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Subban Better than McDo?

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Old
01-04-2009, 11:47 AM
  #101
Kriss E
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Originally Posted by davedave View Post
Subban has had a great tournament so far, but I'm not sure how much we should read into it. There have been a lot of prospects come through this tournament who never did anything afterwards, just as there have been players cut who went on to great NHL careers.

As for the comparison between Subban and McDonagh, they're very different players. McDonagh strikes me as a defence-first, smart player with good closing speed, a safe first pass, and sound body work. That is an NHL profile. He doesn't have to change anything in his game. He just has to keep improving. Basically, it's boring but safe, as he'll never be a gamebreaker (either way) the way Subban might be.

Subban has great skills but is a little erratic. Even against Russia, he had some outstanding end-to-end rushes, but also some headshakingly bad giveaways. The challenge for Subban will be to keep the good and fix the bad as he moves up levels. It gets harder and harder to be successful with that flambouyant style as you rise, but also it gets easier and easier to get burned for your mistakes. If he can keep the same enthusiasm and creativity but get rid of the errors, then he will be an excellent prospect.

My feeling is that he draws his offence from the same source as he draws his mistakes. In other words, I suspect that the only way to get rid of the errors completely is to stifle that instinct that makes him so fun to watch. I'm happy with him as a prospect, but I want to see how he adjusts to the AHL before calling him a top end prospect. While my impression is that he'll always be a turnover/mistake risk, kind of like Kovalev, I'm hoping that he'll refine his game to the point where we can live with the regular but infrequent bad and enjoy the overall good.

Anyway, I am anything but a prospect expert, so I might very well be full of it.
I agree, and I think the ones who are full of it are the ones basing their judgement on a few games to now call him our best D prospect instead of just saying he's having a great tourny.

Some people even compared him to Coffey and Orr..

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01-04-2009, 12:29 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Some people even compared him to Coffey and Orr..
To be fair, most of the ones I've heard and read have been comparing certain rushes Subban has made to those guys' moves, but if generalizing their comments makes you feel smart, fill yer boots...

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01-04-2009, 12:29 PM
  #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
I agree, and I think the ones who are full of it are the ones basing their judgement on a few games to now call him our best D prospect instead of just saying he's having a great tourny.

Some people even compared him to Coffey and Orr..
Not basing our judgement on one tourney

He was great at dev. camp. He's been improving his defence ever since he got drafted. He's always been an offensive defencemen.

The fact that he can still play this bull rushing style with his peers (OHL) and remain a +27 tells me he's adjusted to that level and is able to dominate it as well. The fact he has also been able to do it at the WJC level also indicates to me that he is able to play this way with the BEST of his peers

Now it all depends on what he does from here on out (with the pros) but heck I believe he can be this type of player in the NHL... some like Crosby and Ovy can just take it to the nhl right away, whereas others need time to adjust (LeCavalier and Thornton) all 4 of these aforementioned players are Elite level players.

He'll be able to do it in the NHL one day...it'll just take time

Go Subban!
Go Canada!
Go Habs Go!

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01-04-2009, 12:52 PM
  #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ape Clutch View Post
Not basing our judgement on one tourney

He was great at dev. camp. He's been improving his defence ever since he got drafted. He's always been an offensive defencemen.

The fact that he can still play this bull rushing style with his peers (OHL) and remain a +27 tells me he's adjusted to that level and is able to dominate it as well. The fact he has also been able to do it at the WJC level also indicates to me that he is able to play this way with the BEST of his peers

Now it all depends on what he does from here on out (with the pros) but heck I believe he can be this type of player in the NHL... some like Crosby and Ovy can just take it to the nhl right away, whereas others need time to adjust (LeCavalier and Thornton) all 4 of these aforementioned players are Elite level players.

He'll be able to do it in the NHL one day...it'll just take time

Go Subban!
Go Canada!
Go Habs Go!

