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Old
08-25-2008, 01:54 PM
  #1
DL44
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Avs Team Rankings

Hey guys... I'm trying to get a grasp of the NW a bit and was wondering the exact areas of upgrades and downgrades of your team from Avs fan perspective...

Roster Changes
: To my understanding thus far (and please correct me if i'm missing someone)... (Assuming for the purposes of this ranking that Sakic is coming back, but Forsberg is out)
IN - Tucker, Raycroft, Willsie, Tarnqvist
OUT - Burnette, Theodore, Finger, Forsberg, Sauer, Hlinka

How do Avs fans perceive the Avs rankings relative to last yr in the following areas...
(++ improved, + slightly improved, = about the same, - slightly worse, -- worse.... plus maybe a one line description of the logic)

Categories
ES Offense:
ES Defense:
Offensive Depth:
Defensive Depth:
PP:
PK:
Faceoffs:
Speed:
Size:
Grit/Sandpaper:
Hockey Sense:
Goaltending:

cheers..

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Old
08-25-2008, 03:10 PM
  #2
WarriorOfGandhi
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ES Offense: -- worse, lack of Bruno and Sakic is severe
ES Defense: -- much better, team has very good defensive capabilities except for the allmighty faceoff center
Offensive Depth: -- might be better, Hensick/Jones/Stewart ready to fill in
Defensive Depth: -- same
PP: -- can't get much worse
PK: -- better with Foote
Faceoffs: -- tapped
Speed: -- might be faster due to more youth
Size: -- subject of debate round these parts
Grit/Sandpaper: -- should be pretty physical with Tucker, Lappy, the Codys, Foote, Salei, and Leopold
Hockey Sense: -- ?
Goaltending: -- 10 Avs fans will give you 10 different answers. IMO its no better and no worse than last season

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Old
08-26-2008, 12:50 PM
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volaju
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Might want to add Ledin on the "in" list, because he's got a one-way contract.

ES Offense: The loss of Bruno hurts, esp. in clutch situations. But we've already got a player like him in Smyth and the team kinda felt like a one-trick pony with the same style of player on each of the top two lines. Tucker's passion and grit, provided he isn't totally on the decline, might make up for Bruno's absence by motivating the team not to play like a bunch of pansies.
ES Defense: Better, with Foote, Salei, and hopefully Leopold. Spotlight on Leo: can he finally play a season without getting injured? For the man's career I sure hope so.
Offensive Depth: Hensick is almost ready to make the jump to the club, but he's the odd-man out with Sakic, Stastny and Arnason down the center. Should anyone on the top 3 lines go down, he'll get the call-up. Past Hensick the depth isn't that great -- I don't see anyone else making a big impact.
Defensive Depth: I'd rather have a defensive backup (Sauer) than an offensive 7th d-man (Tjarnqvist). That said, I need to see Tjarnqvist in action again to make the judgement.
PP: Better provided Q is out! Please god, if Sakic returns, may we never have to watch him man the point again. Tucker should also give the PP a small boost. But the PP won't be as good as the last 20 or so games we saw, due to Forsberg not being on the team.
PK: Losing Bruno will hurt here as well. I don't expect the PK to be good at all.
Faceoffs: Still missing a good faceoff man. I'm hoping that Stastny has been working on it all summer and will come back to amaze us with Yanic Perreault-esque abilities. If not, another depressing year of losing important faceoffs.
Speed: Pretty much the same. Bruno giving up his spot adds speed, so does the inclusion of Jones. But we're still not a very fast team.
Size: Not much size on the top 2 lines (paging Wolski, prove me wrong!). The Codys, Ledin, and Lappy are our "biggest" players, moreso via playing style than actual stature.
Grit/Sandpaper: See above. Not much physical presence on the top 2 lines. Pretty gritty third and fourth lines with Tucker, Lappy, Guite, Codys, etc. If only they could chip in the occasional goal.
Hockey Sense: Bruno's clutch play and experience here won't be replaced.
Goaltending: Won't be spectacular, but ideally, it doesn't have to be. The Avs have re-tooled their roster to address more glaring needs. If goaltending is still a crux this season, the issue will be addressed by the offseason, possibly sooner. FWIW, I prefer Budaj's average-NHL-goalie consistency to Theodore's higher ups but lower downs. Consistency is so important for a team; they have to know what to expect night in and night out. I don't think the team was ever comfortable with Theodore in net ... I know I wasn't.

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Old
08-26-2008, 02:22 PM
  #4
quesosauce
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ES Offense: W/o sakic and forsberg we are worse up front. This could be negated by Wolski and Svatos breaking out and Hensick/Jones stepping up
ES Defense:Much better than the start of last season, what i love is that Hannan doesnt have to be the main PK/Physical guy out there, foot can take some pressure off him and we can have a great season from our d which will take our pressure off the goalies.
Offensive Depth:About the same, provided we dont have injury problems like last year and if Svats can take some pressure off the duke we should be good.
Defensive Depth:Amazing! Even if leopold goes down we have guys like Tjarquist and Cumisky, this is probably the deepest D in the NHL
PP:well we got rid of Q so much improved
PK:should be about the same as last year or a touch better due to imporoved d
Faceoffs:if sakic is gone, then we are worse, we need staz to improve here and maybe hensick/arnason could learn to be better
Speed:better offensively with bruno gone, but worse defensively with foote back and not playing cumisky
Size:ummm better? ledin and parker are big, our d is big where it needs to be
Grit/Sandpaper:should be another strength with lappy, codys, ledin, parker, tucker, foote, guite
Hockey Sense:?
Goaltending:about the same for much less money is better in my mind

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Old
08-26-2008, 04:28 PM
  #5
DL44
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Hockey Sense...AKA: Hockey IQ... Intellegence... Vision... Usually directly correlated with Experience (but not with all players)...
Best reflected in players by superior positioning, intellegent playmaking. You'll hear commentators often say.. "Always in the right place at the right time"... "There's a heads up play"..
Reflected in defensemen by their ability to know how the play in front of them develops and their ability to disrupt it consistently..

Gretzky was the ultimate example. Not particularly gifted physically, but he could out-think everyone. Often said to be 3-4 steps ahead of everyone around him.
Hasek's game was based on his ability to just know how the play in front of him was developing and use his athleticism to get where the puck was going to be.

Examples in todays game... Sakic, Crosby, Lidstrom, Niedermeyer, Thornton are some elite examples.


These statements contradict each other..
Quote:
Originally Posted by quesosauce
ES Offense: W/o sakic and forsberg we are worse up front. This could be negated by Wolski and Svatos breaking out and Hensick/Jones stepping up

Offensive Depth:About the same, provided we dont have injury problems like last year and if Svats can take some pressure off the duke we should be good.

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Old
08-26-2008, 04:49 PM
  #6
volaju
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Well, hockey sense is more traditionally thought of as an individual trait rather than a team trait. I see what you're getting at, but I'm not sure how to evaluate the entire team's collective hockey IQ relative to other teams' IQ in the league, since the high hockey IQs will be balanced out with the low hockey IQs.

Forsberg makes players around him a lot better. Sakic and Bruno also have a high hockey IQ. Beyond that, nothing special stands out. It's kind of arbitrary to assess smarts for an entire team because only a few players really make a difference, and each team has one or two of those players. If that's what you're getting at -- we'll have a relatively "dumb" team, provided we lose all three of Forsberg, Sakic and Bruno.

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