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Who is Ottawa's best player?

View Poll Results: Who is Ottawa's best player?
Alfredsson 169 63.53%
Heatley 60 22.56%
Spezza 23 8.65%
Fisher 0 0%
Gerber 5 1.88%
Redden 9 3.38%
Voters: 266. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
08-12-2008, 12:11 PM
  #76
DG
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NyQuil View Post
As far as I'm concerned, Heatley's additional offensive ability does not compensate for all of the other areas where Alfie has him beat, at least right now.
That's a pretty good summary of my feelings.

I'm shocked that you (danishh) would call Heatley tougher than Alfie considering the number of Sens games you watch. It's one of the main criticisms of Heatley (and Spezza) in Sens GDTs all year.

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Old
08-12-2008, 12:31 PM
  #77
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Since the word "fantasy" does not appear between the words "best" and "player", the answer is obviously Alfredsson.

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08-12-2008, 12:53 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Darth Gerber View Post
That's a pretty good summary of my feelings.

I'm shocked that you (danishh) would call Heatley tougher than Alfie considering the number of Sens games you watch. It's one of the main criticisms of Heatley (and Spezza) in Sens GDTs all year.
And what criticisms did they get?

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Old
08-12-2008, 01:00 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sensational Spezza View Post
I have heard this thousands of tims, literally

The reason Spezza looked out of place is because he ws playing on the top line with Fisher and Kelly/Vermette/Robitaille, and the longest strech Spezza played without Heatley was 9 games I think, that isn't what I would call a long strech, and even then he was around a PPG, that's pretty good for Kelly and Fisher

Skating aimlessly? No desire to finish? I am not even going to respond
Look up those Game Threads because Spezza sure as hell wasn't playing with Vermette... and both the Spezza and Vermette fans could tell you that. He played the majority of those games with Foligno and Robitaille: two 4th liners. Because Paddock didn't seem to want to disrupt the other lines.

Seriously people... STOP IT!!! Yes, Spezza didn't look good without Heatley and Alfie because he downgraded to two 4th liners. Take one of your top offensive players on your team, shoot him in both kneecaps and see how much scores. Not much? Well, stop playing him with 4th liners!

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08-12-2008, 01:04 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danishh View Post
i seem to be getting some hate from my fellow fans...

here's my thinking:
Offense: Heatley>Spezza=Alfie
Defence: Alfie>Heatley>Spezza
Leadership: Alfie>Heatley>Spezza
Tough play: Heatley>Alfie>Spezza

heatley is the only true superstar ottawa has ever had. (unless you count cashin)

heatley may have untapped leadership potential, and has worked his way up the leadership chart in ottawa.

alfie is the heart, soul, and leader of our team, and is easily our most valuable player, but this question asks for our best player, and by my interpretation of that word, heatley shoud win.
Exactley
Cashin? Don't you mean Yashin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sensational Spezza View Post
Spezza is better than Heatley because Spezza is better defesnively IMO and has better offensive skill, and creativity

And what is the deal with you? Are you a Sens fan? Because any Sens fan should be man enough to admit that Alfie is the best player out of the three
Yeah, I am

Quote:
Originally Posted by loadie View Post
How does playing for Ottawa end up with a comment on about the IIHF. Jesus, you can go back to Heatley's time in Atlanta if it makes you feel better.
I comment on the IIHF beacuse you people say that Heatley has to play with Spezza to be a superstar

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08-12-2008, 01:05 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luongofan View Post
And what criticisms did they get?
1. Well, they were completely absent in the playoffs this year. After being completely absent in the finals last year.

2. Sometimes they don't appear to be skating very hard. They also do not use their large frames very effectively, and employ the body relatively rarely, even on the forecheck.

3. They can become lazy offensively, particularly on the powerplay, with Spezza trying the same pass to Heatley over and over again, and Heatley standing relatively immobile with his stick in the air.

4. They can be less than dedicated in their own zone, although this is one area in which both players have improved for the most part over their tenure with Ottawa.

