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Nigel Dawes, anyone?

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Old
01-21-2009, 12:24 AM
  #26
RangerFan10
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I agree, and as far as I'm concerned just about every forward minus Gomez, Drury, Callahan, Dubinsky, and Betts are expendable. Maybe Korpikoski is included in that group too. nd of the world if Gomez was traded either.

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01-21-2009, 12:25 AM
  #27
Tawnos
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He hasn't even played 1.5 NHL seasons...

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01-21-2009, 12:33 AM
  #28
levski87
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Dawes is a decent prospect. We can't keep trading away our youth. Who else in hartford do you want replacing him? He must be a wing, like him.

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01-21-2009, 12:33 AM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
He hasn't even played 1.5 NHL seasons...
If he isn't a superstar within one season, he doesnt belong on the Rangers whom have real superstars, like Gomez and Redden

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01-21-2009, 12:42 AM
  #30
trilobyte
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Originally Posted by levski87 View Post
If he isn't a superstar within one season, he doesnt belong on the Rangers whom have real superstars, like Gomez and Redden
No, not like that at all. I'm totally a fan of Dubinsky, Prucha, Korpikosky, Callahan, Staal, Zherdev. Not to be confused with saying that any of them are 'untouchable', a word often used on the board. For now, I like seeing all of the above play, and look forward to them developing as Rangers. I actually don't feel the same way about Dawes. He does not stir my drink as a Ranger. I guess it could be called a subjective opinion (I suppose all are), but I base it on his very uneven play. I simply have no patience for Nigel Dawes. There, I said it

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01-21-2009, 12:43 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trilobyte View Post
No, not like that at all. I'm totally a fan of Dubinsky, Prucha, Korpikosky, Callahan, Staal, Zherdev. Not to be confused with saying that any of them are 'untouchable', a word often used on the board. For now, I like seeing all of the above play, and look forward to them developing as Rangers. I actually don't feel the same way about Dawes. He does not stir my drink as a Ranger. I guess it could be called a subjective opinion (I suppose all are), but I base it on his very uneven play. I simply have no patience for Nigel Dawes. There, I said it
Dubinsky has been consistent this season? Staal has been consistent this season? Honestly, all three of these guys are having very typical sophomore seasons.

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01-21-2009, 12:49 AM
  #32
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I have no problem with waiting it out to see if Dawes can become a consistent player, but he is one of 8 RFAs this upcoming offseason and we won't be able to resign all of them. I'm assuming that we will let Fritsche and Prucha walk, but if the cap doesn't go up, we may have around $17 million to resign our 6 other RFAs, Vally, Betts, Orr, free agents, etc. It may be more beneficial to trade Dawes at the deadline rather than letting him go at the end of the year for nothing or losing him to a higher offer sheet.

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Old
01-21-2009, 06:40 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trilobyte View Post
I consider Dawes totally expendable. Seen him play, and what I see is talent that peeks out every now and then. The last thing the Rangers need is this peek-aboo crap, now you see I'm good, now you don't.
The real big problem with the NYR organization is indecision regarding player management, whether bringing them up or casting them away.
sheesh, hes only 23.... Inconsistency should be expected, right?

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01-21-2009, 09:12 AM
  #34
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I don't think the inconsistancy is the issue, it's the fact that we have a surplus of future 2nd and 3rd line cornerstones on this roster and in the system. Most of the people that are saying Dawes is expendable aren't saying TRADE DAWES HES HORRIBLE HE SUCKS. I'd be fine with a Dawes trade because of the younger forwards we have (Callahan, Dubinsky, Korpikoski included) Dawes is the least likely of them to become a consistent 20-30 goal guy. Prucha's also only 26 and I think he's on his way to having a good rebound season this year, if he stays I'd much rather have him than Dawes if it came down to the two.

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Old
01-21-2009, 09:39 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Like so many of our forwards, Dawes is woefully inconsistent.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Balej20 View Post
No one on the team is scoring.
Coincidence?

It's not a Dawes issue. This isn't a free-wheeling game strategy with an aggressive forecheck where someone with speed, vision and hands is going to have the green light to generate offense and, in turn, get enough opportunities with the puck to earn more quality chances. If you want to tap the offensive potential of anyone/everyone on the roster, the entire game plan has to change.

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Old
01-21-2009, 10:28 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dedalus View Post
...That being the case, it seems fair now to ask, with one point the last five games, what says his booster club?

I don't bring this up to bash Dawes. I think he's a perfectly adequate NHL role player. I bring it up because it seems to me that memories sometimes grow very short 'round these parts...
We're going to start questioning a 23 year old sophomore who's still developing his offensive game at the NHL level, after a 5 game drought? Seriously?! Without even looking at the stats I'm willing to gamble that with the exception of Zherdev, every player on this team has gone, at some point this season, 5 games without a point. I'm no huger fan of Dawes, I think he's got lots of potential, but I'm certainly no apologist for the guy. On the other hand, I think you'd have to seriously question your enrollment in the Dawes hater club.

