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Old
12-16-2008, 05:49 PM
  #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pukboy5kroner View Post
I think going with both goalies is a good option to have. Neither one of them will get too cold by not seeing action, and if either has a great streak, he can be the guy for a while. If either guy loses thursday you are looking at the same problem; if Andy were to play and lose, the team would also have to decide who plays Sunday; I guess I don't see it as that big of a problem.
Rather than goalie roulette, which I define as play one guy until he loses then let the other guy have a chance, I prefer either a true number one guy if he's elite or in the Panthers case, a stated goalie rotation in that the goalies know who going to start a couple of games in advance and have time to prepare rather then the guy starting worrying if he has one bad game he's out of there for awhile and the guy sitting on the bench wondering if his next game is the next day, week or month. If one guy is clearly outplaying the other over a period of time then scrap the rotation and name him the clear number one. I just don't like the one bad game and you're sitting awhile approach.

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12-16-2008, 05:49 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Rattrick View Post
I wouldn't want to move either Horton or Frolik from their natural position and since both are RW, I don't see them being together.
It's too good a punch at RW to have them together - spread the scoring out. I like that the Sunrise Express is back together and so is the CPR line. Good to see guys getting healthy. I hope they are highly motivated by the teams' run as of late.

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12-16-2008, 05:54 PM
  #53
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Rather than arguing on who gets to play with Weiss, Frolik or Horton, I suggest JM should get another scoring line center so they both have a chance to be productive. What an original idea, having two true scoring lines!

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12-16-2008, 06:08 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J17 Vs Proclamation View Post
Period of Frolik's PPG pace = large amount of winning games for us.

Period before, just meh. So far, he is the only player to be at a PPG pace over a span of 10 games for us this year.

Sure Horton/Stillman and Zednik are bigger names, more experience, but surely with an Offense such as ours, you have to give the guy who is producing more ice time.

If anybody at this point can give me a valid reason for Frolik not being a top 6 forward for us, i'd really to hear it.

I believe Horton has massive potential, and obviously he should and will see large minutes, but i don't understand breaking up Frolik and Weiss.
i don't care about ppg over 10 games or however many games. well, i do actually if i'm the coach and that plays into the lines i believe, just not the way you're fixated on thinking it should (i.e., top 6). i don't care about big names. don't think about these lines as moving frolik out of the top 6 either. you haven't given me anything. you don't have any idea why PDB would have put those lines together???

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12-16-2008, 06:16 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
i don't care about ppg over 10 games or however many games. well, i do actually if i'm the coach and that plays into the lines i believe, just not the way you're fixated on thinking it should (i.e., top 6). i don't care about big names. don't think about these lines as moving frolik out of the top 6 either. you haven't given me anything. you don't have any idea why PDB would have put those lines together???
Nobody knows what PDB is thinking, we just have opinions. The only thing we do know is this:

-The Express line will be back together as long as Weiss is healthy, otherwise its Horton centering Stillman and Booth

-the CPR line will stay together

-Kreps is centering Frolik and Zednik, and McLean is centering Stewart and Tanarsky

That is from the mouth of PDB, and what GR learned from the practice/interviews. Now comes peoples opinion. My opinion, the Express line should be put back together. It puts our two best snipers together, and we should spread that out when we are light offensively. Frolik's play, regardless if it was 10 games or the whole season, he is a top six player, and he deserves the right to play there.

So what you are saying is that Booth shouldnt be playing on the top six either right?

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12-16-2008, 06:25 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by pb1300 View Post
Nobody knows what PDB is thinking, we just have opinions. The only thing we do know is this:

-The Express line will be back together as long as Weiss is healthy, otherwise its Horton centering Stillman and Booth

-the CPR line will stay together

-Kreps is centering Frolik and Zednik, and McLean is centering Stewart and Tanarsky

That is from the mouth of PDB, and what GR learned from the practice/interviews. Now comes peoples opinion. My opinion, the Express line should be put back together. It puts our two best snipers together, and we should spread that out when we are light offensively. Frolik's play, regardless if it was 10 games or the whole season, he is a top six player, and he deserves the right to play there.

So what you are saying is that Booth shouldnt be playing on the top six either right?
you're absolutely right that nobody knows. i watched the clip too and found it interesting that he just threw that frolik line combo out there and moved on without comment. i agree that it makes some sense to put booth and horton back with weiss. those guys have proven they can generate offense, they can take care of themselves. i'm focusing pretty squarely on the people here who can see no reason for frolik playing with zeds/kreps and think they know better than PDB. i'm simply asking the question, if you're PDB, why would you put frolik and kreps with zeds?

