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Trade: Garon for Sabu,Stone,4th in 2011

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Old
01-17-2009, 03:18 PM
  #101
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Originally Posted by Gooch View Post
This just seems to be a stupid waste of assets, giving up a 4th rounder for a friggen backup that is UFA this summer??? why? This is beyond retarded not to mention taking on an additional 600k in cap space we don't have.
He may not be just a backup goalie for us, MT can convert him to wing

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01-17-2009, 03:20 PM
  #102
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Evidently they do have the cap space, or at least a plan to deal with the situation.

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01-17-2009, 03:21 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Gooch View Post
I am probably sure he is better than Sabourin, but for a guy who is likely to play maybe 7 games as a penguin (if that) really worth giving up a mid round draft pick over as well as taking on additional salary that gives us even less flexibility in future trades as our gm FINALLY addresses the winger issue?
Point taken, but I think he'll be utilized more than 7 games. Clearly, MT has lost confidence in Sabourin more recently.

He's a guy that can stand on his head and steal a game, like he did last night. If we're going to make a run at the playoffs, we need a back-up who can not only be a stopgap, but actually be counted on to win games.

This deal w/ his goalie coach is kind of weird, though.

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01-17-2009, 03:23 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Champagne Wishes View Post
Because I'm sure Ty Conklin would've fared anywhere near as well on this incarnation of the Pens as he has in Detroit.

For ****'s sake, people. It's like you don't consider any other variables at all.
Right because when he signed with Detroit on July 1,2008 he knew the Penguins would have this exact same team on the ice right now.

And yeah what would a guy right out of the AHL do with an extra .5 million?

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01-17-2009, 03:25 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by SCUDeriMISSILE View Post
Point taken, but I think he'll be utilized more than 7 games. Clearly, MT has lost confidence in Sabourin more recently.

He's a guy that can stand on his head and steal a game, like he did last night. If we're going to make a run at the playoffs, we need a back-up who can not only be a stopgap, but actually be counted on to win games.

This deal w/ his goalie coach is kind of weird, though.
Exactly.

When we do give MAF a breather, we are in a position in which we need every game we can get. And Sabourin after a very good first 4-5 games, has been awful.

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01-17-2009, 03:25 PM
  #106
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Not a bad move, we take on some salary but hopefully in the end we will be better for it. Here is hoping the defense plays well infront of Garon and he rewards them with several W's.

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01-17-2009, 03:26 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by Gooch View Post
I am probably sure he is better than Sabourin, but for a guy who is likely to play maybe 7 games as a penguin (if that) really worth giving up a mid round draft pick over as well as taking on additional salary that gives us even less flexibility in future trades as our gm FINALLY addresses the winger issue?
Maybe Shero wants us to pick up some points in the shootouts? After all, Garon went 10–0 in shootouts last season, stopping 30 out of 32 attempts.

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01-17-2009, 03:29 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by SCUDeriMISSILE View Post
Point taken, but I think he'll be utilized more than 7 games. Clearly, MT has lost confidence in Sabourin more recently.

He's a guy that can stand on his head and steal a game, like he did last night. If we're going to make a run at the playoffs, we need a back-up who can not only be a stopgap, but actually be counted on to win games.

This deal w/ his goalie coach is kind of weird, though.
as much as I would rip on Sabourin he really wasnt that big of an issue. He played well when the team played well, he really didnt single hadedly lose us any games year, he just played like crap while the rest of the team was playing like crap anyways.

Our goaltenders numbers and performances are in direct correlation to the overall play of the team itself. On games where the team is actually playing well and not screwing up you see Fleury (or Sab) with very impressive numbers. In games where the defense is a sieve and the offense cant score a goal or even keep the puck in the offensive zone then yeah you see some .800 ish like numbers from our goaltenders.

I really hope that Garon is not used more than 7 games. I think our starting franchise goaltender should be playing the amount of games as a franchise goaltender.

