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07-29-2008, 08:43 AM
  #1
toshiro
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Cup winning strategy

Detroit often loads up at the trade deadline. Would BG be wise to sign a good Dman (if there are any left) or forward with size and trade for a star forward at the deadline? Or wait until the deadline and trade for a Blake/Schneider and a forward? Or go for two Dmen and drown em with D? BG has a one to two year window. Its almost now or never. The futur is now. Fans will have to get used to the fact that some young players may be lost for salary cap reasons or in trades. I would easily lose eg Higgins for a cup win.

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07-29-2008, 08:52 AM
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Kriss E
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The seasons hasn't started..
Dont you think its a bit premature to talk about what we should get at the deadline?
We have to see how our team is going to perform. For now, I have little doubt that our defense won't be able to do a good job.

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07-29-2008, 09:10 AM
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The objective is to more than a 1-2 "window" team like tampa or buffalo, but to build a perrenial contender like the wings or new jersey of the 90s.

Habs have a lot of young producers and good prospects in the system that should mean the team will be at least in the top 8 of the conference for a while especially if the habs' front office remains as deep and smart as it currently is.

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07-29-2008, 09:14 AM
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Jiggernaut
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toshiro View Post
Detroit often loads up at the trade deadline...
You sure about that?

Their last two cups:

2008 - D Brad Stuart
2002 - D Jiri Sleger

Non-Cup:
2007 - RW Todd Bertuzzi
2006 - D Cory Cross
2004 - None
2003 - D Schneider

I don't really call that loading up. This year they got Stuart because Rafalski had a nagging groin injury from mid feb to early march. That was an insurance move.

Other than Schneider back in 2003, in a pre-cap world, I wouldn't say any of their deals were anything but depth moves.

Detroit rarely upsets team chemistry to make a move for the sake of making a move. Most of their deals are out of necessity.

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07-29-2008, 09:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toshiro View Post
Detroit often loads up at the trade deadline. Would BG be wise to sign a good Dman (if there are any left) or forward with size and trade for a star forward at the deadline? Or wait until the deadline and trade for a Blake/Schneider and a forward? Or go for two Dmen and drown em with D? BG has a one to two year window. Its almost now or never. The futur is now. Fans will have to get used to the fact that some young players may be lost for salary cap reasons or in trades. I would easily lose eg Higgins for a cup win.
Theres a reason we have such a young core ya know... Gainey is setting us up to be a top cup winner/contender for a long term period, not short term like everyone is rushing to become.

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07-29-2008, 09:18 AM
  #6
Habs10Habs
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I think a lot depends on the whole "Sundin" situation. If he retires or signs elsewhere I could see Gainey going out and obtaining a veteran top 4 d-man to start the season. Schneider comes to mind because of his salary, and Anaheims cap situation.

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Old
07-29-2008, 10:40 AM
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toshiro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jiggernaut View Post
You sure about that?

Their last two cups:

2008 - D Brad Stuart
2002 - D Jiri Sleger

Non-Cup:
2007 - RW Todd Bertuzzi
2006 - D Cory Cross
2004 - None
2003 - D Schneider

I don't really call that loading up. This year they got Stuart because Rafalski had a nagging groin injury from mid feb to early march. That was an insurance move.

Other than Schneider back in 2003, in a pre-cap world, I wouldn't say any of their deals were anything but depth moves.

Detroit rarely upsets team chemistry to make a move for the sake of making a move. Most of their deals are out of necessity.
Good point. Smacks my head.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yarfangor View Post
Theres a reason we have such a young core ya know... Gainey is setting us up to be a top cup winner/contender for a long term period, not short term like everyone is rushing to become.
With Koivu and Kovy old or retired or signed elsewhere what are the chances? Some of the American players will leave eg Komi, Higgins etc. Building to a peak doesnt mean gut your team but trade a few assets.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs10Habs View Post
I think a lot depends on the whole "Sundin" situation. If he retires or signs elsewhere I could see Gainey going out and obtaining a veteran top 4 d-man to start the season. Schneider comes to mind because of his salary, and Anaheims cap situation.
Is there a big forward that is less skilled that is out there?


Last edited by Beakermania*: 07-29-2008 at 02:10 PM.
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07-29-2008, 10:46 AM
  #8
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That is it, don't need to play the season for nothing,

with this strategy they should give us the cup right away...

MVP to Tender...for his performance in a bout de souffle

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07-29-2008, 11:28 AM
  #9
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My Cup winning strategy...score more than the other guys.

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07-29-2008, 12:29 PM
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I think it would be wrong to look at one way to win the cup, if you look at TB Anaheim Detroit Carolina, they all had different type rosters and set ups.

Carolina was a good team that got hot at the right time, we had them beat until Koivu got high sticked and they pulled Gerber for Ward.

TB had tons of offensive skill plus Khabibulin made the big saves.

Anaheim was a defensive team that was borderline dirty, played a physical style except for their top guys.

Detroit was a puck posession team with average goaltending.

