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Old
01-02-2009, 11:07 AM
  #1
BillyShoe1721
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Philadelphia-Atlanta

Just imagine what the Philadelphia offense would look like. A basically impossible scenario yes, but just think...

To Philadelphia: Ilya Kovalchuk,

To Atlanta: Ryan Parent, James vanRiemsdyk, Scott Hartnell, Mike Knuble(salary), 3rd 09

Philadelphia gets the second best goal scorer in the NHL to go along with the 3rd best goal scorer. Atlanta gets a very good young defenseman who going forward would form 3/4 of a good top 4 in Bogosian, Parent, and Enstrom. They also get the best LW drafted prospect in the NHL in vanRiemsdyk who will be coming to the NHL in 09-10 who has first line potential written all over him. They also get a very good second line energy player who is an extremely valuable player to a team going forward and is signed for another 4 years. Knuble has to go because of salary reasons. And a pick in a deep draft. Look at how lethal a lineup we could have...

Kovalchuk-Richards-Briere
Gagne-Carter-Giroux
Upshall-Metropolit-Lupul
Cote-Powe-Asham

Timonen-Vaananen
Coburn-Carle
Jones-Alberts

I know this is basically impossible and kind of non-logical but how does the value look for each team?


Last edited by BillyShoe1721: 01-02-2009 at 11:45 AM.
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Old
01-02-2009, 11:12 AM
  #2
The Naz
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i think thats pretty close but you may have to throw in a first instead of the 3rd. or maybe a player with 1st line ability now. at least somthing a little more i think.

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01-02-2009, 11:16 AM
  #3
BrindamoursNose
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awright1393 View Post
i think thats pretty close but you may have to throw in a first instead of the 3rd. or maybe a player with 1st line ability now. at least somthing a little more i think.
JVR is a future franchise LW...I'd say he'll do for that

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01-02-2009, 11:26 AM
  #4
PensFan101
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This might be the best Kovalchuk proposal I've seen. If the Flyers changed the 3rd to a first I'm sure Atlanta would be into that. Atlanta doesn't get a franchise player back but JVR is the closest thing to that and certainly he's the part of the deal that the Flyers will hate to lose.

Don't know how others will feel but if Philly were to somehow get Kovalchuk an offer like this would probably be one to happen.

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01-02-2009, 11:26 AM
  #5
LEIFey
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value wise, it's ok, but at that price, i'd pass. two key roster players and arguably our two best prospects for ilya? why do we need kovalchuk again?

flyers really aren't in a position to pick up another high priced forward.

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01-02-2009, 11:31 AM
  #6
BrindamoursNose
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Originally Posted by LEIFey View Post
value wise, it's ok, but at that price, i'd pass. two key roster players and arguably our two best prospects for ilya? why do we need kovalchuk again?

flyers really aren't in a position to pick up another high priced forward.
That's why it's an un-realistic trade proposal...We don't need Kovie at all. If anything, I think we need JVR for his entry level deal over the next few years for the cap.

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01-02-2009, 11:38 AM
  #7
Peter Griffin
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Shouldn't the Flyers focus more on improving their defense/goaltending?

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Old
01-02-2009, 11:40 AM
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BrindamoursNose
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Originally Posted by Peter Griffin View Post
Shouldn't the Flyers focus more on improving their defense/goaltending?
He just wanted to know if the trade value was fair is all, he wasn't really proposing it to make the team better.

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01-02-2009, 11:40 AM
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Peter Griffin
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Originally Posted by BrindamoursNose View Post
He just wanted to know if the trade value was fair is all, he wasn't really proposing it to make the team better.
Okay.

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01-02-2009, 11:41 AM
  #10
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I don't think either team does this to be honest. From what Flyers fans say, the organization is very high on JVR (and rightfully so). But the Thrashers have no need for Knuble, he'd probably be pawned off for a 2nd at the deadline. Hartnell is nice, but ATL is rebuilding and I doubt they want to add any long term salary like that.

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Old
01-02-2009, 11:45 AM
  #11
BillyShoe1721
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I was more wondering how the value was. I know this seems like a backwards deal for the Flyers, as it would be more beneficial for us to just keep our offense now and JVR's entry level deal, even thought it will be more than 2.5M. I've always liked Kovalchuk as a player, and was just wondering how close it was, even though Philadelphia is one of the least likely destinations for Ilya.

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01-02-2009, 11:46 AM
  #12
johnny canuckistan
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I think the Flyers would be better off not making this deal, and the Thrashers would be insane not to make it. Having said that, it is pretty close.

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01-02-2009, 11:49 AM
  #13
The Naz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrindamoursNose View Post
JVR is a future franchise LW...I'd say he'll do for that
i wouldnt call him a franchise guy just yet, he did nothing against solid compitition in team canada, i'm sure he'll be a solid 30 goal scorer, but i wouldnt call that a franchise guy, just a top liner. having said all that, someone made the good point that kovi is not needed for philly to be any better, not at that cost. for a lot less you could improve your D

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01-02-2009, 11:50 AM
  #14
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I don't want Kovalchuk and certainly not for that amount of players. I'm sorry, but in my eyes it's a retarded proposal. Trading two top six wingers, a decent defensive prospect and a fantastic offensive prospect as well a decent draft pick for a top line left wing which will leave us at the end of next season, that is simply ridiculous. Not to mention that we already have a top line left wing in Gagné.

