HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Kukkonen waived

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-14-2009, 12:30 PM
  #126
captainpaxil
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Country: United States
Posts: 2,179
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
You're confusing "we think he's great" myth with the "we think he's not so much worse than Alberts and Jones" reality.
i think hes has better ice vision and skating ability then alberts but not as much as jones. the problem here is that his game doesnt suit this team. hes a guy who backpedals and reads plays to block shots and hes a stickchecker not a body checker.he doesnt have the speed or passing ability to be an offensive guy but hes got a puckmoving dmans defensive game if that makes any sense to you. hes got enough to be a servicable 3rd pairing 6/7 guy. and he was hands down better than slowdry or vandermeer last year but this year he just doesnt fit. he could go back to europe for more money but i wouldnt be surprised if he gets a job somewhere.

captainpaxil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2009, 12:31 PM
  #127
phlocky
Registered User
 
phlocky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 6,391
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
Paul Holmgren made a panic trade for Andrew Alberts, so it's apparent that outside of Parent, they don't see anyone on the Phantoms capable of even spot duty, which is an absolute joke in itself.
I don't see it that way. They knew that they'd need someone LONG TERM, not just as a call-up for a few games and THAT'S why they traded for Alberts. Obviously they didn't feel that anyone on the Phants was a LONG TERM solution and on that they are actually correct.

Svyret would be made to look really silly against NHL talent. Ratchuk MIGHT be able to handle 3rd pairing duties but even he probably isn't ready yet. Guenin and Bartilus, no way. They aren't even 7th dmen yet (if ever) so there's no way we could expect them to jump in for any significant time.

phlocky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2009, 12:36 PM
  #128
BringBackStevens
Registered User
 
BringBackStevens's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 12,845
vCash: 500
I think the question is why wasn't Nate Guenin given a shot for at least a few games? He's a capable defensemen, and he's never been given a chance for more than spot duty. Overall, the Phantoms defense doesn't have anyone with grit other than Guenin, so if they weren't comfortable with him, then the Alberts trade makes more sense

BringBackStevens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2009, 12:46 PM
  #129
Ychocky
Registered User
 
Ychocky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Ottawa, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 309
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
Paul Holmgren made a panic trade for Andrew Alberts, so it's apparent that outside of Parent, they don't see anyone on the Phantoms capable of even spot duty, which is an absolute joke in itself.
Knee jerk or not, at the time the Flyers needed another NHL ready body on the back end.

Ychocky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2009, 01:32 PM
  #130
CantSeeColors
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Country: Seychelles
Posts: 5,472
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JXC View Post
I don't think so.

But I would like to see how close teams are to the cap.

And, really, part of the whole point here is that if a $500,000 AHL callup is a real alternative to Lasse Kukkonen, then Lasee Kukkonen just ain't that good.
It's not that they don't have cap room, it's why spend an extra $300k or so when you don't have to? Take a guy like Bartulis. Next year, his cap hit will still be under $600k. In his third year on his ELC, he may have developed into something nice (just an example, I have never seen the kid play). If you were another organization looking for a guy, would you rather bring up the cheaper player who has some upside or add a contract to your books to bring in a more expensive guy with no upside? Kukkonen's problem isn't that he isn't good enough now, it's that he's probably not going to get any better and we all know how much people love their potential.

CantSeeColors is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-14-2009, 02:48 PM
  #131
GKJ
Global Moderator
Entertainment
 
GKJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Do not trade plz
Country: United States
Posts: 115,992
vCash: 625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ychocky View Post
Knee jerk or not, at the time the Flyers needed another NHL ready body on the back end.
At the expense of someone leaving the team in mid-season. We're talking about someone getting a shot for 2 months. It was not unlike using Rory Fitzpatrick last year. A long-term solution is not 2 months. They still had Kukkonen, who despite the belief of some, was apparently good enough to stay on the NHL roster at the time and be used more as a 4th line center than the position he actually plays. I said this about the 3rd goalie for years, the point hold true for other positions, if there are people in your organization you don't trust, then they shouldn't be in the organization. You can't make knee-jerk, panic trades in the NHL, that's how you get screwed. It hurt the team out west when we couldn't call up Nodl on a day-to-day basis for fear of being over the cap. Instead we had to use an 18-year old defenseman on scoring lines. That is very poor organizational management no matter how you cut it.

