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Is Martin Havlat a dirty player?

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Old
03-02-2004, 04:46 PM
  #51
Mats_Hallin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by south-sentral
I haven't seen the slash against Cooke so I can't comment on that but chances are Johnson's slash on Cooke was probably intentional while Havlat's was not. Any 'illegal' thing Havlat does is out of frustration not sheer lunacy. If you don't have a problem with cheapshots then why are you fussing so much about the Havlat incident?
Because when a tough player does the same thing everybody gets antsy pantsy like you around here and is screaming for a 20 games+ suspension.
And Havlat himself said he wanted to hit him, but not in the head... BS.

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03-02-2004, 04:49 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by south-sentral
I haven't seen the slash against Cooke so I can't comment on that but chances are Johnson's slash on Cooke was probably intentional while Havlat's was not. Any 'illegal' thing Havlat does is out of frustration not sheer lunacy. If you don't have a problem with cheapshots then why are you fussing so much about the Havlat incident?

Love him or hate him. You will love him on your team..same thing goes with paxtong even if he is the undisputed Havlat hater.
Why is it that my opinion means less because I don't like the guy, but yours is infallible because you are a homer? The fact that you call Havlat's hit on Recchi unintentional just because of who he is is insane. So Johnsons slash at Cooke was sheer lunancy because of who he is, and wasn't out of frustration? Most cheap shots are in the heat of the moment, that doesn't change what they are.

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Old
03-02-2004, 04:50 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by paxtang
Actually, it makes me enjoy it more, because it reinforces what I feel about most Sens players and their fans who defend him. He is a gutless puke, despite his skill set. I won't cry if he gets a stick in the chop, but I'm sure you will.
Gutless? Bull****. Dirty? Of course.

If Martin Havlat was a gutless coward he wouldn't be playing in the game this Friday with the way Philly claims revenge is imminent. That takes courage to go out there and continue to play your game even when you know the other team is after you, and I tell you now Havlat will do exactly that.

It was a very cheap play but that stuff happens all the time. It's not like he backed away from the media and pretended nothing happened, he knew and openly admitted that he had messed up. I don't see what you keep whining about. What's your favourite team and player? I'm sure they have a squeaky clean record, right?

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Old
03-02-2004, 04:59 PM
  #54
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I bet all of you against Havlat would love to have him on your team.
Sens fans... you should be proud to have him on your club, as this jealousy is just another form of flattery.

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Old
03-02-2004, 05:00 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SumOfUs
Gutless? Bull****. Dirty? Of course.

If Martin Havlat was a gutless coward he wouldn't be playing in the game this Friday with the way Philly claims revenge is imminent. That takes courage to go out there and continue to play your game even when you know the other team is after you, and I tell you now Havlat will do exactly that.
With the current 27 min package he'll be pretty safe out there anyways

Quote:
It was a very cheap play but that stuff happens all the time. It's not like he backed away from the media and pretended nothing happened, he knew and openly admitted that he had messed up.
You make it sound like he was asking for forgivness thru the papers.

Quote:
I don't see what you keep whining about. What's your favourite team and player? I'm sure they have a squeaky clean record, right?
My favourite player is/was Cam Neely. Of the current players it's Keith Primeau. Tough, talented honourable hockeyplayers. Ok Primeau has hands of stone...

Favourite fighter is Brownie of course.

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03-02-2004, 05:01 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Mats_Hallin
Because when a tough player does the same thing everybody gets antsy pantsy like you around here and is screaming for a 20 games+ suspension.
And Havlat himself said he wanted to hit him, but not in the head... BS.
We're just going in circles here really. It's not like havlat got any favoritism from the officials or the league. He served his time and rightfully so. Again, I never said that Havlat should have not been suspended or what not but calling him dirty because of one careless incident is not reasonable. He is chippy but not dirty. As for havlat saying he wanted to hit him, what's wrong with that? Last I checked, hitting was part of the game.

Quote:
Why is it that my opinion means less because I don't like the guy, but yours is infallible because you are a homer? The fact that you call Havlat's hit on Recchi unintentional just because of who he is is insane. So Johnsons slash at Cooke was sheer lunancy because of who he is, and wasn't out of frustration? Most cheap shots are in the heat of the moment, that doesn't change what they are.
It looks like you have done quite a job putting words in my mouth. When did I say Jonhson slash was driven from madness? Havlat hit was not deliberate he said it himself. He doesn't go head-hunting because he is the one being chased most of the time.

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Old
03-02-2004, 05:11 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by south-sentral
As for havlat saying he wanted to hit him, what's wrong with that? Last I checked, hitting was part of the game.
Nothing wrong with that, and nothing wrong with Johnson's whack on Cooke. Johnson was probably just as frustrated as Havlat was but for different reasons.
Havlat should accept if Recchi wants to go, that's all.