5. Spezza, when he's playing at his worst, refuses to shoot the puck. When the line is firing on all cylinders, all 3 players pass and all 3 players shoot.

To be fair, Alfredsson has his problems too.

1. He can try to be a little bit too fancy in his own zone at times, relying on his stick-handling and puck possession skills as opposed to simply clearing it. Usually he can get it out, but sometimes he doesn't.

2. Alfredsson will try to do everything himself at times when nothing seems to be working, as opposed to just simplifying the game, getting the puck in deep and building off of the cycle.

All three players will sometimes stay out too long on a shift.

I've watched almost every game that the three of them have played together in a Senators uniform, and this is the impression that I get.

The best that they ever played was against New Jersey and Buffalo in the 2007 playoffs, in that they were all playing a committed two-way game, and all of them were both passing and shooting.\

I keep hearing how Alfredsson's game is going to spontaneously disappear, when in fact he was leading the NHL in scoring at the All-Star break and was a Hart candidate as little as 6 months ago.

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08-12-2008, 01:07 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NyQuil View Post
1. Well, they were completely absent in the playoffs this year. After being completely absent in the finals last year.

2. Sometimes they don't appear to be skating very hard. They also do not use their large frames very effectively, and employ the body relatively rarely, even on the forecheck.

3. They can become lazy offensively, particularly on the powerplay, with Spezza trying the same pass to Heatley over and over again, and Heatley standing relatively immobile with his stick in the air.

4. They can be less than dedicated in their own zone, although this is one area in which both players have improved for the most part over their tenure with Ottawa.

5. Spezza, when he's playing at his worst, refuses to shoot the puck. When the line is firing on all cylinders, all 3 players pass and all 3 players shoot.

To be fair, Alfredsson has his problems too.

1. He can try to be a little bit too fancy in his own zone at times, relying on his stick-handling and puck possession skills as opposed to simply clearing it. Usually he can get it out, but sometimes he doesn't.

2. Alfredsson will try to do everything himself at times when nothing seems to be working, as opposed to just simplifying the game, getting the puck in deep and building off of the cycle.

All three players will sometimes stay out too long on a shift.

I've watched almost every game that the three of them have played together in a Senators uniform, and this is the impression that I get.

The best that they ever played was against New Jersey and Buffalo in the 2007 playoffs, in that they were all playing a committed two-way game, and all of them were both passing and shooting.
Good analysis. Buffalo's Game 5 was a perfect example of how they play when they're on, imo.

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Old
08-12-2008, 01:14 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danishh View Post
i seem to be getting some hate from my fellow fans...

here's my thinking:
Offense: Heatley>Spezza=Alfie
Defence: Alfie>Heatley>Spezza
Leadership: Alfie>Heatley>Spezza
Tough play: Heatley>Alfie>Spezza
How come both Spezza and Alfredsson have a higher ppg then?
And i aslo remember Alfredsson having a ppg of 1.50 before getting hit with injuries...
This is the only one Heatley can win.
Durability: Heatley >>Alfredsson>Spezza

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Old
08-12-2008, 01:14 PM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NyQuil View Post
1. Well, they were completely absent in the playoffs this year. After being completely absent in the finals last year.

2. Sometimes they don't appear to be skating very hard. They also do not use their large frames very effectively, and employ the body relatively rarely, even on the forecheck.

3. They can become lazy offensively, particularly on the powerplay, with Spezza trying the same pass to Heatley over and over again, and Heatley standing relatively immobile with his stick in the air.

4. They can be less than dedicated in their own zone, although this is one area in which both players have improved for the most part over their tenure with Ottawa.

5. Spezza, when he's playing at his worst, refuses to shoot the puck. When the line is firing on all cylinders, all 3 players pass and all 3 players shoot.

To be fair, Alfredsson has his problems too.

1. He can try to be a little bit too fancy in his own zone at times, relying on his stick-handling and puck possession skills as opposed to simply clearing it. Usually he can get it out, but sometimes he doesn't.

2. Alfredsson will try to do everything himself at times when nothing seems to be working, as opposed to just simplifying the game, getting the puck in deep and building off of the cycle.