I mean 5 games, for a sophomore, on a low scoring team, where the whole team scored all of 8 goals on a 5 game road trip and the whole team was shut out in one of those games???? You don't think you're being a tad bit overly critical of this guy?

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Old
01-21-2009, 11:45 AM
  #37
maddog24g
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Over the last 3 months (Nov, Dec, Jan):

Zherdev: 35 games 7 goals 20 assists 27 points (89 shots)

Drury: 35 games 13 goals 13 assists 26 points (93 shots)

Gomez: 30 games 6 goals 15 assists 21 points (98 shots)

Naslund: 35 games 9 goals 8 assists 17 points (88 shots)

Dawes: 28 games 7 goals 8 assists 15 points (47 shots)

Callahan: 35 games 9 goals 5 assists 14 points (105 shots)

Dubinsky: 35 games 3 goals 9 assists 12 points (84 shots)

Prucha: 15 games 3 goals 3 assists 6 points (20 shots)

Voros: 28 games 3 goals 2 assists 5 points (39 shots)

Sjostrom: 35 games 2 goals 3 assists 5 points (52 shots)

Betts: 34 games 4 goals 1 assist 5 points (40 shots)

Fritche: 12 games 1 goal 3 assists 4 points (14 shots)

Korpikoski: 28 games 1 goal 2 assists 3 points (28 shots)

Orr: 35 games 1 goal 2 assists 3 points (19 shots)

The whole team is sucking offensively, with mr inconsistent/loafer/should sit before prucha still outproducing the golden children cally and dubi and only one point less than naslund. Korps doesn't get involved period. If sjostrom can find a way to take that many shots on the 4th line then korps has no excuse. You can't score if you don't shoot.

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Old
01-21-2009, 08:51 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hlundqvist30 View Post
There are people who ARE singling out Dawes. Complaining about Dawes' scoring on this Rangers team is like complaining about a rain drop in Seattle.
Complaining that Dawes isn't scoring isn't singling him out. It's stating a simple fact. That it's a fact that applies to other players as well does not make noting it in Dawes's case "singling him out."

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01-21-2009, 09:10 PM
  #39
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First: THANK YOU! A layered response that actually speaks to the topic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR94 View Post
It's not so much that people have short memories as much as they have selective ones. But it's not just some Dawes supporters who are quick to praise him when he scores but clam up when he goes unnoticed for a stretch. It happens win fans of all sorts of players and coaches.
I'm okay with either "short" or "selective" as adjectives. Take your pick. And I will agree with the second sentence to a degree. There are fans who will do this with other players, but there are also fans who are entirely consistent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR94 View Post
Maybe a poster is quick to praise Lundqvist after a shutout (and deservedly so) but is nowhere to be found after a bad night in net by Henrik. Or they blast Renney after a bad loss but won't give him credit for a well-coached game. People pick and chose. Play favorites or whatever.
In Lundqvist's case you have a player who is well established, however. There is really no one who doubts he is at LEAST a very good goalie, and when fans critique him for a poor game or two, no one suggests that those fans are Henrik Lundqvist haters. This is where he parts company with (say) Dawes and Dawes fans part company with the mainstream. To suggest someone is a "Dawes hater" suggests that any critique of the kid can ONLY be founded on emotion. This is, of course, nonsense that is more likely to reflect the reverse: fans who would offer such a term are themselves most likely the ones emotionally invested in the kid, thus their quick response for something as simple as a nifty goal scored.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR94 View Post
And it happens on every board. Not by all posters, but by enough to make it noticeable.
That's certainly true but I don't care about other boards. If folks elsewhere want to be ridiculous, that's okay with me.


Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR94 View Post
The problem with both players is that they don't have the size, strength and defensive ability to be consistent 3rd liners and haven't scored enough this season to be solid top 6 guys. And that's on a team desperate for offense. The spark is definitely missing from Nigel's game on many nights. And when a player seems to need a spark lit under his ass on most nights, you have to wonder if that's the type of player you want on your team. Where is the desire to self-motivate?
Now see, I think you have offerd a very balanced assessment of the kid (both kids actually). Yet we both know that a number of posters here would greet such a neutral assessment with catcalls and derision after Dawes tallies two points in two nights.

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01-21-2009, 09:12 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by levski87 View Post
If he isn't a superstar within one season, he doesnt belong on the Rangers whom have real superstars, like Gomez and Redden
Strawman, therefore worthless.

