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Antropov to Pittsburgh

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Old
12-23-2008, 10:20 AM
  #126
Goalie_Bob
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The Pens will not give up their 1st round pick for a UFA. Plain and simple.

Unless Antropov is willing to sign a new contract before the deal is done.

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12-23-2008, 10:26 AM
  #127
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Originally Posted by Goalie_Bob View Post
The Pens will not give up their 1st round pick for a UFA. Plain and simple.

Unless Antropov is willing to sign a new contract before the deal is done.
Umm, what about the whole Hossa deal? You've done it before so it can be done again. It's not like you guys don't have a vast amount of youth or anything already to build around eh?

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12-23-2008, 10:33 AM
  #128
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Originally Posted by wej20 View Post
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_A0WaWSMnIQ...lke-voting.jpg

Last years Selke voting.Staal had more than Antropov.
lol One person gave him a third place vote. Wow.

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12-23-2008, 11:01 AM
  #129
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Originally Posted by DougGilmour93 View Post
Umm, what about the whole Hossa deal? You've done it before so it can be done again. It's not like you guys don't have a vast amount of youth or anything already to build around eh?
That was a one year occurrence for an All-star caliber player.

And the Pens do not have a vast amount of youth. The core of their team is young but outside of that core the cupboards aren't bare but they are not very good either. The Pens need to start replenishing their farm system. They will not give up their 1st round pick for a player that can walk in the summer.

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12-23-2008, 11:19 AM
  #130
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lol One person gave him a third place vote. Wow.
one more than Antropov got.Also Talbot got two 4th votes and a 5th

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12-23-2008, 11:28 AM
  #131
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DougGilmour93 View Post
To Pit:
Nik Antropov
Alexei Ponikarovsky

To Tor:
1st in 09
2nd in 10
Ryan Stone
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goalie_Bob View Post
The Pens will not give up their 1st round pick for a UFA. Plain and simple.

Unless Antropov is willing to sign a new contract before the deal is done.
Having Ponikarovsky for next year could help us resign Antropov though as Cyris and dredeye have said.

Heck even trading for Ponikarovsky alone this year might be worth it if he can get Antropov to come here in the offseason! But I think it would be easier to keep them if they both came here an played through the playoffs and liked it here.

I realize that we can't give up draft picks every year but value wise this is a good trade for both teams I think

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12-23-2008, 11:28 AM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Goalie_Bob View Post

And the Pens do not have a vast amount of youth. The core of their team is young but outside of that core the cupboards aren't bare but they are not very good either. The Pens need to start replenishing their farm system. They will not give up their 1st round pick for a player that can walk in the summer.
I'm sorry, I hate to sound like I'm picking on you but this statement is BS. Unless your name is Ray Shero to firmly state that your team is not going to make any type of transaction that will help you win, is laughable.

You honestly believe that your team is interested in drafting in the first round over competing for a Stanley Cup? I could not believe some of the responses I read after Hossa was traded to Pittsburgh. Some fans were upset that they traded a prospect and a pick. Why? That man took you to the Stanley Cup Finals, and was the only player on your team IMO, that played to the last second of the game and he proved it by almost scoring the tying goal, while it seemed the rest of the team gave up!

Your team is in a position to win now, not restock the cupboards. The core of your team is elite and skilled. If I'm not mistaken Crosby is 21, Malkin 22, Staal 20, Goligoski 23, Letang 21, Kennedy 22 and Fleury is 24. The fact that 2 of the 8 players are already at an elite level while the others are catching up suggests that when they all do, your team is going to be a powerhouse with some pieces added correctly. This team has at least 5 to 7 years to win a Stanley Cup. maybe 10 if you consider that Crosby will still only be 31 by that time! And in that time, I can guarantee you that 1st round picks will be flying to get that extra piece of the puzzle. You've had the taste and you're gonna go for more.

In Antropov's case, he's not a scrub "putting up points on a bad team". He's putting up the points that he should be putting up, on his own. He's making a player out of Matt Stajan and is proving that he wasn't in Sundin's shadow. The player that made Nik Antropov wasn't Mats Sundin, it was Joe Nieuwendyk. Antropov is a 60 point player on his own, lined up with either Malkin or Crosby would do wonders. The man has gotten a bad rep because of his injuries, but people often forget that when he plays, he performs. He is Toronto's best forward by a longshot. I truly wish that he re-signs in Toronto.