__________________
Philadelphia's Real Alternative
(ynotradio.net)

Stop Feeding the Rumor-Monger

"I wonder if Norstrom has Forsberg's spleen mounted on his wall." - KINGS17

My 50 Favorite Albums of 2014 (sorry it's late)
GKJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 03:23 PM
  #132
Get Carter
Registered User
 
Get Carter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Bucks County, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 317
vCash: 500
Again

http://csnphilly.com/pages/landing_h...162&feedID=717

Get Carter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 03:29 PM
  #133
Opus
Boondoggle
 
Opus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,927
vCash: 875
It's just that time of the month!

Opus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 03:29 PM
  #134
sa cyred
Offseason...
 
sa cyred's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: South Jersey
Country: Cuba
Posts: 16,600
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Get Carter View Post
Isnt it again.... X 2 lol... personally i dont think anyone will pick him up

Wow I havent been as angry at Stevens as I am now. Anyone read what they said on Ossi? Stevens pretty much said that he's been sucking so now he's the 7th defenseman. Steven's pisses me the **** off..

sa cyred is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 03:33 PM
  #135
BringBackStevens
Registered User
 
BringBackStevens's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 12,845
vCash: 500
I really wish someone would claim him

BringBackStevens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 03:49 PM
  #136
dbr2
Lockout Beard
 
dbr2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 9,346
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to dbr2
Quote:
Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Isnt it again.... X 2 lol... personally i dont think anyone will pick him up

Wow I havent been as angry at Stevens as I am now. Anyone read what they said on Ossi? Stevens pretty much said that he's been sucking so now he's the 7th defenseman. Steven's pisses me the **** off..
I read that. Pretty ****ed up

dbr2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 04:01 PM
  #137
CantSeeColors
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Country: Seychelles
Posts: 5,472
vCash: 500
If Kukkonen goes down to the Phantoms, who does that leave to call up in the case of an injury that isn't subject to waivers? Bartulis and Ratchuk?

CantSeeColors is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 04:54 PM
  #138
MiamiScreamingEagles
Global Moderator
A Fistful of Dollars
 
MiamiScreamingEagles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 42,798
vCash: 2273
Quote:
Originally Posted by CantSeeColors View Post
If Kukkonen goes down to the Phantoms, who does that leave to call up in the case of an injury that isn't subject to waivers? Bartulis and Ratchuk?
Maybe Syvret or Guenin, depending on need.

MiamiScreamingEagles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 05:05 PM
  #139
ForsbergIsOdin
Registered User
 
ForsbergIsOdin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Asgaard
Country: Sweden
Posts: 8,391
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to ForsbergIsOdin
Poor Kuks. He probably hates everyone.


Also, regarding the Stevens quote on Ossi:

When did he start playing bad? Does anyone think he didnt play well at all? I really haven't noticed. Besides, I think Ossi has been solid enough all year to not warrant the 7thDman spot.


Anyone else a bit peeved by that?

ForsbergIsOdin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 05:11 PM
  #140
Jaydepps
Registered User
 
Jaydepps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Greenfield, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 1,393
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Jaydepps
Honestly I thought Ossi was our best at the defensive aspect of the game. Some of the things he did were unteachable. We need Ossi back in the lineup.

Jaydepps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 05:30 PM
  #141
Terence Peterman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 5,296
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForsbergIsOdin View Post
Poor Kuks. He probably hates everyone.


Also, regarding the Stevens quote on Ossi:

When did he start playing bad? Does anyone think he didnt play well at all? I really haven't noticed. Besides, I think Ossi has been solid enough all year to not warrant the 7thDman spot.


Anyone else a bit peeved by that?
Maybe I'm seeing it out of context, but it sounds like Stevens is saying Ossi isn't the seventh defenseman.

Terence Peterman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 05:34 PM
  #142
Raffl House
Registered User
 
Raffl House's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: South Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 2,849
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Isnt it again.... X 2 lol... personally i dont think anyone will pick him up

Wow I havent been as angry at Stevens as I am now. Anyone read what they said on Ossi? Stevens pretty much said that he's been sucking so now he's the 7th defenseman. Steven's pisses me the **** off..
Sorry, I missed where he said it. Or "pretty much" said it..."Ossi is a good player. Heíll be back in there for us at some point" doesn't sound like someone saying you are sucking...

Raffl House is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 06:04 PM
  #143
GKJ
Global Moderator
Entertainment
 
GKJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Do not trade plz
Country: United States
Posts: 115,992
vCash: 625
Quote:
Originally Posted by CantSeeColors View Post
If Kukkonen goes down to the Phantoms, who does that leave to call up in the case of an injury that isn't subject to waivers? Bartulis and Ratchuk?
Judging by the article, Holmgren said he was going to send him to the Phantoms for conditioning, rather than sending him down outright. It sounds like he isn't all that interested in simply assigning him to the Phantoms.