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01-02-2009, 11:52 AM
  #15
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this probably gets it done.

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01-02-2009, 11:52 AM
  #16
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Flyers would come out worse with this deal

-they're trading their future shut-down d-man
-they're trading 2 players that are probably the biggest part of their PPs success
-and they're trading their best forward prospect

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01-02-2009, 11:54 AM
  #17
Finnish Your Czechs
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I'd actually call this overpayment.

Keep JVR, and upgrade the 3rd to a 1st, and I'm sure Atlanta would accept.

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01-02-2009, 12:00 PM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCiarniello View Post
I'd actually call this overpayment.

Keep JVR, and upgrade the 3rd to a 1st, and I'm sure Atlanta would accept.
Ryan Parent, Scott Hartnell, Mike Knuble(salary), 1st 09?

That's all it takes? Really? 2 salary dumps, a decent prospect and a late 1st? Kovalchuk is probably the 2nd best goal scorer in the NHL... You're not getting him for ehh prospect and salary dumps.

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01-02-2009, 12:03 PM
  #19
mja
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The Flyers don't need any more firepower. I don't even think they need to upgrade their D (they just need to let it mature). The only key piece the Flyers really need to look at is an upgrade in net, if it is to be found out there.

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01-02-2009, 12:11 PM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruinsfan1 View Post
Ryan Parent, Scott Hartnell, Mike Knuble(salary), 1st 09?

That's all it takes? Really? 2 salary dumps, a decent prospect and a late 1st? Kovalchuk is probably the 2nd best goal scorer in the NHL... You're not getting him for ehh prospect and salary dumps.
I know this may come as a surprise to you, but both Hartnell and Knuble are on pace for 30 goal seasons.

Knuble actually makes very little for what he brings to the table. The Thrashers could turn him into a 2nd round pick easily at the deadline.

Hartnell is NOT a salary dump. Hartnell is a valuable player. He's probably been the Flyers second best forward in the month of December. He's big, can skate, has a good shot, all around good skills, uses his size, and is a total mother****er to play against. He's a PERFECT second line power forward. He'd be Boston's fourth leading scorer.

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01-02-2009, 12:12 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mja View Post
I know this may come as a surprise to you, but both Hartnell and Knuble are on pace for 30 goal seasons.

Knuble actually makes very little for what he brings to the table. The Thrashers could turn him into a 2nd round pick easily at the deadline.

Hartnell is NOT a salary dump. Hartnell is a valuable player. He's probably been the Flyers second best forward in the month of December. He's big, can skate, has a good shot, all around good skills, uses his size, and is a total dick to play against. He's a PERFECT second line power forward.
Knuble is gone after the season- Pretty much no value to the Thrashers.

Hartnell may not be a salary dump, but he's overpaid.

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01-02-2009, 12:16 PM
  #22
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I actually think its overpayment from the Flyers because of what they have to do for his cap hit. Hartnell isn't waiving the NTC for Atlanta either.

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01-02-2009, 12:20 PM
  #23
mja
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Originally Posted by Bruinsfan1 View Post
Knuble is gone after the season- Pretty much no value to the Thrashers.

Hartnell may not be a salary dump, but he's overpaid.
Um, Knuble has very good trade value to the Thrashers at the deadline. They can turn him into a good draft pick without breaking a sweat.

If Hartnell keeps up his current pace since being put on Carter's wing, he'll be a 30 goal 70 point legitimate power forward. 4.25 million is plenty reasonable. Hell, Ryder makes 4 million and I'd much rather have Hartnell.

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01-02-2009, 12:22 PM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mja View Post
Um, Knuble has very good trade value to the Thrashers at the deadline. They can turn him into a good draft pick without breaking a sweat.

If Hartnell keeps up his current pace since being put on Carter's wing, he'll be a 30 goal 70 point legitimate power forward. 4.25 million is plenty reasonable. Hell, Ryder makes 4 million and I'd much rather have Hartnell.
That doesn't change the fact... Parent, a late first, a late 2nd, and Hartnell will land you nowhere near Kovalchuk. On Knuble: The same was said about Schneider... They'd be lucky to get anything for him now.

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01-02-2009, 12:23 PM
  #25
Finnish Your Czechs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruinsfan1 View Post
Ryan Parent, Scott Hartnell, Mike Knuble(salary), 1st 09?

That's all it takes? Really? 2 salary dumps, a decent prospect and a late 1st? Kovalchuk is probably the 2nd best goal scorer in the NHL... You're not getting him for ehh prospect and salary dumps.
A solid prospect, a young, effective roster player and a 1st round pick seems to be the going rate for star players.

I guess Philly could throw in another prospect. But I think Philly can get Kovalchuk without giving up JVR.

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