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What's with Dion?

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Old
12-12-2008, 10:22 AM
  #1
JohnnyMapleLeaf
 
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What's with Dion?

Only seen a couple Flames games, and I'm wondering...what is wrong with Dion this year? From your prediction thread...most people had Dion hitting 20 goals this year, a reasonable prediction after 20/17/17 the last three years. But he's got 3 measly goals this year. WTF? It seems like his shot totals, and PP time are the same as previous years...is he just not finishing this year?

Dion's penalty minutes are also WAY down this year....has he turned a bit soft this year? And has that resulted in a change in the style of player...resulting in lesser stats. I mean, a usual plus player...he's also a surprising -7.

How can such a steady, Dman...coming off a Norris nomination be having such a down year?

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12-12-2008, 10:27 AM
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StreakingRed
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He hasn't had that great of a start as far as goals, but he has put up 20 assists and is on pace for his best year in points. He's currently at 7 points in last 4 GP, I can't say I'm concerned. The goals will come.

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12-12-2008, 10:32 AM
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DownInFlames
 
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He'd score more if his shots hit the net. I'll bet he's got one of the highest shot totals of all NHL defenseman and he also has the highest number of missed shots of all NHL players.

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12-12-2008, 11:04 AM
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He creates more offense through deflected shots and rebounds than he has through goals of late. I can think of 5 of his assists that were tip ins off the top of my head.

Teams have figured out to watch him finally. Its alot harder for him to unleash his slapper without having someone constantly in his shooting lane as well.

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12-12-2008, 11:24 AM
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Ice Cream Man
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It does appear he's playing a little bit more 'soft' this year than previous years. Why that is, I'm not sure... but his bonecrushing-type play has definitely taken a bit of a break this year. Perhaps there's something there we do not know about.

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12-12-2008, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Flames 4 Life View Post
He'd score more if his shots hit the net. I'll bet he's got one of the highest shot totals of all NHL defenseman and he also has the highest number of missed shots of all NHL players.
This is the correct answer. Just making up numbers here, but assume he's shot 100 times. Of that 100 I would estimate only about 20 shots actually hit the net. If he would get his accuracy up to even 80% I would be willing to wager that we would notice a marked raise in goal production.

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12-12-2008, 12:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMapleLeaf View Post
Only seen a couple Flames games, and I'm wondering...what is wrong with Dion this year? From your prediction thread...most people had Dion hitting 20 goals this year, a reasonable prediction after 20/17/17 the last three years. But he's got 3 measly goals this year. WTF? It seems like his shot totals, and PP time are the same as previous years...is he just not finishing this year?

Dion's penalty minutes are also WAY down this year....has he turned a bit soft this year? And has that resulted in a change in the style of player...resulting in lesser stats. I mean, a usual plus player...he's also a surprising -7.

How can such a steady, Dman...coming off a Norris nomination be having such a down year?

I would not be worried. I think he needs a good D- Parnter because most of the time Regher and Dion are covering for D-mans mistakes.

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12-12-2008, 12:48 PM
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4th in D scoring and leads the NHL in shots by a dman with 102.

Goals will come.

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12-12-2008, 02:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ice Cream Man View Post
It does appear he's playing a little bit more 'soft' this year than previous years. Why that is, I'm not sure... but his bonecrushing-type play has definitely taken a bit of a break this year. Perhaps there's something there we do not know about.

More responsibility and more icetime? I actually think he is getting to much icetime right now. I don't know if I would say he is playing soft either. He is still playing his physical style. Maybe not as many highlight hits as usual, but I'm sure those will come.

The goals will come as well. He has been better offensively the last couple weeks after really struggling in the beginning of the season.

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12-12-2008, 03:25 PM
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He is playing great. Have you noticed the way the defence has performed recently?

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12-12-2008, 03:27 PM
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He had a slow start point wise but I think he is slowly becomming a better all round player this year. Sure he has gaffs, all players do but they seem fewer then last season. Now as Lanny says if he can add an improvement in his shot accuracy he should be deadly.

