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Leafs trade away first round draft pick... Again

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Old
03-03-2004, 09:41 PM
  #26
littleHossa
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This trade will be funny as hell in the case Leetch falls down injured for the playoffs.

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03-03-2004, 09:42 PM
  #27
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I never really believed in the Leafs chances over the past few years. Last season I knew they were gonna get ousted. I'm surprised they stretched it to 7 games (Thanx Cechmanek).

But this season I really think they have the making of a very very solid cup contender. They've got ALL you can possibly want on a playoffs contender. As much as it pains me to say this they're the best bet to win it all in the east and go to the cup finals.

I just don't get why leafs fans are crying about those obscure prospects and 2 draft picks. They just added a conn smythe trophy winner, one of the top offensive blue liner in the league and a classy leader. It's now or never for the leafs.

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03-03-2004, 10:15 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by littleHossa
This trade will be funny as hell in the case Leetch falls down injured for the playoffs.
You Habs fans(well some of you) are unbelievable!

Just remember word KARMA.

What if it'll happen to your new boy or another key player?

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03-03-2004, 10:15 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf_Crazy
haha


I agree with you somewhat but the Leafs totalllllly over payed for Leetch.
Yeah, did I read that right? 3 prospects and 2 draft picks? 5 futures for a 36 year old Leetch?

Seems like alot to me...but I am not a GM, so what do I know?

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Old
03-03-2004, 11:06 PM
  #30
ATG
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Quote:
Originally Posted by littleHossa
This trade will be funny as hell in the case Leetch falls down injured for the playoffs.
as would the gonchar,kovalev and any other deals

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Old
03-03-2004, 11:20 PM
  #31
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Two words: Belfour's back

Errr well more words:

If Belfour goes down, how ready do you think Tellie is going to be? Or how good do you think Kidd is going to be? I'm serious. I think Tellie might be damn good but...He has no playoff experience.

 
Old
03-03-2004, 11:26 PM
  #32
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Leafs will always sellout which will always allow them to spend money. They don't need a superstar prospect because they have money. It would be nice but they don't need one. Our minor system seems to be doing good for D men as of late and every year we see plenty of talented UFA forwards to sign.

Is this a deep draft year? Last I heard it wasn't.

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03-03-2004, 11:26 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Higgy4
Yeah, did I read that right? 3 prospects and 2 draft picks? 5 futures for a 36 year old Leetch?

Seems like alot to me...but I am not a GM, so what do I know?
3 prospects? Who? Players that may or may not play in the NHL!! This year draft is not that deep and 2nd round picks rarely pan out. Great trade for the Leafs!!

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03-04-2004, 12:28 AM
  #34
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Please this is ridiculous. The Leafs have only traded away their 1st round picks this year and last year, that's hardly a huge trend. And they were used to acquire two potentially game-breaking players; Leetch and Nolan. Aside from those two picks which have "potential" to be something, the other players the Leafs traded away are nothing special (Boyes, Kondratiev, Immonen, 2nd). Could they play in the NHL one day? Sure they could, but none are what you would call "bluechippers". I'm happy to see Macauley succeeding in San Jose, good for him, he has as many points as Darcy Tucker. I actually am glad to see him doing well but I'll still take Nolan thanks.

None of the players the Leafs have given up are going to make or break their future like say Colaiacovo, Stajan, or Antropov has the potential to do. But acquiring guys like Nolan and Leetch could make or break their present. IMHO that makes them smart deals.

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03-04-2004, 03:16 AM
  #35
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Im sure Calgary thought the same thing about St. Louis.

I've read Kondratiev is a better prospect than Colaiacovo, and Waters said the same thing on the radio here. I dont know them enough to say but he thought the Leafs got jacked.

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03-04-2004, 09:01 AM
  #36
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I'm not going to take shots at the Leafs or JFJ for doing what they think is best to help their club compete for the cup. However, since the issue of money vs draft picks (in terms of team building) has been mentioned several times in this thread, I thought I'd ask Leaf fans the following question.

Although the outcome of the CBA negotiations is uncertain, it appears clear that the owners are pushing for cost certainty measures (a salary cap). Assuming a salary cap is adopted (even allowing for current player contracts to be grandfathered into the CBA) Can the Leafs still do business the same way? Are they prepared to change their approach to team building? (in a salary cap environment, the ability to use money to bolster/augment a line up will definitely be curtailed).

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03-04-2004, 09:10 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by MoS
coilovaaoicalvoa...coilvialvaivoaiosi
Whoa!! Will that fit on the back of his jersey?

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03-04-2004, 09:44 AM
  #38
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I THINK that Kondratiev is undervalued by the Leafs organization (and Leafs fans) due to him going back to Russia. But remember, he is the same age as Coliacavo, and it was Kondratiev, not Coliacavo who made the team to start the year. Now, their is probably some anger towards him in the Leafs organization due to him going home to play, but that doesn't really affect his future potential. And if the Leafs chose HIM after camp, and not Coliacavo, that should tell you something.

Immonen is a nothing prospect, but Kondratiev isn't. The first and second round picks are a decent chunk to give up. And remember, Toronto won't have a pick until the third round this year, which kindof sucks....

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Old
03-04-2004, 09:59 AM
  #39
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Does anyone remember how long ago Leetch won that Conn Smythe? It was last year wasn't it? So he should only have aged 1 year from his Conn Smythe form?

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03-04-2004, 10:12 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle
Does anyone remember how long ago Leetch won that Conn Smythe? It was last year wasn't it? So he should only have aged 1 year from his Conn Smythe form?
He won that in 1994. So he's 10 years past his Conn Smythe form. That's half of a good player's career.

