i would hate to think what everyone would be saying if kipper got traded and exploded into his past form and the goalie we got in return just stunk up the joint.
this forum would be in an uproar about why he was traded.
Rarely stole games? The only reason the Flames made it into the playoffs is because of Kipper. Each game against the Sharks, they were consistently outshot and taking stupid penalties, basically leaving Kipper to stand on his head and weather a storm. They took something like 8 penalties against the Sharks, in game 2 or one of them. Kipper only allowed one powerplay goal and that's because the Flames D was a complete joke. I'm happy after all of this that Kipper's still with us, otherwise we'd be bottom feeding with the Coyotes and Kings.
Actually i would say last year the Flames made the playoffs in spite of him. Maybe you don't realize it but the Flames have a pretty decent team, despite what the Oiler fans might try and convince you.
It wasn't just the poor stats which partly are a result of weaker defensive play, but he let in more brutal goals last season then the previous 3 years combined.
If Kipper put up top 10 stats last year, Calgary wins the division. We'll see what he can do this season.
So, according to stats Luongo was just an 'average' goaltender in Florida as well. Vancouver, at the time, overpayed dramatically to get him, it was just sheer luck that he panned out to be the best goaltender in the West over the last two seasons.
If you go by stats, Giguere was the best goaltender in the league and Luongo was only average last season. Giguere had a good season but he's not even a top 5 IMO, while Luongo deserved to win the Vezina.
That said, Kipprusoff had a bad season by his own standards and by the looks of it, he's working his ass off right now so that it doesn't happen again.
How do you know? He usually disappears to Finland in the summer.
He had an average season last year. It all depends on what kind of numbers he puts up this year; specifically his save percentage.
However, you also have to take into account that he has an excellent defense corps in front of him.
Off topic but when the words goalie and overrated are mentioned together then Martin Brodeur comes to mind in my opinion.
But until the eastern dominated media stops voting him in for the Vezina then it won't change. Luongo should have won it two years ago and Nabokov last season.
Kiprusoff - I would say he is talked up a bit by the media in the West but is still a top 5 goalie. I think he has become a little predictable and I think some teams have good scouting reports on him - for example how many times on a 2 on 1 do opposing forwards pass? Most of the time because Kipper is so far out it's an easy tap in for a goal. Also there has to be a scouting report about him going down, hugging the post too soon (see Cheechoo goal, game 4).
by the looks of things to me he is in finland on his boat with a drink in one hand and a smoke in the other... since thats how he spends every summer
That's just what I thought. With that said, he should have something to prove next season. Key word is should, you can't really get a good read on the guy and with new contract kicking in plus NTC, who knows if he really cares...
That's just what I thought. With that said, he should have something to prove next season. Key word is should, you can't really get a good read on the guy and with new contract kicking in plus NTC, who knows if he really cares...
Seriously?
Anyways, like you said, he should have something to prove next season, especially with that new contract kicking in. I think we'll see a bounce back year from Kipper.
Kipper hasn't changed, the Flames have just been getting progressively worse than they were in 05. If you put Kipper on a team with great D, like the Wings or Devils, I guarantee you his numbers would be consistent.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Murderlizer
Rarely stole games? The only reason the Flames made it into the playoffs is because of Kipper. Each game against the Sharks, they were consistently outshot and taking stupid penalties, basically leaving Kipper to stand on his head and weather a storm. They took something like 8 penalties against the Sharks, in game 2 or one of them. Kipper only allowed one powerplay goal and that's because the Flames D was a complete joke. I'm happy after all of this that Kipper's still with us, otherwise we'd be bottom feeding with the Coyotes and Kings.
I normally don't agree with Murdelizer but I do here. How badly do we get outshot and outplayed in every playoff? Detroit and SJ worked us and doubled us in shots nearly each game. There's a reason we gave up so many goals - our team cannot play defense and the team overall has gotten progressively worse since 2005. No one is acknowledging that. The fact is we've been spoiled by 3 years of Kipper's excellence. He bailed this team out countless times and we got used to it. He even did it for a few games in the playoffs last year and was the only reason we won. He did have a terrible game 7 but the team showed no signs of competency.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Cool
Kipper took too much flak last year in my eyes. Our defense backed up to the crease all season long and just let players walk in and have their way with Kipper, also our forwards were rarely found backchecking.
Kipper had no confidence in his defense, which I think definitely hurt his game. Calgary wasn't a "team defense" style team last year, and it hurt Kipper's play because he could never count on someone to take away the pass so he'd have to be playing shot and pass which would leave him open to being exploited while he was cheating to the pass. Last year the forwards didn't play defense, and the d-men played...well...mediocore defense.
Kipper's play was very much a product of the team in front of him, he just didn't "steal" as many games last year as we're used to seeing, but then again...I don't we were used to seeing such an error-ridden defensive line-up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny__K
Actually i would say last year the Flames made the playoffs in spite of him. Maybe you don't realize it but the Flames have a pretty decent team, despite what the Oiler fans might try and convince you.
It wasn't just the poor stats which partly are a result of weaker defensive play, but he let in more brutal goals last season then the previous 3 years combined.
If Kipper put up top 10 stats last year, Calgary wins the division. We'll see what he can do this season.
The Flames do have a decent playoff team but why is it we expect dominance from Kipper and we're alright with the rest of the team constantly being outperformed and outclassed? Kipper should demand a better defensive game and a better team game all around to help him. I guarantee you the day this team turns it around (if it ever happens) and becomes consistently dominant and find its own zone on a map for a change, we'll all be kissing his ass again. Seriously, this guy is so underappreciated and if he ever goes down to injury we'll find out just how important he is, knock on wood, and I hope it never happens.