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12-16-2008, 07:13 PM
  #57
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Well, on the subject of "scoring line" centers, yesterday Senschirp said that we are the team showing the most interest in Vermette right now, and today he reiterated that and said a deal could be made before Friday's roster freeze, it only depends on Murray pulling the trigger or not. Couple other teams interested too.

His stats this year are pretty bad, but I think he may just need a change of scenery. He scored 53 pts. last season, and he and Stillman had good chemistry together and both produced well after Cory was traded there last season. From the comments section it looks like a lot of Sens fans would be pissed if he was traded because they think his value is low right now.

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12-16-2008, 07:30 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
you're absolutely right that nobody knows. i watched the clip too and found it interesting that he just threw that frolik line combo out there and moved on without comment. i agree that it makes some sense to put booth and horton back with weiss. those guys have proven they can generate offense, they can take care of themselves. i'm focusing pretty squarely on the people here who can see no reason for frolik playing with zeds/kreps and think they know better than PDB. i'm simply asking the question, if you're PDB, why would you put frolik and kreps with zeds?
I dont put Frolik on the bottom two lines because he doesnt belong to be on the bottom two lines. Not comparing the two by any means, but you dont put Ovechkin on the third or fourth line. Frolik is one of our most talented forwards out there, and his play has dictated that. He deserves to be playing with guys like Booth, Weiss, Horton, Stillman, etc. Not to say that Zednik or Kreps arent good players, but he has proved over this stretch that he deserves the minutes.

I actually wouldnt mind him playing with Kreps, but not with Zednik as well. I know PDB knows 1000% more than most, if not all, of this board, but I just dont see the benefit of playing Booth and Horton together. Sure they played well together, but so did Booth, Weiss, and Frolik. No reason to put our two best goal scorers on one line, when we are thin up front.

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12-16-2008, 07:34 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterBouw View Post
Well, on the subject of "scoring line" centers, yesterday Senschirp said that we are the team showing the most interest in Vermette right now, and today he reiterated that and said a deal could be made before Friday's roster freeze, it only depends on Murray pulling the trigger or not. Couple other teams interested too.

His stats this year are pretty bad, but I think he may just need a change of scenery. He scored 53 pts. last season, and he and Stillman had good chemistry together and both produced well after Cory was traded there last season. From the comments section it looks like a lot of Sens fans would be pissed if he was traded because they think his value is low right now.
Ive wanted Vermette here for a long time now. He is one of the best faceoff men in the game, has a lot of talent, and is still relatively young at 26. I think it gives us enough skill down the middle, and we wouldnt have to go out in the offseason and get a center. A winger in the offseason, shore up the 4th line, and we are good to go.

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12-16-2008, 08:00 PM
  #60
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Just a little word on Carolina

I'M watching their match against montreal

11 penalties to the Habs in two periods...and 0 for Carolina

But they're really playing horrible on the PP. I like our chances for Thursday. This team is not playing good hockey

5 shots after the 1st period and 5 PP

....11-0

but hey...it's in Carolina

Do you think it could have happened if the game was in Montreal?

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12-16-2008, 08:11 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sinDer View Post
Just a little word on Carolina

I'M watching their match against montreal

11 penalties to the Habs in two periods...and 0 for Carolina

But they're really playing horrible on the PP. I like our chances for Thursday. This team is not playing good hockey

5 shots after the 1st period and 5 PP

....11-0

but hey...it's in Carolina

Do you think it could have happened if the game was in Montreal?
And right now they are leading after two, but Im sure they will implode just like they did against the Flyers. The Canes arent the same team of years past, and they dont scare me like they use to. The ONLY team in the division that frightens me is the Caps. We are the better team, and we will prove it Thursday.

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12-16-2008, 08:48 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by pb1300 View Post
I dont put Frolik on the bottom two lines because he doesnt belong to be on the bottom two lines. Not comparing the two by any means, but you dont put Ovechkin on the third or fourth line. Frolik is one of our most talented forwards out there, and his play has dictated that. He deserves to be playing with guys like Booth, Weiss, Horton, Stillman, etc. Not to say that Zednik or Kreps arent good players, but he has proved over this stretch that he deserves the minutes.