Seriously his strongest skill seem to be able to past through defense like butter, not displaying any kind of extreme skills.. but just to be able to do it.. wich he might have a special talent.. sometimes i wondered why hedoesnt position himself better in the offense (slap shot areas being more of a fluid player while in offensive zone, seem like sometimes doesnt know what to do when he doesnt have the puck), also when he doesnt shot in some specific situations, he is a steal we can be sure of that, but what kind of production he will have in the nhl is different, he seem to have his tricks but he doesnt have enough of them he will be intersting to see subban after the season ends.. he can then join hamilton he will be 20 then.. i believe.. anyway.. then Mcdonagh.. i have been far from being impressed, he doesnt seem to have any kind of offensive talent he isnt as smart as i tought he was, isnt as physical as i tought he was, overall, i would say the perfect word is overated, that doesnt mean he wont be underated from now on, individual like him get better and better.. he is strong between the years.. and something about Subban, he is as well...

we have to be patient and see how they both will turn out..

as of now, clearly Subban seem superior in the fact that he is way more needed on a team then Mcdo is in almost all levels.. that doesnt mean he will remain.

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Old
01-05-2009, 05:47 PM
  #105
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PK Subban

leaf fan here....juss gotta say you guys have a great player of great character in PK subban. Wish he was a leaf....u never know..u might even trade him to the leafs like u did with grabovski...and we all know how that turned out lol

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01-05-2009, 05:50 PM
  #106
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grabovski was a cancer. subban is not. you won't see subban in any NHL jersey other than a Hab one for a long time.

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01-05-2009, 06:53 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by tmlfan007 View Post
leaf fan here....juss gotta say you guys have a great player of great character in PK subban. Wish he was a leaf....u never know..u might even trade him to the leafs like u did with grabovski...and we all know how that turned out lol
Yep, we got Robert Lang out of it and he is of far more use to us then Grabovski ever would have been. Next question?

Subban is pretty impressive thus far.

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01-05-2009, 07:13 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by tmlfan007 View Post
leaf fan here....juss gotta say you guys have a great player of great character in PK subban. Wish he was a leaf....u never know..u might even trade him to the leafs like u did with grabovski...and we all know how that turned out lol
our scabs are your stars... remember that

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01-05-2009, 07:14 PM
  #109
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subban is tourney leading +13 so much for bad mistakes...everyone has got their mistakes but he seems to be getting better every year

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01-05-2009, 07:21 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by bhuya71 View Post
subban is tourney leading +13 so much for bad mistakes...everyone has got their mistakes but he seems to be getting better every year
subban will single handedly bring back the jungle fever.

i'm lovin' subban right now.. hope he keeps up his speedy development.

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01-05-2009, 09:45 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by bhuya71 View Post
subban is tourney leading +13 so much for bad mistakes...everyone has got their mistakes but he seems to be getting better every year
Before the Russia game he was a +12 and hadn't been on for a single 5 on 5 goal against. I don't know if that changed after the game.

And he OPENLY hates the Leafs, so don't picture him in a Leafs jersey anytime soon! (Message to another poster above)

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01-05-2009, 09:49 PM
  #112
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Subban is exactly what this team need, an elite puckmover with incredible skills, a team player with a great attitude bringing energy and enthousiasm around...

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01-05-2009, 09:49 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by tmlfan007 View Post
leaf fan here....juss gotta say you guys have a great player of great character in PK subban. Wish he was a leaf....u never know..u might even trade him to the leafs like u did with grabovski...and we all know how that turned out lol
I don't want to hijack the thread but...

How did it turn out?

Just curious of what comes next.

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01-05-2009, 10:07 PM
  #114
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Well i dont know if Subban will be better than McDo in the near future but tonight, in this tournament and in the tournament's All star team: its Subban!

Does that mean that he is superior to McDo? Who knows... but in this tournament he completely was superior to all defensemen EXCEPT Victor Hedman.

Thats has to mean something.

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01-05-2009, 10:42 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by Ice Poutine View Post
Well i dont know if Subban will be better than McDo in the near future but tonight, in this tournament and in the tournament's All star team: its Subban!

Does that mean that he is superior to McDo? Who knows... but in this tournament he completely was superior to all defensemen EXCEPT Victor Hedman.

Thats has to mean something.
Well apparently Karlsson was better than Hedman, so... Hedman was also playing hurt, so it's understandable.

