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Team Canada 2010: Boyle, Green, or Burns?

View Poll Results: choose one
Boyle 78 44.07%
Green 64 36.16%
Burns 35 19.77%
Voters: 177. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
01-22-2009, 09:25 AM
  #51
ItsAllPartOfThePlan
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Burns. He finally is back where he belongs on Defense. Such a stupid move by Lemaire.

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Old
01-22-2009, 10:16 AM
  #52
The Big Swede
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Burns is better then the other 2 in his own zone and offensively they're all pretty close

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Old
01-22-2009, 12:03 PM
  #53
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If Boyle keeps his play up like he has so far I can't see how you can leave him off the team, and this is coming from a guy who loves Green from his Saskatoon Blades days.

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Old
01-22-2009, 02:48 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amnesiac View Post
I have the impression that he, like Boyle, have a higher +/- due more to the fact that they both play on highly offensive teams, as opposed to their actual defensive ability. As surprisingly low as Burns`s +/- is this year, hes still the probably the best defensively of the 3.

Your +/- wont go up if your team cant score. Boyle was almost a -29 just last year, and Green was -10 two years ago when they both their teams sucked respectively.
absolutely.

I wouldn't read much into Burns' +/- because his team is much worse than the Caps or Sharks.

But Washington and San Jose are more comparable....but still San Jose as a team has a big +/- advantage over Washington.....so the fact that Green has a better +/- even though the caps have a significantly lower team +/- tells us that green has probably been signifiacntly more effective defensively.

Of course, the fact that Boyle is only 6th on his team in +/- despite scoring so much tells us that Boyle is still the same shaky defensive player he was in Tampa, and is being carried defensively by a very good defensive team. Meanwhile, Green's +17 leads his defense corps by a mile in +/- (Schultz is 2nd at +7), and is 2nd on his team only to Semin's +23 (and well ahead of Ovechkin's 3rd best +13), telling us that Green is not being carried by his team defensively, but is in fact one of the defensive leaders on the team.


Boyle has always been shaky defensively - this hasn't magically changed in San Jose.....he just plays on a much better defensive team than he used to.

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Old
01-22-2009, 02:51 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Shef View Post


This just proves your a stat ***** and dont actually watch hockey. There is no way at this point that Mike Green is even "better" defensively then Boyle. Green regularly coughs up the puck when trying to do too much, gives the puck over alot more easy when being pressured. I bet you somehow looked at there career +/- and came to this conclusion.
I can guarantee you I've watched more of both players than you.

Green is very good defensively, while Boyle is, and always has been, very shaky defensively.

Quote:
LOL at "Mike Green might be the best all around defensemen in hockey at the moment"

Nick Lidstrom
Shea Weber
Zdeno Chara

^^All 3 of those guys are easily better all around defencemen then Green at the moment.
Lidstrom for sure, although at 38 he's looking like he's slipping a bit,.

Chara could be as well.

I'd take Green over Weber by a good margin.

I'm guessing at the end of the year the norris trophy will come down to a battle between Chara and Green, with Lidstrom in there just for old time's sake, even though he isn't having a great year.

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Old
01-22-2009, 02:54 PM
  #56
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I would definitely take Boyle. Big game experience wins out for me.

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Old
01-22-2009, 02:55 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by chaosrevolver View Post
lol, zeke. You seemed to miss one stat..and it's one stat that will really hurt your "best all-around defenseman" argument. It's giveaways.

Mike Green: 54 Giveaways (82 Game Pace: 127 Giveaways)
Dan Boyle: 32 Giveaways (82 Game Pace: 60 Giveaways)
Brent Burns: 37 Giveaways (82 Game Pace: 72 Giveaways)

Im taking Boyle on this one. Doesn't turn the puck over as much and still provides the offence needed in a PP/Offensive Specialist.
yeah, giveaways and takeaways are useless stats, really. they say more about the team's style of game than anything else.

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Old
01-22-2009, 02:56 PM
  #58
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Burns is better than all of them by a fair margin.

If he's not on the team, then the person selecting the players needs to be fired.

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Old
01-22-2009, 02:56 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke View Post
I can guarantee you I've watched more of both players than you.

Green is very good defensively, while Boyle is, and always has been, very shaky defensively.



Lidstrom for sure, although at 38 he's looking like he's slipping a bit,.

Chara could be as well.

I'd take Green over Weber by a good margin.

I'm guessing at the end of the year the norris trophy will come down to a battle between Chara and Green, with Lidstrom in there just for old time's sake, even though he isn't having a great year.
Are you serious?

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01-22-2009, 02:57 PM
  #60
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dead serious.

Green is amazing.

he's the best of the good young defensemen in the league right now.

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Old
01-22-2009, 02:58 PM
  #61
Novak Djokovic
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That, again, shows how underrated Burns is playing in Minesota and that team's system. Brent Burns in San Jose would just be amazing......and he's better than Dan Boyle and Mike Green, in my opinion.