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Old
03-02-2004, 08:06 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by south-sentral
I haven't seen the slash against Cooke so I can't comment on that but chances are Johnson's slash on Cooke was probably intentional while Havlat's was not. Any 'illegal' thing Havlat does is out of frustration not sheer lunacy.
Sounds like you are comparing the two incidents, and saying Havlat's was out of frustratin, while Johnson's was out of lunacy.

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Old
03-11-2004, 02:01 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Yes, he is a dirty player and I'm glad. That's exactly what the Sens need.
no team needs a dirt player. teams need TOUGH players. there is a HUGE difference. and havlat is definately not tough. he is cheap
he has tons of skill and lots of potential, but he really has some issues with the way he retaliates to the events that occur in games.

Rob

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Old
03-11-2004, 02:22 PM
  #60
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Although his teammates stuck up for Havlat in public and on the ice, I'm sure privately his GM, coaches and teammates have told him that he has to stop crossing the line. Clearly if you do something you are going to get suspended for, don't do it. One has to play tough, but within what is allowed to take place.

Btw thanks for your 4th post Rob. We do read a lot here on the HF boards, so no need to use UPPERCASE for whole words, as might be the case on less mature boards.

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Old
03-11-2004, 02:23 PM
  #61
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Isn't Domi serving a suspension?

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Old
03-11-2004, 02:39 PM
  #62
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I don't think he's dirty and I would love for him to be on the Leafs. But I think he better watch out what he does and who he does it to because one day "someone will feed him his lunch".

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03-11-2004, 02:44 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syc
I don't think he's dirty and I would love for him to be on the Leafs. But I think he better watch out what he does and who he does it to because one day "someone will feed him his lunch".
We already know it won't be the Flyers, because Hitchcock would devour it before anybody gets a chance to feed it to him.

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Old
03-11-2004, 03:05 PM
  #64
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He's not a dirty player in the sense that C Lemieux was, or Ulf Samuelsson, or Marchment, but he's certainly capable of doing something stupid. I'd lay money on a repeat performance one day.


With the context of the NHL right now, the League has an opportunity to really address the issues of on ice violence. Will they? Not a chance. It's odd that the NHL has come down on Bertuzzi the way they have, yet at the same time they have created an environment that fosters these incidents. You can't discount the state of the game as a factor in what we're seeing these days. The League needs to take as much of the responsibility as the players.

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Old
03-11-2004, 03:30 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DOMInator
no team needs a dirt player. teams need TOUGH players. there is a HUGE difference. and havlat is definately not tough. he is cheap
he has tons of skill and lots of potential, but he really has some issues with the way he retaliates to the events that occur in games.

Rob
Since when is having one or two dirty guys on your team to stir up the pot and annoy the opponent a bad thing? Sure Havlat brings it too far sometimes but Ottawa needs that type of guy who plays on the edge.

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Old
03-11-2004, 04:44 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SumOfUs
Since when is having one or two dirty guys on your team to stir up the pot and annoy the opponent a bad thing? Sure Havlat brings it too far sometimes but Ottawa needs that type of guy who plays on the edge.
This is a pretty good way to look at it in my opinion.

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Old
03-11-2004, 11:32 PM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by officeglen
Although his teammates stuck up for Havlat in public and on the ice, I'm sure privately his GM, coaches and teammates have told him that he has to stop crossing the line. Clearly if you do something you are going to get suspended for, don't do it. One has to play tough, but within what is allowed to take place.

Btw thanks for your 4th post Rob. We do read a lot here on the HF boards, so no need to use UPPERCASE for whole words, as might be the case on less mature boards.
hey.

if you would like i could use exclamation marks after the words im trying to emphasize....(im not being sarcastic)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SumOfUs
Since when is having one or two dirty guys on your team to stir up the pot and annoy the opponent a bad thing? Sure Havlat brings it too far sometimes but Ottawa needs that type of guy who plays on the edge..
Thats the problem. He takes it way to far. He also take it was too far, way too often. There are alot of "dirty guys in the NHL and yes you can say that there are a few on the Leafs. But these "dirty players" have respect for their fellow opponents.

There is a difference between stirring things up and "doing it for the team" and showing total disregard for the well being of other players.


Rob

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Old
03-12-2004, 01:22 AM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DOMInator
hey.

if you would like i could use exclamation marks after the words im trying to emphasize....(im not being sarcastic)



Thats the problem. He takes it way to far. He also take it was too far, way too often. There are alot of "dirty guys in the NHL and yes you can say that there are a few on the Leafs. But these "dirty players" have respect for their fellow opponents.

There is a difference between stirring things up and "doing it for the team" and showing total disregard for the well being of other players.


Rob
Go ahead and show your objectivity, why don't ya. You're doing a hell of a job selling your point with that avatar too.

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Old
03-12-2004, 03:21 AM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DOMInator
There is a difference between stirring things up and "doing it for the team" and showing total disregard for the well being of other players.


