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It's up to Bob says Boivin

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Old
02-24-2004, 03:35 PM
  #1
gunnerdom
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It's up to Bob says Boivin

I just read a article at sportnet
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/artic...24_155201_4828

The interesting part is this : "Despite its losses, the Habs' owners are willing to contribute some extra money to make moves before the March 9 trading deadline in the team's quest for a 25th Stanley Cup.

"If there's a way we can improve the team while remaining responsible fiscally, we'll do it," Boivin said, noting trade decisions are left to general manager Bob Gainey.

"At this point, I would think that ownership would invest a little bit more if there was a true answer to a need.""

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02-24-2004, 03:43 PM
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key phrase there is "while remaining responsible fiscally"....

Any type of key player I can think of worth getting would not be 'fiscally responsible'.....

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02-24-2004, 03:48 PM
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I believe there will be a Move, and a more Significant one then most ppl. thought there would be. Bob Gainey now has the power to do whatever he so wishes... Its going to be very interesting over the next 2 weeks.

 
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02-24-2004, 03:55 PM
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"If there's a way we can improve the team while remaining responsible fiscally, we'll do it," Boivin said, noting trade decisions are left to general manager Bob Gainey.

"At this point, I would think that ownership would invest a little bit more if there was a true answer to a need.""

#1 Habitant,
Bob Gainey has always had the power to do as he wished while GM of the Habs. Who else would have the power (over personnel decisions)??

Other notes, on the trade front... i find Boivin's comments interesting because in my interpretation, they say that there won't be any trade unless it makes us better in the long run--no trade to boost us for the playoffs (like the Steve Sullivan deal). "if there was a true answer to a need" sounds a lot like there isn't a market for a trade, or that management believes that the current problems that the team has cannot be solved in the current trade market... how do others interpret these comments??

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02-24-2004, 03:57 PM
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I get the feeling we'll see a move on the same level as the Linden, Zubrus - Zednik, Bulis scale.

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02-24-2004, 04:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habsfansam
"If there's a way we can improve the team while remaining responsible fiscally, we'll do it," Boivin said, noting trade decisions are left to general manager Bob Gainey.

"At this point, I would think that ownership would invest a little bit more if there was a true answer to a need.""

#1 Habitant,
Bob Gainey has always had the power to do as he wished while GM of the Habs. Who else would have the power (over personnel decisions)??

Other notes, on the trade front... i find Boivin's comments interesting because in my interpretation, they say that there won't be any trade unless it makes us better in the long run--no trade to boost us for the playoffs (like the Steve Sullivan deal). "if there was a true answer to a need" sounds a lot like there isn't a market for a trade, or that management believes that the current problems that the team has cannot be solved in the current trade market... how do others interpret these comments??
Even if we made the playoffs and didnt make the third round, there would still be extra revenue for next year that no one was counting on. there would be a increase in ticket sales and merchandise for next year. i dont believe the 3 rd comment. thats just for a guarantee to break even. i think it will be close to breaking even if there was a 2nd rd exit too. even a 1st rd exit would make quite a dent.

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02-24-2004, 04:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jl.roberts
I get the feeling we'll see a move on the same level as the Linden, Zubrus - Zednik, Bulis scale.
Me too but it's also just a feeling.
I don't know why I have this feeling but I really feel like Bob will trade for someone that will help the team in the playoffs and will be a good player to keep in the long run too.
But it's just a feeling, I have absolutely nothing to back this up.

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02-24-2004, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by jl.roberts
I get the feeling we'll see a move on the same level as the Linden, Zubrus - Zednik, Bulis scale.
That would rule

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02-24-2004, 04:38 PM
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Originally Posted by jl.roberts
I get the feeling we'll see a move on the same level as the Linden, Zubrus - Zednik, Bulis scale.


All I can say is dont get your hopes high, who's our Zubrus(Hossa?), whos our Linden.

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02-24-2004, 04:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Habsaku
All I can say is dont get your hopes high, who's our Zubrus(Hossa?), whos our Linden.
My thoughts exactly.

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02-24-2004, 04:45 PM
  #11
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[QUOTE]
#1 Habitant,
Bob Gainey has always had the power to do as he wished while GM of the Habs. Who else would have the power (over personnel decisions)??[QUOTE]

First of all, of course he has the freedom to make a trade as he so wishes. However, I dont think your understanding my point of that until today he might have not had Managements blessings to bring in a higher priced player.

If he didn't.... he has now!

 
Old
02-24-2004, 07:00 PM
  #12
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Hey guys,What do you think Of Peter Nedved,I think he could help the team In the Playoff,I don't know what It would cost but Im sure this guy could help the team

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Old
02-24-2004, 09:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RE-HABS
My thoughts exactly.
Hossa and Perreault?

Seriously guys, take a look at the trade Savard did.

Richard Zednik, Jan Bulis, Alexander Perezhogin
vs
Trevor Linden, Dainius Zubrus, ?

I don't know who's the ?, I thought it was a 2nd pick but I can't find who.

