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Lundqvist's Mechanic and Style

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Old
01-28-2009, 11:44 PM
  #1
nyrangersfan39
 
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Lundqvist's Mechanic and Style

First time posting here but had to be done after such a miserable 3rd (missed first two due to work... boy i wish i missed that game).As someone who played ice hockey goalie, there seem to be great things wrong with Henk this year. As much as I like him and followed him before NYR days, he's been way too soft and inconsistent this year. Granted, every goalie will have down years no doubt. However, a team as "good" as the Rangers, his GAA and Save % shouldn't be at 2.61 and .911.

Take Pens game as an example; out of six goals, Crosby's was the only one that he truly couldn't have stopped. All others were either softies or not sufficiently challenged. Foremost, our goalie's been mentally weak (granted having crappy D doesn't help too much either); he just doesn't seem to be in "it" as much.

Sykora's goal - could have been prevented if Henk paid more attention where the puck was. Can't let the puck bounce around from near left post, out to top right crease area. Communicate w/ D, find the puck and ice it.
Staal's - Boy, I feel bad. But elite goalies cannot let this kind of goal in; especially against arch rivals
Letang's - Overall good shot but Henk was again not aggressive and wasn't well squared to the shooter. wasn't a softy but who knows? w/ better mechanics, it could have been stopped.
Sykora - Goalies hate 5 - 3. But not good mechanic here. Again, too deep in the net and didn't cover 5 hole. But can't blame him too much
Letang - again, deep in net, not squared to the shooter; bad positioning. 1 on 1's goalies should have this and be more aggressive.
Crosby - good goal. Nice shot.

If I were Allaire, I will sit with Henk and go over his mechanics. I understand that he likes to stay in net a lot. But, for a pure butterfly goalie like him, he must learn when to get out of the net and cut down the angle when necessary. Goaltending isn't all about reflex. It's more about positioning, quick footwork and reading the play (mental). Even guys like Cujo, Turco, Luongo and Hasek, who like to stay in net, came out when necessary.

Overall though, their D sucked too so can't blame everything on the goalie. However, communication between them has been pretty inept also and I think that's been certainly reflected in today's game. I just hope that Henk and the NYR rebound against B town (oh boy). And by end of the season, I expect 2.40 GAA and about .917 save %. Still, these numbers aren't elite , especially for a goalie who's supposed to be the best player on the team. But then again, I don't expect anyone to put up under 2.20 and over .925 every year.

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01-28-2009, 11:54 PM
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Cynical TyranT
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He has no glove hand.

period.

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01-28-2009, 11:55 PM
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He has no glove hand.

period.
That pretty much sums it up. He's giving up to many softies down low lately also.

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01-29-2009, 12:42 AM
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mrhockey193195
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The disconcerting one was Letang's second goal...right through the legs, and it wasn't that great of a shot either.

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01-29-2009, 01:02 AM
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The disconcerting one was Letang's second goal...right through the legs, and it wasn't that great of a shot either.
I think he kinda gave up at that point. It didn't look like he was trying too hard towards the end of the game.

I was pleased with his reaction during his post-game interview, though. He took full responsibility for the game and was pissed off, saying "I could destroy this locker room right now." Lundqvist is a great competitor and shows a lot of intensity, unlike some other players on this team.

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01-29-2009, 01:18 AM
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He goes down too quickly and shooters know that. They constantly gun for his glove side shoulder. He also lets in too many flukey goals. You can only be so unlucky, at some point you gotta look at yourself and say maybe I'm doing something wrong.

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01-29-2009, 01:27 AM
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lundqvist

he is a pad goalie...needs to be more hybrid....im pretty sure he was good at this style early in this season and started to slowly crouch and play deep net....i think he has talent but lets all pray that he isnt going to have a **** season cause after the all star break he saves this team who cant score.

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01-29-2009, 01:34 AM
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He's a butterfly goaltender. He's going to let up the occasional goal over the shoulder because it's a small sacrifice to be really damn good covering the rest of the net, especially when you're facing a wide-open shooter in close.

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01-29-2009, 01:51 AM
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If I said anything like what the 10 guys in front of me did youwould want me banned. Hank is not a elite goalie he plays deep,has no glove, bad and careless while handling the puck. He ripped his teammates in Montreal this season for weak play then he should be draw and quartered. Every year you people make excuses for him he had a headache, dad was sick, What now? The back up is out playing him so he doesn't like it?