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03-04-2004, 10:12 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle
Does anyone remember how long ago Leetch won that Conn Smythe? It was last year wasn't it? So he should only have aged 1 year from his Conn Smythe form?
If this is a joke, I don't get it.

Leetch won the Conn Smythe in 1994.

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Old
03-04-2004, 10:33 AM
  #42
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It was a joke. In essence, he was saying Leetch is over-rated. I'd say that too.

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03-04-2004, 10:36 AM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle
Does anyone remember how long ago Leetch won that Conn Smythe? It was last year wasn't it? So he should only have aged 1 year from his Conn Smythe form?
So, either you've gone Rip Van Winkle for the past 10 years or you're trying to make an obscure joke...
Leetch got the Conn Smythe in '94(which should've gone to McLean IMO, but I'm being a homer )

Slightly overpaid, IMO, for Leetch, but the Leafs are gunning for the present right now. Their core isn't getting any younger and it's time to push for the Cup. Fans will still turn out while they rebuild, you'll just hear louder whines. I kid, I kid.
This trade basically puts them even in terms of the Bob Mackenzie dubbed "arms race of the Eastern Conference". Ottawa got Bondra, Boston got Gonchar, Philly got Markov and Zhamnov. If anything, it'll make for one damn fine stretch drive and playoffs for the Eastern Conference.

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Old
03-04-2004, 10:56 AM
  #44
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Sorry, subtle sarcasm is tougher to pick up online.

Yes, I was making a joke.

He was 26 when he won it (deservingly or not). That was nearly a 1/3 of his life ago! It's great that he won a Conn Smythe but to justify the trade by saying you got a "Conn Smythe winner" with "Playoff Experience" is hogwash.

How long since the Rangers made the playoffs? He knows less about the playoffs in recent years than 20 year old Jason Spezza.

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Old
03-04-2004, 11:12 AM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Egil
I THINK that Kondratiev is undervalued by the Leafs organization (and Leafs fans) due to him going back to Russia. But remember, he is the same age as Coliacavo, and it was Kondratiev, not Coliacavo who made the team to start the year. Now, their is probably some anger towards him in the Leafs organization due to him going home to play, but that doesn't really affect his future potential. And if the Leafs chose HIM after camp, and not Coliacavo, that should tell you something.
Good point, I like Kondratiev personally but i wouldnt read too much into the fact that he made the Leafs out of training camp. One of the reasons could very easily have been because of the fact that he had an out in his contract that Colaiacovo did not have. They couldn't send him to the AHL (well they could but as we've witnessed he just exercised his option to go back to Russia), whereas Colaiacovo did not have such an option. Regardless he was only a fill-in until Pilar returned he only played 7 games so I wouldnt make too big a deal of it.

I do find it funny that some people are quoting Bill Watters as saying the Leafs got ripped off. He's been a huge Kondratiev booster for the past several years dating back to when he was assistant GM with the club. No one took his opinions seriously before, why should they now just because Max is no longer Leaf property?

Personally I think Kondratiev certainly has the chance to become a good 4/5 defenseman some time down the road, but Id be truly shocked if he ends up being better than Colaiacovo.

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Old
03-04-2004, 12:12 PM
  #46
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Can the Leafs still do business the same way? Are they prepared to change their approach to team building? (in a salary cap environment, the ability to use money to bolster/augment a line up will definitely be curtailed).
i think the leafs have already started to change things. having players from late in the draft be used to get a player of leetch's caliber shows how the leafs drafting and scouting have improved and JFJ seems to be hiring more help for the end of the season.

exactly max is a 4th dman at best.

"'|).

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Old
03-04-2004, 12:14 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Marquis Dee

exactly max is a 4th dman at best.

"'|).
Having the potential to be a "top four" d-man is nothing to scoff at. Kondratiev looks like he could be a good NHL d-man.

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Old
03-04-2004, 12:20 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle
He was 26 when he won it (deservingly or not). That was nearly a 1/3 of his life ago! It's great that he won a Conn Smythe but to justify the trade by saying you got a "Conn Smythe winner" with "Playoff Experience" is hogwash.
He did win a Conn Smythe. Which makes him a Conn Smythe Winner !

He has playoffs experience. He won a cup. Wether it was 3000 years ago , 100 years ago or last season ... how is that supposed to matter ? Unless the guy has a serious case of Alzheimer he should still remember those moments pretty well and be a more experienced player for it.

So because he did those things a while ago we should all erase that from our collective memory ? Brian Leetch is one of the few rangers who brings it year after year. He's still one of the best offensive dman out there.

If given the choice between pay the price the bruins paid for Gonchar or the price the leafs paid for Leetch I'd go for Leetch.

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Old
03-04-2004, 01:10 PM
  #49
Marquis Dee
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Having the potential to be a "top four" d-man is nothing to scoff at. Kondratiev looks like he could be a good NHL d-man.
you're right 4th d man isn't something to scoff at but the odds of that happening are esp. compared to the odds that A) he never sees the NHL again B) he beomes a marginal 5-7th dman.

the leafs d looks pretty good post lock out if you ask me. who do we lose? cola gains 2 more years exp. and same with all our other prospects. i don't think max would have made our team.

JFJ knows how to evaluate a player and a team much better than the ppl who think he blew it on this one.

"'|).

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Old
03-04-2004, 01:13 PM
  #50
Marquis Dee
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So because he did those things a while ago we should all erase that from our collective memory ? Brian Leetch is one of the few rangers who brings it year after year. He's still one of the best offensive dman out there.
exactly. the fact that he hasn't been there in a while and he doesn't have many years left should mean he's even hungrier to win.

"'|).

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