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Our team has no direction/role definition/identifiable core

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Old
01-03-2009, 05:29 PM
  #26
coolguy21415
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Maybe we should get Radek Bonk back.

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Old
01-03-2009, 05:48 PM
  #27
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Well I think you make some good points. The injuries in my mind are the cause of the numerous shuffles, saying that Carbo maybe using this time to get a good look at some of his younger players, knowing he will have to identify a core for the stretch run.
I think we have gotten a good look at D'agostini, I think we have all seen that Maxwell is not ready for the jump to the bigs, Lapierre thru all of this has started to find his game and is probably the closest think to a power foward weve got. Despite injuries it looks as
though Price has really found his game and is playing with more intensity.
Try to look at the positives and be happy that these injuries arent coming at the end of the season.
One thing I know for sure is we have to start scoring more and continue being physical everynight.

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Old
01-03-2009, 06:02 PM
  #28
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I do agree that sometimes I find myself scratching my head trying to figure out what exactly this team is. We have the players on the team, it's up to team to start pulling in the same direction. There are players we can add to improve the team, but it should be resolved prior to a trade I suppose. There's no need to suggest this team doesn't have role players. We have guys like higgins & chipchura for defence(mind you a lot of our players are two-way), we have grinders, potential power fowards, snipers, danglers, agitators, playmakers, fighters, etc. We have it all, it's just a matter of how they mesh and how the execute the game plan. A lot try to do too much. Do your role and the team will be fine.

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Old
01-03-2009, 06:46 PM
  #29
Blades 0f Steel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
Draper and Maltby are shadows of their former selves.

And it's Kris Draper, by the way.

Malhotra's nothing special.
Completely disagree on both counts.

Draper takes most of Detroit's draws on the PK or in the last 2 minutes of the game, and...well, he was good enough to help them win the President's trophy and the Cup. He's still very much a key player for them, and if he was on a rapid decline Ken Holland would have shipped him out for a replacement by now.

Manny Malhotra is Ken Hitchcock's guy. He's stellar on the PK, and has been one of the best faceoff men in the league for some time. He's usually played on the 3rd line, but last year centered the 1st line with Rick Nash for a bit.


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Old
01-03-2009, 07:15 PM
  #30
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Injuries haven't helped but to have a leading point scorer of 28 pts. and leading goal scorer with 11 is pretty weak compared to other teams. We'll likely have a few 20 goal guys but not 5 (six?) like last year.

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Old
01-03-2009, 07:23 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by TheGoalJudge View Post
So our 2nd line will be our shutdown line? "We have a few leaders on offence". Like who? Who can we turn to to carry us? Our playmaker is our entire team? Not really. Koivu and Lapierre CAN win faceoffs I'll give you that. PP specialist is not Markov because he's our #1 D-Man. I'm talking about a guy like Streit. Physical presence is Gui? LOL.

I'll give you Lapierre as the agitator.

We have too much quantity, not enough quality. We need a star that other players can play off of and that can carry a top line. Then we can use our other players more suited for 2nd-3rd line duty like Plekanec and Higgins in their proper spots.

A guy like Kovalchuk would do wonders for this team. We have the pieces to trade for him and I think it's a no-brainer. What are we going to do with all this talent? Pacioretty, D'Agostini, Maxwell, The Kost bros. That's almost 2 full lines right there. Are we going to go with 4 offensive lines? Chipchura can't even get out of Hamilton because we have offensive players playing in his spot.

What I'm saying is all the cup teams have stars and then they have role players who succeed because they only have to a specific task and they do it well. We don't have stars and we don't have role players because they're being asked to do things they're not capable of (Plekanec #1 Centre for example).
Really?..Kovalchuk would be good with us??...you don't say..
You think Crosby and Ovechkin would be good too??

You created this thread yesterday or today..
Don't you realize we have Koivu/Higgins/Tanguay/Price/Laraque/Dandy that are injured today. That's 5starters.
On top of having had A.Kost injured twice already and Komi out for a few weeks.
No freaking wonder you can't put a finger on which lines are the shutdown and all that blabla you're whining about.

Plek and Kovy had trouble earlier this year but have been playing better lately.

Once all our players come back, and we can have some production out of the Koivu and Plekanec line.
Then the Lapierre line will be the shutdown line.

Who can we turn to carry us?..Kovalev..Koivu..Komi..Markov..Plek..Higgins.. Tang..It's called A TEAM. There's always 2-3 or even 4 guys you can give the Conn Smythe to at the end of the POs.

