HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New Jersey Devils
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Brooks: Elias Must Go...

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-18-2008, 11:23 AM
  #151
britdevil
Tea with milk...
 
britdevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Internets.
Posts: 19,220
vCash: 500
Your soup sandwich crazy mate.

Have a cup of tea, and enjoy the game.

britdevil is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 11:52 AM
  #152
DEVILS ALL THE WAY*
Yes, I'm a hypocrite
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,477
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by åboriginal View Post
dood.......

youre no gm any more than the rest of us. we cant say what ACTUAL(not armchair) gms can/will trade who for. because jbouw is an impending UFA that obv makes his price somewhat lower because hes not guaranteed to sign with said team if he so chooses. jm can demand all he wants for a top shelf return but hes not going to get it unless some desperate team in a conference battle is willing to take that sortve gamble. nothing is written in stone yet so before u go calling people homers just for trying to be realistic, have a coke and a smile and $tfu.
Were did I say that my proposals were better then others... Are you guys crazy !?!?! What i'm trying to say is that a package of Gionta, Bergfors and a pick aren't getting you diddly squat.

We have Gionta on our roster at the moment and about 90% of this board wants his ass out of town so you guys actually think that some other team will take him off our hands for someone like Barker... please. You were saying that a team that is desperate for a good puck moving 25 year old d-men that can log up to 25 minutes per games will overpay just to get a hold of J-Bow, then your absolutely right. I can see the Flyers and Rangers on top of that list while we look at the boat float by with our mediocre offer and we'll be at the exact same spot next year with our AHL defense.

Alot of people are reluctant to trade guys like Elias, Madden, Pandolfo, White, etc... the bottom line is if the trade makes your team better, you go for it. Plain and simple

DEVILS ALL THE WAY* is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 11:54 AM
  #153
CFD
shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
 
CFD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 18,087
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEVILS ALL THE WAY View Post
Were did I say that my proposals were better then others... Are you guys crazy !?!?! What i'm trying to say is that a package of Gionta, Bergfors and a pick aren't getting you diddly squat.

We have Gionta on our roster at the moment and about 90% of this board wants his ass out of town so you guys actually think that some other team will take him off our hands for someone like Barker... please. You were saying that a team that is desperate for a good puck moving 25 year old d-men that can log up to 25 minutes per games will overpay just to get a hold of J-Bow, then your absolutely right. I can see the Flyers and Rangers on top of that list while we look at the boat float by with our mediocre offer and we'll be at the exact same spot next year with our AHL defense.
Take a deep breath and calm yourself.

And I wouldn't call our defense "AHL" anymore. We may not have the strongest group, by as a whole the group has improved from where it was last year.

CFD is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 11:57 AM
  #154
britdevil
Tea with milk...
 
britdevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Internets.
Posts: 19,220
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEVILS ALL THE WAY View Post
Were did I say that my proposals were better then others... Are you guys crazy !?!?! What i'm trying to say is that a package of Gionta, Bergfors and a pick aren't getting you diddly squat.

We have Gionta on our roster at the moment and about 90% of this board wants his ass out of town so you guys actually think that some other team will take him off our hands for someone like Barker... please. You were saying that a team that is desperate for a good puck moving 25 year old d-men that can log up to 25 minutes per games will overpay just to get a hold of J-Bow, then your absolutely right. I can see the Flyers and Rangers on top of that list while we look at the boat float by with our mediocre offer and we'll be at the exact same spot next year with our AHL defense.
I want to know who has been posting this mystery Gionta, Bergfors and 3rd proposal you keep harping on about...

I suggest you find a new team to root for really, thats all I can recommend. Lou's strategies gave us 3 cups and the Flyers and Rangers strategies? Mediocrity...

Blocked.

britdevil is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 11:57 AM
  #155
Brooklyndevil
82nd Airborne
 
Brooklyndevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Brooklyn, NY USA
Country: United States
Posts: 15,880
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drewr15 View Post
So basically our second best forward for a rental goalie and a young dman. And this isn't giving up on this season how? I honestly don't know what we can trade for a puck moving dman - I think at the trade deadline those options will become clearer - what I do know is that trading elias is giving up and again I am not for doing that while Marty is a Devil. i would trade Vrana and Bergfors before Elias right now.
You have to take into consideration getting Elias off the books. But, if you're not interested in a rebuild the deal makes no sense. I personally have no problem with looking to the future, because even when Marty comes back, I don't see this team beating Pitt, Montreal or the NYR in the east.