All three players will sometimes stay out too long on a shift.

I've watched almost every game that the three of them have played together in a Senators uniform, and this is the impression that I get.

The best that they ever played was against New Jersey and Buffalo in the 2007 playoffs, in that they were all playing a committed two-way game, and all of them were both passing and shooting.
Wasn't Alfie absent last year and this year too?
Didn't Alfie get a match penatly for intentionally shooting a puck at S.Niedermayer in the last seconds of the finals (from what I heard form my friend). You call that great leadership?

Not good at defense? So my card of him is wrong and Heatley did not get 68 takeaways in 06-07?

Spezza not shooting? So my card of him is wrong again about him having the second best shooting % in the leagur in 06-07 and getting 34 goals and being on pace for 44?

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Old
08-12-2008, 01:15 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luongofan View Post
Wasn't Alfie absent last year and this year too?
Didn't Alfie get a match penatly for intentionally shooting a puck at S.Niedermayer in the last seconds of the finals
(from what I heard form my friend). You call that great leadership?

Not good at defense? So my card of him is wrong and Heatley did not get 68 takeaways in 06-07?

Spezza not shooting? So my card of him is wrong again about him having the second best shooting % in the leagur in 06-07 and getting 34 goals and being on pace for 44?
***???

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Old
08-12-2008, 01:17 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luongofan View Post
Wasn't Alfie absent last year and this year too?
Didn't Alfie get a match penatly for intentionally shooting a puck at S.Niedermayer in the last seconds of the finals (from what I heard form my friend). You call that great leadership?

Not good at defense? So my card of him is wrong and Heatley did not get 68 takeaways in 06-07?

Spezza not shooting? So my card of him is wrong again about him having the second best shooting % in the leagur in 06-07 and getting 34 goals and being on pace for 44?
lol he would have had a worse shooting percentage if he shot more.

Spezza is capable of 40+ goals. If he shot more.

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08-12-2008, 01:18 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfredsson View Post
How come both Spezza and Alfredsson have a higher ppg then?
And i aslo remember Alfredsson having a ppg of 1.50 before getting hit with injuries...
This is the only one Heatley can win.
Durability: Heatley >>Alfredsson>Spezza
And I remember Heatley on pace for 50 again and I also remember Heatley getting a SEPERATED SHOULDER against Detroit. I think that is a little (A LOT) more serious than the injuries Alfredsson suffered. And I don't think Heatley can come back to play 100% right after he got his injury.

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08-12-2008, 01:20 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfredsson View Post
lol he owuld have a worst Shooting percentage if he shot more.
How about him getting 34 goals and on pace for 44 even though he isn't 100 % after he returned from his injury
And a lot of great players disappear because of playoff pressure. Didn't Malkin suck in the Finals? Don't forget about Thornton

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08-12-2008, 01:22 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Luongofan View Post
And I remember Heatley on pace for 50 again and I also remember Heatley getting a SEPERATED SHOULDER against Detroit. I think that is a little (A LOT) more serious than the injuries Alfredsson suffered. And I don't think Heatley can come back to play 100% right after he got his injury.
Thing is even before those injuries to Heatley, Alfredsson was till outscoring him.

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08-12-2008, 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Luongofan View Post
How about him getting 34 goals and on pace for 44 even though he isn't 100 % after he returned from his injury
And a lot of great players disappear because of playoff pressure. Didn't Malkin suck in the Finals? Don't forget about Thornton
Another reason why Alfredsson is better than Heatley and Spezza.

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08-12-2008, 01:27 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfredsson View Post
Thing is even before those injuries to Heatley, Alfredsson was till outscoring him.
I don't remember Alfredsson being on pace for 50 goals

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08-12-2008, 01:28 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfredsson View Post
Another reason why Alfredsson is better than Heatley and Spezza.
Since when was Alfredsson good in the playoffs when Spezza and Heatley was not?

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08-12-2008, 01:29 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luongofan View Post
I don't remember Alfredsson being on pace for 50 goals
Well he was.

