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Bure, Fedorov, Mogilny or Kovalchuk, Malkin, Ovechkin?

View Poll Results: Which era of Russians is better?
Bure, Fedorov, Mogilny 157 49.68%
Kovalchuk, Malkin, Ovechkin 159 50.32%
Voters: 316. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
11-13-2008, 02:05 PM
  #51
Dark Shadows
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Originally Posted by KingLundqvistXXX View Post
I honestly think Bure is more offensively skilled than ANY of them.

You say Mogilny played alongside high scoring LaFontaine yet act like Ovechkin and Malkin don't have a team around them right now?

Kovalchuk is the only one that doesn't have a team around him and if I compare Bure as the Florida Panthers to Kovalchuk as the Atlanta Thrashers, Bure wins by a landslide. Bure can be the whole team and win by himself, I've seen it several times before. No one else can do that.
Bure was also the world's worst defensive Liability. All he did was hover around the blueline waiting for that cherrypick pass, essentially leaving his team shorthanded in their own zone until they could sneak a pass to him.

Ovechkin's Capitals in his rookie year were a terrible terrible team and he still scored a metric ton. Bure's best finishes for points were 2nd, 3rd, 5th, and 7th in his 12 years, and his best finish for the Hart was 3rd.

Ovechkin is still getting better, and has already won the Hart, Pearson, Art ross, and come in 3rd in scoring to go along with his 1st and Rocket Richard(In which he outscored the nearest goal scorer by 25% during a very low scoring year, near equal to the dead puck era). He also has 3 first team all star selections. A country mile ahead of Bure's 1st team and 2 second team selections. Ovechkin is also nowhere near the defensive liability Bure was. He is not a Selke candidate, but he is a world ahead of Bure in terms of controlling a game.

Ovechkin is literally the best chance Russia has of seeing a player overtake Valeri Kharlamov as greatest Russian player ever.

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Old
11-13-2008, 02:29 PM
  #52
tony d
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Bure,Fedorov and Moginly but it's close.

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Old
11-13-2008, 06:09 PM
  #53
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Bure, Fedorov, Mogilny

but close

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Old
11-13-2008, 07:10 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingLundqvistXXX View Post
Mogilny - Let me know when one of them scores 76 goals in 77 games.
Please. Adam FREAKIN' Oates scored 45 goals that year!

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Originally Posted by KingLundqvistXXX View Post
Bure - More offensive skill than all of them combined.
How many Art Ross trophies does Bure have on his shelf?

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Originally Posted by KingLundqvistXXX View Post
Fedorov - Probably best overall. Can play offense AND defense.
So can Datsyuk but you conveniently left him off the ballot.

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Old
11-13-2008, 07:14 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Thornton_19 View Post
Fedorov: No argument there. He is the best two way Russian ever. But his peak was very short. He only had a few good seasons and then his effort after getting big money disappeared in the regular season.
Datsyuk is the closest thing to a prime Fedorov. Right now it's too early to make that comparison, but Datsyuk already has 2 stanley cups and a selke. Plus his giveaway/takeaway ratio is insane. In 10 years he could very well surpass Fedorov as the greatest Russian 2-way player.

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Old
11-13-2008, 07:17 PM
  #56
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I'm talking about (projected) careers here. Earlier in this thread I posted Ovechkin>Bure, Kovalchuk>Mogilny, and Malkin=Fedorov--actually Fedorov<Malkin. For Malkin to be elite so quickly says something about his likely career. Fedorov had a very short prime like Mogilny.

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Old
11-14-2008, 09:55 AM
  #57
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Kovy Ovy Malking

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Old
11-14-2008, 10:19 AM
  #58
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Bure --- When he was healthy he was truely a spectacle.
Fedorov --- best two way european forward ever. EVER. In his prime he scored tons as well.,
Mogilny --- whenever he felt like it he could take command of the game. One of the most entertaining guys to watch without the puck.The one of the three who had the most potential for sure. (Scored over 70 goals 1 year)

I'm a huge Ovechkin fan, but I have a hard time buying into the idea that he's going to play 78+ games for longer than the older russians did.