Our team is balanced, there's capable playmakers on every single line once we'll have our full team.

Our PP is the only thing that isn't working.

You should wait for us to have a full healthy roster or close to it to start whining about our roles/direction/definition. Because right now, it's normal that we don't look that defined, we have 3-4 AHL players on our roster.

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Old
01-03-2009, 07:40 PM
  #32
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did we not win 3 of 4 on this road trip with all the injuries?

can there be a click box, that if you click negative post, it doesnt allow you to post?

we finally lost our 10th game of the year, IT TOOK US 3 MONTH TO LOSE 10 GAMES!

These are the same fans who will party with me when we win the cup? I really don't want you there.

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Old
01-03-2009, 07:45 PM
  #33
Mike8
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Originally Posted by Blades 0f Steel View Post
Completely disagree on both counts.

Draper takes most of Detroit's draws on the PK or in the last 2 minutes of the game, and...well, he was good enough to help them win the President's trophy and the Cup. He's still very much a key player for them, and if he was on a rapid decline Ken Holland would have shipped him out for a replacement by now.

Manny Malhotra is Ken Hitchcock's guy. He's stellar on the PK, and has been one of the best faceoff men in the league for some time. He's usually played on the 3rd line, but last year centered the 1st line with Rick Nash for a bit.
Re: Draper, I don't see why Holland would ship him out. He's still a decent player, just not integral to any team's success at this point. Maltby's decline has been more rapid. Draper's still got his sense and he's still quicker than most. Further, his replacement is in the system (Helm), and the emergence of Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Filppula and Franzen have collectively eased Draper's role.

The Wings match power versus power now. That is in part due to Draper's decline.

I'm not a big fan of +/-, but in this instance, take it for what it's worth:

Draper a worst -11 on Detroit, for a team which is in the + (Datsyuk a +17), does not bode well.

Further, Draper averages 12:29 in ice time (Maltby 9:00). That's 10th and 12th respectively, meaning they've been relegated to the fourth line.

Six forwards average more SH ice time than Maltby (including Draper), which means Maltby's not even among the primary PKers for Detroit at this point.

Compare this to 2007-08:

Draper averaged 15:37 ice time (Maltby 12:03), Maltby had been 4th in PK ice time (meaning an important component to the PK), Draper had been a -2 on the year (Babcock was still playing power vs. power last season)

...

Draper had been on the decline even last year, but his ice time and role with the team was more involved than it was this season.


Compared to 2006-07:

Draper was the pitbull of the Detroit PK, logging 3:34. Maltby was third at 2:29.

Draper also logged 16:45 ice time total (fourth among forwards, and only 4 seconds less than third-placed Robert Lang); Maltby had logged 13:11.

This was Draper's last effective year where he played an integral role to Detroit. After Detroit's disappointing (and wrongful) ousting from the playoffs at Anaheim's hands, where Draper had been less than stellar, it was the end of Draper being a core piece of the Red Wing team.

He is now a fourth liner in Detroit, and with Helm ready to take over soon, I anticipate Maltby retiring this year or becoming the 13th forward next season while Draper plays with Helm, allowing the latter an easy transition to the shut-down/energy role in 2 years time.



Re: Malhotra. Hitchcock is a coach who will key in on a guy who he can work with. That doesn't make the player good; it makes them good under Hitchcock. Keenan, Burns, Wilson, Sutter, essentially all good coaches who like to play favourites tend to find a couple of players that will do as they're told. And, as a result, they tend to look good and be rewarded with more ice time under said coaches. Those players may have genuinely found their niche role in the league, but more often than not they've found a situation where they're utilized in just the right way ... that if they're moved to another team, or if the dynamics of their own team are shifted in any drastic way, said player will regress to the player everyone knew them to be for the duration of their career.

This is why, in my view, Malhotra would be less effective in a non-Hitchcock, non-CLB setting, and would be a terribly risky proposition. Especially since even within his current cushy situation, he's nothing too special IMO.

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Old
01-03-2009, 08:25 PM
  #34
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I think this team is very solid. We have upwards of 16 forwards who can play in the NHL. Our depth is significant and we have played well given that a majority of our second line has been out for some time now. Our d has been good and Price has been fantastic. There are two obvious weaknesses, however. The first has been stated elsewhere and that is the PP. A PP specialist as our number #5 D man spot (replace Breisbosi) is needed. The second, and most important, is that the team seriously lacks a gamebreaker/superstar who gets, on average, 100 points a season (45 G, 55 A). These are extraordinarily difficult to find and, as it looks right now, we will get no help on the UFA front. We will have to find them in the draft, does not look so good here, or a trade. The latter is most likely and the one player out there right now, Kovalchuk comes with some question marks. Nevertheless, he may excel if placed in a situation like Montreal due to being insulted by other good players.