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01-05-2009, 10:54 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Ice Poutine View Post
Thats has to mean something.
The '07 Draft could be our Red Wings '89 Draft?

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01-05-2009, 11:17 PM
  #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ice Poutine View Post
Well i dont know if Subban will be better than McDo in the near future but tonight, in this tournament and in the tournament's All star team: its Subban!

Does that mean that he is superior to McDo? Who knows... but in this tournament he completely was superior to all defensemen EXCEPT Victor Hedman.

Thats has to mean something.
Holy crap it's Ice Poutine! Nice avatar IP!

So how 'bout them Habs?

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01-05-2009, 11:22 PM
  #118
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Comparing Subban to McDonagh is rather difficult. Each defensemen brings something different to the table. Subban with the speed and the vibrant attitude. McDonagh is the more poised player. Who doesn't have Subban's flashy style.

Subban will require at least a year in Hamilton. His defensive game needs some work. I'm glad we have these type of prospects in Montreal's system. By the way, what did you guys think of Nichlas Torp on Sweden? He's Canadiens property too.

Torp's stats and scouting analysis ...

http://www.eliteprospects.com/player...r=4509&lang=en

Comments?

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01-05-2009, 11:24 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Chet-Nick View Post

Subban will require at least a year in Hamilton.

Comments?
I doubt very much he spends a full year in Hamilton.

"P.K. Subban, on ne pensait pas au début qu'il était proche d'un poste, mais il est en train de prouver le contraire."- Carbonneau on PK during pre-season, which roughly translates into-

"At first, we didn't think he was close to have a spot on the team, but he's proving otherwise."

Not to mention he's gotten better since... you can't keep someone with as much passion, heart, and talent down for long.


Last edited by Beaker: 01-05-2009 at 11:45 PM.
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01-05-2009, 11:28 PM
  #120
Kriss E
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Originally Posted by Chet-Nick View Post
Comparing Subban to McDonagh is rather difficult. Each defensemen brings something different to the table. Subban with the speed and the vibrant attitude. McDonagh is the more poised player. Who doesn't have Subban's flashy style.

Subban will require at least a year in Hamilton. His defensive game needs some work. I'm glad we have these type of prospects in Montreal's system. By the way, what did you guys think of Nichlas Torp on Sweden? He's Canadiens property too.

Torp's stats and scouting analysis ...

http://www.eliteprospects.com/player...r=4509&lang=en

Comments?
I saw him in 2 games, and I was at the gym so I wasn't 100% focused on those games but I thought he handled himself pretty well.

I thought he made some nice passes and skated well.

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01-05-2009, 11:39 PM
  #121
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PK has some hilarious and impressive individual skill videos on YouTube (around 65).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKDbnm_IdYY

I'll tell you one thing, PK is a great interview for such a young kid. So much confidence and personality.

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01-05-2009, 11:44 PM
  #122
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Hello Habs faithful, Pens fan here. The more I watch PK Subban the more I develop a man crush. The kid can seriously motor and has a presence on offense even as a D-man. He is beloved by his teammates and will bring leadership and character to you guys down the road. Wish we could take him off you.

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01-05-2009, 11:46 PM
  #123
Kriss E
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I doubt very much he spends a full year in Hamilton.
It's one thing to be doing all he does, in the juniors, and another to be doing it with in the Pros.

It's way too early to be optimistic about a quick jump into the NHL.

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01-05-2009, 11:53 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by petrskudra1 View Post
Hello Habs faithful, Pens fan here. The more I watch PK Subban the more I develop a man crush. The kid can seriously motor and has a presence on offense even as a D-man. He is beloved by his teammates and will bring leadership and character to you guys down the road. Wish we could take him off you.
This is pretty much exactly what I was going to say. Subban is a bad ass. Really wish Ottawa had him.

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01-05-2009, 11:56 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by petrskudra1 View Post
Hello Habs faithful, Pens fan here. The more I watch PK Subban the more I develop a man crush. The kid can seriously motor and has a presence on offense even as a D-man. He is beloved by his teammates and will bring leadership and character to you guys down the road. Wish we could take him off you.

We'll gladly take of Malkin from your hands, then you can have Subban

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