But I also have no problem keeping Elias, just as long as Lou gets some assets for Gio, Madden, Holik and Oduya, if he isn't resigned after January. Of course, you move those players if we're out of the playoff hunt.

Brooklyndevil is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:01 PM
  #156
Jiri Bicek
Rusty Shackleford
 
Jiri Bicek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Jersey City, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,706
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Jiri Bicek
Why would you want to move Oduya?

Even though he's a UFA, I'm sure Lou would like to hold on and try to re-sign the guy

Jiri Bicek is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:04 PM
  #157
DEVILS ALL THE WAY*
Yes, I'm a hypocrite
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,477
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarkson Falls Down View Post
Take a deep breath and calm yourself.

And I wouldn't call our defense "AHL" anymore. We may not have the strongest group, by as a whole the group has improved from where it was last year.
Let's grade our guys:-

- Colin White isn't the player he was... period.
- Andy Greene was playing to same way he was when he got called up during the SCP a few years ago but he isn't a garantee.
- Mike Mottau is a AHL'er that can step up in case of injury's but he's a starter on our roster.
- Bryce Salvador and Johnny Oduya are good... not great, good.
- Paul Martin is the only bright spot on defense.

OUR BIGGEST DEFENSEMEN IS NAMED.... MARTIN BRODEUR.

DEVILS ALL THE WAY* is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:04 PM
  #158
CFD
shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
 
CFD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 18,087
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jiri Bicek View Post
Why would you want to move Oduya?

Even though he's a UFA, I'm sure Lou would like to try and re-sign the guy
People seem to be still coming to grips with the fact that he makes 600k and is a very good defenseman...

Just remember - if your name isn't Stevens, Niedermayer, Martin, or Daneyko, you stink.

CFD is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:05 PM
  #159
britdevil
Tea with milk...
 
britdevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Internets.
Posts: 19,220
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jiri Bicek View Post
Why would you want to move Oduya?

Even though he's a UFA, I'm sure Lou would like to hold on and try to re-sign the guy
The future is way more important that the present silly....

We should employ strategies like the evil NYR and Flyers because of all the success they have had with them!

britdevil is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:08 PM
  #160
åboriginal
lou ****ing sucks
 
åboriginal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: LV-426
Country: Finland
Posts: 24,127
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to åboriginal
Quote:
Originally Posted by britdevil View Post
The future is way more important that the present silly....

We should employ strategies like the evil NYR and Flyers because of all the success they have had with them!
or say **** all and move to hamilton

åboriginal is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:10 PM
  #161
DEVILS ALL THE WAY*
Yes, I'm a hypocrite
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,477
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by britdevil View Post
I want to know who has been posting this mystery Gionta, Bergfors and 3rd proposal you keep harping on about...

I suggest you find a new team to root for really, thats all I can recommend. Lou's strategies gave us 3 cups and the Flyers and Rangers strategies? Mediocrity...

Blocked.
It's called post lockout buddy. With the salary cap, I'm sorry to say that Lou had to dig his way out of trouble more then anything else. I'm a hardcore Devils fan and it won't change but that statement is as stupid as what my friends (Habs fan) say... "Look at how many Stanley Cups we have". If you want to live in the past and say that we were good the past 10 to 15 years... it's your call. I want to say that we are good now and in the future.

DEVILS ALL THE WAY* is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:12 PM
  #162
Eric Sachs
Registered User
 
Eric Sachs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Country: Japan
Posts: 16,008
vCash: 500
In Lou we trust...

Eric Sachs is online now  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:15 PM
  #163
Hypernova
Gelly shots all day
 
Hypernova's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Baahston, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 3,143
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Hypernova
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEVILS ALL THE WAY View Post
It's called post lockout buddy. With the salary cap, I'm sorry to say that Lou had to dig his way out of trouble more then anything else. I'm a hardcore Devils fan and it won't change but that statement is as stupid as what my friends (Habs fan) say... "Look at how many Stanley Cups we have". If you want to live in the past and say that we were good the past 10 to 15 years... it's your call. I want to say that we are good now and in the future.
I think he meant that we should trust the Devil's management because they won three cups. They must know a little more than you about what we should do. It has nothing to do with living in the past.