Bure > Kovalchuk (pure goal scorer)
Mogilny > Malkin (offensive wizzard)
Ovechkin > Federov (dudes who can do it all) --- and Ovechkin is only better than Federov if he accomplishes what we expect him to accomplish. Win a few Cups and score well over 500 goals. He's got a long road ahead of him yet.

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Old
11-14-2008, 10:38 AM
  #59
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bure, mogilny, and federov, no question.

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Old
11-14-2008, 10:53 AM
  #60
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Who can even say anything about eras now? The three mentioned young players will never be known as a trio like the Russians who were together in the Russia team, because they aren't going to play together as a unit, and its way too early to say what these guys can do. Talent wise, I don't think they're behind though.

Bure came over at a time that was comparable to today even if scoring was HIGHER then, and Ovechkins numbers in his first three seasons were very much comparable and he even got a Hart and Art Ross to boot. These were the most productive years of Bure's career, and Ovechkin now has as many 100+ seasons as Bure got. Lets agree it won't end there for A.O...

Mogilny.... same time and, yes, that was a sick season. Is greatness - and yes he was great - is greatness to be defined by one season (where Selšnne got as many goals and neither won the Ross)? He had two +50 goals seasons all together - and so does Kovalchuk, playing for a team that has been to the playoffs once, whereas Mogilny was there in all of his first seasons in the NHL.

Fedorov? I agree that he is probably the greatest of the bunch. A phenomenal career. A fantastic two way player.
No player in his third NHL season should be matched up against what Federov have done. But saying that - where is the limit on Malkin's talent? He's definitely going to score a whole lot more than Fedorov and he will never have Federov's defence. Where the balance is... that'll be decided down the line when we see just how good Malkin will get and how much he wins.

I think there's as much "it was better in the past" nostalgia here as there is exuberance from those younger who didn't see as much of the older players (and I'm only 31 ).
In any case it is too early to tell either way, except for one thing: The present trio certainly ranks as high judged against their peers as the old did. I would say quite a bit higher also, as you could legitimately argue that A.O is the best scorer in the game now and that Kovy is right up there too. Malkin is in a one two with Crosby for best center in the league (in my biased mind at least).

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Old
11-14-2008, 03:26 PM
  #61
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IMO Malkin Kovalchuk Ovechkin > Bure Mogilny Fedorov

but....
Bure > Malkin, Kovalchuk, Ovechkin, Mogilny, or Fedorov

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Old
11-14-2008, 04:43 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thadd View Post
Bure --- When he was healthy he was truely a spectacle.
Fedorov --- best two way european forward ever. EVER. In his prime he scored tons as well.,
Mogilny --- whenever he felt like it he could take command of the game. One of the most entertaining guys to watch without the puck.The one of the three who had the most potential for sure. (Scored over 70 goals 1 year)

I'm a huge Ovechkin fan, but I have a hard time buying into the idea that he's going to play 78+ games for longer than the older russians did.

Bure > Kovalchuk (pure goal scorer)
Mogilny > Malkin (offensive wizzard)
Ovechkin > Federov (dudes who can do it all) --- and Ovechkin is only better than Federov if he accomplishes what we expect him to accomplish. Win a few Cups and score well over 500 goals. He's got a long road ahead of him yet.
I'm sorry, Mogilny is in no way shape or form better than Malkin. Mogilny had that one freak season, getting fed by Lafontaine, when scoring was way up leaguewide. After that, he was incredibly inconsistent and was always a no-show in the playoffs.

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Old
11-14-2008, 04:49 PM
  #63
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Ill take Kovalchuck, Malkin and Ovechkin

I see all 3 as 500+ goal scorers
They're all more physical as well
Overall this group I find to be better defensively, even if Fedorov was the best individually

If we're talking better-at-their-peak, then I might go with Bure-Fedorov-Mogilny

But career wise, ill give it to the younger generation

Bure vs Ovechkin
Id have to go with ovechkin. Seems almost if not equally adept at scoring, but much better defensively and more physical
Ovechkin

Mogilny Vs Kovalchuck
Mogilny had one amazing season, and some great ones. But overall i feel Kovalchuck will get more career goals. Also Kovalchuck does get a bit edgy when he wants to
Kovalchuck