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01-03-2009, 08:36 PM
  #35
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Why do some posters become sarcastic here when some fans simply voice their concern?

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01-03-2009, 08:49 PM
  #36
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Why do some posters become sarcastic here when some fans simply voice their concern?
I have a solution - limit "this team has no..." posts to only days following a victory.

"[insert name here] appreciation" threads should similarly be limited to days following a loss.

it'll really mess with the bipolar personalities but they produce mostly noise anyway.

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Old
01-03-2009, 10:12 PM
  #37
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Ok firstly for the people that feel the need to attack me. Relax please. I'm not posting this because we lost a game, I've been thinking about this for a while. I'm thinking about what it takes to win the Stanley Cup.

Secondly, I should have left off the "no direction" part. That was too vague and doesn't really make sense in hindsight.

What I'm more concerned about is the role definition aspect of our team and our lack of a true superstar(s). Even the teams that can fluke out a playoff run had a go-to offensive guy or line. (Carolina, Staal).

We have guys like Sergei Kostitsyn and Latendresse playing on the 4th line and then guys like D'Agostini, Chipchura, Pacioretty, Maxwell who are on their way or already here. Why not consolidate these assets and bring in a star that can make others around him better like for example:

Datsyuk, Zetterberg with their surrounding talent.
Crosby, Malkin, Hossa
Lecavalier, Richards, St. Louis
S. Niedermayer, S. Stevens
Selanne, Getzlaf, Pronger
Sakic, Forsberg, Hejduk

Even look at San Jose and Boston currently. Their roles are all clearly defined on their hockey clubs. They have their stars, the players that play off of them and then their bottom line players.

The players that I can clearly see roles for look kind of like this:

____ - ______ - Kovalev
Tanguay - Plekanec - A. Kostitsyn
Higgins - Chipchura -
______ - Lapierre - Kostoplous.

I don't think we have a 1st line center, and I think the only semi-superstar / go-to guy is Kovalev and he's done soon. I do think we have a ton of quantity that can be moved to bring in quality which we can then use to carry other players with specific skill sets. For example, Lucic with Savard or Cheechoo with Thornton of a couple years ago. Or even Sykora with Crosby, Prospal with Lecavalier/St. Louis. These guys are not great by any means but can be utilized better because of their limited but great skills in certain areas.

I just don't know where all these players go? Guys like D'Agostini, Latendresse, S. Kost, Koivu. To me, if you have Kovalchuk on your top line than Koivu can be a top line center. If you have Kovalchuk on your top line than maybe Latendresse can be a top line winger because he complements him.

Then there's the whole issue of paying all these guys. Is it better to have 5 guys making $4M a year or a couple guys making, say, $7M a year and then 3 guys making $2M a year that you can just interchange? I can't say I know for sure but IMO I think it's the 2nd way. Maybe I'm just greedy when I see a guy like Kovalchuk available and all this quantity of talented young players we have doing relatively nothing.

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Old
01-03-2009, 10:24 PM
  #38
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01-03-2009, 10:38 PM
  #39
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I somewhat agree we lack enough role players

Injuries have hurt us of course, but we do lack a good shut down line. I know we are doing well defensively, but a lot is goaltending. I also think our penalty killing needs to be better. None of the guys we have compare to Carbonneau, Muller, Skrudland. Middle of the pack won't cut it.
I don't feel we have a game breaker either. Seems like there isn\t anyone we can look to to get that big goal or to step up and elevate everyone else. Koivu would be the closest guy i think. I do see us as a "mish mash" type of team.
I also question appointing Kovalev captain. He's too quiet. I know he isn't a bad role model, but I don't know what kind of leader he is out there. I think Komi would have been my choice.

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Old
01-03-2009, 10:48 PM
  #40
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On a more positive note:

For a team that has no direction, we certainly are cleaning up with a 21-10-6 record. If Boston wasn't playing so well, we wouldn't be complaining right now.

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01-03-2009, 10:53 PM
  #41
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good record, but..

Why are so many of us not happy? A lot of those wins were lucky. We barely beat some very bad teams. A 27th ranked PP for a top team? A leading scorer with only 28 points. A leading goal scorer with only 11 goals?