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01-29-2009, 02:08 AM
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i agree with dagoon that hank isn't an elite goalie yet as 3 years isn't enough. But, i don't think he's horrible either. Yes, he's been struggling since he complained about his teammate (though can't blame him). that being said however, he does have very good glove hand overall, than many ppl think (his blocker sucks though). furthermore, i don't have problem with him playing deep in net. you really can't expect goalie to change his overall style that he played with his entire life. the problem i've the most are his inability to cut down the angle and play aggressive when necessary and his questionable mental game. He just is not as focused. Frankly, I was worried about the all star game and I wasn't too surprised when he got lit up. If you watch his old clips, you can clearly see he's been playing differently and understand that my statements have great validity. Glove hand for example, you can have the best glove hand in the world, but if you can't play the correct angle, chances are, pucks will end up behind the net. I think Rangers' passive style has been catching up to him leading to mental breakdown, resulting in poor mechanics. Hopefully, the interview after pens game will eventually wake him up.

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01-29-2009, 03:32 AM
  #11
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What's wrong with Lundqvist?

Absolutely nothing. . .

He's an above average player who had a below average night.

Some of you people act like great goaltenders haven't given up 6 in a game before.. You overreact way too easily.

If there really was a major flaw in his mechanics, he wouldn't be a starting goaltender for an NHL team. Teams would light him up every single game, until he's shuffled away.

Luongo gave up 5 last night. Gave up 6 a week and a half ago as well. He also gave up 6 goals in October.

Broduer gave up a sixer against Philly earlier this season.. Hell, even our low-scoring Blueshirts netted 4 against him.. He must have a problem in his mechanics as well?

When Lundqvist is on his game, the only goals he gives up are perfect shots that would beat most goalie's 9/10 times.

Also, I think some of you guys fail to realize that Lundqvist isn't a seasoned vet. Yes, it is his fourth season now, but I don't think he has really reached his ceiling yet.

When he does, you won't see more flashier saves.. All I think you'll see, is a little more consistency.

But 3 straight Vezina nominations, in my books, already qualifies as consistent, which is my original dispute with this thread in the first place.

Learn to live with it people. It's damn near impossible to bring your A game night in, and night out. Hell, I can't even do that at my desk job.

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01-29-2009, 05:18 AM
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I spit on people bashing Lundqvist. You're a disgrace and embarrassment to real Rangers fans. You should be banished from the tri-state area. It never ceases to amaze me how people rip Lundqvist when he has a bad game or period when he is the only reason this loser organization makes the playoffs now. If you only knew how pathetic and sad you are.

The people ripping Lundqvist sound like loser gamblers who lost money on the game because they either took the under or the Rangers to win. Whenever you hear a fan rip a great player on his team, it's almost always because the loser bet money on the game and lost.

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01-29-2009, 05:45 AM
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i'm not concerned about his style or anything, rather that he is pretty streaky. for the rangers to go anywhere in the playoffs we have to hope he goes on a hot streak, and not a cold one...

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01-29-2009, 05:57 AM
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Originally Posted by trademasterb View Post
I spit on people bashing Lundqvist. You're a disgrace and embarrassment to real Rangers fans. You should be banished from the tri-state area. It never ceases to amaze me how people rip Lundqvist when he has a bad game or period when he is the only reason this loser organization makes the playoffs now. If you only knew how pathetic and sad you are.

The people ripping Lundqvist sound like loser gamblers who lost money on the game because they either took the under or the Rangers to win. Whenever you hear a fan rip a great player on his team, it's almost always because the loser bet money on the game and lost.
You're on a forum, thats what people do. They discuss the good, the bad and the ugly. I missed last nights game so I can't really talk about it but apparently some people feel the need to address a poor performance. God forbid it be the franchises golden boy.

And for the record some people might see spitting on people as disgraceful.

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01-29-2009, 06:19 AM
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lundqvist was off in the 3rd per after a couple flukey goals and then giving letang all the time in the world to pick his spot.....he and pretty much the team fell apart after that....he carried us in the beginning of the year.....and helll do it again towards the playoffs....just like the last 2 yrs

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01-29-2009, 06:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boom Boom Geoffrion View Post
What's wrong with Lundqvist?

Absolutely nothing. . .

He's an above average player who had a below average night.

Some of you people act like great goaltenders haven't given up 6 in a game before.. You overreact way too easily.