Anyway, what a great trade.

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02-24-2004, 09:19 PM
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Montreal Canadiens traded Trevor Linden, Dainius Zubrus and a 2nd round selection (previously acquired, later traded to Tampa Bay - Andreas Holmqvist) in 2001 to the Washington Capitals for Richard Zednik, Jan Bulis and a 1st round selection (Alexander Perezhogin) in 2001.

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Old
02-24-2004, 09:26 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obcd1
Montreal Canadiens traded Trevor Linden, Dainius Zubrus and a 2nd round selection (previously acquired, later traded to Tampa Bay - Andreas Holmqvist) in 2001 to the Washington Capitals for Richard Zednik, Jan Bulis and a 1st round selection (Alexander Perezhogin) in 2001.
Hossa could definitely be the Zubrus, but may I venture to suggest Hainsey?

Hainsey, Hossa and Perrault are probably as valuable, if not moreso, as Zubrus and Linden.

I really think Hainsey, Hossa and Perrault could bag us a deal involving someone off of this list:

Jeff O'Neill
Ryan Smyth
Viktor Kozlov
Petr Nedved
Eric Daze (although the injuries lessen his attractiveness)

What about dealing Hossa and a 2nd for Kovalev, and then really trying to sign him?

Or take a run at Todd Marchant in Columbus. Just ideas.

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02-24-2004, 09:26 PM
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Strange, isn't that the prez complaints about lack of help from govmt's and then adds that the owner is ready to shell out more cash for players...

Show me the books! That's all I have to say about that.

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02-24-2004, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by deandebean
Strange, isn't that the prez complaints about lack of help from govmt's and then adds that the owner is ready to shell out more cash for players...

Show me the books! That's all I have to say about that.
A rather glib interpretation of Boivin's comments. Most owners would be willing to shell out a few more dollars to improve a team that is in playoff contention.

In terms of the books, I have no doubt that Boivin is telling the truth, the Habs spent over $US 7 million buying out the likes of Audette (3.4) , Chow (1.8) and McKay (2).

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02-24-2004, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by habfan4
A rather glib interpretation of Boivin's comments. Most owners would be willing to shell out a few more dollars to improve a team that is in playoff contention.

In terms of the books, I have no doubt that Boivin is telling the truth, the Habs spent over $US 7 million buying out the likes of Audette (3.4) , Chow (1.8) and McKay (2).

Ok, let's do some math here. The payroll stayed about the same. The Canadian dollar helped the Canadiens save 11 M $ CND (per Globe and Mail, a very credible source). The tickets prices have gone up slightly. Yet, the Habs are losing 10 M $, as much as last season, right?

If you believe that, then I've got some swamp land to sell you in Florida.

Until the books are really open (and they will never be, since this is a family holding), I don't believe a single word coming out of the mouth of this executive.

Is the deficit an Ebidta deficit, or one after taxes and immobilisations? Very different. Does the deficit include the personnal loan granted by the Caisse de dépôt and the banks? Sooooooooooo many questions. I've got a book full of them.

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02-24-2004, 09:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deandebean
Ok, let's do some math here. The payroll stayed about the same. The Canadian dollar helped the Canadiens save 11 M $ CND (per Globe and Mail, a very credible source). The tickets prices have gone up slightly. Yet, the Habs are losing 10 M $, as much as last season, right?

If you believe that, then I've got some swamp land to sell you in Florida.

Until the books are really open (and they will never be, since this is a family holding), I don't believe a single word coming out of the mouth of this executive.

Is the deficit an Ebidta deficit, or one after taxes and immobilisations? Very different. Does the deficit include the personnal loan granted by the Caisse de dépôt and the banks? Sooooooooooo many questions. I've got a book full of them.
The Canadiens like most businesses who have expenses in US dollars purchase the currency months in advance (in this case before the start of the season) the benefit of the rise of the Cdn dollar has been overstated. It will make a difference next season.

If the deficit does not include interest charges (Ebidta) then it's worse, and Boivin would be understating the teams financial status/obligations - what would be his motive for doing so?

Edit: Typo


Last edited by habfan4: 02-24-2004 at 09:57 PM.
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02-24-2004, 10:05 PM
  #20
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Originally Posted by habsfansam
Other notes, on the trade front... i find Boivin's comments interesting because in my interpretation, they say that there won't be any trade unless it makes us better in the long run--no trade to boost us for the playoffs (like the Steve Sullivan deal).
I still fail to see how Sullivan is not a trade that would have helped us in the long run. Care to bring up facts to back this up ?

Sullivan is 29 years old. At season's end the preds could sign him to a 1 year deal. And at the end of that deal if the CBA rules remained the same he'd still be a RFA because his date of birth is July 6th. Assuming Sullivan refused to sign a 1 year deal they could sign him to a 3-4 years deal. Two 2nd rounders is a small price to pay for 3-4 years of a 25 goals ; 60-70 pts energy guy with a great work ethic. Besides if they let Sullivan walk at the end of his free agency they would get compensation which is I believe a 2nd rounder. So it comes down to one 2nd for a chance to go deeper into the playoffs. If you think a 2nd rounder is a steep price to pay for help up front then we'll never agree ...