I have thought about this question a fair bit myself I must confess. To be honest he did have a sub par year based on his previous performances and indeed his stats do seem to drop off from last season. With that being said I think he got bumped for the top 3 but is still a top 5 goalie in the NHL but that IMO, Top 8 no doubt. I think we take him for granted here in Flames land as if we did not have him we would be in a much, much worse position. The one thing I have noticed is that players shoot in area where he never had lots of shots before as no one seems to buy the five-hole trick no more. Also his concentration seemed to have slipped as well to the point where he lets in soft goals more often.
By looking at his numbers I am a little concerned but I am not worried because if he can get back to the 06/07 form I would not worry. All of us know what he has done for this franchise and he is a big part of our team as well, but if he is under performing again this year I say let him go as we could get a sweet return for him.
So I pick both under appreciated as he was never over rated in my eyes, but I do see why people would say that as it falls in the HF logic as your only as good as your last season. Do I see a repeat of last year, next season? No. I do see him bouncing back to what he was 2 seasons ago and if that is the case he will be a top 3 goalie once again.
To us I think he is worth his weight in Gold but needs someone to push him as he was considerably better once we got Joseph last season. Hopefully Curtis Mac is ready to do that if not we may see him getting complacent again.
He was better because he feared he had competition. It's recurring. He has had his best years when he had competition. The stronger the competition the better.
He only plays when it matters to him. I think he shrugs off these goals and losses and says oh well. He can't be like that.
And we're so lucky to have yada yada yada. I don't see how a guy who is in the low 20s in telling stats, is a gem.
Overworked. Team defense has been discussed enough. They simply diverted from the system that made them successful. However, there hasn't been any confidence in backgoaltending since the lockout ended. They'd always start off slowly, squandering valuable points in October. Then there'd be some panic, and Kipper would be forced to start against 2nd division teams. Often times, they'd lost those games too. By the end of the season, with the work load and travel, fatigue had to be a factor.
...showing up out of shape to camp last pre-season didn't help his cause either.
Overworked. Team defense has been discussed enough. They simply diverted from the system that made them successful. However, there hasn't been any confidence in backgoaltending since the lockout ended. They'd always start off slowly, squandering valuable points in October. Then there'd be some panic, and Kipper would be forced to start against 2nd division teams. Often times, they'd lost those games too. By the end of the season, with the work load and travel, fatigue had to be a factor.
if fatigue is a factor why did kipper get better as the season progressed?... March/April were one of his best months... he sucked to start there season when fatigue shouldnt be an issue at all
I normally don't agree with Murdelizer but I do here. How badly do we get outshot and outplayed in every playoff? Detroit and SJ worked us and doubled us in shots nearly each game. There's a reason we gave up so many goals - our team cannot play defense and the team overall has gotten progressively worse since 2005. No one is acknowledging that. The fact is we've been spoiled by 3 years of Kipper's excellence. He bailed this team out countless times and we got used to it. He even did it for a few games in the playoffs last year and was the only reason we won. He did have a terrible game 7 but the team showed no signs of competency.
The Flames do have a decent playoff team but why is it we expect dominance from Kipper and we're alright with the rest of the team constantly being outperformed and outclassed? Kipper should demand a better defensive game and a better team game all around to help him. I guarantee you the day this team turns it around (if it ever happens) and becomes consistently dominant and find its own zone on a map for a change, we'll all be kissing his ass again. Seriously, this guy is so underappreciated and if he ever goes down to injury we'll find out just how important he is, knock on wood, and I hope it never happens.
Exactly.
One of these days, Kipper is gonna go down with a pulled groin, or a hamstring, and we'll have McElhinny facing the barrage of shots bought on by our defensemen who can't play very well, maybe except for Regehr.
Then we will see how much Kipper meant to the team. Not to mention how much worse we got over the offseason, I can only hope we can barely get into that 8th playoff spot to be once again ousted in round one.
Rarely stole games? The only reason the Flames made it into the playoffs is because of Kipper. Each game against the Sharks, they were consistently outshot and taking stupid penalties, basically leaving Kipper to stand on his head and weather a storm. They took something like 8 penalties against the Sharks, in game 2 or one of them. Kipper only allowed one powerplay goal and that's because the Flames D was a complete joke. I'm happy after all of this that Kipper's still with us, otherwise we'd be bottom feeding with the Coyotes and Kings.
If the Flames did not have anything but a backup goalie they may not have made it but as far as first string goalies go, he was ordinary. He did not play anywhere near to his best. If he did, they probably get past SJ at least.
Are you seriously comparing Kipper and McElhinney?
Come on if McElhinney was our full time starter the flames don't make the playoffs last year.
Yes, I was comparing them. Obviously Kipper is better, but the point of comparing them was to show McElhinny from the little he has played, we can still win some games.
Haha, Kiprusoff did more to hurt our chances of making the playoffs. He was god-awful. Complete utter junk for most os the season. He had his games, but so does every other goalie. Mike Smith, Alex Auld, Ilya Bryzgalov and Kari Lehtonnen had more shutouts. Smith and Auld played in half the games Kipper did. Bryzgalov and Lehtonnen don't exactly play behind great defenses either.
30th in SOs and SV% and 28th in GAA. And the man is due for a huge pay raise....
Haha, Kiprusoff did more to hurt our chances of making the playoffs.
Are you serious? For a long stretch last season, it was Kipper's play that held the Flames in a playoff spot. Regardless of his average season, it would have been worse without him.