Rob
And the guy in your avatar is a perfect example of someone who frequently crosses this boundary.

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Old
03-12-2004, 07:07 AM
  #70
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my name and avatar have NOTHING to do with this. i like domi. i am giving my unbiased opinion. if you guys have to resort to bringing my avatar and screen name in to this thats pretty weak. domi always gets things going and he fights alot. but he does so cleanly. he does not use his stick or make cheap shots. the only real cheap shot he ever had was on neidameyer (spelling?) during the playoffs that some would argue cost the leafs the series. that was definately dirty. i can admit that. i am simply saying havlat has to make some better choices when he chooses to retaliate. swinging his stick at peoples heads is not the best idea. just wait until the playoffs. id like to see him do it again then and then maybe some of you sens fans will realize how bad it is. i know havlat is a very good player. i just do not agree with some of the choices he makes. hell if hooking and slashing bother him so much why doesnt he get ray or simpson to beat the hell outta that guy. itd be much more fair and much safer that way..sens do have tough guys right?

use them...

Rob

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Old
03-12-2004, 07:26 AM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DOMInator
the only real cheap shot he ever had was on neidameyer (spelling?) during the playoffs
Sucker punching Ulf Samuelsson in the back of the head - eerily reminiscent of the bertuzzi incident, btw - would qualify as a cheap shot.
As would attacking Magnus Arvedson... There are so many more.

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Old
03-12-2004, 08:54 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by JDB3939
I wouldn't call him dirty. "Chippy" seems more like it. But all of Ottawa's Europeans are that way, except Chara. I saw him play recently, I expected him to be throwing people around and being a physical force. He was solid defensively, just not very physical.
"All of Ottawa's Europeans"??? You've been listening to Cherry too much! Hossa, Bonk, Bondra, Chara, Volchenkov and Alfredsson aren't chippy. That leaves only Havlat and Varada. This stereotype of Ottawa and "all" their Europeans is quite comical. Did you know a team like Toronto has more Europeans than Ottawa.

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03-12-2004, 09:55 AM
  #73
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TIE DOMI... rearrange the letters you get ME IDIOT

Havlat is a dirty player. So is Alfredsson btw. Afetr the Bertuzzi incident I don't expect anyone to feed Marty his lunch this season. They'd be pretty stupid to do so now.

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03-12-2004, 11:05 AM
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by highstickingyerface
TIE DOMI... rearrange the letters you get ME IDIOT

Havlat is a dirty player. So is Alfredsson btw. Afetr the Bertuzzi incident I don't expect anyone to feed Marty his lunch this season. They'd be pretty stupid to do so now.
This is exactly the problem with the NHL at the moment.

They suspended Bertuzzi big time, fine, he did something stupid.

But now players can't "police themselves" now. What if Havlat does somethign else stupid? And the NHL doesn't come down on Havlat?

Players have NO IDEA what to do right now. What is a teammate supposed to do when he sees a guy get cheapshotted?

1) Go after the cheapshot guy, and get punished along with the cheapshot guy w/ the instigator.
2) Do nothing, and watch the league give the cheapshot guy 3 games.

These are the options the players have right now. So they might as well continue cheapshotting.

Either let the players police themselves by beating the krap out of cheapshotters, or come down hard on them EVERY TIME regardless of what the result it. THEN watch cheapshots go down.

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03-12-2004, 11:57 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by Ironchef Chris Wok
This is exactly the problem with the NHL at the moment.

They suspended Bertuzzi big time, fine, he did something stupid.

But now players can't "police themselves" now. What if Havlat does somethign else stupid? And the NHL doesn't come down on Havlat?

Players have NO IDEA what to do right now. What is a teammate supposed to do when he sees a guy get cheapshotted?

1) Go after the cheapshot guy, and get punished along with the cheapshot guy w/ the instigator.
2) Do nothing, and watch the league give the cheapshot guy 3 games.

These are the options the players have right now. So they might as well continue cheapshotting.

Either let the players police themselves by beating the krap out of cheapshotters, or come down hard on them EVERY TIME regardless of what the result it. THEN watch cheapshots go down.
Just yesterday, Havlat came out and said that he is the last guy to comment on what Bertuzzi did because he could have hurt someone with his recent brain cramps.

Bertuzzi went overboard with his retribution. The sucker punch was bad enough but slamming his head into the ice was brutal. If Havlat had injured Cairns or Recchi, I'm sure he would have got much more than 2 games. Havlat was fortunate Recchi was not injured. In fact, he definately should have got more games for the kicking incident because of the potential danger. I will agree with you that the league must impose severe punishment to put an end to the frustration of and need to avenge cheap shots.

Now, having said that, how do you police or gauge an incident that some people considered questionable, such as the hit by Moore. I believe Naslund himself said it wasn't such a cheap shot.

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