It just strikes me as too much of a frivalous upgrade that yeah is nice to have but nothing worth actually going out of your way for. If it was just Sab and Stone for him then I wouldnt care, but the fact we actually gave up something of value (4th round pick, regardless of which draft it's for) for something that probably wont make a lick of difference in this crappy season it just isnt too smart.

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01-17-2009, 03:30 PM
  #109
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I hope Stone gets a chance to stick with the big club in Edmonton.

He's a tough kid, and really is trying to be a NHL player.

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01-17-2009, 03:30 PM
  #110
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Maybe Shero wants us to pick up some points in the shootouts? After all, Garon went 10–0 in shootouts last season, stopping 30 out of 32 attempts.
are you suggesting that if and when we get to a shootout that Fleury will be pulled for a cold Garon?

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01-17-2009, 03:31 PM
  #111
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I love how everyone always says ''Why didn't we give Conklin more moneyz?!!?''

HE DID NOT WANT TO COME HERE.

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01-17-2009, 03:31 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by Letang58 View Post
I hope Stone gets a chance to stick with the big club in Edmonton.

He's a tough kid, and really is trying to be a NHL player.
I hope so too. Seems like a good guy.

But I dunno, Edmonton is a fast team, he is going to look even slower than he did here. I just don't think he has NHL skating.

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01-17-2009, 03:32 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by td_ice View Post
Exactly.

When we do give MAF a breather, we are in a position in which we need every game we can get. And Sabourin after a very good first 4-5 games, has been awful.
that part is true, but so has the rest of the team... and our other goaltender which leads me to believe that the impetus is more on the team than the goaltender for that performance (barring his stupid get out of the net moves).

We really werent in any position to be winning those games anyways, regardless of his performance. We also seem to forget that Sabourin single handedly won us that Boston game earlier in the season.. I guess what I am trying to say is that if you stuck Garon in goal during those games our goaltenders were getting the losses in nothing wouldve changed.

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01-17-2009, 03:34 PM
  #114
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Just caught tail end of Joe Starkey interview with Asst. GM Cliff Fletcher.
I missed the Garon part.

But when Fletcher left, Starkey recapped.

And according to Starkey, Fletcher said, "that if Garon plays well enough, he will indeed contend for the No. 1 spot".
I am surprised there weren't any responses to that... Any chance Garon gets the call vs the Rags tomorrow?

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01-17-2009, 03:34 PM
  #115
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I love how everyone always says ''Why didn't we give Conklin more moneyz?!!?''

HE DID NOT WANT TO COME HERE.
Link?

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01-17-2009, 03:35 PM
  #116
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I hope Stone gets a chance to stick with the big club in Edmonton.

He's a tough kid, and really is trying to be a NHL player.
He wanted out of here for some time now.

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01-17-2009, 03:39 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by Gooch View Post
that part is true, but so has the rest of the team... and our other goaltender which leads me to believe that the impetus is more on the team than the goaltender for that performance (barring his stupid get out of the net moves).

We really werent in any position to be winning those games anyways, regardless of his performance. We also seem to forget that Sabourin single handedly won us that Boston game earlier in the season.. I guess what I am trying to say is that if you stuck Garon in goal during those games our goaltenders were getting the losses in nothing wouldve changed.
That could very well be the case.

I think it is a lateral move, with some possible upside. You just never know how Garon will play here. I think the upside is the possibility that he could be better. Because I don't think he could be too much worse than Sabourin. Who knows? Garon, might not be any better.

And I get you on the fact that neither goalie is likely to "steal" a game for us.

But I do think the cost is minimal. To me it was a 4th for a backup goalie. Stone was never going to play here, and Sabourin had shown us enough.

It is flyer, at minimal risk.

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01-17-2009, 03:44 PM
  #118
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We'll only use cap space on him for the amount we pay him while he's on our team. We'll pay him approx 550k for the rest of the season, which, subtracted from the 250k that we would have paid Sabu, means that we spend about 300k more in cap space for the rest of the season.
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Originally Posted by p-skank View Post
No, we will be responsible for his entire cap hit.