Fedorov vs Malkin
Both are the best defensively and best playmakers of the two groups. Malkin will be better offensively, but Fedorov is better defensively
Tie


Last edited by goliath5151: 11-14-2008 at 04:55 PM.
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Old
11-14-2008, 04:54 PM
  #64
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very surprised mogilny-bure-fedorov are winning this. the younger guys are at the top of the nhl even in the infancy of their careers. the older group wasn't the best of the nhl even in their primes. ovechkin and malkin could very well both end up top 20 all time players. kovalchuk could very well score 700+ goals. it will be a very clear choice in a few years.

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Old
11-14-2008, 05:19 PM
  #65
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The new era guys.

Kovalchuk > Bure
Malkin = Fedorov
Ovechkin < Mogilny.

It is ridiculously close.

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Old
11-14-2008, 05:32 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Luigi Lemieux View Post
very surprised mogilny-bure-fedorov are winning this. the younger guys are at the top of the nhl even in the infancy of their careers. the older group wasn't the best of the nhl even in their primes. ovechkin and malkin could very well both end up top 20 all time players. kovalchuk could very well score 700+ goals. it will be a very clear choice in a few years.
There were a WHOLE LOT MORE top tier players in the early-mid 90s. Should I name them and compare them to the players of today? Those poll results would be even worse than this one.

Hate to break it to you fans who like today's players more.

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11-14-2008, 05:32 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Letang58 View Post
The new era guys.

Kovalchuk > Bure
Malkin = Fedorov
Ovechkin < Mogilny.

It is ridiculously close.
You think Kovalchuk > Bure but Mogilny > Ovechkin?! Wow....

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Old
11-14-2008, 05:34 PM
  #68
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There's too much haughty stupid in this thread to address individually.

The younger trio has accomplished more than the older trio could ever have hoped to accomplish so early in their careers, and at this rate, I would be very surprised if they didn't have better careers when all's said and done.

And wonder of wonders, I'm old enough to have seen Bure, Mogilny, and Fedorov play in their prime.

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Old
11-14-2008, 06:56 PM
  #69
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Tough poll, and hard to judge because we know how the careers of the old-school guys turned out. I voted for the younger guys based on career potential because I think Ovy will be the best of them when all is said and done, although I'd put Fedorov as the best all-around player for now.

Kovalchuk I think is very underrated because of where he plays. Bure and Mogilny did not spend enough time at the top of the heap, although Bure at his best was the most exciting player I've ever seen. You younger guys should visit youtube and check him out. Breathtaking.

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Old
11-14-2008, 07:11 PM
  #70
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People who are saying Bure is better than Ovechkin have been watching far too many highlight clips on YouTube.

Ovechkin already is a much better and more complete player than Bure.

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Old
11-14-2008, 07:31 PM
  #71
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this is a great poll, and the results show it. I actually sat here and thought about it for a few minutes. Without any statistical analysis I picked the new era of Russians, bused purely on offensive output. However. Fedorov, which I am on record saying might have been the best 2-way hockey player to every play...EVER.

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Old
11-14-2008, 07:32 PM
  #72
KingLundqvistXXX
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New rule in my poll.

If you are a Penguins or Caps fan, please say so. Also state your age too.

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Old
11-14-2008, 08:51 PM
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingLundqvistXXX View Post
New rule in my poll.

If you are a Penguins or Caps fan, please say so. Also state your age too.
Thats almost like a subtle joke about the thrashers. haha

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Old
11-14-2008, 08:51 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by KingLundqvistXXX View Post
New rule in my poll.

If you are a Penguins or Caps fan, please say so. Also state your age too.
What about ethnicity, gender, sexual orientation, and income? Can't have an unbiased poll without those.

But I think we can just naturally assume that any fans of teams that the older Russians play/played for are completely objective.

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Old
11-15-2008, 06:41 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by KingLundqvistXXX View Post
New rule in my poll.

If you are a Penguins or Caps fan, please say so. Also state your age too.
i see here serious mental problems! keep going dude!

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