If there really was a major flaw in his mechanics, he wouldn't be a starting goaltender for an NHL team. Teams would light him up every single game, until he's shuffled away.

Luongo gave up 5 last night. Gave up 6 a week and a half ago as well. He also gave up 6 goals in October.

Broduer gave up a sixer against Philly earlier this season.. Hell, even our low-scoring Blueshirts netted 4 against him.. He must have a problem in his mechanics as well?

When Lundqvist is on his game, the only goals he gives up are perfect shots that would beat most goalie's 9/10 times.

Also, I think some of you guys fail to realize that Lundqvist isn't a seasoned vet. Yes, it is his fourth season now, but I don't think he has really reached his ceiling yet.

When he does, you won't see more flashier saves.. All I think you'll see, is a little more consistency.

But 3 straight Vezina nominations, in my books, already qualifies as consistent, which is my original dispute with this thread in the first place.

Learn to live with it people. It's damn near impossible to bring your A game night in, and night out. Hell, I can't even do that at my desk job.
excellent post

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01-29-2009, 06:47 AM
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he carried us in the beginning of the year.....and helll do it again towards the playoffs....just like the last 2 yrs
This is exactly what's wrong. People think that expecting something will automatically make it come true. Goalies have the toughest job probably in all sports. So many things can go wrong

Look at Turco in Dallas. Look at Kiprusoff, who's had several down years after he won the Vezina. Look at Nabokov, who has pretty much the same stats despite playing for the second best team in the league. Even Luongo couldn't carry his team to the playoffs last year

Sorry, he's human. It's the third year in where he's being expected to hold other teams to 2 goals or less for 70 games a year. It starts to get to you

It could be that he's not that good... but was anyone watching the first 25 games? He got no help from the D at all and still played unbelievably. And average goalies don't get nominated for Vezina's three years in a row. Obviously he has been doings something right in his career. And don't tell me it was the defense, because that's taken into account. Our defense at best has been average or below since Lundqvist came into the league. A 21 year old is practically our #1 defenseman, which says a lot about the current state of things

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01-29-2009, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by ThirdEye View Post
This is exactly what's wrong. People think that expecting something will automatically make it come true. Goalies have the toughest job probably in all sports. So many things can go wrong

Look at Turco in Dallas. Look at Kiprusoff, who's had several down years after he won the Vezina. Look at Nabokov, who has pretty much the same stats despite playing for the second best team in the league. Even Luongo couldn't carry his team to the playoffs last year

Sorry, he's human. It's the third year in where he's being expected to hold other teams to 2 goals or less for 70 games a year. It starts to get to you

It could be that he's not that good... but was anyone watching the first 25 games? He got no help from the D at all and still played unbelievably. And average goalies don't get nominated for Vezina's three years in a row. Obviously he has been doings something right in his career. And don't tell me it was the defense, because that's taken into account. Our defense at best has been average or below since Lundqvist came into the league. A 21 year old is practically our #1 defenseman, which says a lot about the current state of things
im saying he'll do it again because i truly do believe in him that he has what it takes to get it done.....i beleive in him because ive seen him do it before....and i saw how he covered all the mistakes earlier this season.....im just trying to back him from these guys attacking him and saying he sucks.....hes one of the better starters in the league....to pick him apart over a few bad games or stretches here an there is ridiculous ...cause if it wasnt for our goalie wed be on the outside looking in already

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01-29-2009, 07:24 AM
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Two more days until we should start expecting him to really show up

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01-29-2009, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThirdEye View Post
This is exactly what's wrong. People think that expecting something will automatically make it come true. Goalies have the toughest job probably in all sports. So many things can go wrong

Look at Turco in Dallas. Look at Kiprusoff, who's had several down years after he won the Vezina. Look at Nabokov, who has pretty much the same stats despite playing for the second best team in the league. Even Luongo couldn't carry his team to the playoffs last year

Sorry, he's human. It's the third year in where he's being expected to hold other teams to 2 goals or less for 70 games a year. It starts to get to you

It could be that he's not that good... but was anyone watching the first 25 games? He got no help from the D at all and still played unbelievably. And average goalies don't get nominated for Vezina's three years in a row. Obviously he has been doings something right in his career. And don't tell me it was the defense, because that's taken into account. Our defense at best has been average or below since Lundqvist came into the league. A 21 year old is practically our #1 defenseman, which says a lot about the current state of things
Great post.