Hypernova is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:17 PM
  #164
Jiri Bicek
Rusty Shackleford
 
Jiri Bicek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Jersey City, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,706
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Jiri Bicek
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEVILS ALL THE WAY View Post
It's called post lockout buddy. With the salary cap, I'm sorry to say that Lou had to dig his way out of trouble more then anything else. I'm a hardcore Devils fan and it won't change but that statement is as stupid as what my friends (Habs fan) say... "Look at how many Stanley Cups we have". If you want to live in the past and say that we were good the past 10 to 15 years... it's your call. I want to say that we are good now and in the future.
Once again.. The spoiled nature comes out..We've been one of the more successful teams over the last 10 years.

God forbid we have an off year..

How many teams, in all the major sports, can say they've been as competitive year in and year out like the Devils?

Try being a fan or someone like the Panthers, Blue Jackets, or Coyotes.. Not so lucky

Jiri Bicek is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:19 PM
  #165
britdevil
Tea with milk...
 
britdevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Internets.
Posts: 19,220
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEVILS ALL THE WAY View Post
It's called post lockout buddy. With the salary cap, I'm sorry to say that Lou had to dig his way out of trouble more then anything else. I'm a hardcore Devils fan and it won't change but that statement is as stupid as what my friends (Habs fan) say... "Look at how many Stanley Cups we have". If you want to live in the past and say that we were good the past 10 to 15 years... it's your call. I want to say that we are good now and in the future.
Ok, first of all its only been 3 seasons and 3 cups since the lockout. Unless you expect the Devil's to win every single year, I think they have done fine. Apart from maybe this stanglehold that the NYR have on us... Thats simply because our boys aren't stepping up against them, our team is just as good as theirs.

Secondly I am not living in the past... If you honestly think that trading away our 2nd (arguably best) most dangerous forward and a solid top 4 defensive defenceman, for a very young defenceman and stop gap goalie, is a wise decision then I applaude you.

Without the likes of Patrik Elias and Colin White, this team gets nowhere in the playoffs. What the hell is Cam Barker going to do to make up for the lost offence of Patty and the secondary shutdown defence of Whitey?? In all honesty I havent really seen that much of a decline in the guy anyway.

But hey, Cam Barker will win it all for us right. Lets just cut ties with our very successfull recent history and employ the tactics of the NYR and the Flyers.

BTW, how many cup wins do they have since the lockout?

Personally, I think you simply are not thinking clearly. Maybe the loss of Marty has sent you insane, maybe your a fairweather fan. Who knows? All I know is that I will stick by my man Lou, and the team he chooses to put on the ice. You are acting like a spoilt brat.

britdevil is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:21 PM
  #166
DEVILS ALL THE WAY*
Yes, I'm a hypocrite
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,477
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrsyDevil13 View Post
I think he meant that we should trust the Devil's management because they won three cups. They must know a little more than you about what we should do. It has nothing to do with living in the past.
Of course we should trust Lou... LOL. If one of us was better then him we wouldn't be typing some stupid posts on HF.

But can someone argue the fact that we lost KEY peaces like Gomez, Rafalski and Niedermayer to free agency and got nothing back in return. If he does the same thing with Madden, Oduya, Gionta and other pending UFA's... i'll be pissed.

DEVILS ALL THE WAY* is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:23 PM
  #167
Jiri Bicek
Rusty Shackleford
 
Jiri Bicek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Jersey City, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,706
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Jiri Bicek
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEVILS ALL THE WAY View Post
Of course we should trust Lou... LOL. If one of us was better then him we wouldn't be typing some stupid posts on HF.

But can someone argue the fact that we lost KEY peaces like Gomez, Rafalski and Niedermayer to free agency and got nothing back in return. If he does the same thing with Madden, Oduya, Gionta and other pending UFA's... i'll be pissed.
Yes and it's very simple..

We were in contention... That's it..

Lou likes to win and put forward a team that has a chance each year.. He's not going to waive the white flag for that season if he have upcoming UFAs and trade them off..