By the way, the article said he cleared re-entry waivers, which is wrong, because he was never sent down to begin with, and thus, was never on re-entry waivers.

GKJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 06:13 PM
  #144
Jester
Registered User
 
Jester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: St. Andrews
Country: Scotland
Posts: 34,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
Judging by the article, Holmgren said he was going to send him to the Phantoms for conditioning, rather than sending him down outright. It sounds like he isn't all that interested in simply assigning him to the Phantoms.

By the way, the article said he cleared re-entry waivers, which is wrong, because he was never sent down to begin with, and thus, was never on re-entry waivers.
Erm, I don't think you can do that unless you were on IR. If he goes down...he has to go down outright, unless they have some bizarre loophole to what "conditioning" should be used for. I think what he was saying is that it isn't really fair to not let him ever play, so they might as well let him play with the Phantoms.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiScreamingEagles View Post
Maybe Syvret or Guenin, depending on need.
I was of the impression that he had to pass through waivers...might be wrong.


Last edited by GKJ: 02-09-2009 at 06:28 PM.
Jester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 06:25 PM
  #145
GKJ
Global Moderator
Entertainment
 
GKJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Do not trade plz
Country: United States
Posts: 115,992
vCash: 625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Erm, I don't think you can do that unless you were on IR. If he goes down...he has to go down outright, unless they have some bizarre loophole to what "conditioning" should be used for. I think what he was saying is that it isn't really fair to not let him ever play, so they might as well let him play with the Phantoms.
I think there is a loophole for conditioning stints. I don't know exactly what it is, but I think it can be as simple as being out of shape (or claiming as such).

Also, I don't think Syvret is on a one-day deal. He is still on the ELC he signed with the Oilers.

GKJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 06:26 PM
  #146
Dig Out Your Soul
Ex Storm...
 
Dig Out Your Soul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 23,075
vCash: 500
This whole thing doesn't make sense. We've waived him twice before but refused to send him down. Today, TSN says he was on re-entry waivers despite never being sent down. Then Homer says he's going down for conditioning despite never being injured. Who isn't telling the truth?

Dig Out Your Soul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 07:02 PM
  #147
Jester
Registered User
 
Jester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: St. Andrews
Country: Scotland
Posts: 34,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
I think there is a loophole for conditioning stints. I don't know exactly what it is, but I think it can be as simple as being out of shape (or claiming as such).
You'd have to find it in the CBA...it would be a pretty massive loophole if you could just send guys down for conditioning whenever you wanted to.

Quote:
Also, I don't think Syvret is on a one-day deal. He is still on the ELC he signed with the Oilers.
I'm pretty sure both Potulny and Syvret were RFAs when we swapped them. And one-way/two-way is irrelevant when it comes to waivers.

Jester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 07:06 PM
  #148
sa cyred
Offseason...
 
sa cyred's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: South Jersey
Country: Cuba
Posts: 16,600
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carle Winslow View Post
Sorry, I missed where he said it. Or "pretty much" said it..."Ossi is a good player. Heíll be back in there for us at some point" doesn't sound like someone saying you are sucking...
right here:

Quote:
On the other hand, Vaananenís play hasnít been impressive lately, and when Stevens was asked about that Saturday, he sidestepped the question, saying that Vaananen is a victim of using seven defensemen right now.

sa cyred is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 07:08 PM
  #149
Terence Peterman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 5,296
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
right here:
riiiiiidiculous.

Terence Peterman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-09-2009, 07:23 PM
  #150
GKJ
Global Moderator
Entertainment
 
GKJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Do not trade plz
Country: United States
Posts: 115,992
vCash: 625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
You'd have to find it in the CBA...it would be a pretty massive loophole if you could just send guys down for conditioning whenever you wanted to.



I'm pretty sure both Potulny and Syvret were RFAs when we swapped them. And one-way/two-way is irrelevant when it comes to waivers.
I don't think two-way contracts have to pass through re-entry waivers unless it is so much.

Syvret is not eligible for arbitration this off-season. Players are only arbitration eligible after their second contract has expired [unless you're eligible for unrestricted free agency], which means he still has to be on his ELC.

GKJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:42 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2015 All Rights Reserved.