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Flames are killing Avs

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Old
03-07-2004, 07:46 PM
  #51
Freudian
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ducksflytogether
You can't blame Oliwa for taunting the bench. Unsportsmanlike or not, the guy has scored 2 goals all year. 2 freakin' goals! I'd probably taunting everyone if I scored just my second goal of the year, when the year's nearly over.
There is a difference between celebrating and taunting though. I doubt anyone has any problem with an enforcer celebrating a goal. Of course when you are down 1-7 I can imagine Worrell being upset with pretty much everything.

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03-07-2004, 07:52 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by CupBound
Oliwa may have been on decline(???) but today he is a top 5 enforcer if not better. He does his job and does it well. He lost 2 or 3 fights this year and this is a guy that leads the NHL with 29 fighting majors. He makes guys like Kobasew and Lombardi grow 2 inches and 30 pounds.
Kariya and Selane still look like girls out there and that's because they don't feel "protected". That's what makes Worrell a useless player, not a true enforcer and no other skills to speak of. Oliwa would smoke him if they squared off, but that's not what Pete the Queen wants to do.
A top five enforcer eh?

You're saying that he's better than any 4 of these guys?
Parker, Ray, Boulton, Brashear, Shelly, Neil, Peters, Johnson, Low, or Laraque.

Good luck proving that one.

And how do Kariya and Selanne look like little girls. Nobody has even taken a run at them this year. They haven't really needed protection.

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Old
03-07-2004, 07:56 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ducksflytogether
I didn't say that he doesn't have control over his actions. It's just understandable that he would taunt the bench. Alot of players taunt their opposition, whether it's near the bench or not.

As for the Avs fans complaining about the taunting, I've just got a question: were you guys saying that Crosby gets whatever is coming to him if someone attacks him for taunting them? Or, did you guys not care because it wasn't against the Avs?
It's NOT understandable. There's no reason at all for him to taunt. If he wants to celebrate with his guys, that's one thing, but to skate in front of hte bench and make gestures? C'mon now.

Taunting in general is bs. There's no reason for one to do it at all, except for trying to show up your opponent. I don't know of the Crosby incident, because I've never seen Crosby play. Because of that, I don't know the context in which he taunted opponents. If he did it in similar fashion, then there's no reason for him not to deserve similar punishment.

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Old
03-07-2004, 07:57 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ensane
Oliwa was not blindsided. They stared at each other as Worrell was making a slow beeline towards Kristy. Worrell dropped his gloves without waiting for Oliwa to do so, but so what? He didn't "jump him from behind" as some misguided souls have said. Oliwa deserved what he got. He hits dirty and his showboating was BS. Oliwa has been on decline since he left New Jersey. As I said in another thread, Oliwa always gets his ass kicked when he fights an Avs enforcer.
Wow, someone sounds a little choked up. I saw the replay several times and never saw Oliwa prepared at all for Worrell to start pummelling him, but I'll be sure to watch for that on the highlights tonight. As for Oliwa deserving what he got, I guess so if you consider arm-raising roughly equivalent to sucker punching a guy a few times on the ice. Oliwa pretty much said in the postgame that he wouldn't have done it if Worrell hadn't proven to be so yellow all season long. Perhaps a real enforcer for Colorado might have deterred that from happening. Also, I've never seen Oliwa get his ass kicked by an Avs enforcer, but that may be because no Avs enforcer has been willing to go with Krysztof this year (didn't really follow him too much when he was in the Eastern conference).

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03-07-2004, 08:03 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CupBound
Kariya and Selane still look like girls out there
Does that mean that the Sedins finally lose their "sister" title? :p

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Old
03-07-2004, 08:08 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icarus
Wow, someone sounds a little choked up. I saw the replay several times and never saw Oliwa prepared at all for Worrell to start pummelling him, but I'll be sure to watch for that on the highlights tonight. As for Oliwa deserving what he got, I guess so if you consider arm-raising roughly equivalent to sucker punching a guy a few times on the ice. Oliwa pretty much said in the postgame that he wouldn't have done it if Worrell hadn't proven to be so yellow all season long. Perhaps a real enforcer for Colorado might have deterred that from happening. Also, I've never seen Oliwa get his ass kicked by an Avs enforcer, but that may be because no Avs enforcer has been willing to go with Krysztof this year (didn't really follow him too much when he was in the Eastern conference).
Naw, I'm not choked up, I'm actually quite content with the outcome of the incident.

Oliwa might not have been ready, but he wasn't blindsided and definitely wasn't hit from behind as others have said. Both men were looking at one another, Pete threw his mitts off much quicker because it was clear that Oliwa didn't want to go. Then he threw his off at the last second for protection.

As far as I'm concerned, Oliwa's comments in the postgame are pure cop-outs. Sure what Worrell did was bad and cheap, but it was purely for retribution. We wouldn't be having this discussion if Oliwa showed some more class and didn't taunt in the first place. And as I said a few posts back, I don't think Worrell has been doing his job quite properly so far this season. In fact, I'm disappointed with his lack of fights. However, tonight, he did what was needed.