Besides it's always easier to develop young players when you have quality established NHL veterans (I'm using the word veteran loosely, after all he's only 29 years old). Teams like the wings, avs and devils have a great scouting staff but they also have great NHL veterans to help the kids develop better. The fact is that it's harder to develop guys and it takes longer when you have a team like the panthers or the thrashers. In most cases only special players will find a way to thrive and succeed within such poor systems.

Plus if Sullivan helps us finish a little bit higher than we would have in the standings and help make it a little farther than it gives invaluable playoffs experience to our young guns. Experience that could prove to be a big difference in the long run. You just can't quantify that.

Again I fail to see how Sullivan is a "short term move" only. I'm sure the preds don't feel that way toward him. There's more to such a trade than statistics.


Last edited by Habsolution: 02-24-2004 at 10:26 PM.
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02-24-2004, 10:33 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsolution
I still fail to see how Sullivan is not a trade that would have helped us in the long run. Care to bring up facts to back this up ?

Sullivan is 29 years old. At season's end the preds could sign him to a 1 year deal. And at the end of that deal if the CBA rules remained the same he'd still be a RFA because his date of birth is July 6th. Assuming Sullivan refused to sign a 1 year deal they could sign him to a 3-4 years deal. Two 2nd rounders is a small price to pay for 3-4 years of a 25 goals ; 60-70 pts energy guy with a great work ethic. Besides if they let Sullivan walk at the end of his free agency they would get compensation which is I believe a 2nd rounder. So it comes down to one 2nd for a chance to go deeper into the playoffs. If you think a 2nd rounder is a steep price to pay for help up front then we'll never agree ...

Besides it's always easier to develop young players when you have quality established NHL veterans (I'm using the word veteran loosely, after all he's only 29 years old). Teams like the wings, avs and devils have a great scouting staff but they also have great NHL veterans to help the kids develop better. The fact is that it's harder to develop guys and it takes longer when you have a team like the panthers or the thrashers. In most cases only special players will find a way to thrive and succeed within such poor systems.

Plus if Sullivan helps us finish a little bit higher than we would have in the standings and help make it a little farther than it gives invaluable playoffs experience to our young guns. Experience that could prove to be a big difference in the long run. You just can't quantify that.

Again I fail to see how Sullivan is a "short term move" only. I'm sure the preds don't feel that way toward him. There's more to such a trade than statistics.
Yeah, well one statistic you should look at is Sullivan's height and weight.

Montreal is already small enough. Why would they bring in another undersized player?

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Old
02-24-2004, 10:44 PM
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Marchant or Smyth would be nice. O'Neill would be too but his comments about the World Cup bothered me.

Of course, Lang would be amazing.

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02-24-2004, 10:52 PM
  #23
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Originally Posted by Natural Habs Fan
Marchant or Smyth would be nice. O'Neill would be too but his comments about the World Cup bothered me.

Of course, Lang would be amazing.
What did O'neil say about the world cup, I know he said something negative I just never found out what exactly he said... i've done abit of searching but came up dry

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02-24-2004, 11:14 PM
  #24
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Yeah, well one statistic you should look at is Sullivan's height and weight.

Montreal is already small enough. Why would they bring in another undersized player?
I'm not saying Sullivan would have been the answer to all of our problems. One thing is sure we need big scoring wingers a la O'neill and Smyth but it seems that those guys come at a heavy price. And I'm not sure Gainey is willing to pay it. On the other hand small guys like St-Louis, Sullivan and Briere have all been acquired for next to nothing and they all seem to be pretty important parts of their team. And if you give a quick look at the sabres they're not much bigger than we are up front but their offense is still pretty productive.

Another thing is that while we need size up front we also need speed and scoring. Which is two things that Sullivan could have brought to the habs. When you have Dagenais, Ribeiro and Ryder up front you know that you've not got the fastest team out there. All 3 players compensate this lack of speed by doing other things really well but I still think we have no players like Sullivan. I'm not talking about Donald Audette here. I'm talking about a guy who's career high for goals and points is better than anything we have on our team. All of this while playing on a rather bad hawks team. I have the belief that if you replace Bulis by Sullivan our first line is instantly a much bigger scoring threat. The price was ridiculously low for him considering those 2nd rounders still are a long time away from having a small chance to maybe one day be half as good as he is.

Anyway we missed our chance on Sullivan but that doesn't mean there's nothing left on the market to help us out at the same kind of price.

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02-24-2004, 11:16 PM
  #25
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Originally Posted by Natural Habs Fan
Marchant or Smyth would be nice. O'Neill would be too but his comments about the World Cup bothered me.

Of course, Lang would be amazing.
I'm not sure about Marchant... he's signed to such a huge deal for what he brings on the ice. He can't score to save his life. Don't you think we need less passers and more guys who can put the puck in the net ?

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