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08-12-2008, 01:36 PM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luongofan View Post
Wasn't Alfie absent last year and this year too?
Didn't Alfie get a match penatly for intentionally shooting a puck at S.Niedermayer in the last seconds of the finals (from what I heard form my friend). You call that great leadership?

Not good at defense? So my card of him is wrong and Heatley did not get 68 takeaways in 06-07?

Spezza not shooting? So my card of him is wrong again about him having the second best shooting % in the leagur in 06-07 and getting 34 goals and being on pace for 44?
Er, what the hell are you talking about?

1. Alfie was kind of absent this year because of his MCL tear, which you may or may not be aware of, judging by your posts thus far on this subject.

And as for last year if you're considering Alfie absent in the finals, you must have been watching pretty selectively. Alfie put up four goals in the last 3 games of the Finals, including a SH marker in the 4th game where he simply battled through Ryan Getzlaf. Total 4-1-5 in 5 games.

Against Anaheim, Heatley put up 1 goal and 0 assists in 5 games. Spezza put up 2 assists. Alfredsson was moved off that line and put with Mike Fisher, who was at that point, the only other forward competing on a regular basis.

With respect to Niedermeyer, Alfie never received a match penalty, and while Ottawa lost that game, Ottawa actually outshot and outchanced the Ducks in the 3rd period after the shooting attempt. The media tried to pin the loss on Alfie, where there simply wasn't much correlation there.

Now Heatley had a lung injury, which obviously crippled him, but Alfie was also fighting the flu over the first two games.

For a Sens fan, it's remarkable how little you actually know about the Stanley Cup Finals involving the team.

2. If you're judging defence strictly on takeaways, you've got more problems than I can possibly solve for you. I didn't say Heatley was bad, just inconsistent in his effort when it comes to defence. He's a smart player and can read the play well, which helps him pick off passes on defence.

3. Yeah, Spezza not shooting has nothing to do with his shooting percentage and everything to do with his shot selection. He'll pass up legitimate scoring chances to dish it off, particularly to Heatley. When he's playing at his best, he doesn't, and that keeps the defencemen guessing. Spezza has a terrific shot and may in fact have the best wrister on the team when he chooses to use it.

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08-12-2008, 01:36 PM
  #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luongofan View Post
Wasn't Alfie absent last year and this year too?
Against Anaheim Alfie had 4 goals and 1 assist. 5 points in 5 games. Almost a goal per game pace.

This year in 2 games Alfie had 0 points but was playing with a torn MCL, injured shoulder, and in all probability recovering from a mild concussion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luongofan View Post
Didn't Alfie get a match penatly for intentionally shooting a puck at S.Niedermayer in the last seconds of the finals (from what I heard form my friend). You call that great leadership?
There was no match penalty. Alfie did fire a puck in Neidermeyer's direction, but he says it was unintentional as he was looking at the clock. There's no need to debate whether or not it was intentional, I'm just saying that he received no match penalty.

If you watch Ottawa regularly you know that Alfie is one of the greatest leaders in the league. He frequently picks up the team on his back and carries them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luongofan View Post
Not good at defense? So my card of him is wrong and Heatley did not get 68 takeaways in 06-07?
Heatley has improved defensively, he is still nowhere close to Alfie in terms of D ability.

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08-12-2008, 01:44 PM
  #96
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***???
FROM WHAT I HEARD FROM MY FRIEND

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08-12-2008, 01:49 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Luongofan View Post
FROM WHAT I HEARD FROM MY FRIEND
did you say you were a Sens fan?

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08-12-2008, 01:51 PM
  #98
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Alfredsson! I don't think there's any contest. He's not Ottawa's most skilled player (though he is extremely skilled) but he is Ottawa's most complete, or in other words, best player.

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08-12-2008, 01:53 PM
  #99
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Alfredsson! I don't think there's any contest. He's not Ottawa's most skilled player (though he is extremely skilled) but he is Ottawa's most complete, or in other words, best player.
Best first post ever! Good Job!

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08-12-2008, 01:55 PM
  #100
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You should have seen my first post

"How do you spell Alfredson?"


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