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12-12-2008, 03:33 PM
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I would also add that I think he is trying to improve his defensive game. There was an interview earlier in the season about how him and Regher were trying to learn from each other - Dion with defensive positioning, and Robyn with when to jump into the play and take more shots.

I think the lack of bonecrushers is a result of this - because he almost always ended up out of position when he made those hits last year.... But Why Can't We Have BOTH!?

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12-12-2008, 03:42 PM
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I would also add that I think he is trying to improve his defensive game. There was an interview earlier in the season about how him and Regher were trying to learn from each other - Dion with defensive positioning, and Robyn with when to jump into the play and take more shots.

I think the lack of bonecrushers is a result of this - because he almost always ended up out of position when he made those hits last year.... But Why Can't We Have BOTH!?
Agreed, being out of position was the case for most of the team early in the season and look where it got them. If 3 and 28 can learn from each other great. At this time Regehr seems to be more punishing in his end though which kind of makes up for Dion not having as many highlight reel hits. Either way, wins is what I am after.

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12-12-2008, 06:59 PM
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I think Phaneuf has been just as good as always offensively, but wildly inconsistent defensively so far. He seems to be calming down defensively though, which would do the Flames wonders as his better defensive play basically reflects their winning streaks.

As for his penalty minutes going down, good, he took too many in the past.

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12-12-2008, 07:08 PM
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bananaz
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as soon as he starts hitting the net on the pp, the goals will start coming. frankly, i will never worry about phaneuf offensively. he'll always be in the top 5 points wise.

the good thing is that he's doing much better defensively. the first 20-25 games were very inconsistent for dion, but he's been much better the last few games. hopefully he'll pick it up from here.

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12-13-2008, 09:01 PM
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superhakan
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The reason his goals are down is because he cant unleash that bomb from the point on the power play, Teams are covering him and blocking his shooting lanes before he can get the shot off. So in its stead he just wrist the shot on net and hopes it gets tipped. Thats why he has so many assists this year.

Watching him lead the rush, he is an exceptional passer and skater for a defenseman. He is being used more to create offense than to provide it. The "coaching staff" needs to work on the power play to provide Phaneuf with more shooting lanes so he can be more effective. I am personally happy to see the way hes performed this year.

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12-13-2008, 09:25 PM
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He's a -7 because prior to the last 14 games, the Flames had no defensive system at all. It was painful to watch them play some games.

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12-13-2008, 09:56 PM
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He's a -7 because prior to the last 14 games, the Flames had no defensive system at all. It was painful to watch them play some games.
Exactly.

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12-14-2008, 08:57 AM
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honestly, while he makes a few screw-ups in the O-zone defensively, in the D-zone he has made some awesome plays this year. I dont mind the lack of highlight reel hits, if he can turn himself into a lidstrom!

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12-14-2008, 10:18 AM
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There is nothing wrong Dion's game this year... there is more happening on the ice than you see in the numbers...

His goal totals are down because he is using his wrist shot more, this can be attributed to a combination of things such as:
- adding Bertuzzi and Cammalleri to the powerplay, more offensive weapons mean he isn't doing it all alone anymore
- playing with lots of PP time with Giordano, before it wa Dion and Aucoin for most PPs and the defense had 2 bombs to watch not just 1
- teams have become more aware of Dion's shot and realize they don't have as much time as before because he won't always wond up the cannon

While the goal totals are down his assists are way up, in fact he leads all NHL defensemen in assists this year and is 3rd in points... in comparison he finished 5th in points last season and 6th in assists... offensively I do not see the concern because its just being distributed differently and is on pace to eclipse his career high in points, which he has done every year of his career thus far.