Would you have been pissed if we won the cup one of those years and then lost them for nothing?

Jiri Bicek is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:25 PM
  #168
MoonDragn
Registered User
 
MoonDragn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 9,117
vCash: 500
If you watch Elias closely during the games, he's still got his skills there, that hasn't disappeared. What he lacks is really confidence. He is so worried about screwing up defensively that sometimes he makes the safer play and end up not scoring. Or he goes for it and it turns out bad and he loses confidence in doing that the next time.

He beats himself up too badly whenever he misses an easy goal. Instead he should be encouraged that it was so close and the next time he won't miss.

Elias is fine, give him some stable good support and he'll produce again.

MoonDragn is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:31 PM
  #169
DEVILS ALL THE WAY*
Yes, I'm a hypocrite
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,477
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by britdevil View Post
Ok, first of all its only been 3 seasons and 3 cups since the lockout. Unless you expect the Devil's to win every single year, I think they have done fine. Apart from maybe this stanglehold that the NYR have on us... Thats simply because our boys aren't stepping up against them, our team is just as good as theirs.

Secondly I am not living in the past... If you honestly think that trading away our 2nd (arguably best) most dangerous forward and a solid top 4 defensive defenceman, for a very young defenceman and stop gap goalie, is a wise decision then I applaude you.

Without the likes of Patrik Elias and Colin White, this team gets nowhere in the playoffs. What the hell is Cam Barker going to do to make up for the lost offence of Patty and the secondary shutdown defence of Whitey?? In all honesty I havent really seen that much of a decline in the guy anyway.

But hey, Cam Barker will win it all for us right. Lets just cut ties with our very successfull recent history and employ the tactics of the NYR and the Flyers.

BTW, how many cup wins do they have since the lockout?

Personally, I think you simply are not thinking clearly. Maybe the loss of Marty has sent you insane, maybe your a fairweather fan. Who knows? All I know is that I will stick by my man Lou, and the team he chooses to put on the ice. You are acting like a spoilt brat.
I can see you point and if you think i'm acting like a spoilt brat, then so be it. I never said that trading Elias + White for Khabibulin, Barker and a good pick would win us the cup but what it would do is clear ALOT of cap room in order for us to land a big name UFA like, eh... Eh.......... Jay Bouwmeester. Even if we have Elias on our lineup, our style of play is based on defense and when your defensemen can't step up too the plate like the good old days, you go out and get one.

You were saying that Lou built 3 SC teams. What's missing in this years team from those 3 SC teams ?!?!? GOOD AND GREAT DEFENSEMENS... not average, not okay... GOOD AND GREAT, wich we don't have at the moment. Pittsburgh is a offensive team so they'll try to go and find offensive minded players so if we're a defensive minded team wouldn't it be logical to acquire a real #1 d-men ?!?!?

DEVILS ALL THE WAY* is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:32 PM
  #170
åboriginal
lou ****ing sucks
 
åboriginal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: LV-426
Country: Finland
Posts: 24,127
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to åboriginal
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoonDragn View Post
If you watch Elias closely during the games, he's still got his skills there, that hasn't disappeared. What he lacks is really confidence. He is so worried about screwing up defensively that sometimes he makes the safer play and end up not scoring. Or he goes for it and it turns out bad and he loses confidence in doing that the next time.

He beats himself up too badly whenever he misses an easy goal. Instead he should be encouraged that it was so close and the next time he won't miss.

Elias is fine, give him some stable good support and he'll produce again.
exactly. if the man had better linemates, wed see a different patty. the more i think about it, the more i want havlat next to him. then as for center, i dunno what hulking, arnott type center we could get him, but thats up to unca lou. gio and zubrus arent up to pattys talent level or getting the job done in either case. hopefully rolston will be part of the puzzle when hes back again.

åboriginal is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:35 PM
  #171
Drewr15
Registered User
 
Drewr15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: New Milford, CT
Country: United States
Posts: 5,907
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEVILS ALL THE WAY View Post
I don't want to do this... but look at what Montreal did a couple of years ago. They had a so-so team and then brought up rookies like Plekanec, Sergei and Andrei Kostitsyn and Guillaume Latendresse. If you draft people it's not to let them rot in Lowell or the 4th line, it's to see what they have in they're gut and to see if they can make the next step.