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01-29-2009, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThirdEye View Post
This is exactly what's wrong. People think that expecting something will automatically make it come true. Goalies have the toughest job probably in all sports. So many things can go wrong

Look at Turco in Dallas. Look at Kiprusoff, who's had several down years after he won the Vezina. Look at Nabokov, who has pretty much the same stats despite playing for the second best team in the league. Even Luongo couldn't carry his team to the playoffs last year

Sorry, he's human. It's the third year in where he's being expected to hold other teams to 2 goals or less for 70 games a year. It starts to get to you

It could be that he's not that good... but was anyone watching the first 25 games? He got no help from the D at all and still played unbelievably. And average goalies don't get nominated for Vezina's three years in a row. Obviously he has been doings something right in his career. And don't tell me it was the defense, because that's taken into account. Our defense at best has been average or below since Lundqvist came into the league. A 21 year old is practically our #1 defenseman, which says a lot about the current state of things
This one can't be quoted enough.

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01-29-2009, 08:47 AM
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I obviously don't know a damn thing about playing goalie, but the one thing that always makes me wonder if he couldn't improve is where he holds his glove hand. When he goes into the butterfly, it always seems that his glove hand is resting just above his pad, parallel to his leg. I always felt that if he held it more straight up, perpendicular to his leg, then there would be less space to shoot at, especially with his otherwise uselessly giant uncloseable glove. Anyone have any idea if that would make a difference? Obviously, like I said, I'm essentially guessing here and I know Lundqvist and Allaire know a lot better than I do, but it seems to me like this might cut down on the high glove problem.

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01-29-2009, 08:54 AM
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Consistency is key. Regardless of what style goalie he is. Everyone has **** nights. No one is perfect but like I said, it all comes down to being the most consistent. Fingers can always be pointed but in the end, its never just one persons fault.

Oh yeah, please take a step back from the ledge. Its ok. You're going to live.

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01-29-2009, 09:24 AM
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I'm really starting to think that Lundqvist's biggest problem is that when he gets frustrated, he lets in bad goals. He's got to buckle down and not let fluke goals get to him. It always seems like, in these games where he let's in a bunch of goals, that he starts getting flustered and then stops making saves he normally should make.

I know it's frustrating when pucks bounce in off your teammates or are going in from weird, fluky chances, but he's gotta shrug that off and realize there's still more game to be played.

Facing a large number of shots or scoring chances doesn't seem to bother him...it's just when things start to snowball, he has a really hard time turning it around, and he needs to work on that. Usually the game is already going out of reach, so I'm not sure it hurts the team as much as it hurts his stats, but still...

Quote:
Originally Posted by NYReign View Post
I obviously don't know a damn thing about playing goalie, but the one thing that always makes me wonder if he couldn't improve is where he holds his glove hand. When he goes into the butterfly, it always seems that his glove hand is resting just above his pad, parallel to his leg. I always felt that if he held it more straight up, perpendicular to his leg, then there would be less space to shoot at, especially with his otherwise uselessly giant uncloseable glove. Anyone have any idea if that would make a difference? Obviously, like I said, I'm essentially guessing here and I know Lundqvist and Allaire know a lot better than I do, but it seems to me like this might cut down on the high glove problem.
I think if you look at any butterfly goalie, you'll notice that when they start to react to a shot, they pull their glove hand in tight to their body first, and then reach out with it to try to snag a shot if it's going high. I think it's mainly the idea of closing up any holes next to your body first and trying to take up space. If he starts holding his glove up further away from his body, then shooters will start picking the holes under his arm and over his pad, etc

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01-29-2009, 09:36 AM
  #25
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his problem is...

he hasn't been playing well for a couple months now. He's been wildly inconsistent and you do not know which Lundqvist you will get in nets. And no, it wasn't just an off night, this is part of a bigger secular trend over the last couple months. Look at his last 10. A couple shutouts, nice. 5 games with 3 or more goals (4 of 4 or more goals). Pathetic. He played like the best goalie in the league through November-ish. Definitely top 3 if he wasn't the best. He has played towards the bottom half since then. Below average. Since 11/19, 23 games ago, he has given up 3 or more goals 13 times - more than 1/2. Prior to that, in his first 18 games, the number was two. See a troubling trend? Night and day. Perhaps there was something to his knee injury to start the season and the early workload has put a burden on that knee causing some inconsistencies. Perhaps it's his annual slump. Who knows, but if he's not playing like an elilte goalie.

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