I actually wouldnt mind him playing with Kreps, but not with Zednik as well. I know PDB knows 1000% more than most, if not all, of this board, but I just dont see the benefit of playing Booth and Horton together. Sure they played well together, but so did Booth, Weiss, and Frolik. No reason to put our two best goal scorers on one line, when we are thin up front.
try to forget about top 6 bottom 6. i don't think coach is thinking that way. he needs as many lines going as possible and, imo, is probably thinking that frolik, who's playing well right now, could be the one to jump start zeds. kreps and frolik give you two guys with some vision and skill who can play on the wall and, potentially, create some room for zeds. at this point, we're still early in the week so who knows if the line will have any chemistry or will stick but my guess is that's what he's thinking - take advantage of frolik's play to spark a 3rd line. we know what we'll get from CPR and the sunrise express as well. makes sense, to me at least.

don't see where stillman fits in. does anyone know who he was skating with?

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12-16-2008, 08:59 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pb1300 View Post
Ive wanted Vermette here for a long time now. He is one of the best faceoff men in the game, has a lot of talent, and is still relatively young at 26. I think it gives us enough skill down the middle, and we wouldnt have to go out in the offseason and get a center. A winger in the offseason, shore up the 4th line, and we are good to go.
I wouldn't want Vermette in a Bouwmeester trade. To trade Bouw, i would aim higher in the center department. Now if Ottawa wanted to dump vermette for say, McLean and Murphy, that's a deal.
Unless you're going to trade Horton, the Cats don't need a winger. Booth, Horton, Frolik and Stillman with Olesz and Matthias in reserve to move up in case of injury should give us enough depth in the top 4 scoring winger positions. Those wingers would score more if they had more than one and in some cases none scoring line centers on the roster to play with.


Last edited by Georgia Panther: 12-16-2008 at 09:07 PM.
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12-16-2008, 09:19 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
try to forget about top 6 bottom 6. i don't think coach is thinking that way. he needs as many lines going as possible and, imo, is probably thinking that frolik, who's playing well right now, could be the one to jump start zeds. kreps and frolik give you two guys with some vision and skill who can play on the wall and, potentially, create some room for zeds. at this point, we're still early in the week so who knows if the line will have any chemistry or will stick but my guess is that's what he's thinking - take advantage of frolik's play to spark a 3rd line. we know what we'll get from CPR and the sunrise express as well. makes sense, to me at least.

don't see where stillman fits in. does anyone know who he was skating with?
I agree with you about the top 6 obsession. Dvo, Campbell, and Peltonen are more of a shutdown line, though they have had some offensive success. So, whether they get 2nd line minutes or 3rd line minutes shouldn't really be taken as so literally in reference to what to call the other lines. They are staying together due to the success they have had. When playing against teams that with stacked top lines offensively, they are going to play more.

If the Booth-Weiss-Horton line struggles, I'm pretty sure Deboer won't hesitate to shake up the line combinations again.

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12-16-2008, 09:20 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
try to forget about top 6 bottom 6. i don't think coach is thinking that way. he needs as many lines going as possible and, imo, is probably thinking that frolik, who's playing well right now, could be the one to jump start zeds. kreps and frolik give you two guys with some vision and skill who can play on the wall and, potentially, create some room for zeds. at this point, we're still early in the week so who knows if the line will have any chemistry or will stick but my guess is that's what he's thinking - take advantage of frolik's play to spark a 3rd line. we know what we'll get from CPR and the sunrise express as well. makes sense, to me at least.

don't see where stillman fits in. does anyone know who he was skating with?
We will see Thursday. PDB said that Horton will center Stillman and Booth if Weiss is a no go. If Weiss is playing, then I guess we will see him on the second with who knows lol.

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12-17-2008, 10:48 AM
  #66
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If Weiss plays,

Sunrise Xpress
Stillman-Kreps-Frolik
CPR
Tarnasky-McLean-Zed/Stewart

Looks good to me

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12-17-2008, 11:05 AM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterBouw View Post
If Weiss plays,

Sunrise Xpress
Stillman-Kreps-Frolik
CPR
Tarnasky-McLean-Zed/Stewart

Looks good to me
Looks like my lines. The only difference I had was:

Booth - Weiss - Frolik
Stillman - Kreps - Horton

Like I said before, spread Booth and Horton out. There is no need to have our two best scorers on the same line. And besides, Frolik played quite well with Booth and Weiss when they were together, plus Stillman and Horton had great chemistry together as well.