And when speaking of his history against Avs, I'm talking all along Oliwa's career. This was his first fight with an Av this season. I believe that when Parker KO'd him in separate years, Oliwa was on the Blue Jackets and the Pens respectively.

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Old
03-07-2004, 08:09 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ensane
A top five enforcer eh?

You're saying that he's better than any 4 of these guys?
Parker, Ray, Boulton, Brashear, Shelly, Neil, Peters, Johnson, Low, or Laraque.

Good luck proving that one.

And how do Kariya and Selanne look like little girls. Nobody has even taken a run at them this year. They haven't really needed protection.
Oliwa has fought a few of those guys, taken them on and won. The only fight he has lost was vs Brookbank this year.

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Old
03-07-2004, 08:10 PM
  #58
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Shouldn't the thread title be "Avs are killing Granato", because that's what today's coach killing "performance" was about. Tony Soprano has a better chance of keeping his job than Tony Granato.

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Old
03-07-2004, 08:21 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ducksflytogether
You can't blame Oliwa for taunting the bench. Unsportsmanlike or not, the guy has scored 2 goals all year. 2 freakin' goals! I'd probably taunting everyone if I scored just my second goal of the year, when the year's nearly over.
Did Worrell taunt the Sharks' bench on Friday after he scored on Toskala? Come on.

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Old
03-07-2004, 08:28 PM
  #60
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I'm loving Oliwa right now. The Avs players were backing down from him all night and then he goes and scores a beauty. I could care less if he lost a fight, he's only won about half this year anyways.

I'm also suprised as to how absolutely useless Peter Worrell is. At least Oliwa contributes to the play, this guy looks like he put on skates for the first time yesterday.

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Old
03-07-2004, 08:30 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ensane
A top five enforcer eh?

You're saying that he's better than any 4 of these guys?
Parker, Ray, Boulton, Brashear, Shelly, Neil, Peters, Johnson, Low, or Laraque.

Good luck proving that one.

And how do Kariya and Selanne look like little girls. Nobody has even taken a run at them this year. They haven't really needed protection.
In a single fight any one of these guys can win, but that means squat, Oliwa can drop any of them as well. As an example Laraque and Oliwa fought early in the season to a very entertaining draw, but Oliwa has been a much better enforcer this season. Laraque doesn't fight anymore, he thinks he is a scorer. Plus he got killed by Johnson the other day. He is not what he used to be.

Jody Shelley was dropped by Oliwa twice this year. TKOs. Johnson got beat up twice I think, but one may be in the preseason.
Low, Neil and Peters are not in the same league. Peters is a big boy, but hardly a great enforcer.

Boulton? Please, the guy is a punching bag.

Parker and Brasher are animals. So that's 2.

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Old
03-07-2004, 08:35 PM
  #62
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We have a few cup winners. What do you have Oil boy?

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Old
03-07-2004, 08:39 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by CupBound
We have a few cup winners.
WOW! Calgary better start planning that parade RIGHT NOW because despite the fact they haven't won a playoff round since 1989, they have 2 CUP WINNERS!!!! Get Lord Stanley ready!

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Old
03-07-2004, 10:15 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by hemskyfan
WOW! Calgary better start planning that parade RIGHT NOW because despite the fact they haven't won a playoff round since 1989, they have 2 CUP WINNERS!!!! Get Lord Stanley ready!
You're one angry Oiler fan :mad:

Also the Flames have 6 cup winners on the team. Care to take a guess?

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Old
03-07-2004, 10:26 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CupBound
In a single fight any one of these guys can win, but that means squat, Oliwa can drop any of them as well. As an example Laraque and Oliwa fought early in the season to a very entertaining draw, but Oliwa has been a much better enforcer this season. Laraque doesn't fight anymore, he thinks he is a scorer. Plus he got killed by Johnson the other day. He is not what he used to be.

Jody Shelley was dropped by Oliwa twice this year. TKOs. Johnson got beat up twice I think, but one may be in the preseason.
Low, Neil and Peters are not in the same league. Peters is a big boy, but hardly a great enforcer.

Boulton? Please, the guy is a punching bag.

Parker and Brasher are animals. So that's 2.
Brashear is not a top fighter. He's one of the bigger jokes in the league himself.

Simple fact is, Worrell is scared sh*tless of Oliwa, and has been proving it all year long.

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Old
03-07-2004, 10:53 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ensane
A top five enforcer eh?

You're saying that he's better than any 4 of these guys?
Parker, Ray, Boulton, Brashear, Shelly, Neil, Peters, Johnson, Low, or Laraque.

Good luck proving that one.

And how do Kariya and Selanne look like little girls. Nobody has even taken a run at them this year. They haven't really needed protection.
Actually he is the BEST enforcer this year. He's just as good of a fighter and he has far more fighting majors than any of those guys. He's doing his job the best.