His penalty minutes are down because his fighting and lazy penalties are down... Keenan wants Dion on the ice for 27+ minutes a game, that doesn't happen when he takes a fighting major or lazy penalties. Another difference is Dion is not pulling himself out of position as often looking for the big hit, this causes less scrums and less fights.

as for his shots... he has 106 and is on pace for 290 which would be a career high by a decent amount... this has nothing to do with him missing the net either because shots are shots on goal, they do not include shots that are blocked or shots that miss the net. The truth is Dion is shooting more and getting more pucks through because he isn't using the slapper as often... also Dion tries missing the net sometimes too, we have all seen it since the Saddledome had new livelier boards put in mid-way through last season

His +/- is misleading as is more players in the league but if you stop to think about how bad the Flames had been at 5 on 5 this year it would make sense. Bad 5 on 5 team , plus a defenseman playing 27+ minutes a game can quite often translate to a poor +/- rating. I would like to point out Dion is playing more on the 1st shorthanded unit than ever before and more against other teams top lines than ever before as well; him being bad defensively has become a myth. His number of poor defensive plays has dropped this year, largely because as I mentioned before he is looking fo the big hit less than ever... but his number of great defensive plays has risen considerably... last season you would hear the commentators comment on a great defensive play by Dion every couple of games, but this year you are seeing it at least once a game.

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12-14-2008, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Lunatik View Post

His +/- is misleading as is more players in the league but if you stop to think about how bad the Flames had been at 5 on 5 this year it would make sense. Bad 5 on 5 team , plus a defenseman playing 27+ minutes a game can quite often translate to a poor +/- rating. I would like to point out Dion is playing more on the 1st shorthanded unit than ever before and more against other teams top lines than ever before as well; him being bad defensively has become a myth. His number of poor defensive plays has dropped this year, largely because as I mentioned before he is looking fo the big hit less than ever... but his number of great defensive plays has risen considerably... last season you would hear the commentators comment on a great defensive play by Dion every couple of games, but this year you are seeing it at least once a game.

Always been confused how peple are trying to make this point this season. I totally agree on the plus minus. The Flames as a team are a -12. Dion, playing almost half of every game, is a -8. Thats not suprising. But I agree you have to look closer.
Since the SJ game he is a minus 3 and since the Dallas game (which IMO woke him up) he is a plus 2.
No one gives him any credit for being a big SH contributer one one of the best PK units in the NHL. He is 3rd on ice time for Flames dman in SH situations, and IMO will pass Sarich shortly becuase Keenan is using hi more and more. You can't be a defensive liability, log that much SH time, and be that effective.

I'll agree that Phaneuf had a rough start to the season, but I will not suggest he is weak defensivly or having a bad season. He has been playing fantastic in the last few weeks.

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12-16-2008, 03:18 AM
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If we could get him a solid PERMANENT Dman that can feed him the puck... I'm sure that goal total will take a sprightly jump.

Wonder if we can pry Meech out of Det... or get Hammy back.

Mentioned earlier in this thread too... but watching Dion this year, he does seem a bit odd. Wouldn't be surprised to have a nagging shoulder injury or something be revealed.

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12-16-2008, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Split98 View Post
If we could get him a solid PERMANENT Dman that can feed him the puck... I'm sure that goal total will take a sprightly jump.

Wonder if we can pry Meech out of Det... or get Hammy back.

Mentioned earlier in this thread too... but watching Dion this year, he does seem a bit odd. Wouldn't be surprised to have a nagging shoulder injury or something be revealed.
May the good lord have mercy on your soul for wanting Hamrlik back. Actually no. May the good lord rip your heart out and feed it to rabid ferrets.

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12-16-2008, 10:29 AM
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May the good lord have mercy on your soul for wanting Hamrlik back. Actually no. May the good lord rip your heart out and feed it to rabid ferrets.
That bad, huh? You do realize that Phaneuf played terrific hockey with Hamrlik as his linemate, right?

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12-16-2008, 10:35 AM
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That bad, huh? You do realize that Phaneuf played terrific hockey with Hamrlik as his linemate, right?
I think 5.5 million can be better used than on Roman Hamrlik. For that salary I wouldn't touch him with a ten foot pole.

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