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12-17-2008, 11:21 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by pb1300 View Post
Looks like my lines. The only difference I had was:

Booth - Weiss - Frolik
Stillman - Kreps - Horton

Like I said before, spread Booth and Horton out. There is no need to have our two best scorers on the same line. And besides, Frolik played quite well with Booth and Weiss when they were together, plus Stillman and Horton had great chemistry together as well.
I'm just going with what DeBoer's said. Just saying, it looks like a pretty good and well-balanced top 3 lines. I don't get why everyone's so upset.

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12-17-2008, 11:31 AM
  #69
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Originally Posted by MisterBouw View Post
I'm just going with what DeBoer's said. Just saying, it looks like a pretty good and well-balanced top 3 lines. I don't get why everyone's so upset.
when did he say "Stillman-Kreps-Frolik"? last i heard, he had zeds with frolik and kreps (thus all the fuss above).

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12-17-2008, 11:34 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
when did he say "Stillman-Kreps-Frolik"? last i heard, he had zeds with frolik and kreps (thus all the fuss above).
Going from what I heard PDB say, and GRs blog, the lines will look like this:

with Weiss
Sunrise Express
CPR Line
Zednik - Kreps - Frolik
Stewy - McLean - Tanarsky

Notice that Stillman isnt there? Im sure PDB will shift him with a line.

w/out Weiss
Stillman - Horton - Booth
CPR Line
Zednik - Kreps - Frolik
Stewy - McLean - Tanarsky

Those lines are what I have read/heard from PDB and GR. Maybe if GR comes on here, he can help us out a little.

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12-17-2008, 12:01 PM
  #71
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I really wish we didn't rely on Zednik to bring in secondary scoring. I mean I've seen Frolik set him up beautifully a few times and just Zednik can't even hit the net or get the shot off.. or he tries and goes around the net for the far too predictable wrap around which never works. Honestly, if he could at least hit the net, it wouldn't be so bad, but he can barely do that. Put Stewart on the third line, some toughness, zednik is nothing more than a 4th line player with the ability to draw penalties, to rely on him more than that is just very much so wishful thinking.

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12-17-2008, 12:09 PM
  #72
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Frolik shouldn't be on anything lower than the 2nd line. I understand we gotta make room for our "high offense" players coming back, but he's been on fire lately. Putting him on the 3rd line would be pointless.

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12-17-2008, 12:13 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Booootthh View Post
I really wish we didn't rely on Zednik to bring in secondary scoring. I mean I've seen Frolik set him up beautifully a few times and just Zednik can't even hit the net or get the shot off.. or he tries and goes around the net for the far too predictable wrap around which never works. Honestly, if he could at least hit the net, it wouldn't be so bad, but he can barely do that. Put Stewart on the third line, some toughness, zednik is nothing more than a 4th line player with the ability to draw penalties, to rely on him more than that is just very much so wishful thinking.
zednik's been a consistent 20+ goal guy. he's streaky but you make him sound incompetent. he's not. nor is he anything close to a 4th line player. also we're not relying on him for anything right now, we're trying to get him going to add to scoring mix.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggzy View Post
Frolik shouldn't be on anything lower than the 2nd line. I understand we gotta make room for our "high offense" players coming back, but he's been on fire lately. Putting him on the 3rd line would be pointless.
it's not pointless and you really have to stop boxing yourself in wrt top six, bottom six. read above for reasoning as this has already been discussed.

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12-17-2008, 12:16 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
zednik's been a consistent 20+ goal guy. he's streaky but you make him sound incompetent. he's not. nor is he anything close to a 4th line player. also we're not relying on him for anything right now, we're trying to get him going to add to scoring mix.



it's not pointless and you really have to stop boxing yourself in wrt top six, bottom six. read above for reasoning as this has already been discussed.
Well considering bottom six generally get less ice time than top six, I would want him getting more ice team. Make sense?

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12-17-2008, 12:17 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
zednik's been a consistent 20+ goal guy. he's streaky but you make him sound incompetent. he's not. nor is he anything close to a 4th line player. also we're not relying on him for anything right now, we're trying to get him going to add to scoring mix.



it's not pointless and you really have to stop boxing yourself in wrt top six, bottom six. read above for reasoning as this has already been discussed.
He's incredibly streaky and many times he can't capitalize on his chances. He's also prone to taking bad penalties at bad times. I just think he is much more a liability than he is useful. Just imo.

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