It's not like you can trade for an $8 million player at the 75% mark of the season and only have him be a $2 million cap hit.
You are both kind of correct. The upper-limit for the cap is 56,7M, and the length of this season is around 190 days. That means teams can spend 56,7M/ ~190 days = ~300k a day on salaries. We will be responsible for Garon’s full cap hit for the remainder of the season, which will be 1.1M/~190 days = ~6k a day, which makes up to a (projected) total cap hit of 6k*95 days = ~570k.

(Note, the number of days are a little of, so it’s only roughly estimates).

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01-17-2009, 03:46 PM
  #119
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It could be true that Garon will look no better than Sabourin, considering the defense this team has played for most of the last 2 months.

I would argue though, that Garon has #1 goalie stuff. He has been one, and has shown flashes of that kind of talent.

The reward possibility for Garon is so much higher than Sabourin.

Whether it was worth the gamble to give up a pick and prospect for someone who may turn out no better than Sabs is definitely up for discussion though.

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01-17-2009, 03:48 PM
  #120
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Congrats guys, this deal will work out well for you. As a tip, let Garon use his goalie coach(Lyle Mast) and he can outbattle some of the best goalies in the world(RL, Kipper, Backstrom).
Well, now he only has to worry about Clemmensen/Brodeur, MacDonald, Lundqvist, Biron.

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01-17-2009, 03:48 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by td_ice View Post
That could very well be the case.

I think it is a lateral move, with some possible upside. You just never know how Garon will play here. I think the upside is the possibility that he could be better. Because I don't think he could be too much worse than Sabourin. Who knows? Garon, might not be any better.

And I get you on the fact that neither goalie is likely to "steal" a game for us.

But I do think the cost is minimal. To me it was a 4th for a backup goalie. Stone was never going to play here, and Sabourin had shown us enough.

It is flyer, at minimal risk.
I see that fourth as something that couldve been used towards getting something that actually could be used for this team, and/or a lack of an asset that could be very handy to have 2 years from now when we probably would need it more...

Lets face it... it is a longshot right now that this team can even scrape into the 8th spot of the playoffs. When one thinks rental player you usually think of a guy who will be playing in all the games instead of hanging out on the pathways to the lockerroom. That 4th rounder will bite us in the ass at a future date, whether we need to make a trade and have to trade additional draft picks from that draft, or more valuable players because we dont have that trade piece because it was effectively thrown away.

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01-17-2009, 03:48 PM
  #122
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are you suggesting that if and when we get to a shootout that Fleury will be pulled for a cold Garon?
If I remember correctly Oilers did that several times last season, and it seemed to work well for them...

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01-17-2009, 03:49 PM
  #123
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Ah so another move where the Pens get a little bit more experience and better, I wonder how long it will take for people to whine about Garon like they do about Boucher, for the sake of whining too, it's not even whining for a legit reason.

I guess Shero figures another ex-Oiler could get Fleury going like last season. If he thinks the goaltending was a big issue, he really doesn't know how to fix the team right now. Yeah a lot of injuries here and there, oh well.

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01-17-2009, 03:50 PM
  #124
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Exactly.

When we do give MAF a breather, we are in a position in which we need every game we can get. And Sabourin after a very good first 4-5 games, has been awful.
Pretty much right on the button.

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01-17-2009, 03:50 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by SCUDeriMISSILE View Post
It could be true that Garon will look no better than Sabourin, considering the defense this team has played for most of the last 2 months.

I would argue though, that Garon has #1 goalie stuff. He has been one, and has shown flashes of that kind of talent.

The reward possibility for Garon is so much higher than Sabourin.

Whether it was worth the gamble to give up a pick and prospect for someone who may turn out no better than Sabs is definitely up for discussion though.
my big beef is that it is for a guy who will be on the ice less than 25% of the time on a team that is likely heading to the golf course. I mean if we're going to get something to sure up this team to make sure we snag that last playoff spot we should go for guys who can contribute to the team 100% of the time and at least get our damn money's worth before they hit their UFA.

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