In terms of value, I think he's worth more to the Leafs than he is to any other team; but I'm sure other teams would pay to get him.

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12-23-2008, 11:52 AM
  #133
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Originally Posted by joeparez View Post
I'm sorry, I hate to sound like I'm picking on you but this statement is BS. Unless your name is Ray Shero to firmly state that your team is not going to make any type of transaction that will help you win, is laughable.

You honestly believe that your team is interested in drafting in the first round over competing for a Stanley Cup? I could not believe some of the responses I read after Hossa was traded to Pittsburgh. Some fans were upset that they traded a prospect and a pick. Why? That man took you to the Stanley Cup Finals, and was the only player on your team IMO, that played to the last second of the game and he proved it by almost scoring the tying goal, while it seemed the rest of the team gave up!

Your team is in a position to win now, not restock the cupboards. The core of your team is elite and skilled. If I'm not mistaken Crosby is 21, Malkin 22, Staal 20, Goligoski 23, Letang 21, Kennedy 22 and Fleury is 24. The fact that 2 of the 8 players are already at an elite level while the others are catching up suggests that when they all do, your team is going to be a powerhouse with some pieces added correctly. This team has at least 5 to 7 years to win a Stanley Cup. maybe 10 if you consider that Crosby will still only be 31 by that time! And in that time, I can guarantee you that 1st round picks will be flying to get that extra piece of the puzzle. You've had the taste and you're gonna go for more.

In Antropov's case, he's not a scrub "putting up points on a bad team". He's putting up the points that he should be putting up, on his own. He's making a player out of Matt Stajan and is proving that he wasn't in Sundin's shadow. The player that made Nik Antropov wasn't Mats Sundin, it was Joe Nieuwendyk. Antropov is a 60 point player on his own, lined up with either Malkin or Crosby would do wonders. The man has gotten a bad rep because of his injuries, but people often forget that when he plays, he performs. He is Toronto's best forward by a longshot. I truly wish that he re-signs in Toronto.

In terms of value, I think he's worth more to the Leafs than he is to any other team; but I'm sure other teams would pay to get him.
Well thought out post.

Kudos

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Old
12-23-2008, 11:55 AM
  #134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeparez View Post
I'm sorry, I hate to sound like I'm picking on you but this statement is BS. Unless your name is Ray Shero to firmly state that your team is not going to make any type of transaction that will help you win, is laughable.

You honestly believe that your team is interested in drafting in the first round over competing for a Stanley Cup? I could not believe some of the responses I read after Hossa was traded to Pittsburgh. Some fans were upset that they traded a prospect and a pick. Why? That man took you to the Stanley Cup Finals, and was the only player on your team IMO, that played to the last second of the game and he proved it by almost scoring the tying goal, while it seemed the rest of the team gave up!

Your team is in a position to win now, not restock the cupboards. The core of your team is elite and skilled. If I'm not mistaken Crosby is 21, Malkin 22, Staal 20, Goligoski 23, Letang 21, Kennedy 22 and Fleury is 24. The fact that 2 of the 8 players are already at an elite level while the others are catching up suggests that when they all do, your team is going to be a powerhouse with some pieces added correctly. This team has at least 5 to 7 years to win a Stanley Cup. maybe 10 if you consider that Crosby will still only be 31 by that time! And in that time, I can guarantee you that 1st round picks will be flying to get that extra piece of the puzzle. You've had the taste and you're gonna go for more.

In Antropov's case, he's not a scrub "putting up points on a bad team". He's putting up the points that he should be putting up, on his own. He's making a player out of Matt Stajan and is proving that he wasn't in Sundin's shadow. The player that made Nik Antropov wasn't Mats Sundin, it was Joe Nieuwendyk. Antropov is a 60 point player on his own, lined up with either Malkin or Crosby would do wonders. The man has gotten a bad rep because of his injuries, but people often forget that when he plays, he performs. He is Toronto's best forward by a longshot. I truly wish that he re-signs in Toronto.