Brent Burns = The best defenseman last year in WC

In a run-and-gun system, he would be flat-out fantastic. [Like Boyle and Green get to play]

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Old
01-22-2009, 02:59 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lux Aurumque View Post
Burns is better than all of them by a fair margin.

If he's not on the team, then the person selecting the players needs to be fired.
I agree...[Finally I agree with J.S. Bach...I can't believe it]

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Old
01-22-2009, 02:59 PM
  #63
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Team Canada defense:

Niedermayer - Pronger
Green - Weber
Bouwmeester - Phaneuf

not sure who I'd take as the 7th guy.

Maybe a pure offense guy like Boyle or Campbell, maybe a pure defense guy like Regehr or Mitchell, maybe an all around kid like Wideman, Keith, or Burns, maybe a booming PP shot with a good physical presence like Souray, McCabe, or Bieksa.

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Old
01-22-2009, 03:02 PM
  #64
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Quote:
"He's going to be the best" - B.Boudreau on Mike Green
Sure he's his coach and all, but I agree with him.

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Old
01-22-2009, 03:02 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke View Post
yeah, giveaways and takeaways are useless stats, really. they say more about the team's style of game than anything else.
You say this is a useless stat and then try to use plus/minus to show how great Green is?

Plus/Minus is the most useless stat out there.

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Old
01-22-2009, 03:02 PM
  #66
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Boyle. Hes just as good offensively as green and is EXTREMELY good defensively. He is probably the best defenseman at shuting down opposing teams top line (Vlasic is still a little rusty when facing a good cycle) on the sharks. He, Nabokov, thornton and marleau are the best sharks players and this year I easily give him the MVP of the sharks (even if Thornton is having one of his best years). He is key in 5 on 5 the pp and the pk. I'd call him a neidermayer in his prime.

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Old
01-22-2009, 03:05 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by byter View Post
You say this is a useless stat and then try to use plus/minus to show how great Green is?

Plus/Minus is the most useless stat out there.
Plus/Minus is a dicey stat for sure - but when used to compare two players with very similar roles and minutes on similar quality teams, it can be useful.

Giveaways/Takeaways, on the other hand, are compeltely useless.

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Old
01-22-2009, 04:08 PM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke View Post
dead serious.

Green is amazing.

he's the best of the good young defensemen in the league right now.
Hes also one of the more overrated d-mans in the league

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Old
01-22-2009, 09:04 PM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke View Post
I can guarantee you I've watched more of both players than you.

Green is very good defensively, while Boyle is, and always has been, very shaky defensively.



Lidstrom for sure, although at 38 he's looking like he's slipping a bit,.

Chara could be as well.

I'd take Green over Weber by a good margin.

I'm guessing at the end of the year the norris trophy will come down to a battle between Chara and Green, with Lidstrom in there just for old time's sake, even though he isn't having a great year.
You can gurantee you've watched the two players more then me? Haha how can anyone actually even use that as your argument? Thats weak. You obviously havent watched much of Green considering in a earlier post you said that he's excellant in his own end and most capital homers wouldnt even agree with that. Hes awesome offensively and prolly one if not the best puckmover in the league currently but he certainly is not good in his own end.

You also said he very well might be the best all around defencemen currently in the NHL. How can someone be considered that when hes not elite in his own end and he gives the puck up a ton?

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Old
01-22-2009, 09:07 PM
  #70
weems
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke View Post
Plus/Minus is a dicey stat for sure - but when used to compare two players with very similar roles and minutes on similar quality teams, it can be useful.

Giveaways/Takeaways, on the other hand, are compeltely useless.
Keep coming with the excuse's. When the guy is almost at double the amount of giveaways per game compared to Boyle or Burns it says more about the player then his team. Ya im sure the style the Caps play is totally the reason for Green coughing the puck up so much in the neutral zone and also in his own zone.

You dont watch hockey games, you only look at the stat sheets at the end of the night.


Last edited by weems: 01-22-2009 at 09:25 PM.
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Old
01-22-2009, 09:16 PM
  #71
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Another thing that shows your full of crap Zeke.

"Green really has the whole package. He's big and strong"

Since when is 6'1, 200 pounds considered big for a defender?

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Old
01-22-2009, 09:17 PM
  #72
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zeke is a bad liar.

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Old
01-22-2009, 09:21 PM
  #73
weems
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Originally Posted by Rakovsky View Post
zeke is a bad liar.
He's a stat junkie. He base's all of his opinions off what the #'s tell him.

According to him Green is excellant in his own end, could very well be the best all around defender in the league and to top it off, Green is now apparently big and strong.

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Old
01-22-2009, 09:24 PM
  #74
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I'll go with the guy who was the best defenceman at the World Championships.

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Old
01-22-2009, 09:28 PM
  #75
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Boyle's a lot better defensively than most people give him credit for. He's obviously out there for the offence instead of the D, but he's not anywhere close to being the giant liability that he was made out to be.

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