouver, so I dont think travel is an issue.

I would understand the selling point if mats was born and bred in vancouver or anywhere in BC, but under these circumstances, I think its a stretch to use this olympic thing as a selling point.

The canucks do have a solid selling point in their very generous contract on the table, but the olympic thing? I dont think so.
if thats what its come down to for him to sell vancouver he's trying a last ditch effort because sundin has shown no interest.

as a hockey player if both teams were equally stanley cup contenders (which as much as canucks fans would like to think so are not) then which would you choose? to be part of the greatest nhl franchise's 100th anniversary or the chance to be in a city 2 years from now during the olympics? the guy is thinking about retirement to booth this year let alone 2 years from now. if sundin signs with anyone it will be for a year

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Old
07-19-2008, 07:08 AM
  #340
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http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/2008/...aclean_sundin/

Former Jackets GM Maclean says it's Toronto or Retire according to 'his sources'.

I know Maclean wasn't a great GM, but his sources are probably much better than any wanna be on the 'Nucks board.

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Old
07-19-2008, 07:34 AM
  #341
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I haven't made a single post about the whole Mats Sundin to Montreal talk on either board but I have to say....Sundin, really? The guys is literally the image of the Maple Leafs, the icon.

Come on, he would never look right in that jersey, and would you seriously cheer him on to a cup. Go get someone else, Mats to the Habs is no good any way you slice it if he wanted to be a Hab I am sure it would have been done already. Give it up, go sign another center or trade for one.

I mean really think about it, Sundin a Hab
If I am a true Habs fan I win without him or not at all.

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Old
07-19-2008, 07:36 AM
  #342
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AH View Post
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/2008/...aclean_sundin/

Former Jackets GM Maclean says it's Toronto or Retire according to 'his sources'.

I know Maclean wasn't a great GM, but his sources are probably much better than any wanna be on the 'Nucks board.
GM is that what he was doing in Columbus?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HellasLEAF View Post
I haven't made a single post about the whole Mats Sundin to Montreal talk on either board but I have to say....Sundin, really? The guys is literally the image of the Maple Leafs, the icon.

Come on, he would never look right in that jersey, and would you seriously cheer him on to a cup.
Go get someone else, Mats to the Habs is no good any way you slice it if he wanted to be a Hab I am sure it would have been done already. Give it up, go sign another center or trade for one.

I mean really think about it, Sundin a Hab
If I am a true Habs fan I win without him or not at all.
Come on could you not imagine the ammunition that would give us (habs fans) for t-shirts and post cards and jokes in general.

I would love nothing more than Sundin to the Habs and a Cup Parade in June.


Last edited by Beakermania*: 07-19-2008 at 08:00 AM.
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Old
07-19-2008, 07:39 AM
  #343
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Originally Posted by HellasLEAF View Post

I mean really think about it, Sundin a Hab
If I am a true Habs fan I win without him or not at all.
Sundin has never been hated in Montreal. We just hated the Leafs as a whole.

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07-19-2008, 07:44 AM
  #344
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Originally Posted by HellasLEAF View Post
I haven't made a single post about the whole Mats Sundin to Montreal talk on either board but I have to say....Sundin, really? The guys is literally the image of the Maple Leafs, the icon.

Come on, he would never look right in that jersey, and would you seriously cheer him on to a cup. Go get someone else, Mats to the Habs is no good any way you slice it if he wanted to be a Hab I am sure it would have been done already. Give it up, go sign another center or trade for one.

I mean really think about it, Sundin a Hab
If I am a true Habs fan I win without him or not at all.
I'd cheer for any player that makes the Habs better. Sundin would do that so I can certainly picture him in the CH. Besides your not a Habs fan so don't be jealous.

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Old
07-19-2008, 07:44 AM
  #345
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Originally Posted by HellasLEAF View Post
I mean really think about it, Sundin a Hab
If I am a true Habs fan I win without him or not at all.
A true Hab fan wants to win at all costs. If Mats can help that, Habs fans will want him. Who cares who he played for?

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07-19-2008, 08:01 AM
  #346
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Rags are clearing cap space to bring back Shanny. Once that happens, we cand stop talking bout the Rags. Unless they cheat the cap again this year, and the league lets them get away with it... again.

Leafs are still in this. Their team got better, in spite of the criticism Fletcher took, and he still loves the Leafs. I'd put their chances above ours and above Vancouver's.
When did the Rags cheat the cap??? As far as I can tell they havent....

Sure they have lots of high end talent.... but their bottom two lines, and bottom four defence are **** and are paid peanuts.

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Old
07-19-2008, 08:59 AM
  #347
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I dont understand that either. I try to imagine myself in the same scenario as mats and I wonder why I would even give a damn about the olympics being in the same city I play in. Its not like mats is going to play on the other side of the continent if he doesn;t play in vancouver, so I dont think travel is an issue.

I would understand the selling point if mats was born and bred in vancouver or anywhere in BC, but under these circumstances, I think its a stretch to use this olympic thing as a selling point.

The canucks do have a solid selling point in their very generous contract on the table, but the olympic thing? I dont think so.
The olympic thing should be used to convince someone like BC native Joe Sakic as he could be Canada's captain if he's still playing by then. Local guy as the captain of the host nation, now that would be a good selling point and quite a nice story.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pascal View Post
Sundin has never been hated in Montreal. We just hated the Leafs as a whole.
Tucker, McCabe, Domi in particular.

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Old
07-19-2008, 09:28 AM
  #348
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Originally Posted by HellasLEAF View Post
I mean really think about it, Sundin a Hab
If I am a true Habs fan I win without him or not at all.
On the other hand, if Mats plays for the Habs and does well, it'll seem like his previous teams were the wrong ones, that his destiny took an unfortunate twist and he should really have been here all throughout.

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07-19-2008, 09:37 AM
  #349
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Originally Posted by AH View Post
Former Jackets GM Maclean says it's Toronto or Retire according to 'his sources'.
But if Sundin decides to go to the Leafs... do the Leafs want him?
I have a feeling Toronto (or at least Fletcher) wants Sundin back about as much as the Habs wanted to bring back Souray.

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Old
07-19-2008, 09:45 AM
  #350
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Originally Posted by greyboy67 View Post
I don't think the "inside" posts are total nonsense. It's apparent that the posters are well-respected and reliable.
You're welcome to believe whatever you want. I personally say these Vancouver posters with "inside sources" are totally full of crap.

Sundin has not made up his mind in any way, shape or form. He has certainly not tipped his hand in any way to suggest he's signing in Vancouver.

You've got guys on that forum saying he's "95% going to Vancouver." I can tell you, from some "speculation" around work that is totally false. I'm not saying he is not gonna sign there - he has twenty millions reasons to do so - I'm simply telling you right now, it doesn't look to good for them, and to suggest it's "95% done" is laughable. Regardless of the reputations of the posters in question, right now, they are dead wrong.

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