In terms of value, I think he's worth more to the Leafs than he is to any other team; but I'm sure other teams would pay to get him.
1st - I never said Shero would not make a trade to help the team win. How do you know that Antropov will do that? I agree he is a good player but he is also a UFA and is not on par with Hossa. Hossa is a top five player and was worth the risk of him not signing.

2nd - I was not one of the people who thought the Hossa deal was bad. I thought it was a great success. But that deal along with a few others had left the Pens with no 1st, 2nd or 3rd round pick last year. If they trade off a bunch of their picks this year then the Pens will not be able to sustain their success. Every team, no matter who it is needs a decent set of prospects so the team can grow from within.

3rd - Would I like Shero to trade for Antropov, sure. But not at a cost of giving up long term success.

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12-23-2008, 11:59 AM
  #135
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Shero would probably offer up a mid level prospect and Tampa's 3rd round pick..

Sneep and a 3rd round pick or something...

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12-23-2008, 12:03 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by KGpens View Post
Shero would probably offer up a mid level prospect and Tampa's 3rd round pick..

Sneep and a 3rd round pick or something...
That for Antropov??
Not even close to enough.

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12-23-2008, 12:05 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by KGpens View Post
Shero would probably offer up a mid level prospect and Tampa's 3rd round pick..

Sneep and a 3rd round pick or something...
Brian Burke would respond with a polite tapestry of expletives telling Shero where he can shove such a lame offer.

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12-23-2008, 12:06 PM
  #138
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Agreed. That is not enough for Antropov.

I have no doubt someone could offer Toronto a 1st round pick+ for Antropov. But like I said, it won't be the Penguins, not without a signed contract.

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12-23-2008, 12:09 PM
  #139
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Brian Burke would respond with a polite tapestry of expletives telling Shero where he can shove such a lame offer.
Hey I was gonna use that same pick as my avy. I have that issue framed.

GoNzO!

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12-23-2008, 12:10 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by Goalie_Bob View Post
Agreed. That is not enough for Antropov.

I have no doubt someone could offer Toronto a 1st round pick+ for Antropov. But like I said, it won't be the Penguins, not without a signed contract.
Thats fine I'm sure one of the teams your competing against will.

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12-23-2008, 12:11 PM
  #141
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Hey I was gonna use that same pick as my avy. I have that issue framed.

GoNzO!
My framed edition got trashed the last time I moved... Can't get a re-print either

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12-23-2008, 12:12 PM
  #142
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Originally Posted by Goalie_Bob View Post
Agreed. That is not enough for Antropov.

I have no doubt someone could offer Toronto a 1st round pick+ for Antropov. But like I said, it won't be the Penguins, not without a signed contract.
I agree with this, the grief you took for speculating notwithstanding. Shero has repeatedly said he is building long term and will not make short term trades. Grated there was the Hossa exception where he went for it last year but that pretty much was trading out fat and not touching any of the bone to use an analogy. It is not something a guy like Shero will do every year, nor can the Pens do it if they wish to remain a top team year in and year out. The Pens currently are sixth in the league in scoring, five points away from second. They do not need more scoring at all in order to win, even to win it all. How they play defensively and the maturation of those already on the team will determine how far they go this playoff season, not adding Antropov to the mix to add to their already bloated goal total.

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12-23-2008, 12:14 PM
  #143
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My framed edition got trashed the last time I moved... Can't get a re-print either
they come up for sale on ebay every once in a while. for around 20 bux

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12-23-2008, 12:15 PM
  #144
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they come up for sale on ebay every once in a while. for around 20 bux
I will look into that. Cheers!

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12-23-2008, 12:16 PM
  #145
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Originally Posted by Jaded-Fan View Post
I agree with this, the grief you took for speculating notwithstanding. Shero has repeatedly said he is building long term and will not make short term trades. Grated there was the Hossa exception where he went for it last year but that pretty much was trading out fat and not touching any of the bone to use an analogy. It is not something a guy like Shero will do every year, nor can the Pens do it if they wish to remain a top team year in and year out. The Pens currently are sixth in the league in scoring, five points away from second. They do not need more scoring at all in order to win, even to win it all. How they play defensively and the maturation of those already on the team will determine how far they go this playoff season, not adding Antropov to the mix to add to their already bloated goal total.
You say they need to improve defensively? Antropov is an accomplished 2 way forward.