We are underachieving and will never beat any of the elite teams playing this way.

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01-03-2009, 10:59 PM
  #42
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Why are so many of us not happy? A lot of those wins were lucky. We barely beat some very bad teams. A 27th ranked PP for a top team? A leading scorer with only 28 points. A leading goal scorer with only 11 goals?

We are underachieving and will never beat any of the elite teams playing this way.
You have nailed it.

It is no coincidence so many negative comments keep popping up about this team despite its decent record. People suspect that, if it continues like this, we'll be bounced out of playoffs rather quick.

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Old
01-03-2009, 10:59 PM
  #43
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Koivu, Kovalev, Markov and Hamrlik and probably AKost. are core European players. Komi, Higgins, Price and maybe Gorges are core North American players. Latendresse, Lapierre, Skost, D'Agostini, Chipchura, Pacioretti, O'Byrne, Weber and others are good loking prospects. Subban is the real deal.

The identity is coming from within, with Koivu and, let's face it, Kovalev as the lifestyle examples.

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01-03-2009, 11:00 PM
  #44
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This is really bothering me and I don't know if I'm right or wrong in thinking this but I can't help but be bothered by this. In my eyes at least, we have just a mish-mash of players. We have a ton of youth and a ton of skilled forwards but we don't have any real role definition or core.

I get the feeling that the players don't know what is expected of them night in and night out when they're playing on different lines, playing with different players, playing different times, playing in different situations.

Our PP, our top lines, our bottom lines are all scrambled and filled with what seems like the same type of player. Part of it has to do with injuries obviously but even then there's just so much redundancy on this roster.

I guess what I'm saying is there's more quantity than quality. IMO we need to consolidate, bring in a couple top-end players or star type players, and get rid of all the youth depth we have.

I want to see a top line, a good 2nd line, a SHUTDOWN 3rd line (not a mish mash of Lang and some other unproven youngsters trying to do god knows what), and an energy line.

Our defense is okay in terms of their roles and our goaltending is fine obviously but the forward core is driving me nuts!

Let's identify who we want to keep long-term and who we don't, and trade those guys for some star power and fill the bottom lines with shutdown players and cheap grinders that we have (Lapierre, Stewart, Chipchura, Kostopolous).

Teams that win the Cup have VERY strict role definition and an easily identifiable core of players. They have stars and role players. I don't see anything like this on our team. Sorry for the long post btw.
Ugh. I did call for a shutdown line before the season but Carbo made it clear it was going to be 3 scoring lines. He said exactly that, there's no lack of direction, THAT is it. So that's what they're trying to do with the forward lines.

If you don't think there's role definition, well, it's because some of the players in "scoring" roles have been poor to bad for stretches and they get moved down a line or 3 or into the pressbox until they try harder. Carbo moves players who earn it up towards the top lines and puts guys who give bad efforts down to line 4.

The notion of stars and role players is in itself something the Habs have tried to downplay. Going through my old hockey cards I see the stats for the Habs of 76, 77, 78...... a lot of the time the "stars" are/were the role players.

Gainey has been trying to work a deal for a star player by trading youth now for 2 years running.

You only have to watch this team for a year to know all this stuff, so have patience and you'll understand -- it's not redundancy to have so many skilled forwards, it's offensive depth and that is the team's identity.

EDIT: regarding your second post, of course we lack a superstar offensive talent. That's been talked about to death. It sounds like that's really your #1 gripe, but you might as well not hold your breath, it's something we've been waiting many years for. In the meantime, a team full of 10-15 goal scorers and a few 25-30 guys will have to do the job.


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01-03-2009, 11:00 PM
  #45
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At least know we finally know where Chipchura is: he will be our savior!


*cough cough*

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Old
01-03-2009, 11:02 PM
  #46
TheGoalJudge
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Ugh. I did call for a shutdown line before the season but Carbo made it clear it was going to be 3 scoring lines. He said exactly that, there's no lack of direction, THAT is it. So that's what they're trying to do with the forward lines.

If you don't think there's role definition, well, it's because some of the players in "scoring" roles have been poor to bad for stretches and they get moved down a line or 3 or into the pressbox until they try harder. Carbo moves players who earn it up towards the top lines and puts guys who give bad efforts down to line 4.

The notion of stars and role players is in itself something the Habs have tried to downplay. Going through my old hockey cards I see the stats for the Habs of 76, 77, 78...... a lot of the time the "stars" are/were the role players.