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01-21-2009, 09:19 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vipernsx View Post
You don't think you're being a tad bit overly critical of this guy?
You tell me. Is calling him "a perfectly adequate NHL role player" being a tad too critical? Because that's what I said about Dawes. It is, in fact, ALL I said about Dawes.

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01-21-2009, 10:57 PM
  #42
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When you are trying to improve your team, judgements have to be made about how you think a player will develop and what he could ultimately look like. Dawes has talent, we have all seen it. I don't think he is a blood and guts player, that's all. And I also don't see the level of talent that would make me think he is a diamond in the rough. In other words, I don't think his potential to help NYR is as great as Dubinsky, Prucha, Callahan or Korpikosky.

Mostly because NYR should point themselves towards getting bigger talented guys, not smaller talented guys. Prucha is a smaller talented guy, and I think he is way ahead of Dawes.
Can't keep everyone. It's subjective, and my opinion is that Dawes is not all that impressive.

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01-22-2009, 09:36 AM
  #43
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mti....

I've seen the same selfishness in Dawes lately (choosing not to pass the puck, rather taking a shot that's easy to save). Of course, they teach you to shoot, but at the same time, I've seen Dawes make some of those passes he opted not to in the past and it got me scratching my head. The conspiracy theorist in me suggests he's unwilling to setup Prucha because he wants the goals on the line to come from either him or Drury, since he's directly competing for that spot with Prucha, in a way. Sounds crazy and I don't know Dawes to suggest this is actually true, but it did seem odd of late.

And Dawes is in his second year, after a decent first year. Everybody expects a sophomore slump (although, it wasn't like he scored 25 goals last season, from which he would slump). However, you expect a sophomore slump as the case is with Dubi, not Dawes. Dubi is not invisible on any night. He keeps involved and keeps going. He's having trouble getting pucks into the net, or finding a guy to get pucks into the net. Dawes has been finding it difficult to be noticed in a game far too often. The effort is lacking, which is why he has sat and Dubi has not. When you give effort, the coach believes you will come around if he thinks you have the skills and talent. If you have the skills and talent but do not put forth the effort, well then you sit.

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01-22-2009, 09:49 AM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by levski87 View Post
Dawes is a decent prospect. We can't keep trading away our youth. Who else in hartford do you want replacing him? He must be a wing, like him.
I really wish Byers didn't get hurt because I thought he was just as worthy as Korpikoski to come up with the Rangers this season. I agree that Dawes is a decent prospect. These are the type of players that pay off in 2 or 3 years. For example. Look at a player like Franzen. I know he isn't the same player as Dawes but he's 29 years old and having a good season thus far. Definitely on pace for 35 goals or more. I think it was only last year that this guy started to really develop. Now I'm giving an extreme example I feel. And I think If we give Dawes another 2 years he has the capability of scoring many more goals. He just needs to mature some more. But I think he has the discipline to do that.

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Old
01-22-2009, 11:56 AM
  #45
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gravy,
Byers is probably going to play a different role than Korpi, I don't know if Renney would want him on the 3rd line. He's a projected 4th liner, his build is for the 4th line, his toughness screams 4th line...and his scoring abilities scream 4th line.

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01-22-2009, 11:59 AM
  #46
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Rangersfan...

I wonder where you come up with your comparison of Lauri and Byers. They're the same age and they had the same goal total on the same team last season (Byers scored more the season before). Was wondering why one would project to be a top six forward and the other a fourth liner (not even a third liner).

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01-22-2009, 12:07 PM
  #47
Vitto79
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A trade needs to be made at some point and guys like Dawes, Prucha, Fritsche ,Voros will be offered up to get that. Plus picks and a prospect like Sauer

teams will see value in Dawes especially

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01-22-2009, 12:17 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitto79 View Post
A trade needs to be made at some point and guys like Dawes, Prucha, Fritsche ,Voros will be offered up to get that. Plus picks and a prospect like Sauer

teams will see value in Dawes especially
Why, exactly, would Dawes carry much value? While he does seem to have talent, he hasn't proven very much. I'm not saying he won't become a solid, NHL regular down the line, he very well may, but to this point, on one of the league's worst offensive teams, he struggles to stay in the lineup consistently.

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01-22-2009, 01:22 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitto79 View Post
teams will see value in Dawes especially
Are you seeing this in the press? Are GMs expressing interest and/or scouting him?

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01-23-2009, 10:20 AM
  #50
Son of Steinbrenner
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What is the point of this thread?

Dawes is a young player who has scored some big goals this year....his goal against the ducks in december showed the promise he has at this level...it also showed that perhaps when he is fully developed he might be a 2nd line player...(actually he already is but that's by default more then anything....)


Is this really a "I'm right and your wrong thread? I imagine if Dawes was playing for the Flyers the thread starter would be telling us all "look at another flyers draft pick playing in the NHL."

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