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Old
03-07-2004, 11:34 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by SmokeyClause
Sauve has looked awful. I just can't see them heading into the playoffs with this kid. The team is just significantly worse when he's in net.
Please name a time in recent history that a backup goaltender has played any sort of role in the playoffs, let alone one that lead to success..

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Old
03-07-2004, 11:43 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by DarioinDenver
Please name a time in recent history that a backup goaltender has played any sort of role in the playoffs, let alone one that lead to success..
one could argue Mike Vernon was the Red Wings back up in 1997. Osgood played more games all year long. But it was the march 26th brawl against colorado where Vernon came in. The year before it was Osgood as the starter as well.

Vernon had a significant roll in the play-offs, but by the numbers he was the back-up.

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Old
03-07-2004, 11:43 PM
  #69
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Suave <<<<< Zoidberg

That says it all right there my friends .......


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Old
03-07-2004, 11:59 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by DarioinDenver
Please name a time in recent history that a backup goaltender has played any sort of role in the playoffs, let alone one that lead to success..
You also have to go back 18 years when a rookie goalie had huge success as well,if your happy with Aebischer leading you to the promiss land..then i guess i'm happy for you

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Old
03-08-2004, 12:04 AM
  #71
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Originally Posted by T@T
You also have to go back 18 years when a rookie goalie had huge success as well,if your happy with Aebischer leading you to the promiss land..then i guess i'm happy for you
Good thing Aebischer isn't a rookie.

Yes, I know he's still a first year playoff goalie.

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Old
03-08-2004, 01:49 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by X8oD
one could argue Mike Vernon was the Red Wings back up in 1997. Osgood played more games all year long. But it was the march 26th brawl against colorado where Vernon came in. The year before it was Osgood as the starter as well.

Vernon had a significant roll in the play-offs, but by the numbers he was the back-up.
Good point.

But Osgood didn't get hurt in the playoffs and have Vernon come in to take over. Also, Vernon won the job over Osgood in the regular season.

Neither of these cases are really what we are talking about with the Avalanche. It seems a lot of media and fans are forcasting the end of the world based on the fact the Avs will go into the playoffs with Sauve as the backup goaltender. Frankly, when it comes to the playoffs the least important person on the entire team is the backup goaltender. I cannot think of a situation in which a backup goaltender has played any role of success for a team during a playoff run in which said backup was a true backup.

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Old
03-08-2004, 03:21 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by CupBound
In a single fight any one of these guys can win, but that means squat, Oliwa can drop any of them as well. As an example Laraque and Oliwa fought early in the season to a very entertaining draw, but Oliwa has been a much better enforcer this season. Laraque doesn't fight anymore, he thinks he is a scorer. Plus he got killed by Johnson the other day. He is not what he used to be.

Jody Shelley was dropped by Oliwa twice this year. TKOs. Johnson got beat up twice I think, but one may be in the preseason.
Low, Neil and Peters are not in the same league. Peters is a big boy, but hardly a great enforcer.

Boulton? Please, the guy is a punching bag.

Parker and Brasher are animals. So that's 2.
Brookbank took out Oliwa earlier this year. Wasn't a total knock out like some have said but it did make Oliwa have some trouble getting into the penatly box - thats 3

 
Old
03-08-2004, 03:23 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by DarioinDenver
Please name a time in recent history that a backup goaltender has played any sort of role in the playoffs, let alone one that lead to success..
well I guess the recent tandems in Minnesota and Carolina come to mind (but I admit those are more 1a/1b goalies for underdog team scenarios, as opposed to a backup for a cup favorite stealing the show)

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Old
03-08-2004, 03:27 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by nucks2001
Brookbank took out Oliwa earlier this year. Wasn't a total knock out like some have said but it did make Oliwa have some trouble getting into the penatly box - thats 3
as stated, any 1 person can do damage to anybody. Look what Hordichuk did to Worrell.

point was, Worrell has declined to fight oliwa I believe at least 6 times this year. And he did it once during that game. I saw the video of the fight. The two skated past each other and it almost appeared as if worrell said somethign to Oliwa. Right as Oliwa turned around Worrell Tackled him. and then punched him on the back of the head.

I also watched the Parker Worrell fight and watch Parker tag him a couple times. After some missed haymakers from worell he grabbed Parker. Parker got pissed as the referees came in and tugged himself out of Worrells hug and clearly said "what the hell are you doing" to worrell, *****ing that he resorted to Hugging when Parker started landing punches.

Worrell was once a Damn good heavyweight fighter. But the point is, he has backed out of more fights this year than he has faught. And he has been beat soundly twice and lost plenty of decisions. hes becoming a washed up fighter, and this Chickensh*t move he pulled on Worrell was the icing on the cake. Bottom line is next game he will either drop them with Oliwa or turtle, cause Im sure after what he did, Oliwa will gladly take the Instigator to beat the tar out of him.

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