Gainey has been trying to work a deal for a star player by trading youth now for 2 years running.

You only have to watch this team for a year to know all this stuff, so have patience and you'll understand -- it's not redundancy to have so many skilled forwards, it's offensive depth and that is the team's identity.
Ok and then I ask myself if that identity is good enough to win the cup and I just don't think it is.

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01-03-2009, 11:06 PM
  #47
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You have nailed it.

It is no coincidence so many negative comments keep popping up about this team despite its decent record. People suspect that, if it continues like this, we'll be bounced out of playoffs rather quick.

Barring some extreme misfortune, this team will make the playoffs. Beyond that, it's hard to see what indicates they'll win in the playoffs. Price and a prayer.

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01-03-2009, 11:12 PM
  #48
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Why not consolidate these assets and bring in a star that can make others around him better like for example:

Datsyuk, Zetterberg with their surrounding talent.
Crosby, Malkin, Hossa
Lecavalier, Richards, St. Louis
S. Niedermayer, S. Stevens
Selanne, Getzlaf, Pronger
Sakic, Forsberg, Hejduk

Even look at San Jose and Boston currently. Their roles are all clearly defined on their hockey clubs. They have their stars, the players that play off of them and then their bottom line players.

The players that I can clearly see roles for look kind of like this:

____ - ______ - Kovalev
Tanguay - Plekanec - A. Kostitsyn
Higgins - Chipchura -
______ - Lapierre - Kostoplous.

I don't think we have a 1st line center, and I think the only semi-superstar / go-to guy is Kovalev and he's done soon. I do think we have a ton of quantity that can be moved to bring in quality which we can then use to carry other players with specific skill sets. For example, Lucic with Savard or Cheechoo with Thornton of a couple years ago. Or even Sykora with Crosby, Prospal with Lecavalier/St. Louis. These guys are not great by any means but can be utilized better because of their limited but great skills in certain areas.

I just don't know where all these players go? Guys like D'Agostini, Latendresse, S. Kost, Koivu. To me, if you have Kovalchuk on your top line than Koivu can be a top line center. If you have Kovalchuk on your top line than maybe Latendresse can be a top line winger because he complements him.

Then there's the whole issue of paying all these guys. Is it better to have 5 guys making $4M a year or a couple guys making, say, $7M a year and then 3 guys making $2M a year that you can just interchange? I can't say I know for sure but IMO I think it's the 2nd way. Maybe I'm just greedy when I see a guy like Kovalchuk available and all this quantity of talented young players we have doing relatively nothing.
Moving the 'quantity' for some quality is an idea, but I question the necessity of such a move. You point toward past winners, but I'd say that: Ottawa with Spezza, Heatley and Alfredsson (and previously with Chara and Redden on D) had one of the most elite and largest cores in the league, yet failed to take a real run at the Cup. Tampa Bay with Lecavalier, St-Louis, Richards and Boyle--two legitimate top 10 scorers, one top two-way pivot and a top offensive defenseman--failed to even maintain itself as a playoff club. Carolina with Staal, Brind'Amour as a top tier all-around centerman, and a strong supporting cast with Williams (injuries aside, he's a hell of a player IMO), Cole, Whitney, Stillman ... one of the better-looking all-around top 6 forward groups, in my mind, failed to make the playoffs.

In the end, having game-breaking, top-tier players may make it easier to be elite, but it does not ensure success.

...

If we examine how necessary an elite core is, then:

Is SJ a Cup contender? Thornton is an elite point-getter, but has frequently not shown up for the playoffs. Boyle was on another elite core which rarely hobbled into the playoffs nevermind Cup contender status (TB). Marleau's up-and-down and of similar impact to Koivu, I would say. Cheechoo's no better than the second-tier scorers Montreal has. Setoguchi is very impressive, but significantly better than Tanguay right now? I would be surprised. Come playoff time, do you expect Thornton to be superior to Kovalev? How about Kovalev and Lang, then? Because Montreal's offensive depth outshines San Jose's--at least on paper.

I see nothing in SJ's core that makes them more elite than Montreal. Notice I am speaking purely of elite cores, and not identifiable roles (which you addressed as well, noting SJ).