Detroit won last year but it was after falling short numerous times. Anaheim fell on their face the year after winning.

I think the Hbas should build their own gameplan and not worry about what the right formula is. Obviously Price and Halak's development in goal is the huge variable, last year it was a weakness, experience could turn it into a strength.

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07-29-2008, 02:11 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toshiro View Post
With Koivu and Kovy old or retired or signed elsewhere what are the chances? Some of the American players will leave eg Komi, Higgins etc. Building to a peak doesnt mean gut your team but trade a few assets.
Yes the Americans are dying to leave and go home... just like Vinny and Briere are dying to leave their teams and come home to Montreal .

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07-29-2008, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toshiro View Post
Is there a big forward that is less skilled that is out there?
I'm not sure at the moment. I think we will hear of more players being available once training camp starts. By then teams will all have to get their salary caps in order.

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07-29-2008, 03:27 PM
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toshiro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
Yes the Americans are dying to leave and go home... just like Vinny and Briere are dying to leave their teams and come home to Montreal .
Where did you derive that comparison from? It isnt like American UFAs line up to join Montreal. Maybe most UFAs period dont want to join Montreal. Most American players would prefer to play in the USA so get used to losing a few

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
I think it would be wrong to look at one way to win the cup, if you look at TB Anaheim Detroit Carolina, they all had different type rosters and set ups.

Carolina was a good team that got hot at the right time, we had them beat until Koivu got high sticked and they pulled Gerber for Ward.

TB had tons of offensive skill plus Khabibulin made the big saves.

Anaheim was a defensive team that was borderline dirty, played a physical style except for their top guys.

Detroit was a puck posession team with average goaltending.

Detroit won last year but it was after falling short numerous times. Anaheim fell on their face the year after winning.

I think the Hbas should build their own gameplan and not worry about what the right formula is. Obviously Price and Halak's development in goal is the huge variable, last year it was a weakness, experience could turn it into a strength.
All of those teams had depth that they could not sustain after winning hence the peaking theory. Detroit may peak again adding Hossa. Geeez. Hossa Zetter. Datsy, Lidstrom. The rich get richer


Last edited by Beakermania*: 07-29-2008 at 11:37 PM.
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Old
07-29-2008, 03:44 PM
  #14
JGRB
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My Strategy for winning the cup? Offense + Good Carey Price.

Oh, and hope someone can upset Detroit.

Thats how we win.

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07-29-2008, 04:25 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toshiro View Post
Where did you derive that comparison from? It isnt like American UFAs line up to join Montreal. Maybe most UFAs period dont want to join Montreal. Most American players would prefer to play in the USA so get used to losing a few
You question his comparison and then spout nonsense like this?

When did it become common knowledge that American players prefer playing in the States? This is quite an insight. You'd better tell Gainey and Timmins because they're obviously making a huge mistake drafting all these Americans.

Higgins and Komisarek have gone on record saying they love it in Montreal. There is nothing to indicate we will "lose a few" players like that just because they were born on the wrong side of the 49th parallel.

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07-29-2008, 04:32 PM
  #16
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Make the playoffs, then win 16 games. Thats your Cup winning strategy

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07-29-2008, 04:34 PM
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Grit and more puck movement on D, and add a star to the mix. Worked for Detroit.

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Old
07-29-2008, 05:31 PM
  #18
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phase 1 : Ice a good team
phase 2 : ?
phase 3 : Win the cup

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07-29-2008, 06:31 PM
  #19
toshiro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by starglider View Post
You question his comparison and then spout nonsense like this?

When did it become common knowledge that American players prefer playing in the States? This is quite an insight. You'd better tell Gainey and Timmins because they're obviously making a huge mistake drafting all these Americans.

Higgins and Komisarek have gone on record saying they love it in Montreal. There is nothing to indicate we will "lose a few" players like that just because they were born on the wrong side of the 49th parallel.
Are American UFAs lined up to play with the Habs? We will see when they are UFAs I spose. An ex NHL player discussed this with me (he was empatic about it) and it is sometimes alluded to on talk radio. BG and company may have accepted Toshiro's peak theory. accepting that most are gone at age 27. Bye bye american pie.

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07-29-2008, 08:55 PM
  #20
ChemiseBleuHonnete
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
I think it would be wrong to look at one way to win the cup, if you look at TB Anaheim Detroit Carolina, they all had different type rosters and set ups.

Carolina was a good team that got hot at the right time, we had them beat until Koivu got high sticked and they pulled Gerber for Ward.

TB had tons of offensive skill plus Khabibulin made the big saves.

Anaheim was a defensive team that was borderline dirty, played a physical style except for their top guys.

Detroit was a puck posession team with average goaltending.

Detroit won last year but it was after falling short numerous times. Anaheim fell on their face the year after winning.

I think the Hbas should build their own gameplan and not worry about what the right formula is. Obviously Price and Halak's development in goal is the huge variable, last year it was a weakness, experience could turn it into a strength.
All these teams have one thing in common, they had a goalie that got hot in the playoffs. This is something essential to win the cup imo.

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