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12-23-2008, 12:23 PM
  #146
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Thats fine I'm sure one of the teams your competing against will.
That's a concern when you're talking about Marian Hossa.

Antropov? Not so much.

It's no insult here, Leaf fans. The Pens have traded away their past two 1st rounders, and they currently have the 2nd worst batch of prospects in the league, according to HF. Last year, the trade was worth it because the East was relatively weak and the Pens had youth to spare, plus a roster that really only needed one big piece to make them the class of the conference.

But it can't be a scorched earth policy every season. Shero wants this team to be a perennial contender, and you can't do that in a cap world if you don't have cheap, quality players (i.e. first rounders) coming in and filling gaps.

You can't deal 1st rounders for UFAs and mediocre top 6ers every year and hope to remain competitive in a salary capped league.

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12-23-2008, 12:31 PM
  #147
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Originally Posted by Champagne Wishes View Post
That's a concern when you're talking about Marian Hossa.

Antropov? Not so much.

It's no insult here, Leaf fans. The Pens have traded away their past two 1st rounders, and they currently have the 2nd worst batch of prospects in the league, according to HF. Last year, the trade was worth it because the East was relatively weak and the Pens had youth to spare, plus a roster that really only needed one big piece to make them the class of the conference.

But it can't be a scorched earth policy every season. Shero wants this team to be a perennial contender, and you can't do that in a cap world if you don't have cheap, quality players (i.e. first rounders) coming in and filling gaps.

You can't deal 1st rounders for UFAs and mediocre top 6ers every year and hope to remain competitive in a salary capped league.
I agree for that most part with what you are saying. You can not remain competitive if you arent bringing in new prospects, thats why for the most part why the leafs are in the situation they are in now.
But I am comfortable from a leafs point of view, somebody will give the leaafs a first rounder as part of a package for Nik even if its not the pens.

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12-23-2008, 12:46 PM
  #148
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[QUOTE=Champagne Wishes;16956636]That's a concern when you're talking about Marian Hossa.

Antropov? Not so much.

It's no insult here, Leaf fans. The Pens have traded away their past two 1st rounders, and they currently have the 2nd worst batch of prospects in the league, according to HF. Last year, the trade was worth it because the East was relatively weak and the Pens had youth to spare, plus a roster that really only needed one big piece to make them the class of the conference.

But it can't be a scorched earth policy every season. Shero wants this team to be a perennial contender, and you can't do that in a cap world if you don't have cheap, quality players (i.e. first rounders) coming in and filling gaps.

You can't deal 1st rounders for UFAs and mediocre top 6ers every year and hope to remain competitive in a salary capped league.[/QUOTE]

bingo

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12-23-2008, 12:53 PM
  #149
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Originally Posted by Jaded-Fan View Post
I agree with this, the grief you took for speculating notwithstanding. Shero has repeatedly said he is building long term and will not make short term trades. Grated there was the Hossa exception where he went for it last year but that pretty much was trading out fat and not touching any of the bone to use an analogy. It is not something a guy like Shero will do every year, nor can the Pens do it if they wish to remain a top team year in and year out. The Pens currently are sixth in the league in scoring, five points away from second. They do not need more scoring at all in order to win, even to win it all. How they play defensively and the maturation of those already on the team will determine how far they go this playoff season, not adding Antropov to the mix to add to their already bloated goal total.
It may not be something shero will do every year but maybe it will be something Mario will do. Correct me if I am wrong but wasnít Mario the driving force behind that deal and shero didnít really play much a role in the trade.?

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12-23-2008, 12:59 PM
  #150
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I agree for that most part with what you are saying. You can not remain competitive if you arent bringing in new prospects, thats why for the most part why the leafs are in the situation they are in now.
But I am comfortable from a leafs point of view, somebody will give the leaafs a first rounder as part of a package for Nik even if its not the pens.
Yep, Antropov could fetch a 1st from somebody if he keeps it up.

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