Bergfors looks pretty solid out there but if you put him on a line with Rupp and Clarkson, that's just using your assets in a negative way. Put him on a line with offensive minded players and let the kid play on the 2nd PP unit.

If yourself and Britdevil are willing to let the season go along without our best player (Marty) and think we are making the playoffs with our current D... you guys are off the tracks. And even if we do make the playoffs, I don't want to rush Marty off his injury and we are still looking at a 1st round exit.

Sorry if I'm so negative but i'm just looking at the big picture... the "REAL" big picture.
Ok so basically you are saying you don't think this year or next this team has any shot so let's clean house and go with the kids. That's fine if that is your position, I think that is a little defeatist and also a waste of Brodeur. I'd rather see what the kids are made of this year, see if we can sneak in the playoffs and maybe fill one of those holes at the trade deadline and then more in the offseason.

And I have argued myself for Bergfors to get more ice time. Personally I'd have no prob with him getting 4th line ice time if we were healthy and scoring but since we are not I want more time for him otherwise I think 4th line on the NHL is better than first line in the AHL but that's just my opinion.

Drewr15 is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:36 PM
  #172
DEVILS ALL THE WAY*
Yes, I'm a hypocrite
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,477
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoonDragn View Post
If you watch Elias closely during the games, he's still got his skills there, that hasn't disappeared. What he lacks is really confidence. He is so worried about screwing up defensively that sometimes he makes the safer play and end up not scoring.
The reason why, might be because our defense isn't as strong as years past and turning the puck over leads to trouble with the team we have today... That's why i'm screaming for a solid #1 d-men.

DEVILS ALL THE WAY* is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:41 PM
  #173
Drewr15
Registered User
 
Drewr15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: New Milford, CT
Country: United States
Posts: 5,907
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooklyndevil View Post
You have to take into consideration getting Elias off the books. But, if you're not interested in a rebuild the deal makes no sense. I personally have no problem with looking to the future, because even when Marty comes back, I don't see this team beating Pitt, Montreal or the NYR in the east.

But I also have no problem keeping Elias, just as long as Lou gets some assets for Gio, Madden, Holik and Oduya, if he isn't resigned after January. Of course, you move those players if we're out of the playoff hunt.
I agree this team needs more, one more D and one more center. I don't feel that they are that far off that it is time to rebuild though. I don't mind if they don't get anything for Holik, he was a short term add that cost us nothing. Getting assets for Gio and Madden is subjective but if all you are going to get for gionta is some 4th round pick that may never see the nhl, I don't care about not trading him then. Madden and Oduya are the two that could really garner something in a trade and I honestly think Lou will get both to stay unless Mad Dog is really unreasonable about his cost. Myself, I would trade Langs before any of them.

Drewr15 is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:42 PM
  #174
Drewr15
Registered User
 
Drewr15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: New Milford, CT
Country: United States
Posts: 5,907
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEVILS ALL THE WAY View Post
The reason why, might be because our defense isn't as strong as years past and turning the puck over leads to trouble with the team we have today... That's why i'm screaming for a solid #1 d-men.
And I agree with you on that but I'd rather try and plug that hole without giving up.

Drewr15 is offline  
Old
11-18-2008, 12:45 PM
  #175
DEVILS ALL THE WAY*
Yes, I'm a hypocrite
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,477
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jiri Bicek View Post
Once again.. The spoiled nature comes out..We've been one of the more successful teams over the last 10 years.

God forbid we have an off year..

How many teams, in all the major sports, can say they've been as competitive year in and year out like the Devils?

Try being a fan or someone like the Panthers, Blue Jackets, or Coyotes.. Not so lucky
I'm perfectly fine with us struggling without Marty. What i'm having a hard time understanding is that with a sub par defense, Weekes or Clemmenson between the pipes and our stuggling offense, people still think that we have a team that can compete in the SCP. Even if we do, we're looking at a 1st round exit, so why not get a decent pick and change things around a little. Give the youngsters some ice time instead of Clarkson on the PP and if one of them has a good game, move him on the top 6.

DEVILS ALL THE WAY* is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:17 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2015 All Rights Reserved.