Given that SJ's core is not necessarily elite, and that they are widely considered a legitimate contender, I would say that in the new NHL an elite core is not a necessity. For further evidence, we can look at Boston. There is only one player on that team that is elite: Chara. Savard has been a point producer, but far from elite. He has yet to even win a playoff series in his career. Kessel is playing like an elite scorer right now. Wideman is playing like a core defenseman. But I would not count on either of these players over the likes of Kovalev or Hamrlik/Komisarek down the stretch and into the playoffs. At best, they're of the same tier.

In fact, other than Detroit, Pittsburgh, and Tampa Bay, which teams have elite cores, to the level you're speaking of? Note that one of those teams does not strike any fear into Montreal (Pittsburgh) and is of roughly the same (or lower, IMO) caliber, while one is a down-and-out circus (TB), and the other a Cup-defender. So you've got a mixed bag ...

...

The next issue to consider: what elite players are actually available, and does it make sense for the franchise to target them (considering the salary cap and contracts)?

Gaborik is perhaps done for the season, and quite possibly merely a rental. Meaning dealing Higgins and Pacioretty or equivalent for him makes little sense if Montreal is planning on building a Contender for more than this season.

Kovalchuk is a UFA after this coming year, so you'd have time to work with him. I see him as an option, but would be cautious since Kovalchuk has trouble playing nice with others. Notice Savard and Hossa rarely played with him in Atlanta ... the reason is not ego, but rather that Kovalchuk is a game-breaker and a one-man show. Putting talent with him tends to negate that talent. In other words, he doesn't necessarily utilize the players around him nor make them better, but rather allows them to pile up points simply by feeding him the puck within their own zone, then letting him go end to end. Does that work for Montreal? Maybe ... but then you're stuck on the price tag, and whether it takes a Pacioretty to get him. What would Atlanta have left if Kovalchuk is moved, really? How could Waddell justify it to season ticket holders?

Bouwmeester ... well, he's a core player, but not the elite difference-maker we're talking about here.

So what's left?

...

Finally, the players you have omitted are: Koivu, S.Kostitsyn, D'Agostini and Latendresse. I don't think it's a coincidence that these players have either been on cold streaks recently (D'Agostini), out of mind recently (Koivu), or consistently in the fan doghouse this season (S.Kost & Latendresse). Nevertheless, I would say that:

- Koivu is the team's heart and soul, and that when the team needs a spirited lift down the stretch, Koivu is the man to deliver it. Dealing him is of no value to Montreal.

- The other three have marginal value and you'd have to pile them all together, add in a guy like Pacioretty and a pick, and then you'd be able to talk Kovalchuk.

...

In the end, I think what you're noticing with Montreal right now is that the team's been shuffled around a lot. It does indeed lack identity, but the reason for that may lie in the fact that injuries have been significant, there's been a good chunk of new players added to the team, and younger players are going through growing pains. Further, the team's style has had to accommodate those growing pains, the injury woes, and the significantly different team make-up than what we saw last year. If I were in Gainey's shoes, unless Kovalchuk could be had for a good price (which is highly, highly unlikely for the aforementioned reasons), I would stand pat. I see this team having sufficient veteran components to be a very good team down the stretch and in the playoffs. I would look to add a defenseman ... someone like Kubina preferably, but perhaps Kaberle as well, and I would deal significant futures to do so. But I see more potential for fixing up the blueline than adding a gamebreaker right now.

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01-03-2009, 11:13 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by TheGoalJudge View Post
Ok firstly for the people that feel the need to attack me. Relax please. I'm not posting this because we lost a game, I've been thinking about this for a while. I'm thinking about what it takes to win the Stanley Cup.
Thats the problem with your post. Like it or not, this is the core we have. There are no quick fixes. Blowing it up or making major changes will take us back not forward. We know this team is good enough to get 100 points per season. As long as every year we get a bit better, we increase our chances of winning the cup. That's how Detroit does it.

Your approach is one of a fan who has no idea what it takes to build a franchise and no concept of the salary cap. As I mentioned previously, Gainey has made significant modifications to a lineup that got us over 100 points and the second round. We have not even given these changes to manifest themselves and we will only see it at the end of the year.

There is no cookie cutter approach to win the Stanley Cup. I think you first need to build a proven winner, continue scouting and drafting well, tweak without giving up pieces and hope that all falls in place. In the end it's a crap shoot. You just make it sound like you have the secret recipe as if build a Stanley Cup winner is like KFC.

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01-03-2009, 11:13 PM
  #50
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Defense

More offense from the defense is what this team needs. Aside from Markov, nobody provides offense from the back end. This team need another offensive D and quick. They need more D that can carry the puck and create plays for the forwards or to start rushes.

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